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Therion
31-12-2005, 09:30
I apologize if this is posted in the wrong forum, but I couldn't find a battle reports forum anywhere.

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As a proper end to the Warhammer year 2005 I participated in a tournament called 'Breakfast for Champions' this week. It was a Finnish invitational tournament for players who have placed in the top3 of a 'Chaosboyz' tournament atleast once during the past couple of seasons. The tournament consisted of 6 games, three being Warhammer and three Warhammer 40K, so players brought two armies; 2000 points of Warhammer, and 1500 points of 40K.

The Warhammer part of the tournament took place on Wednesday, and I took High Elves with me. I borrowed the army from a friend, and didn't manage to get any practise games with the list before the tournament, so I wasn't sure how well I would be able to do.

I took:

Prince on Dragon, Loremaster, 3 Scrolls
Commander on Eagle, Fusil of Conflagration
Commander on Eagle
3x5 Silver Helms
8 Tiranoc Chariots
3 Eagles

Game 1, Bretonnians

The opponent had four large units of Knights of the Realm, a large unit of Grail Knights, Mounted Yeomen, Pegasus Knights and a lot of heroes inside the lances. He had two Damsels. The match was Pitched Battle. I deployed evenly all over my deployment zone, while he had most of his stuff on my left hand side.

He prayed for the blessing, but I let him start the game. His first turn was uneventful, as my opponent was also using a new army, so he advanced very cautiously, looking out for my 18" charge range. His Master of Wood killed a Silver Helm. I moved an inch or two mostly, except that my Dragon and Great Eagle with flamer flew towards the middle to take cover behind a large wood. Next turn I would be on his deployment zone with the two models. On my right hand side, I took a Great Eagle and Commander on Eagle towards his Mounted Yeomen, asking for a charge. My bows from chariots didn't manage any kills.

On his turn two, Mounted Yeomen charged the Great Eagle, while everywhere else the Bretonnians were still shaking in their boots, and didn't move really. Great Eagle fled, but I rolled 4 inches on 3D6 and my Eagle was destroyed. I used a Dispel Scroll to stop a Master of Wood. My turn came, so my Commander on Eagle charged the Yeomen, who held, as they were about 3" away from my Eagle rider to begin with. I didn't charge elsewhere. My Dragon moved between two units of Knights of the Realm together with an Eagle rider and a Great Eagle. My breath weapon killed two Knights, but the enemy held, and didn't panic. The Commander on the right killed the Yeomen and ran their remaining models down to the ground.

Turn three came, but everyone passed their terror tests. Pegasus Knights charged my Dragon from some curious angle I didn't realise was possible, considering the Pegasus Knights had been hiding behind the enemy army mostly, and we had a lot of intervening terrain between the Dragon and the Pegasi. Apparently I had been too careless in moving the Dragon to assume the Pegasus Knights didn't see me. They passed their terror test. The rest of the Bretonnians started advancing everywhere now, for some reason. I scrolled a Howler Wind. I challenged the Pegasus Knight champion, who accepted and managed to put two wounds on my Prince before I killed him. The enemy still held his ground because the Pegasus Knight unit was big. In my turn, on the left hand side three Tiranoc Chariots charged the enemy general's unit, while Commander on Eagle and a normal Great Eagle charged the Pegasus Knights in combat with the Dragon. On the right side, three chariots charged another Knights of the Realm unit. I rolled nicely on the impacts and I went through everywhere, taking his general down and capturing a couple of banners. The Pegasus Knights managed to kill my Prince before they fled and I destroyed them.

The opponent still couldn't do any charges with his Grail Knights or two remaining Knights of the Realm units because the units I had used for charging had overrun behind him, and the game was really short from here. In the end I think I charged the Grails with about 6 chariots and the Dragon, and wiped them out in orderly fashion. I only lost the Prince in this game, but his Dragon had full health remaining. Massacre win, 20-0.

Game 2, Skaven

The mission objective was normal VPs in addition to 1000 points for a marker in the middle, which could only be held by rank and file infantry atleast 10 models strong. The objective also happened to be inside a wood. The Skaven had Grey Seer, 2 Warlocks and Assassin. He had 4 large units of Clanrats with Ratling Guns, no Slaves, two units of Jezzails, two WLCs, a large unit of Gutter Runners, and a large Rat Swarm. We rolled to deploy and the enemy chose his table edge.

