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Caboose123
16-06-2009, 23:08
Hey all.

Here every few days I will post up an army list that I will want comments, suggestions, etc on.
I am a fairly inexperienced fantasy player so any and all advice would be appreciated, and I will be fairly content with comments of "I like the list." :)
Feel free to respond to old army lists in this thread as well as the latest one. Hopefully, I will be able to keep this thread going for a few weeks.

I have a few ideas for army lists I wanted to post up, but rather than creating a bunch of new threads I have created this thread.
(I don't think this thread violates any forum rules, please tell me if it does and I'll lock it or something...)

Anyway, without further adieu...

Caboose123
16-06-2009, 23:56
Warriors of Chaos - 2250 points (Couldn't fit it into 2k)

Meera's Host

Great Meera of the Mist
Sorcerer(ess) Lord
Lv4, Spell Familiar, Book of Secrets, Conjoined Homunculus, Crown of Everlasting Conquest
380 pts

Sgveld the Subtle
Sorcerer
Lv2, Third Eye of Tzeentch, Power Familiar, Blasphemous Amulet, Demonic Mount
245 pts

Prince Blaque the Corrupt
Exalted Hero
Great Weapon, Battle Standard Bearer, Rod of Torment, Mark of Nurgle
208 pts

The Marshmen
28x Marauders
Shields, Light Armour, Full Command
188 pts
Exchanged Great Weapons for Light Armour + Shield

Dark Truth
28x Marauders
Shields, Light Armour, Full Command
188 pts

The Northeners
6x Marauder Horsemen
Light Armour, Spears, Musician
96 pts
Lost Unit Champion & Mark of Nurgle

The Hunt
6x Warhounds
36 pts

Shroudfeast
6x Warhounds
36 points

Royal Guard
14x Chosen
Shields, Halberds, Full Command, Favour of the Gods, Banner of Wrath, Mark of Nurgle
380 pts

Redemption
4x Chaos Trolls
180 pts

Shadow Behemoths
6x Chaos Knights
Unit Champion, Standard Bearer, Rapturous Standard
300 pts

There she is, ain't she a beaut? So I need help "fixing" this list. All advice, suggestions and comments are greatly appreciated. Below will be a note on the units and tactics, which is wordy and can be ignored if you like... Thanks in Advance.
__________________________________________________ ___

Notes:
When I was building a list I had a pretty engaging background for this army in mind, thusly, you can ignore all the silly names for the units if you want. I usually play Empire, and this comes across in this list I think, with the large units and the characters, and the flanking units...

Units:
-The Lv 4 mage chooses lore of shadow, for her spells and her item. She will also usually snag the extra power dice off the Lv2 mage. She usually joins the Marauders, but can "wander" 'cos of the crown and steed of shadows. I, personally don't like the WOC lores, and this gives her some options pre-game depending on whom I'm playing, against Wood Elves she could choose fire, for example. She is an interesting choice who inspired this list methinkgs.
-The Lv 2 mage is essentially just mandatory back-up. The Eye is unreliable but could be handy, depending. This mage would probably join a Marauder Unit.
-The "Pseudo-Priest" I imagine with 4 arms, to carry the Great Weapon, the BSB, and the Rod of Torment. With only 2 mages I think the 2 bound spells help a great deal for the magic phase. I 'spose you may gasp at the lack of a certain helmet for this guy, but, meh...
-The Marauder blocks build up numbers in this list, they are equipped differently for variety depending on the opponent. Their purpose is to hold in combat while somehting gets in to the flanks. They can be fielded 5x5 or 6x4 depending on their opponents as well, usually though 5x5 is safer...
-If you don't like Warhounds you will hate some of my lists. They can screen and go bother enemy artillery pieces, archer units, etc. The Marauder Horsemen fulfill 2 roles. Hunting those susceptible targets, and flanking for the Marauders. The Mark of Nurgle is probably unneccesary, but it offers a little protection.
-There are 3 Hard hitting units in this list, the Chosen, the Trolls and the Knights. The Knights coming in at exactly 300 pts are one of my favourite units. I want the opponent to have to kill all of them, and for them to be able to face down big combat resolutions, hence the magic banner.
- The Trolls seem like a no-brainer. Unreliable but with regeneration they can be quite tough to get rid off, and they add some much needed punch. Obviously though, they are for flanking as well.
- The Chosen are in ranks of 6 with a few spare. The banner might also be an odd choice, but will add to the perhaps a tad feeble magic phase. They do what chosen do best, hacking down enemy. As with all of the 3 hard hitting units they will try to flank after the marauders, but can go toe-to-toe with units if needs be.

