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View Full Version : How much models would I need for Raising in a VC army?



Kodamas
21-05-2009, 12:40
Hello folks,

I have a 1999pts tourny coming up and I don't want to be short on the old Zombie front or Skellies for that matter.

I have the following units in core:

2 x 20 Zombies
1x 18 Skellies

How much more do you need for raising? I have 2 vampires lvl 2 (6 PD in total)

What do you guys think?

Keller
21-05-2009, 13:41
Entirely dependant on your opponent's defense, and just how much you feel like casting.

In 6th Edition, I always kept 20-40 zombies on hand for summoning purposes, depending on whether I included some to start in my list.

Now in 7th edition, you can create units of zombies, as well as increase the starting size of skeletons, ghouls, wolves, and bats, which means you should have all of said models that you will want to raise. Oh, and some Spirit Hosts for Winds of Death spell.

I haven't played a ton of games with my VC in 7th ed, but I don't think I've ever needed any models I didn't start the game with. I don't like increasing my units above starting size; I just replace their losses. And I haven't found Raise Dead to be that important now that zombies are crap. Sure, summoning zombies has all kinds of uses, but you don't need to do it.


So, in short, whatever you feel like you'll want to raise. I'd suggest 20 zombies incase you want to create units to harass/redirect/whatever. If you take small units of ghouls/skeletons, then have more to bolster thier ranks with the respective power. If you buy units at combat strength, dont worry about adding more to them.

FictionalCharacter
21-05-2009, 13:47
depending on how much you plan on using lord of the dead, i'd say plan for about a rank and a half of extra skeletons.

i carry 40 zombies for raise dead, but have yet to use any of them.

sirbone
21-05-2009, 20:20
I've known people to end up making their army three times the size of when they started (this was in several 500pt games, mind) and it was a great tactic for sticking around until turn 6 with enough victory points remaining to get a win.

selone
21-05-2009, 21:51
I don't think you should bother with raising any models at all, tbh.

Cry havoc entrant you say? Muhahaha

Spirit
22-05-2009, 02:02
wit 6 power dice i wouldnt say you need more than 10 extra skeletons and 10 extra zombies. Even then....

Chances are more will die than you can raise with 6 power dice.

Lord Dan
22-05-2009, 02:43
1999 points? I'd throw down dice and coins if they're conning you out of a lord choice.

Kodamas
22-05-2009, 12:49
Cry havoc entrant you say? Muhahaha
Cry Havoc? What's that? :angel:

1999 points? I'd throw down dice and coins if they're conning you out of a lord choice.

I think it is a good size. Hinders a little due to the lack of a lord and rares but makes you think about tactics a little more.

Had a good game last night with a test list. I'll post it in the army list section for you guys to take a look.

Thanks folks for the replies.

W0lf
22-05-2009, 13:02
At 2K i usually run 12 dice with periapt (so 13).

I start with 2x 14 ghouls and 1x 11 ghouls and generally raise about 50 extra at one time. Zombies it depends, ive had games i havnt used any and one game i raised a unit of over 100..

Kodamas
22-05-2009, 13:18
the lack of 1 point seems to half my dice (almost) for casting which is a slight annoyance.

Still 6 Power dice (+1 for the periapt) + 2 bound items aint bad or is it?

selone
22-05-2009, 14:46
It's not too bad, though it really depends what the meta game is like up there. What is the meta game like up there?

I personally like the points restriction :) but this isn't a topic meant for that discussion.

W0lf
23-05-2009, 09:55
Dosnt 1999 pts just force you to deathstar with vampires?

Vampires at effectivly 2K without a lord and capped at so few PD will get eaten alive by Daemons, DE, Warriors, Lizards, HE....

Kodamas
23-05-2009, 15:38
I don't know if Blood Knights unit is death star.

1999pts allows 1 core less and due to the fact you don't have a Lord means more points to spend in your special and rare slots. Of course this poses a problem in itself due to there being only 4 available slots to use these points in.

6-7 dice for a game at this size is ok IMHO. The most I could get is 8-9 plus a couple of bound items. Although this would lead me to have no real combat hero choices.

After playing a couple of games I roughly need 10 Skellies and 20 Zombies for raising and that is that lol.

Thanks for the replies again folks.

PS@selone: Are you coming to Cry Havoc? As for the Meta game well I wouldn't know due to me not really playing much up here until recently. (Probablty better to respond via PM)

Spirit
23-05-2009, 21:17
Tbh id rather play 2k any day lol.

Lord Dan
24-05-2009, 04:07
Dosnt 1999 pts just force you to deathstar with vampires?

...I don't really think anything justifies "deathstarring". And the fact that you brought it up like a last ditch, WAAC attempt at winning says a lot about it as a tactic in general.

Ravenousone2
24-05-2009, 13:02
I'm sure i could be waaaay off base here , but I dont consider Blood Knights a Deathstar as long as you're playing them aggressively. any really killy unit can beat them if they get the flank and if you're playing the BK's aggressively (to a degree) (i still Screen them but i prefer bats as they skirmish and can fly behind enemy units to keep them from flee baiting the Knights) anyway if you're playing aggressively to a point then people have opprtunities there to flank them and that i dont consider a deathstar.

Spirit
24-05-2009, 22:35
I'm sure i could be waaaay off base here , but I dont consider Blood Knights a Deathstar as long as you're playing them aggressively. any really killy unit can beat them if they get the flank and if you're playing the BK's aggressively (to a degree) (i still Screen them but i prefer bats as they skirmish and can fly behind enemy units to keep them from flee baiting the Knights) anyway if you're playing aggressively to a point then people have opprtunities there to flank them and that i dont consider a deathstar.

Within the context of a vampire army, any chance to flank (which will be minimal because the BK's will only charge something they know they can break in one turn with their 16x S7 + 10xS4 attacks) is wiped out with good use of the raise dead spell.

Eisenhorn
25-05-2009, 09:21
Well there you go then. Blood Knights are not Death star, as there are loads of unites that canīt be broken by the 16 s7 + 10 s4 attacks.

These mythical Blood Knight proof unites are:

All rank and file deamon unites as they get a 5+ ward and have to take a leadership test on their crum.. i mean instability test.

Big undead unites, we are talking 40+ here or undead unites backed up with the helm of commandment.

Any rank and file unite that are stubborn with a decent leadership.

Any rank and file unite that are unbreakable.

All ASF unites, as the blood knights cant kill stuff if they are already dead.