When he started deploying, I realised that there was a massive piece of 'rocky ground' in the middle his deployment zone, so the enemy deployed all his core troops inside difficult ground. My chariots wouldn't be charging him now. How much harder could this mission and table get for me? He deployed a unit of Jezzails and WLC on both flanks, Rat Swarms covering the left flank.

I deployed mostly on the left side, because there on his deployment zone a big mountain was blocking line of sight to the Skaven Clanrats. I would try to use that mountain as cover to advance on his flank.

He started the game, and revealed his Assassin. He didn't move at all. The opponent cast Skitterleap as his first spell and rolled irresistible force. His Assassin jumped behind my Dragon. In his shooting phase the Jezzails on the left killed a Silver Helm. The Assasin had Warpstone Stars. My opponent knew how to roll his dice, and I didn't, so my Dragon took FIVE wounds, and had one remaining. Great.

In my turn I started advancing with an Eagle, Eagle commander and a chariot on the right flank. On the left flank, my Dragon or his Eagle buddies didn't move except to turn towards the Assassin. Silver Helms started advancing towards the Jezzails, and all the chariots moved so that they could fire some shots at the Assassin. The two breath weapons and the bowfire killed the rat.

The enemy once again didn't move, because he wanted to keep inside his difficult terrain. His Jezzails and WLC wiped out my Silver Helms on the left.

I started moving now in force on the left, advancing with 4 chariots and two Eagles. I kept the Flamer Commander and the Dragon still behind the big wall on my deployment zone to avoid shots, so I didn't really move with them. On the right, a Commander, an Eagle and some Silver Helms were threatening the other Jezzails and WLC.

Gutter Runners tunneled into the middle of the board, at the objective. Still the Skaven didn't move except to turn, and still he didn't have range for any of his spells. Jezzails and WLC managed to kill a Great Eagle and put a wound on a chariot, on the left. On the right, the WLC killed a Great Eagle and a Silver Helm. Then came my charge. On the left I charge the Rat Swarm with three chariots, and the Jezzails with one. I charged the WLC with an Eagle and chased it off the board. On the left the Commander on Eagle chased the other WLC off the board. The Dragon and the Flamer hero now advanced 20 and took cover behind the mountain that split the centre/enemy deployment zone in two. The Jezzail stand and shoot was ineffective and the chariot blasted through them and overran off the board. Three chariots put a bunch of wounds on the big Rat Swarm but two bases remained.

In Skaven turn four, the opponent thought he now had me completely and two Engineers and the Grey Seer jumped out of their units to draw LoS on the three or four visible chariots on the left flank. Gutter Runners started throwing some stars at two of my chariots in the middle, who were keeping outside Warp Lightning range, but didn't do anything. Grey Seer cast Warp Lightning, and miscast 9 and ended his magic phase. Ratling Gun shot at the Rat Swarm combat, and put two wounds on a chariot. Jezzails managed to kill my Commander on the right flank, but the Eagle remained.

In my turn, the Eagle failed monster reaction and wanted to guard the fallen Elf right there under the nose of the Jezzails for the rest of the game. I knew the opponent had made a big mistake last turn, and was just making my inevitable and only strategy more effective. The Dragon and Flamer commander flew over the mountain and came down on top of the Skaven base, ready to exterminate the rat infestation. Now I started advancing everywhere and went inside my charge ranges where I could. The Dragon's fire touched three units of Clanrats, killing one from the furthest one, and about 15 from the two other units overall, while also wounding a Warlock Engineer. The Commander carrying Fusil killed about 10 extra rats from two units overall, also killing a Ratling Gun. One of the Skaven units paniced and ran. My chariots destroyed the last of the Rat Swarm.

The opponent rolled some panic tests because of fleeing Clanrats, and a Ratling Gun or two started fleeing. Grey Seer failed his terror check and ran. A Skaven Ratling Gun killed my Prince, but failed to wound the Dragon. A Warlock Engineer in one wound killed himself with a token. Game didn't last very long from here, but the Skaven did manage to kill the Dragon and a chariot or two before the game ended. I destroyed almost everything they had, and noone had the objective in the end. I won by a margin of 670 points in the end, which was enough to give me a Solid Victory, 17-3.

Therion
31-12-2005, 09:30
Game 3, Lizardmen

We would play an Assassination scenario that used no VPs, but a chart that determined the result. If you kill 2 out of 3 heroes and enemy kills none from you, you get a solid victory, and so on.