The Plan:
The Mage will choose Shadow, and hopefully cause some havoc. Lurker can be used on a lot of the units to give them added boost. The 2 blocks of Marauders will be together in the centre. On one side of them will be the Trolls, the other will be the Chosen. The Hounds will screen at the front. The Horsemen and Knights then will be on the flanks. Otherwise its just a general advance, nothing fancy. The Marauders will try their hardest to get hit first, and after 1 or 2 rounds should still have enough guys for 3 rank bonus, when the proper units join in, the BSB will help in this.

Anyway, all comments welcome etc. POST!

Draconian77
18-06-2009, 02:46
You won't get many responses, but I'll bump you anyway! :p

I wouldn't pay for the unit Champion or the Mark of Nurgle on the Marauder Horsemen.

Use these points to bump the Trolls up to Dragon Ogres, I like Trolls but after using my Druchii I can safely say that Ld8 and Stupidity is far too unreliable, leave Trolls for armies with Throgg or Chaos Lords.

If the Marauders are bunkers for your mages I recomend you give them the Mark of Slaanesh, isn't about 10 points? It could easily stop a 545pt mages fluffing a panic/terror check and fleeing off the board.

If they are bunkers, don't go with Great Weapons, T3 and no save means you won't be getting any attacks anyway.

All these modifcations can be done by simply dropping 2-3 Marauders from each squad I reckon.

Caboose123
18-06-2009, 22:05
Well, I agree that I could drop the Mark of Nurgle and the unit champ on the Marauder Horsemen, to give me some points to spend.
I don't see the need to bump the trolls into dragon ogres. They have the regeneration, and as they're only meant for flanking it doesn't matter if they go stupid once in the first 2 turns...
The Marauders are kinda bunkers. Depending on the army the Lv4 mat get steed of shadowed closer to the enemy or behind the enemy. I 'spose the only reason for not having Slaanesh on is for fluff then, but honestly Ld8 with re-rolls is plenty, and with so many guys they will rarely take panic checks anyway.
Yeah, I think the Great Weapons were a bad idea now that I think about it... Unless they get the charge they won't get any attacks anyway, and I should try to reduce casualties as much as possible with these guys...

I'll Edit the list to account for these shortly.
(Btw, tomorrow will see an Empire army go up here as well...)

Caboose123
19-06-2009, 14:58
Notes:
Firstly, I love the lore of beasts, sounds odd, but this list was built with this in mind. Secondly, a cookie to someone who catches all the puns in this list! :p

Empire - 2250 points (Still couldn't fit it into 2k :D)

(Not!) Weasels, And Assorted Cowards!

Feral Fred the Atheist
Wizard Lord
Lv4, Doomfire Ring, Holy Relic, Power Stone
305 pts

Wild Waldo
Battle Wizard
Lv2, Van Hostmann's Speculum, Power Stone
150 pts

Babe Ruth
Empire Captain
Hammer of Judgement, Armour of Meteoric Iron, Battle Standard Bearer
125 pts

The "Happy Chappy" Chaplain
Warrior Priest
Dawn Armour, Sigil of Sigmar, Shield
143 pts

