PDA

View Full Version : weapons question



Elrond12
02-06-2009, 00:45
I have a high elf general that I built from the kit but i would like to use the spear that comes with the kit.The question is could i substitute the weapon on the common magic items list & give its properties to the spear (ie biting blade to biting spears) any feedback would be appreciated.:)

PeG
02-06-2009, 00:58
In friendly games yes of course. In many tournaments probably. As long as you use magic weapons that doesnt get any bonuses for being a spear/lance or whatever I dont see what the problem would be. However if the magical spear you want to use has a wording that says that the chargin binus of the spear is increased to +2S instead of +1 or something else you might have a problem if you want use a model with only a sword.

DoomBringer
02-06-2009, 05:27
Friendly Games most people won't mind 'counts as' weapons, and tourny people usually don't mind as long as they know what it is and it isn't something extreme.

TheDarkDaff
02-06-2009, 07:44
For most magic weapons it doesn't make a difference. The Biting blade could be an axe, sword, spear or even a hamster. What does matter is that magic weapon will only follow the rules they have so a magic item you have modelled to be a spear will not have any of the properties of a spear.

Condottiere
02-06-2009, 09:01
The Magical Hamster of Biting - in combat it runs along your army and onto your opponent, and gnaws him.

theunwantedbeing
02-06-2009, 09:15
I have a high elf general that I built from the kit but i would like to use the spear that comes with the kit.The question is could i substitute the weapon on the common magic items list & give its properties to the spear (ie biting blade to biting spears) any feedback would be appreciated.:)

If a model has a spear and you havent given him a spear in his equiptment for that game, you need to say "this guy doesnt have a spear, its just for show".

Same goes for anything you could just look at a model and see.
So the mundane properties of magical stuff needs to be told if they have mundane properties.
eg. the starlance is a lance, so if the model has no lance, you need to say "this guy has a lance".

Keeps the game nice and freindly so neither side resorts to underhand tactics like using models that are wildly different from how they are equipt.
eg. barded steed mounts for models that dont have bardings so the enemy sits in charge range without realising it.

Griefbringer
02-06-2009, 12:04
The Biting blade could be an axe, sword, spear or even a hamster.

Don't forget the possibilities of it being a turnip, a carrot or even a feather duster. There used to even be a specific mention of this in some FAQ somewhere.

A champion of Slaanesh could look very sinister waving around a massive and pink two-handed feather duster of doom! And your opponent might just underestimate her a bit, and not consider the prospect of it being a daemonic feather duster or something...

Mercules
02-06-2009, 13:33
If a model has a spear and you havent given him a spear in his equiptment for that game, you need to say "this guy doesnt have a spear, its just for show".

Same goes for anything you could just look at a model and see.
So the mundane properties of magical stuff needs to be told if they have mundane properties.
eg. the starlance is a lance, so if the model has no lance, you need to say "this guy has a lance".

Keeps the game nice and freindly so neither side resorts to underhand tactics like using models that are wildly different from how they are equipt.
eg. barded steed mounts for models that dont have bardings so the enemy sits in charge range without realising it.

Exactly. While I typically take a Bangstick on one Butcher and the Skullmantle on the other Butcher and have modeled them appropriately one of my models is the special Tyrant/Bruiser from the OLD Ogre Army Box. He has Handguns dripping off him and an Ironfist. In a recent game he was giving the Tenderizer and so I stated, "He has Heavy Armor, Brace of Handguns, a Luck Gnoblar, and a Great Weapon."

My Maneaters are similar. The Pirate ME has a Sword, a BoH, and a GW made from an anchor. So which equipment does he have for WYSIWYG? :) I just tell my opponent and remind him as we go.

ashc
02-06-2009, 14:04
For most magic weapons it doesn't make a difference. The Biting blade could be an axe, sword, spear or even a hamster. What does matter is that magic weapon will only follow the rules they have so a magic item you have modelled to be a spear will not have any of the properties of a spear.

This is pretty much my view of it. I'm certain GW themselves have said that magic items can pretty much take any form you like (i.e. sword of might could be an axe of might, spear of might, etc.) if you prefer the look of them that way, so hey, go for it.

Nurgling Chieftain
02-06-2009, 18:42
The Magical Hamster of Biting - in combat it runs along your army and onto your opponent, and gnaws him.I think that's actually a squig. :cool:

TheDarkDaff
03-06-2009, 08:51
I think that's actually a squig. :cool:

Not in a Slaaneshi warband

Condottiere
03-06-2009, 11:40
Rabid Hamster of Biting +1 attack, poison.

Milgram
03-06-2009, 12:40
This is pretty much my view of it. I'm certain GW themselves have said that magic items can pretty much take any form you like (i.e. sword of might could be an axe of might, spear of might, etc.) if you prefer the look of them that way, so hey, go for it.

yes, though the sword of might might (so funny, huh?) then be a spear of might, but it still counts as a hand weapon and you still have to declare to your opponent, that that spear looking thing there is indeed only a handweapon.

ashc
03-06-2009, 13:00
yes, though the sword of might might (so funny, huh?) then be a spear of might, but it still counts as a hand weapon and you still have to declare to your opponent, that that spear looking thing there is indeed only a handweapon.

Well, you would declare that its a sword of might, not a hand weapon (as the sword of might itself isn't a hand weapon either in the true sense of the definition in game).

DarkTerror
03-06-2009, 17:13
If a model has a spear and you havent given him a spear in his equiptment for that game, you need to say "this guy doesnt have a spear, its just for show".