The opponent had a second generation Slann and two Saurus heroes I guessed would have the standard Nike sportswear and Piranha blade. He also had plenty of Skinks, a unit of Saurus Warriors, a Jungle Swarm of one base, Chameleons, two units of Terradons, 4 Kroxigors, and a Stegadon.

The table had a large wood on the middle of the left table half, and a lot of hills, and some smaller woods all over the table. I was pretty determined that I wouldn't be able to win this game by a large margin, and if the Slann rolled some good offensive magic I would probably lose atleast my Eagle heroes to spells. I deployed evenly all over again, except that I deployed my three flying heroes in one tight battle group on the extreme right flank, while the enemy Slann was in the left corner. Atleast he wouldn't have range with other than Life. The Lizardman player tried his best to roll damage spells from life, but the dice weren't with him and in the end he ended up having zero damage spells. He rolled Steed of Shadows, Howler Wind, Rain Lord, Second Sign and some useless spell from Life if I recall correctly. So far so good.

I won the roll, and let the Lizardmen begin. They advanced all over the battlefield. I dispeled the re-rolls, a chariot was soaked with water and Howler Wind was on. Chameleons that scouted near the Dragon inside a wood used their blowpipes but achieved nothing. In my turn, I advanced carefully, going into my charge range from Terradons and Kroxigors who had no Skink screen because all the Skinks were protecting the Slann around a wood, and nudged my Dragon and Flamer hero a little so they could kill the Chameleons, which they did, wiping out the entire unit with breath weapons.

The Lizardmen didn't charge anywhere, and only maneouvred better to look out for my moving, although the 18" moving Saurus hero came out of a wood to look out for some easy chariot kills. Magic was uneventful, except the re-rolls succeeded but the Stegadon still didn't hit anything with the giant bow. In my turn I figured that since units were worth no VPs I could play a little more brave with them, and I charged two Terradon units with one chariot to each. They looked like they could be inside my charge range, and my guesstimation was right and they were at 18" exactly from me so I managed to hit them, one on the left flank and one on the right. Now the way seemed clear for my flyer hero base to move from the right towards enemy deployment zone, now flanking Kroxigors. Both of the chariots went through the two Terradon units and destroyed them. I moved my chariots so that the ones the Nike Saurus saw, would take his charge off the table.

The Kroxigors turned to face my heroes, and the Saurus moved to support them. A Jungle Swarm charged the flank of a Silver Helm unit. The Nike Saurus chased a chariot off the table and went off the table himself. Magic was still useless except that Howler Wind was always on, and my chariots were all being soaked, and the giant bow still always misses. Jungle Swarm couldn't kill anything. In my turn, I charged the Kroxigors with two chariots to the flank, but didn't charge the front with any of my heroes because then I would surely destroy them and get too close to the enemy Stegadon and Piranha hero, who were protecting the Slann around the wood. I also charged the Jungle Swarm with a chariot, and destroyed it, freeing the Silver Helms for some action on the Saurus' flank the next turn. The Kroxigors realised I wouldn't do anything dumb and chose to flee from the two flank charging chariots.

The Lizardmen were reinforcing their position around the wood and the Kroxigors rallied. Giant bow killed four Silver Helms, and Howler Wind was on. Now in my turn I moved my heroes deeper into the enemy deployment zone, but I still had to mostly stay behind hills and such because even a single hit of the giant bow, or a failed terror test, could cost me the entire game. I charged the Saurus with more units they have ever seen, hitting them with about 5 chariots and some Silver Helms. I destroyed every model with impact hits alone, and overran to all directions. Kroxigors charged something in the Lizardmen turn but I fled and they went a long way out of the main action. I managed to declare a charge on the Stegadon with two chariots and some Silver Helms, but because Silver Helms and the chariot failed terror and ran, the single chariot was decimated. I also managed to charge the Slann with a chariot, and later with an Eagle, but they could only put a few wounds on the model, and not kill it, and the Warbanner and outnumber made sure I would always run for my life from the combat. In my second last turn I tried my luck and forced a terror test on the Slann with the Dragon, but the toad kept his cool. I also kept following the Piranha hero with about 4 chariots for the two last turns, and did manage to cause one wound with bowfire, but wounds wouldn't count here, only kills. Neither player lost a hero, and the game ended a Draw, 11-11.