Bodyguards
30x Swordsmen
Full Command
205 pts

Body Parts
Detachment: 11x Free Company
55 pts

Soaked Soot
Detachment: 8x Handgunners
64 pts

Squad Mandatory
30x Swordsmen
Full Command
205 pts

Mandatory Backup
Detachment: 11x Free Company
55 pts

Rusty Barrel
Detachment: 8x Handgunners
64 pts

Mountaineers
10x Archers
Huntsmen
100 pts

Order of the Prairie
5x Knights
115 pts

Order of the Dog
5x Knights
115 pts

Foxtrot
6x Pistoliers
Musician
115 pts

Faster, Presently
6x Outriders
126 pts

Bertie's Blaster
Great Cannon
100 pts

Miscast
Giant
205 pts

Thats it. As with the last list, below will be a note on units and tactics. You can skip it if you want. Otherwise all comments and stuff appreciated...
_______________________________________________

Notes #2:
As I said Lore of Beasts for the mages. Everyone is US1, and can be Beast Angers if needs be. Also, this list doesn't have an Arch Lector!!! or STanks!!! Amazing...

Units:
2 Characters will join each unit of swordsmen. The Lv4 will be with the priest methinks, but there is some scope for change. I feel as though I should squeeze a Rod of Power in there somewhere, and maybe one of the power stones should be swapped for a dispel scroll instead, my theory was always that magic heavy armies should have lots of dispel dice anyway (In this case 6). The Lv2 can obviously take out characters with his trinket, and the Captain can take out heavy infantry. The shooting here is for drawing the enemy towards the solid wall of the swordsmen. The Knights will flank to swing combats in their favour. The Pistoliers and Huntsmen can take out those more troublesome units (Fast cavalry, lone mages, etc.). The Giant is the shock unit, who can take out large targets and well, anything he wants really...

Tactics:
The 2 swordsmen units joined by the characters stick together along with the giant in the centre to give a nice strong core. Cannon and Outriders will go outside them. The Knights will turn infield to flank, or if needed will go forward into nasty units. Yeah, otherwise its pretty normal... Wait for them to come to me, then let them regret coming closer. :evilgrin:

Anyway, post here if you have any thoughts or whatnot... Its not an uber competetive list, but it could be improved...

Caboose123
21-06-2009, 23:09
Notes:
After picking up the DoC book for the first time I read it, and noticed how glaringly bad the book is, so many things are just wrong... anyway, here's my attempt at making a "Non-Cheesy" "Semi Competetive" "Fluffy" Slaanesh army! (With a bit of Tzeentch...)

Demons of Chaos -2250 points (I really struggle to get lists into 2k!!! :wtf:)

Embrace of Slaanesh

Sl'ikstaar "Plastic Jesus"
Herald of Slaanesh
Etherblade, Lv1
190 pts

Shre'wep'q
Herald of Slaanesh
Etherblade, Battle Standard Bearer, Great Standard of Sundering
215 pts
Replaced Many Armed Monstrosity with Etherblade :cries:

Tzlaat Gwit
Herald of Tzeentch
Chariot of Tzeentch, Spell Breaker, Iridescent Corona
225 pts

Warmth of Slaanesh
25x Demonettes
Full Command
330 pts

Kiss of Slaanesh
25x Demonettes
Full Command
330 pts

Desire of Slaanesh
15x Demonettes
Standard Bearer, Banner of Ecstasy
217 pts

Sky Scratch
8x Furies
96 pts

Sins of the Flesh
6x Seekers of Slaanesh
Standard Bearer, Siren Standard, Unit Champion
183 pts
Removed Musician, is pointless for these guys! :p

Sins of the Mind
5x Seekers of Slaanesh
Standard Bearer, Unit Champion
144
Ditto ^

Truth & Beauty
2x Fiends of Slaanesh
110

Gwit's Flames
6x Flamers
210

Have I achieved my goals of making a non cheesy, semi competetive, fluffy Slaanesh list (with a bit of Tzeentch), have any ideas on how I could make this list less cheesy, more semi competetive, etc...?
_________________________________________________

