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Norminator
26-12-2005, 08:19
I was thinking today how, in 40,000 years, the ice caps would have melted, sea levels would have risen etc. It then occured to me that mankind may well have 'farmed' this water to sell off. This brings me to my question: what does modern day Terra look like? Is it just like a hive world, or are there untouched regions (such as the Himalayas, as suggested in another thread)?

IMO it's a sort of massive temple dedicated the the Emperor now, though that's just based on guesswork.

starlight
26-12-2005, 08:22
I'd be shocked if it wasn't a combination of the oldest most decayed Hive World and the Palace, which would be the most sanctified and respected Gothic Cathedral in the galaxy.

FieronThor
26-12-2005, 08:27
Two huge fortresses in the shape of the Imperial one and the Ecceschleriac (no idea how to spell it) one. Then there would probably be significant defenses all over the planet, as well as hives. Most of the planet is used by the Administratum. I don't think the ice caps would be gone, because wouldn't that mean huge amount of global warming would exist, therefore very hot and arid Terra?

Ki-Adi-Monkey
26-12-2005, 09:21
Two huge fortresses in the shape of the Imperial one and the Ecceschleriac (no idea how to spell it) one. Then there would probably be significant defenses all over the planet, as well as hives. Most of the planet is used by the Administratum. I don't think the ice caps would be gone, because wouldn't that mean huge amount of global warming would exist, therefore very hot and arid Terra?

According to the fluff in the latest 40k rulebook, terra is a ball of rock, covered in hives, palaces, ancient buildings, iron and steel, and ancient ruins. It says that terra is completely infertile, the oceans have long since boiled away and that the atmosphere is heavily polluted.

Rob

Norminator
26-12-2005, 10:18
Yeah, that's what I thought. The reason I was intigued was someone quoted some fluff saying that the Himalayas (where the Astromican (sp?) is based) had the same appearence as before.

I thought there might also be damages from the wars before the emperor led the great crusade.

CELS
26-12-2005, 10:56
And according to the novel 'Wolfblade' by Bill King, Terra has layers and layers of ruins, which is kind of cool. I imagine that Terra is very much a shrine world, and not just a decaying old hiveworld. It's the Mekka of the Imperium, so I think billions of the most priveleged pilgrims (retired generals, cardinals, etc) from all over the Imperium would come there for worship. And most of them would probably never get within eyesight of the Emperor's palace.

Lord-Warlock
26-12-2005, 11:51
That's what I love about Terra - when honoured men discover how tiny they actually are.

Example - retired Colonel from the Guard, say, is a war hero, has been awarded medals, fought in many glorious wars and is a renowned champion of his homeworld. He petitions to go to Terra as a pilgrim, and is awarded the honour with much pomp and circumstance from the regimental band, commendations from his commanding general, etc.

He gets to Terra, decades later, old and withered and hoping to see the Imperial Palace before he dies.

He sees the endless queues. He asks a passing Administratum official, "I'm Colonel Vashisname" and produces the commendations from the general. The official doesn't even look at them, just sneers and says, "Everyone here is a colonel or something. You want to join the back of that line, pal!"

"But I'm a war hero!"

"Everyone's a war hero," the official says and hurries off.

The colonel screams at his back: "Listen, you worthless little bureocrat, come back here or -"

A passing Arbitrator shoots him for clogging up the traffic.

geoffkemp
26-12-2005, 12:09
I can remember looking at the third ed rule book and thinking that, to me, the Imperial palace looked like it was over Nottingham

Kage2020
26-12-2005, 14:10
Just as a city or even a building can be altered by many hands over time, so the description of Terra has been handled - perhaps even mutilated - by many authors over time. Each author has their own preferences, interpretations and inspirations.

With that said, the 'fluff' does mention an altered by recognisable Himalayas (the Chamber of the Astronomican is meant to be carved from ?Everest), as well as the Inquisitorial headquarters underneath the Arctic (or was it Antarctic) ice-caps? Of course, the age of this 'fluff' also goes back to the time when the ordo malleus was 'secret' even amongst the Inquisition and their own headquarters were hidden in the very headquarters of the Inquisition rather than in the Sol system. So you can take that with however much salt you wish.

Personally, and at the moment since peoples' postings as well as just generally 'cool' reminders can change this, I see Terra as a combination of city and 'barren' landscape. By 'barren' I mean that there are hardy plants out there, but nothing that you could really live on... same thing goes with the oceans. Cities are like cancerous growths, spreading from key locations and impinging even onto the oceans themselves.

The cities are 'layered', as CELS mentions, crushed and fossilised by millennia of construction and habitation (and a decade of mutilation by the authors! ;)), and include the rust-filled dendritic tunnels of nightmare to the vaulted domes and structures mentioned in Draco/Inquisitor. Beyond that to the luxury 'biodomes' maintained by the nobilitas, the height of hedonism, and harking back to a primordial Terra.

For me it's about integrating the various images rather than taking one over the other.

Kage

Norminator
26-12-2005, 15:35
Thats really well put Kage, I think the Inquisitorial headquarters were under Antartica, and the Astronomican is under all the mountains.

