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Eulogy2
09-06-2009, 00:14
So i have a really solid LM force, and want to swing something different. so i figured why not elves with steel skirts! im aiming for something a little shooty, but not a "gun" line by any means. i kinda want to build it around the sea guard core, as 3 ranks of spears and 2 rank stand and shoot with ASF just seems cool, if not expensive. this is my first attempt at a HE list so im looking for tips with keeping the theme in mind. dont tell me to drop em and toss in 2 dragons.


Archmage
Level 4 , pick spells, 5+ ward save

Noble
Great Weapon; Heavy Armour; Battle Standard Beare, Banner of Sorcery

Noble, Heavy Armour, Reaver Bow

Mage, Silver Wand (+1 spell)

20 Lothern Sea Guard
Musician, Standard Bearer

20 Lothern Sea Guard
Musician, Standard Bearer

10 Archers

10 Archers

7 Sword Masters

7 Sword Masters

2 Repeater Bolt Throwers

5 Ellyrian Reavers/w Bow

6 Dragon Princes Musician; Standard Bearer;

Total Roster Cost: 2221

few things im not sure of...

the reavers while theme fitting may suck and not be worth their points.

the dragon princes are out of theme but it makes since to hold back a solid hammer unit.

the archmage or mage....i was thinking of using the +1 dispell dice -1 power dice for the enemy arcane item. not sure what to do with them really.

Desert Rain
09-06-2009, 08:49
First of all I would switch places for the mages magical items, so that the Archmage has the Silver Wand and the Mage has the Seerstaff, which is a much better set up. You really need some magical defense, at least a couple of scrolls. Otherwise your High Elves will die very quickly from enemy spells, especially now since you're playing a rather static army.
I would really recomend a couple of eagles, they are just excellent and you will need them to march block your opponent's units so that you can get as much fire on them as possible before they hit your line.

Some canges I would suggest in the list:

1. Drop the Reaver Bow wielding Noble and one of the Archer units.

2. Use those points to buy three Dispel Scrolls

3. Drop the great weapon form your BSB an give him a shield instead. That gives him a 3+ save which greatly improves his odds of surviving in combat.

4. Get yourself a pair of Eagles.

5. I would stick the two small SM units togeather inte one big one of 14, possibly boosting their numbers if you have some points left.

happy_doctor
09-06-2009, 09:27
I don't agree with everything Desert Rain suggested, however he has some good points:

-Eagles are your friends
-Switch the mages' equipment around
-Buy a SINGLE scroll

Some suggestions of my own:

-If you're going for theme, drop the dragon princes, you can do without them anyway. (and they're not that much of a hammer unit against recent books)

-Give your reaver bow noble a great weapon. Even though he might not want to get stuck in combat, it's very likely that he will, eventually. S6 attacks go a long way tipping the balance to your favour.

-Archmage equipment: I'm not sure about the ward save; if your mage ends up in combat, he's doomed anyway.

-Ellyrian reavers: I'm actually a big fan of these guys, they perform solidly for me every game, if protected fro the first couple of rounds. Consider getting a second unit with bows and spears to give you some speed. Give them musicians!

-Sword masters: nothing wrong with these, they will either die from shooting (sparing the rest of the army) or punch a large hole in the enemy lines.

-BSB: No reason why he shouldn't have a shield AND a great weapon. Depending on opposition, you can choose which setup you'll use.

Eulogy2
09-06-2009, 13:04
i dont have my book with me but...arent great eagles rare? so id have to drop both bolt throwers to get 2? i could see maybe dropping one for an eagle, but i definitly dont want to drop both.

i think your right with the ward save on the archmage, ill drop it when i get home and give the BSB a GW and shield and the other noble a GW too.

i was thinking of the SW's being a flanking unit to the LSG main blocks.

happy_doctor
09-06-2009, 14:14
If you check the book, you'll see that High Elves have an allowance of 4 for their rare slots at this points level (much like the 6 special slots they get). Hence, getting the eagles is just filling vacant spots. :)

The battlefield role of your swordmasters is a solid one, that's why I was against combining them.

Eulogy2
09-06-2009, 20:55
ahh...sweet. too use to the LM book. i was also debating using white lions for the job, as i think theyd fit the theme well too, and be more protected from enemy shooting. but i dont doubt SM's would carve things up quicker. ill be home in a bit, when i get there ill revise the list and repost. thanks again.

Eulogy2
09-06-2009, 23:41
Archmage; Level 4, Silver Wand

Noble, Great Weapon; Heavy Armour; Shield; Battle Standard Bearer, Banner of Sorcery

Noble, Great Weapon; Heavy Armour, Reaver Bow

Mage, Level 2, Annulian Crystal

19 Lothern Sea Guard, Musician; Standard Bearer; Bow; Spear; Light Armour; Shield

20 Lothern Sea Guard, Musician; Standard Bearer; Bow; Spear; Light Armour; Shield

10 Archers

10 Archers

7 Sword Masters

7 Sword Masters

2 Repeater Bolt Throwers


5 Ellyrian Reavers, Musician, Bow; Spear; Light Armour;

5 Ellyrian Reavers, Musician, Bow; Spear; Light Armour;

2 Great Eagles

Total Roster Cost: 2247

i think i like this much better.