Notes #2:
Its a fairly bog-standard list, but very fast, very fast indeed. I'll talk about Tzeentch first: I wanted an all-Slaanesh army, but I'd need a scroll caddy and lo! I notice the only person that can take a scroll is a Tzeentch Herald, a Lv2 Mage. I didn't want a magic list, so I couldn't buy a unit of Horrors for him. With 3 levels of magic I think you may as well go the full way and make a magic list, so I buy a chariot for him. I have already decided to buy another Tzeentch unit, cos a single Tzeentch Herald in a Slaanesh list would be kinda wierd, and I didn't need a unit of screamers: This list already has a lot of fast units to do their job, so I'm left with flamers and a predicament. Flamers are well-known to be cheese, and Fiends of Slaanesh are awesome. So I take 1 unit of Flamers and 2 Fiends. I'm not happy with this resolution, but I thought you'd like to know my thought patterns here as I wrote this list. You may comment on the Lv1 mage of Slaanesh. Well, I thought about my magic phase, how I'd have a lone Lv2 Tzeentch mage. With the Tzeentch spells fairly hard to cast I think he will need 3 dice each turn. This leaves me with an unused dice. I didn't like this (Even in this non-magicky list!), so the solution, a Lv1 Slaanesh mage (Paradox in my thought process here) who can use 2 dice each magic phase, and gives me a valuable extra dispel dice. This gives me 4 dispel dice, which is awkward at best. On average IMHO that leaves me with 3 dice to dispel 1 spell and 1 dice is wasted. I hate this game! :p. To solve this I buy the Great Standard of Sundering (I probably would have bought it anyways...), meaning I can probably use 2 dice to dispel a spell, and thus my characters are selected.

Units:
-"Plastic Jesus" is the General. He can also kill enemy characters. The other Herald of Slaanesh kills infantry, simple, see? Overly so... BSB seems like a no-brainer as well. Lord choices for a 2k game in Demon armies are a tad expensive, and I was frustrated with the Slaanesh Greater Demon (To say the least)
-The "Scroll Caddy" begins my Tzeentch detachment to this list... (See above)
-The 2 big blocks of Demonettes are this army's core. Each joined by a Herald of Slaanesh they're sure to be deadly when they reach combat. 25 allows for 5x5 or 6x4 depending on circumstances (Usually 6x4 as they have ASF).
-The Third Unit of Demonettes is the mandatory 3rd core, as well as bait. Their job is to hold a charge, not all die in 1 round and wait for assistance in the form of the bigger blocks or the fast support units.
-The 2 units of Seekers annoy me. Being ItP scuppers their role as Fast Cavalry and look equally bad when compred to Fiends (Which I love!). I'm still not sure about these 2 units composition, and I'm verging on dropping the smaller one for more fiends, but alas, I only have 2 rare choice...
-The Flamers end the Tzeentch detachment. They really are powerful and can weaken units before combat, and deal with annoying units fluttering about behind the demonettes, things like eagles etc. They are versatile units.

Tactics:
The 3 blocks march up the centre, the faster support units use their speed to get into advantageous flanking postitions, as well as dealing with troublesome fast cav and shooting units, so my demonettes arrive into combat relatively unscathed. Hopefully the enemy will get minced once they reach the Slaanesh Heralds and Demonettes, and if they don't flee will get flanked. Even if they do win, I suspect they will be damaged, and here the faster units will combine to finish them off.

I really like this list, but multiple units with 2+ or higher saves could bother it. Any thoughts on how to improve this list? (While keeping it fluffy and non cheesy :p)

Draconian77
22-06-2009, 01:26
Sl'ikstaar "Plastic Jesus"[/I]
Herald of Slaanesh
Etherblade, Lv1
190 pts


Shre'wep'q
Herald of Slaanesh
Many Armed Monstrosity, Battle Standard Bearer, Great Standard of Sundering
215 pts

Should have an Etherblade aswell, you even mentioned to youself that heavily armoured foes could be a problem and the Daemonette units generate enough attacks.


Tzlaat Gwit
Herald of Tzeentch
Chariot of Tzeentch, Spell Breaker, Iridescent Corona
225 pts

Corona? It's worthless...surely Flames of Tzeentch, Master of Sorcery or simply saving yourself 25pts would be better?