That barren landscape would make sense, as *presumely* there would have been Nuclear War during the pre-emperor-coming-out Terra.

my_name_is_tudor
26-12-2005, 20:42
A person in one of the RP's I'm playing in on Damage Inc, can't remember who now, has a character (a marine) who was brought into the Imperial Fists after being observed as being very resourceful as a child during a 'queue war' on earth.

Hive worlds are very polluted places, the oldest hive in the galaxy would be the most polluted ever.

VanHel
27-12-2005, 05:27
Hee, queue war.

FieronThor
27-12-2005, 07:38
Goes on increasingly in Third World countries today.

my_name_is_tudor
27-12-2005, 11:12
Hee, queue war.

Yeah, two queues, to get permits for something or other. People from one queue attempt to push into the other, and a fight breaks out, which escalates to the occupants of both queues warring over their position in the queues, many die, only the fittest survive to get their permit.. lol

Minister
27-12-2005, 12:29
One point I would like to make is on the Navigators' Quarter (From my reading either America or just North America), the greatest monument to unequal distribution of wealth ever seen by humanity. Never before has so much money been spent with so little taste.

Kage2020
27-12-2005, 14:32
<grin> You're likely going to see the same in any place governed by what I would refer to as the nobilitas imperialis as well.

Kage

Scorpio
27-12-2005, 20:11
i think terra looks like(this is almost entirely guessing) would look much the same as today. with new tech we could stop most of todays pollution:D .
i mean that like we are close today to stopping gas use:D which solves a major pollution problem. but one huge problem that we have is once we run out of coal(we are already low on it) we have no sufficient energy sources to replace it.:cries: so we would literally become stone age.

Kage2020
27-12-2005, 22:15
There are indeed some people that share that approach with you, Scorpio, although they would seem to be in the minority. Remember that the image of Terra is, well, determined by the Image of the 40k universe. This generally doesn't allow for 'pristine' worlds. Well, rarely so.

Kage

my_name_is_tudor
27-12-2005, 22:39
in all probability, terra once was a pristine, eutopia like future world, but then things changed. We're talking 38000 years now, not a couple of hundred/thousand.

Philip S
27-12-2005, 22:53
I Imagine Terra to be completely covered in several layers 300m modular plas-create cubes housing full environment simulation and recycling facilities and each home to several thousand. These blocks house the majority of of Terra's population and supply the workforce. Above these would be vast Gothic structures of the administration of the Imperium, titanic multi-layer 'cathedrals' arrayed in pyramids constructed of riveted metal and plas-create. In and around these billions of pilgrims queue for days, even months waiting to glimpse a holy relic and feel the power of the emperor.

I would imagine the population of Terra to not be billions but trillions, the structures and complexity so unimaginable and overwhelming to us that we wouldn't even know where to begin.

Philip

my_name_is_tudor
27-12-2005, 23:00
I can imagine the terra hive being so complex that entire sub societies could be cut off for centuries just down to the laberynthine structure of the place.

Philip S
27-12-2005, 23:08
I can imagine the terra hive being so complex that entire sub societies could be cut off for centuries just down to the laberynthine structure of the place.
One of the beauties of the self contained environments is that many will be highly individualistic, and many may have limited contact if any with the administration. Also a cut of modular unit could house a cult and no one would know if they didn't venture outside. A world full of adventure and limitless possibilities.

Philip

Latro_
27-12-2005, 23:23
I was thinking today how, in 40,000 years, the ice caps would have melted, sea levels would have risen etc. It then occured to me that mankind may well have 'farmed' this water to sell off. This brings me to my question: what does modern day Terra look like? Is it just like a hive world, or are there untouched regions (such as the Himalayas, as suggested in another thread)?

IMO it's a sort of massive temple dedicated the the Emperor now, though that's just based on guesswork.


I dunno about the general geography but you can bet your ass theres adeptus mcdolandus's everywhere.

:P

Norminator
28-12-2005, 12:19
And, hopeful, Adeptus Gamesworkshopus....

Snakebite
30-12-2005, 13:56
On the PS2 Game Fire Warrior, there is a cutscene at the beginning that shows Terra surrounded by an Imperial fleet. Seen from space, at least half of the planet seems to be made up of gigantic buildings, fortresses and even spacedocks. It's difficult to describe but it looks very, very cool...

Kage2020
30-12-2005, 15:34
At one point I was trying to convince some Anargo Sector Project (http://wiki.anargo-sector.net/) artists to create a unique interpretation of Terra for some of the background pages of the project. E.g. here (http://anargo-sector.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=106) or:


Frame 1 - Terra from Space
Somewhat reminscent of the imagery from the Fire Warrior game, the first 'frame' shows Terra from orbit, perhaps with the curve of the Moon present to one of the sides of the image. Terra is centralised (and perhaps a bit bigger then it should be) and surrounded by the swarms of ships etc., that one would imagine associated with this hub of activity for the Imperium.

Terra itself would be divided by the terminator line and, depending on the method of representation, could show the night lights of the hives on one side, and the smog-filled sky of the day side.