PARTYCHICORITA
10-06-2009, 01:22
Drop the archers, your overpriced core slots are already covered by the LSG. Get 2 more RBT instead since you could use more decent fire power.

I would use the LSG on units of 21 models in 7x3. You get 14 shots if high ground is available and maximum attacks if charged.
Since said list wouldn't have any eagles at least 2 units of reavers would be mandatory and maybe one of shadow warriors (who also fit wonderfully on the theme of the list)

I would drop the SM, they seem out of place.

As for character equipment:
-Rings of fury and corin are a must.
-Banner of sorcery is overrated, Jewel on the dusk on a mage and you should be fine with 9PD.
-All HE BSB (you shouldn't take one but if you insist) should always be mounted to get a 2+ save.

Desert Rain
10-06-2009, 09:28
Looks fine to me, but I would still remove one of the archer units, S3 missiles arn't that great against most enemies. I would also boost the size of the sea gurards to 21 each as PARTYCHICORITA said. Swap the Annulian Chrystal for one scroll for each mage and give the L.2 the Seerstaff.

Eulogy2
10-06-2009, 12:10
I would use the LSG on units of 21 models in 7x3. You get 14 shots if high ground is available and maximum attacks if charged.


if they were 7x3 wouldnt i get 14 shots anyways for stand and shoot cause high elves shoot in 2 ranks instead of one?

PARTYCHICORITA
10-06-2009, 12:55
if they were 7x3 wouldnt i get 14 shots anyways for stand and shoot cause high elves shoot in 2 ranks instead of one?

No they don't

Zingmaster
10-06-2009, 13:31
They used to, but they don't anymore.

They just get to stab people with spears in an extra rank

Eulogy2
10-06-2009, 13:41
where does it say this? i didnt see anything about it.

Zingmaster
10-06-2009, 13:42
it doesn't say anything about shooting in extra ranks in the newest army book, meaning they have the same rules as every other army.

Eulogy2
10-06-2009, 15:52
damn, i coulda sworn i read they attack with spears in an extra rank and shoot with an extra rank as well.

Dragon Prince of Caledor
10-06-2009, 17:27
I think the reaver bow is a waste of time. I also think that having no kind of defense for your lord is insane. Give him folariaths robes at mininum or a ward save. LSG dont shoot in two ranks for stand and shoot as far as i know. I like the idea of the list. I think you should take some more magic defense as well as some casty power if that makes any sense to you. Either a ring of fury or jewel of the dusk or something.
I still and always will think that the units of 7 SM are a waste of time. Anyone with a brain will neutralize them before any combat of any kind is met.

I also think the archers in a list of seaguard are a waste. You could take another ranked unit of seaguard and take some of the leftover points to put to magic items for the mages.
Peace

Eulogy2
10-06-2009, 18:17
for some reason i had it stuck in my head that high elves fight with spears in 3 ranks(2 if charging) and shoot in 2 ranks instead of one. if im wrong about shooting in 2 ranks then i need to rethink alot of things.

PARTYCHICORITA
10-06-2009, 18:36
The rule "Martial prowless" (i think it's the english name) allows any HE unit armed with spears to fight with and extra rank (which means 2 ranks on the charge, 3 otherwise) but that's all it does.

HE do not shoot with an extra rank

Desert Rain
10-06-2009, 20:38
I think the reaver bow is a waste of time. I also think that having no kind of defense for your lord is insane. Give him folariaths robes at mininum or a ward save. LSG dont shoot in two ranks for stand and shoot as far as i know. I like the idea of the list. I think you should take some more magic defense as well as some casty power if that makes any sense to you. Either a ring of fury or jewel of the dusk or something.
I still and always will think that the units of 7 SM are a waste of time. Anyone with a brain will neutralize them before any combat of any kind is met.

I also think the archers in a list of seaguard are a waste. You could take another ranked unit of seaguard and take some of the leftover points to put to magic items for the mages.
Peace
Seconded, if you drop the Reaver Bow noble and 10 archers you can get another unit of sea guard. And that will help you a lot. I would, as I said before, stick the 2 SM units togeather into one. Possibly making it like the following:

18 Swordmasters: Full Command, Banner of Sorcery.

That's a unit that I have used a lot, it works really well and everyone's afraid of it.
Not having a magical banner on your BSB gives him the option to take other magical items. I would strongly suggest the Armour of Caledor since it will give him lot's of protection.

However, having that large sword master block might not be withing your theme so it's up to you whether you want it or not.