Warmth of Slaanesh
25x Demonettes
Full Command
330 pts

Siren Standard is pure gold...dont leave home without it! For fluffly reasons I would drop the units down to 23 stronge for a final model count of 24.

Kiss of Slaanesh
25x Demonettes
Full Command
330 pts

Same as the above.

Desire of Slaanesh
15x Demonettes
Standard Bearer, Banner of Ecstasy
217 pts

I would be tempted to drop these for Horrors...but in theme I would drop them around to 12 models just to save some points. With M6 and their obvious role as a 1 turn speedbump spending more than the minimum seems pointless.

Sky Scratch
8x Furies
96 pts

8 seems wasteful, for fluff reasons and effectiveness reasons I would be tempted to drop them to 6.

Sins of the Flesh
6x Seekers of Slaanesh
Standard Bearer, Siren Standard, Unit Champion
183 pts
Removed Musician, is pointless for these guys! :p

I wouldn't add the Standard(+100vps?) or the Champion either. Save some more points.

Sins of the Mind
5x Seekers of Slaanesh
Standard Bearer, Unit Champion
144
Ditto ^

Same as the above, they don't real benefit from unit upgrades but for fluff reasons I would add one more.

Truth & Beauty
2x Fiends of Slaanesh
110

I would run these in units of 3~4 myself.

Gwit's Flames
6x Flamers
210

Well, can't see a problem here...

Have I achieved my goals of making a non cheesy, semi competetive, fluffy Slaanesh list (with a bit of Tzeentch), have any ideas on how I could make this list less cheesy, more semi competetive, etc...?