Frame 2 - In Transit
A shuttle descends into the atmosphere of Terra, its surface a ruddy red from friction. Beneath it the curve of Terra can be see and, to show the scale of hives, a 'fuzzy' surface can be shown as the hives penetrate high into the sky. (The view would actually be looking towards the Imperial Palace and, therefore, consistent with the view that one might get looking towards the UK in the real world, e.g. distribution of hives, etc.).

Frame 3 - The Palace at Night
As if looking through the plasteel of a shuttle's port or main (cockpit) window, the Imperial Palace is seen in 'night light' format and representing not only the scope of it but also the general shape. At the centre the Inner Palace should itself be visible.

Frame 4 - The Inner Palace
A more detailed shot of the Inner Palace. Image depends on determinations of just what the Inner Palace should look like! Wink

Frame 5 - The Gates
Blanche did a version of this image, and the frame would be reminiscent of that. This time, however, the titans that flank the doors would be included to give a representation of scale. The doors might even be open, given a partial view inside to the pyramidal (I like that image myself!) Golden Throne at some rather large distance.

Frame 6 - The Supplicant
A change in scale. This time a view of a single indiviudal (identity to be established) standing in the gateway of the Throneroom. The thickness of the door, etc., can be used to give a representation of the scale. The adeptus custodes can be seen in their gothic armour flanking the individual. Perhaps s/he is one of the High Lords?

Frame 7 - Suppicant in Transit
Returning to the supplicant, this time s/he is walking across the Throneroom. The viewpoint is from behind and above and the figures are small thereby representing the large distance between the gateway and the Throne itself. Some of the 'bustle' that might be associated with the Throneroom can be represented (i.e. the psyker Sacrifice, etc.). The Golden Throne is distant, but the basic features discernible.

Frame 8 - The Golden Throne
Similar to the image presented in Inquis Exterminatus... The perspective should be altered, indicative of an individual who is looking up from the basic of the Throne.

Frame 9 - The Emperor
A view of the dessicated 'corpse' of the Emperor in the Throne.

Frame 10 - Portrait of the Emperor
A closeup of the face of the Emperor, though this time a 'glint' can be seen under his eye.

Frame 11 - Tears of the Emperor
A close up of the face showing tears rolling own one of his angular cheeks...

Frame 12 - Microcosm of the Imperium
Close up of one of the tears showing a battle scene and the deaths of loyal Imperial citizens whom the Emperor weeps for.

Norminator
30-12-2005, 18:45
That sounds great Kage, shame it was never done.

Kage2020
30-12-2005, 18:53
<hint, hint> I'm sure that there are people out there with the talent to be able to draw this. :D

Kage

heretic
30-12-2005, 21:30
<hint, hint> I'm sure that there are people out there with the talent to be able to draw this. :D

Kage
if I had any sense of animating something like that, I would be working on that right now

Kage2020
30-12-2005, 21:31
Sense? How so? I ask only because I have some very specific images! ;)

Kage

Cadian 122nd
13-01-2006, 01:50
There is a picture in the 3rd Edition rule book that vaugely shows Ancient Terra. It seems remarkably close to todays earth but the majority of descriptions I have heard jive with all of your descriptions. (ie: Desolate hive wasteland) It is easy to imagine Terra as entirely waterless, just think how many humans have been born there and taken water off world with them in ships and in their bodies. And all those trillions of human on Terra would soak up so much water there i doubt there would be much water to go around.

Kage2020
13-01-2006, 14:56
And think of how much could be imported from other sources... ;)

Of course, all those extra structure could be 'cities' rather than land masses.

Kage

Sai-Lauren
13-01-2006, 15:35
I've always considered Terra as basically looking like Coruscant - a massive global city where the only green spaces are those parks that have existed for millenia and no ones built on because they're assuming there's some ancient prohibition on doing so, otherwise they'd already have a housing block, filing storage bunker or factory on them, the private gardens of the Navigator houses, the High Lords, similar aristocrats and anything belonging to the church or the Emperors Palace/Astronomicon or the Inquisition.

Ursca
13-01-2006, 16:07
I always imagined the surface as having the appearance of the most oppulent, grandiose world imaginable. No gardens, but not polluted either. Golden domes miles wide and massive spires.
However, underneath the surface would be a whole different story, as other people have said. With endless tunnels and whole societies that have never seen the surface. No doubt a ton of undiscovered archeotech too.
Personally, I do not see Terra as a place of modular hab-blocks. Terra is the most important world in the Imperium, so I can't imagine anything less than top standard would be built within the last couple of thousand years.

Just as a point of note though, Terra was not the first Hive world, Mars was.

Minister
13-01-2006, 16:26
However, by current Imperial doctrine, being a Forge World precludes being a Hive.

Ursca
13-01-2006, 16:42
Fair enough, but it was a hive before it was a forgeworld. :)

Kage2020
13-01-2006, 17:10
Another reason that I felt that it would be interesting to get some varying pictures done at different resolutions. An interpretation manifested, rather than just all these descriptive interpretations! :D

Kage