View Full Version : First legion fluff recon? Fallen Angels spoilers

18-06-2009, 08:15
Ive just read the new DA Heresy book and on the whole its pretty good.
One thing bothered me though,
I thought DA were the first legion to be fonnd by the emperor hence why they refer to themselves as the first legion. Im sure it has a DA saying they are the first legion toward the beggining of the novel.
But toward the end of the book Jonson says this to another primarch,
'...Horus became our fathers favorite for no other reason than fate. Had I been the first one he found, I would be warmaster today. No offence.' (P411)

So has the fluff been retconned, when did this happen?
Or is Mike Lee just taking liberties/ mistakes with well established fluff?


18-06-2009, 08:19
Is there a difference between first Primarch found and first Legion founded?

18-06-2009, 08:33
Horus was found first. Legion number has nothing to do with the order they were found in.

18-06-2009, 08:34
The DA were the first of the 20 legions the Emperor founded before he launched the Great Crusade; Horus was the first Primarch the Emperor discovered during the Great Crusade. Bit of a difference.

Dang, rossatdi beat me to it.

18-06-2009, 08:40
Is there a difference between first Primarch found and first Legion founded?

(by first primarch found I mean found by the Imperiumand Emperor, not the first primarch found by the inhabitants of the planet.)
I didnt think that there is a difference. The first DA book talks about the Emperor finding Caliban. The Legion is handed over to Jonson and the Imperium moves in within days of this.

18-06-2009, 08:44
There is a pretty big gap between the discovery of the primarchs and the foundation of the marine legions. They were created in part because the primarchs vamoosed.

The emperor had 20 legions created after the 20 primarchs he had made. He then did not find them in the order the legions were made in. It's not that hard.


18-06-2009, 08:49
Yes, as Hellebore said, the Legions' numbers have nothing to do with the order they were found in and everything to do with the order they were founded in.

The Big E created the Primarchs in order, numbered them, then lost them. He then made their Legions (I would assume in the same order) then went out to find his lost sons. He found them in a different order than that of their creation. Alpharius is the last found and was also the last Legion founded. He is the only one to hold the same number Legion and place in order of discovery.

18-06-2009, 09:14
Except for Rogal Dorn, who was seventh, and commanded the VII Legion.

18-06-2009, 09:16
Dorn was found 7th and was also the 7th primarch? Where does it say that?


18-06-2009, 09:20
The Dark Angels were the first legion Founded (ie they were his pratorean guard legion - along side the Custodes until Johnson was found).

as has been said before Foun and founed have 2 completely different meanings.

mind you of all the Primarchs i find that Johnson and Russ act like brothers themost in how they interact with each other even going so far as their duels for honour and who is the best.

18-06-2009, 13:41
But erm, the Imperial Fists were also the Emperor's Praetorian Legion... And the Emperor's Children were also pretty close to the Emperor after their accident...

As for the Legions, they were also present on the Unification Wars, Garro for example fought during that conflict. It was after the Unification of Terra that the Primarchs and the Space Marines were created. So I guess that the Legions (maybe they were called Regiments first) were around longer, but then the Emperor started on the Primarch Project. This kinda backfired since Chaos took them away. With the left over material (according to 3rd edition SM Codex) the Space Marines were created, so I guess the Emperor also used those veterans from the Unification Wars for that.

18-06-2009, 19:32
The Emperor's warriors during the Unification wars were, in fact, surgically enhanced. However, the genetic modification was incredibly basic compared to later Astartes, after geneseed insertion.

These Thunder Armoured warriors were inducted into the ranks of the Adeptus Astartes sometime after the Emperor completed his conquest of Earth. Well, those that were young enough.

18-06-2009, 20:05
Back then, they could make Space Marines from older initiates. I can not remember where I read that, though. I swear it was in one of the 2nd Ed books.

Lord Malorne
18-06-2009, 20:13
For the first time it makes me wonder, how did they know who's legions belonged to which primarch?

Must have been a genseed test or somesuch.

18-06-2009, 20:16
I remember the World Eaters Veterans Space Marines killed by Angron when they try to make him realize that is their Primarch.And Kharn whose diplomacy make the madman to understand the new reality...
If Angron was given to the DA?

Lord Malorne
18-06-2009, 20:24
Your post makes no sense :confused:.

Col. Tartleton
18-06-2009, 21:18
He's saying that the World Eaters are really lucky to have had Kharn, if not for him there legion wouldn't be functional. Angron would be killing them left and right instead of ordering them to follow his lead and kill things left and right. The Dark Angels not having Kharn would be screwed.

Lord Malorne
18-06-2009, 21:21
But kharn as he is portrayed 'now' was only a recent BL addition to the background, he was not as such before that book, what does the worldeaters have to do with this thread :confused: why am I in 40k background :cries:.

19-06-2009, 05:23
Tks Colonel Tartleton for explanation and sorry Lord Malorne for being a little bit confuse (and of course the language barrier is sometimes hard for me to pass it :( ).
I want it to say that maybe a special "feeling" is put in each SM gene-seed so that they can know their kin (other members of the same legion) and their primarch.
I know that Kharn pre-heresy way of being is a recent addition, but this what we have to take into account.