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jaxom
13-05-2009, 17:14
I'm not sure where some things come from... I know Magic Missiles cannot be cast into combat and I often hear the statement that a mage in combat cannot cast magic missiles but this leads me to scratching my head about combat and LoS... I've never seen an explicit rule talking about LoS in combat so I am assuming the general rules would apply and that a unit in combat can see the models in base with him to the front. A unit on the corner or out of combat but in a unit in combat should have normal LoS unless I am missing something... Are there other rules that have an effect that I am forgetting or missing?



222

111
xxaxbxc


Given the three units above with my unit (x's) and enemy 1 in combat and enemy 2 out of combat...

If a mage is at "a", does he have LoS to the enemy in front of him in unit 1? Can he cast a non-magic missile that requires LoS at the enemy (e.g. Burning Iron)? Can he cast non-LoS spells like Rot, Glorious Rot?

Can a mage at "b" see unit 2? Can a mage at "b" cast a magic missile at unit 2 since it is not in combat?

Can a mage at "c" cast magic missiles at unit 2?

tarrasque
13-05-2009, 17:24
i do not have the brb here. but i believe as soon as an unit is in cc it loses los.

Chipacabra
13-05-2009, 17:38
a) Yes, he has LOS to the enemy unit and only the enemy unit.

b) Yes, he has LOS to both units.

c) No, if the unit is in combat everyone in the unit is in combat, even if they can't reach anyone to fight. The wizard can not cast magic missiles. This is specifically stated in the rules for magic missiles.

jaxom
13-05-2009, 17:53
The wizard can not cast magic missiles. This is specifically stated in the rules for magic missiles.

Ok, this sounds familiar and is part of the crux of the question... I did a quick read through the magic section of the BRB the other day and missed any explicit definition of magic missiles. Is the definition of Magic Missiles in the 4-6 pages right around the table defining miscasts or am I looking in the wrong section of the BRB? Either I'm in the wrong section or I am skimming too quickly to find what I am looking for...

(Gah, when will they give us an electronic format that we can use computer search on? I am sick of not being able to search the dead-tree format when I need to find explicit rules.)

tarrasque
13-05-2009, 18:07
try page 110 left column

jaxom
13-05-2009, 18:11
I should also probably expand the LoS question a smidge... Given a spell like Burning Iron which targets a specific model in LoS is there an explicit rule granting LoS to the entire enemy unit in combat or am I limited to the models in base with me?

Does the Metal mage need to line up with the Champ/Characters he wants to hit with Burning Iron or does he have LoS to the whole combat?

Chipacabra
13-05-2009, 18:28
LOS is worked out on individual models, and blocked by models. Wizard A can only see the models in front of him. Wizard B can only see the model on the edge of unit 1, and the entire front of unit 2. Just like you can't draw LOS to a damsel hiding in the second rank, you can't draw LOS over enemy models to an enemy character on the other side of the combat. Finding the most effective place to put your wizard is a useful skill.

jaxom
13-05-2009, 18:31
Thanks, guys. Looks like I am just missing the Magic Missile definition.

Much appreciation for the quick replies.

Lord Yawgmoth
14-05-2009, 23:49
As per mage "c" casting a magic missile, I would use the precedent set by the Vampire FAQ and say you can.

------summary of vamp faq------
Helm of commandment:
"Cannot be used if the vampire is in combat......."

Q: Can a vamp use the helm if his unit is in combat but he is not in B2B?
A: Yes.
--------------------------------

tarrasque
14-05-2009, 23:52
so you say there is no diffrence whit "Cannot be used if the vampire" is in combat and "a wiz cannot cast mm if he, OR THE UNIT HE IS WHIT, is engaged in cc"??

Lord Yawgmoth
16-05-2009, 04:21
c) No, if the unit is in combat everyone in the unit is in combat.


so you say there is no diffrence whit "Cannot be used if the vampire" is in combat and "a wiz cannot cast mm if he, OR THE UNIT HE IS WHIT, is engaged in cc"??

I was contradicting what Chipacabra said,

<.< If you read through the thread this point was never brought up aside from your mention of a page number which I assume says as much...

Obviously then, the answer is clear, my good sir.

(wouldn't have even responded if it seemed you weren't mocking me)

Arnizipal
16-05-2009, 13:29
If a mage is at "a", does he have LoS to the enemy in front of him in unit 1? Can he cast a non-magic missile that requires LoS at the enemy (e.g. Burning Iron)? Can he cast non-LoS spells like Rot, Glorious Rot?
He has line of sight to the unit, but remember you can't cast spells at units engaged in close combat unless the spell description specifically mentions you're allowed to.