Maybe and maybe. You don't need to make the list less cheesy, you need to boost it! As it stands I think it would struggle to beat mediocre opposition. _________________________________________________



~~~~~~~~~~~

Caboose123
22-06-2009, 02:20
Giving both of them etherblade makes sense, will edit that methinks... Never liked using the same weapon twice... seems too much like cheating...

I dont think Corona is worthless... Anyways, I like the Lore of Tzeentch and I think Flames will be useless if hes on a chariot, he'll be in combat most of the time...
Maybe I'll save the points...

Siren Standard isn't all that great, the fast units should have dealt with the shooting, and i have no qualms with them fleeing from the demonettes. I want a unit of >25 so they can choose between 6x4 or 5x5. That whole sacred number thing is silly anyway.

With T3 and only a 5+ Ward save I consider a unit of 15 the minimum (To take charges from things like Chaos Knights, Blood Knights, really big nasty things).

Big Unit of Furies to account for casualties and to ensure they don't fluff their charge against Archers or Artillery. Again Sacred number is silly...

Siren Standard is important for those more expensive Seekers methinks. Missile Fire could hurt them, and an automatic +1 CR is handy just in case. They won't get run over by anything, either they'll get killed outside of combat, or the enemy will pursue whatever else was in combat, cos these guys should never go into combat by themselves (Unless they see an exposed flank...).

Bah! I'm defending my choices to the last. Another Etherblade might be a good idea, I liked the idea of 6 S4 armour piercing attacks...

Caboose123
25-06-2009, 02:28
Back to Warriors of Chaos, and this time for a Khornate Norse Army, lots of Marauders, very fun! :evilgrin: And I don't care if nobody reads these things! :p
Mark of Khorne is abbreviated as "MoK".

Warriors of Chaos - 2000 points (Woot!)

The Red Scare

Nilat's Bloody Hand
Exalted Hero
Shield, Juggernaut of Khorne, MoK, Axe of Khorne
225 pts

Nale, Hammer of Khorne
Exalted Hero
Sword of Might, Collar of Khorne, Shield, Barded Chaos Steed, MoK
191 pts

Vessel of Khorne
Exalted Hero
Armour of Zhrakk, Helm of Many Eyes, Great Weapon, MoK, Battle Standard Bearer
198 pts

Ovra, Leader of the Cult of Bone
Chaos Sorcerer
2x Dispel scrolls, Barded Chaos Steed
151 pts

Enraged Gulags
24x Marauders
Great Weapons, Full Command, MoK
170 pts

Cultists of Kamenov
24x Marauders
Shields, Light Armour, Full Command, MoK
194 pts

Cultists of Zimoniev
24x Marauders
Shields, Light Armour, Full Command, MoK
194 pts

Call of Khorne

5x Chaos Warhounds
30 pts

5x Chaos Warhounds
30 pts

5x Chaos Warhounds
30 pts

5x Chaos Warhounds
30 pts

5x Chaos Warhounds
30 pts

Red Riders
6x Marauder Horsemen
Shields, Light Armour, Flails, Unit Champion, MoK
144 pts

Cult of Bone, Champions
6x Marauder Horsemen
Light Armour, Spears, Throwing Axes, Musician, Standard Bearer
120 pts

Cult of Bone, Elite
6x Marauder Horsemen
Light Armour, Spears, Throwing Axes, Musician, Standard Bearer
120 pts

The Red Beast
Chaos Chariot
MoK
150 pts

Thats the list, comment, rate, etc. As if you care...
_______________________________________________

Notes:
A nice little list here. A Khorne mob joined by the Cult of Bone (Everything without the Mark of Khorne!) Its focused around 3 big mobs rushing, as fast as their legs can carry them, towards the enemy. The marauders add ranks and the characters essentially win the combats single-handedly! I love Chaos :D . I would've liked some Spawn, Giant, Warshrines or even forsaken in this list... And yes, that is 25 Warhounds!

Units:
- The Characters have a nice amount of variety. The Great Weapon guy goes with the similarly equipped Marauders, so they can actually get some attacks. The one on the Juggernought is geared towards character killing and the last is a nice versatile guy, he will join the smallest unit of Marauders along with the caddy.
- The Marauders are in my favourite formation, either 5x5 or 6x4 depending. Their Priority is to add CR.
- The Warhounds are screens and will block shooting and will rush forwards as fast as possible to threathen the enemy early on.
- The Norse "Heavy Cavalry" have a shock flanking role, to aid any unit that needs it by slamming in the flanks. They are not designed to act on their own (lack of musician & standard) though they can if needs be.
- The Fast Cav is there to bother any troublesome units, other Fast Cav, mages archers artillery etc. but they can assist in the centre if thats needed, or they can combine with the "Heavy Cavalry" if its needed.
- And with my last few points I had quite a few options: more heavy cavalry or spawn? In the end I went with a Chariot, it is a tough unit and a nice big distration, as well as being horrific in combat.

Tactics:
For the most part its a general advance. The Warhounds, Heavy and Light Cavalry will rush forward as fast as possible. The Warhounds will be deployed in front of the Marauders, and maybe a unit will join the other flanking units. On one side will be a Chariot and 1 unit of Fast Cavalry, on the other side will be the other Fast Cavalry and the Heavy Cavalry. They can all turn inside to help, but on their own they are still quite powerful if they combine their efforts. All in all its a fairly decent list and I imagine it could do well.

"Despite the limitations of a Norse list this army is still competetive."
Discuss, and suggest any changes you would make to help this list...

Draconian77
25-06-2009, 16:47
I dont think Corona is worthless...

Then you haven't played WHFB before...:p


Anyways, I like the Lore of Tzeentch and I think Flames will be useless if hes on a chariot, he'll be in combat most of the time...
Maybe I'll save the points...

Both are better options than Corona.

Siren Standard isn't all that great, the fast units should have dealt with the shooting, and i have no qualms with them fleeing from the demonettes. I want a unit of >25 so they can choose between 6x4 or 5x5. That whole sacred number thing is silly anyway.

Shooting units are the units in the game least likely to flee, being close to their table edge and all. The Siren standard means that you won't be spending the game chasing things like Skinks and Dark Riders, in such a small army just a few turns of your main combat units being misdirected could ruin your chances of winning.

With T3 and only a 5+ Ward save I consider a unit of 15 the minimum (To take charges from things like Chaos Knights, Blood Knights, really big nasty things).

Well, you won't need that many in my experience. With Ws5 and a 5+ ward the chances of 10~12 of them being killed in a single turn is low, very low.

Big Unit of Furies to account for casualties and to ensure they don't fluff their charge against Archers or Artillery. Again Sacred number is silly...

You said you wanted a fluffy army, the sacred number of Slaanesh is 6. I don't see the problem here. Big units of Furies are a waste. Either find the points to make 2 small units or save some points by dropping the excess.

Siren Standard is important for those more expensive Seekers methinks. Missile Fire could hurt them, and an automatic +1 CR is handy just in case.

So is an extra 100 Vp's for running them down...you're making your cheap missile hunting unit into something more along the lines of a flankning unit, if thats the case you may as well add a mounted Herald to the unit.

They won't get run over by anything, either they'll get killed outside of combat, or the enemy will pursue whatever else was in combat, cos these guys should never go into combat by themselves (Unless they see an exposed flank...).

That seems to be rather naive thinking, fast cavalry get caught in combats all the time(especially against armies that are hordy, have flyers or skirmishers or that have a lot of shooting.) Especially ItP fast cavalry worth over 250pts is caught.

Bah! I'm defending my choices to the last. Another Etherblade might be a good idea, I liked the idea of 6 S4 armour piercing attacks...

...If you think cavalry will be a problem tool to deal with them.