Same goes for anything you could just look at a model and see.
So the mundane properties of magical stuff needs to be told if they have mundane properties.
eg. the starlance is a lance, so if the model has no lance, you need to say "this guy has a lance".

Keeps the game nice and freindly so neither side resorts to underhand tactics like using models that are wildly different from how they are equipt.
eg. barded steed mounts for models that dont have bardings so the enemy sits in charge range without realising it.

WYSIWYG is not required in WHF. For example, if you have a unit of outriders, it is your opponent's job to ask.

Also, it doesn't matter what your hero looks like. He could be armed with the largest great weapon ever seen, and actually be armed with an extra hand weapon. There's nothing wrong with that.

Gazak Blacktoof
03-06-2009, 17:59
WYSIWYG is not required in WHF. For example, if you have a unit of outriders, it is your opponent's job to ask.

They shouldn't have to ask, you should tell them.

Milgram
03-06-2009, 20:00
WYSIWYG is not required in WHF. For example, if you have a unit of outriders, it is your opponent's job to ask.

yeah, and if you have a unit that looks like outriders but actually is a unit of inner circle knights, it is your job to tell your opponent.

you are not obligated to do it. as you are not obligated to wash your hands after you went to the outhouse.

Griefbringer
04-06-2009, 06:23
WYSIWYG is not required in WHF.

Well, there is this section called "Weapons and units" on BRB page 54.

Shamfrit
04-06-2009, 10:59
Rabid Hamster of Biting +1 attack, poison.

Well that about wins the thread, lol.

As long as it's on your army list and it's clear for all to see, nowt wrong with it. If you want to insist your opponent has everything wysiwyg and magnetises all his weapons sure - it won't be a very fruitful relationship.

siphon101
05-06-2009, 03:43
If a model has a spear and you havent given him a spear in his equiptment for that game, you need to say "this guy doesnt have a spear, its just for show".

Actually is this character mounted or on foot? Because if he's on foot, you wouldn't even really need to tell your opponent anything, because as hard as I can think, I can't come up with a single advantage a character on foot would gain from having a spear. For all intent and purpose it IS a hand weapon.

snurl
05-06-2009, 05:02
Rabid Hamster of Biting +1 attack, poison.

Isn't that a skaven only thing?

Condottiere
05-06-2009, 06:57
Might be a Dwarven insult.

"My Thain, Rabid Hamsters have breached the Hold's outer line of defence."

Mercules
06-06-2009, 04:47
Actually is this character mounted or on foot? Because if he's on foot, you wouldn't even really need to tell your opponent anything, because as hard as I can think, I can't come up with a single advantage a character on foot would gain from having a spear. For all intent and purpose it IS a hand weapon.

You could form into a unit one File wide with another character in the front and the Spear Character in the second row. Front Character Challenges and second row character strikes with the spear at other models touching the challenging front character(other than challenged model) with the "Fights in Two Ranks" rule. No one can strike back at him.

havoc626
06-06-2009, 05:12
Rabid Hamster of Biting +1 attack, poison.

lol. Now I'm going to be picturing a whole lot of heros running around with little fluffballs. Like a vampire count having the "Frost Hamster" that kills a sun dragon with a single bite to a certain weakspot

Condottiere
06-06-2009, 06:12
There is the Naked Mole Rat - but a Mouse Empire greater than the Skaven prevents me from mentioning it.

Gazak Blacktoof
06-06-2009, 09:34
You could form into a unit one File wide with another character in the front and the Spear Character in the second row. Front Character Challenges and second row character strikes with the spear at other models touching the challenging front character(other than challenged model) with the "Fights in Two Ranks" rule. No one can strike back at him.

A character can't fight unless in base contact with his opponent, see page 73, first column- spears are specifically mentioned.

Templar_Victorious
09-06-2009, 14:03
Rabid Hamster of Biting +1 attack, poison.

"Go for the EYES Boo, go for the EYES!!! RRRAAAAAAHHHRRRR!!!"

Milgram
09-06-2009, 14:14
OMG, Boo, that were good times! :)

Griefbringer
09-06-2009, 14:37
Never underestimate the power of the hamsters:

http://gilgamesh.hamsterrepublic.com/albums/Bob-the-Fighting-Machine/fighting_hamster.jpg

Elrond12
10-06-2009, 02:05
ok if i get the +1 bonus when charging for a normal spear & I give it the biting characteristic would i get also get the -1 armour save on the enemy?:confused:

siphon101
10-06-2009, 02:36
ok if i get the +1 bonus when charging for a normal spear & I give it the biting characteristic would i get also get the -1 armour save on the enemy?:confused:

You can not give a mundane weapon a "biting characteristic". The biting blade is a magic weapon. If you take it, it does exactly what it says it does. And since the biting blade is not a spear, it does not gain any bonuses of a spear.

What we have been saying is, if you want to model the character with a spear, but give it the biting blade, you can SAY the spear is a biting blade, because the rulebook explicitly states that magic weapons can look like, pretty much, whatever.

But magic weapons ONLY gain specific weapon characteristics if it explicitly states it as a weapon type. For example, the magic item "dreadlance" has a special rule, all attacks hit automatically. It ALSO states, explicitly, that it is a lance. Therefore it also gains all the rules of lances.

Since the biting blade is a magic weapon, and is NOT defined as a spear, it does not grant any bonuses that a spear would.