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Sloppyjayman
25-05-2009, 15:33
I played my Skaven army against a fellow Orc player this weekend. I must say that I love the Warp Lightning Cannon, but I am getting frustrated with the rules.

According to the book: The Warp Lightning Cannon must flee as a charge reaction.

Situation: A unit of goblin wolf riders is 20" away from the WLC and declares a charge. The Orc player genuinely thought the wolf riders could make the charge and I was sure it was more than their 18" charge. But since I have to still make a charge reaction, I had to flee (which I feel is BS)

Rules: An unreasonable charge can not be declared. Please define reasonable???

How do you guys deal with this situation?

My Opinion: The WLC flee, as a result of a charge reaction, should be done in the compulsory movement phase. This should be dealt with the same as frenzied units where you measure to see if you can make the charge before moving.

Thanks for the input,

Shamfrit
25-05-2009, 15:40
You cannot declare impossible charges, if you found out the riders were out of range, then the Cannon does not have to flee. It is considered very unsportsmanlike to do otherwise - we had Bret players declaring 1st turn charges in tournaments 2007-8 I believe, if not earlier, and it was rules against.

If the charge is legal, then they have to flee, otherwise, ZAP ZAP!

EvC
25-05-2009, 15:43
The first rulebook FAQ deals with this. There will be muddy situations, so I advise you and your opponents to come up with a reasonable compromise. I would suggest you let him declare the charge, but if it's out of range, then no charge is declared and the unit can move normally. If he's unwilling to do this, it's because he's clearly being a git who wants to abuse the WLC rules. In which case you either keep playing the git, or stop.

Feefait
25-05-2009, 16:25
I would agree here as well. If it turns out they are not in charge range then you should not have to follow through with your reaction. Especially if you know they are out. 2" doesn't seem like a lot, but for veteran players I can tell when my skaven, for instance are 10" or 12" away. I would assume the same for your orc player. you have to err on the side of caution. I have had charges that are in or out by 1/4" or less that I do not declare because I am not 100% sure.
Would he be okay with d6ing it?

Sloppyjayman
25-05-2009, 16:51
In the game we played we did D6 it and I lost so it fled.

We then talked about a house rule for this situation. We are both good sportmen and he has never declared a charge that was unreasonable. We came up with the following.

1st - The charge has to be reasonable
2nd - If the failed charge was within 2" of the WLC, I would have to FLEE.

Seems fair to me....

How do you guys think this is going to be dealth with in the comming rule book?

fubukii
25-05-2009, 16:56
seems like a good solution to the somewhat iffy and vague rules of the cannon. Maybe next edition if we are lucky it will gt more stable rules.

knightime98
25-05-2009, 22:18
I'd treat it just like a fear test when charging. You only have to run when it is determined that the charger is within range. You only take fear or terror test when the charger can actually reach you. Terror also taken if you are within 6 at start of turn. So, that's the way, I'd play it.

Necromancy Black
26-05-2009, 00:03
Honestly I can't fault the O&G player. From the otherside of the table 2" is damn hard to see the different in, so generally that would be an ok charge to declare in any situation.

Wouldn't it be better to keep the house rule that any charge that would bring them within 2" of the cannon will cause it too flee?

Personally the cannon either needs this rule or only flees if the charge would reach it, it's a rule that's too iffy and brings up situations like this.

sulla
26-05-2009, 01:38
I would agree here as well. If it turns out they are not in charge range then you should not have to follow through with your reaction. Especially if you know they are out. 2" doesn't seem like a lot, but for veteran players I can tell when my skaven, for instance are 10" or 12" away. I would assume the same for your orc player. you have to err on the side of caution. I have had charges that are in or out by 1/4" or less that I do not declare because I am not 100% sure.
Would he be okay with d6ing it?

Would you also not allow units to stand and fire when chargers are found to be out of range?

I'd just offer the option of premeasuring the charge to the O&G player. It's not in the rules, but it runs more smoothly than changing reactions after the charge move IMO.

It's the same solution I offer to 'accidental' overguessers of cannons. I let them measure the actual range to the target unit, then all they have to calculate is how much to subtract for bounce distances.