~~~~~~~~~~~

Caboose123
28-06-2009, 01:17
I'm actually worried about stand and shoot, not Flee, fast cav don't like stand and shoot...

Corona is fine for now, its not that bad! Honestly!

I'd Rather be safe with 15... just in case, I expect them to get mauled horribly in combat, every time.

8 isn't big. Besides shooting units have a wide frontage usually. In this (Slaanesh) list I already have plenty of things that can do the Furies job, 1 unit is enuff!

And I have tooled to deal with knights.

(Btw, they way you respond, inside my quote is hard to respond to, though I am guilty of doing this myself sometimes...)

Caboose123
28-06-2009, 02:01
An Empire Army, my favourite! Not only that, but this is a combat Empire Army!!!

Empire - 2000 points

The Cheapshot

Lord Burgundy
Templar Grand Master
Hammer of Judgement, Shield of the Gorgon, Holy Relic, Barded Warhorse, Full Plate Mail
240 pts

Iggy rides out
Warrior Priest
Barded Warhorse, Heavy Armour, Shield, Van Horstmann's Speculum, Sigil of Sigmar
155 pts

Dark Accountant
Wizard
Lv2, 2x Dispel Scrolls
150 pts

"Bullseye" Bill
Captain
Imperial Pegasus, Doomfire Ring, Enchanted Shield, Full Plate Mail, Lance
157 pts

Tilean Mounted Duelists
7x Knights
Inner Circle, Full Command, Steel Standard
241 pts

Brazen Bold
7x Knights
Inner Circle, Full Command, War Banner
246 pts

Foxtrot
7x Pistoliers
Musician
133 pts

Croquet Crusaders
7x Pistoliers
Musician
133 pts

Miscast!
Giant
205 pts

Like a Bat!
10x Flagellants
100 pts

Outwalkers
10x Archers
Huntsmen
100 pts

X Men
10x Crossbowmen
80 pts

Contingency Unit
30x Swordsmen
Full Command
205 pts

Last Chance
Detachment: 12x Militia
60 pts

That's the list. 'Tis a fine list but it seriously needs help, see below for my thought(s) etc.
______________________________________

Notes:
Right, here are the problems. Its a list focused around its 2 cavalry units. The unit with the warbanner is joined by the priest and head straight on and smash into an enemy unit. The Priest Bothers the Enemy Character and the IC knights with their re-rolls win the combat by sheer brute force. The Other Unit of Knights is joined by the Templar, though they have to flank a unit and the Templar will also bother an enemy character by first weakening him (-1 A) then surviving (4+ ward) then Hammering him into tiny bits. The Flagellants are only there cos I had 100 spare points at the end, the militia could be dropped to 10 or 9 and the swordsmen could be dropped to 25, all of this meaning I would have 140 points to play around with. I'm not advers to the idea of dropping IC on the Templar's knights and adding a cannon, but only if this idea is backed. I Gave the Mage Lv2 cos with only a Lv1 mage the Priests' powers are wasted, but with Lv 2 Mage and a Priest I decided to give the Captain the Doomfire Ring, my reasoning being he could get into all sorts of nasty positions with it. This is prolly not a good idea and if its suggested I would gladly reduce the mage back to Lv1 and drop the ring. This gives me 65 points and added to the previous 140 gives me 205. Taking off the IC as I thought I should be able to add a small squad of utility knights. In summary:

Amendments:
Remove-
5 swordsmen
2 militia
All the Flagellants
Inner Circle on Lord's Unit
Doomfire Ring
Lv2 on Mage

Add-
Cannon
5x Knights (Vanilla Knights)
Other stuff for Captain (Maybe if points allow)

Wadd'ya think?

Units:
- Characters include 2 character killers, 1 scroll caddy and 1 captain with a pegasus and some free time. :evilgrin: Priest joins Warbanner Unit, Templar joins other knights. Wizard joins Swordsmen.
- The Knights are supposed to tear the enemy's army to pieces, sounds ambitious? Steel Standard means they can out-distance other knights if it comes to that...
- Swordsmen are the second wave, and bunker for the mage. They go up to assist if the knights falter (though if knights lose their +2 S and re-rolls to hit they're dead meat anyways). Anything that defeats the knights may struggle here (?...!?)
- Huntsmen do generic Huntsmen stuff, generally bother fast cav etc.
- Pistoliers join Huntsmen and Captain. They also have the fun job of picking off tough units, and are part of the second wave and will join combat in latter parts of the game if necessary...
- Giant is my "cannon-on-legs" and general big distraction. I love these guys, who knows how they will perform on the day? They can keep up with the Knights though, always handy.
- Flagellants tie up an enemy unit for 1 turn or something... I had spare points and had no remaining effort... :p
- The Crossbowmen deserve a mention. (That was it...)

Tactics:
The Priest's Unit charge up the centre with the Swordsmen following to their sides behind them. The Giant also follows on the other side of these guys, providing a flank charge if needs be. The Huntsmen, Pegasus Captain and the Pistoliers all begin with the same "Hunt" role, to kill fast cav, missile troops, artillery, mages, lone characters and maybe hurt big beasties... Hopefully the Charges from the Knights badly hurt 2 units, and the Giant, Pistoliers and Swordsmen "mop-up".


Yeah I need help with this one... So any comments suggestions posts etc....

Draconian77
28-06-2009, 05:23
Empire Stuff

Well, as you said I would indeed drop the Mage down to level 1 and drop the Doomfire Ring.

Now for some other ideas. Have you considered the Shroud of Magnus instead of the Relic? This would give both your hammer units MR and would be really helpful against armies with access to the lore of Metal or Beasts. I think you get more overall protection from the Shroud.

You could also consider putting the Speculum onto your flying Captain, the reasoning being its much easier to catch enemy characters(cough "Bloodthirster" cough) with him than the Priest.

I do think some shooting of the artillery kind is necessary, just to make the enemy come to you or to eliminate large monsters.

For army drops and adds I would probably do the following:

Drop 10 Flagelants.(100)
Drop 7 Pistoliers.(133)
Drop 1 Pistolier.(17?)

I'm just not sire than an aggressive army like yours needs 2 units of expensive fast cavalry when you already have Huntsmen in the list.

Drop 5 Swordsmen.(30)
Drop 2 Militia(10)-Split the Detach into 2x5 man squads.
Drop the extra magic level and the Doomfire Ring.(65)

Points saved: 345

Spend on:

A Cannon.
A Hellblaster. (I know, Bs3, but it's main role would be to stop flying large targets from getting to your firebase, if not this then maybe the Hellstorm. Hellstorms being great against any army that likes to castle(most gunlines/magic lines) or any horde armies.)
10 of any other shooting unit, personally I like Crossbowmen but Archers would be better at protecting your warmachines(360 LoS, move and fire) and Handgunners are good against a variety of different targets.)