So, I finished Wednesday and the Warhammer part with 48 points, and I was still in striking distance to win the tournament.

The fourth, fifth and sixth game of the tournament would be 40K, and with me I took Space Marines, namely the yellow defenders of the imperium, the Imperial Fists of Rogal Dorn.

I took a very balanced army with me for a change, having played Chaos daemonbombs or Siren armies for two years and being utterly bored to death with them and the whole of 40K in the process. My Space Marine army had Blessed be the Warriors and Die Standing traits.

Epistolary, Jump Pack, Fury and Fear
2x6 Assault Marines, Flamer, Furious Charge
Dreadnought, Extra Armour, Assault Cannon, Missile Launcher
3x5 Tactical Marines, Lascannon, Plasma Gun
2x Tornado Speeder, Assault Cannon, HB
7 Devastators, 4x HB
2x Predator Annihilator, Extra Armours, HB sponsons

Game 4, Iron Warriors

First game Thursday morning was against a real blast from the past Iron Warriors army, with Rhinos and all other funny jazz. He had two Lieutenants, two Rhino squads, a Land Raider for some more assaulty Chaos Marines, three shooty squads, an Obliterator, and something I can't remember. The Iron Warrior player had used a VC summon horde as his FB army, and had done reasonably well.

I chose to deep strike my Jump Packers and the Librarian, although I knew I could also use them to defend against the would-be assaulters. The Chaos army started the game, but whatever shooting they had, it was ineffectual, and my Predators and Dreadnought weren't even shaken. The Rhinos and Land Raider came thundering towards my gunline. My shooting stopped one Rhino in its tracks and the passengers were pinned around it. Assault Cannons wouldn't rend at all and the Lascannons failed to roll 5+, and the Land Raider kept coming unopposed, as did the second Rhino.

The Iron Warriors disembarked from the Land Raider, the Lieutenant charging a unit of Tactical Marines and the Chaos Marines charging Devastators on a hill. Chaos Marines disembarked from a the remaining Rhino on the right, taking cover behind the vehicle. The close combat with the Devastators was a draw, but the Lieutenant destroyed a lot of models and my Marines ran from combat, leaving the Lieutenant in the open.

In my turn, my deep strikers dropped down at the enemy shooty squads. Land Speeders came in to support. I sent some help to the Devastators in the form of a 5man Tac Squad. A Predator killed the Lieutenant. The other Predator killed some Marines from the other Rhino squad, together with the Dreadnought on the right. A Land Speeder killed the Obliterator. The other Land Speeder tried his luck on the Land Raider but it didn't help, and my two remaining lascannons that could shoot couldn't penetrate either. Assault Marines and Fear of Darkness sent two units of Chaos Marines running off the table.

The second Iron Warrior Lieutenant on the right assaulted a Tactical Squad together with his Marines, and a lucky lascannon destroyed my Dreadnought. The Land Raider destroyed a Predator. The Marines were destroyed. On my turn, my Assault Marines moved to mop up the Marines that had lost their Rhino on the second turn, together with the Librarian. A Land Speeder moved to the shooty Chaos Marines holding the top right corner, while the other kept shooting at the Land Raider. I used my Predator and Fury of Ancients to kill the second Lieutenant, and his two remaining squad buddies. My Devastators were wiped out but the Tactical Marines killed the rest of the Chaos Marines. In the last turns of the game, my Librarian and Land Speeder and one unit of Assault Marines cleared the top right corner, while the second Assault Marine unit killed the stranded Chaos Rhino squad, and a Land Speeder AC finally destroyed the Land Raider. I had lost almost 1000 points of troops, but I had all quarters held and had destroyed 1500 points of Iron Warriors, so I won by a huge margin of about 2000 points, for a Massacre win, 20-0.

Therion
31-12-2005, 09:32
Game 5, Dark Eldar

My opponent told me his friend had said Dark Eldar couldn't perform out there with the big boys, and that he had taken the army to this tournament to prove his friend otherwise. He had done well so far, also massacring his first opponent for the day and scoring high in the Warhammer FB part with O&G MAD army. My opponent had been forced to read through the Dark Eldar fluff as a requisite for borrowing the army, and he said that reading through it had been the most painful experience of his life. His favorite quote was: "You are doomed, DOOMED I tell you!" Dark Eldar are very evil, and you gotta be careful when you walk out of a Commorragh pub on a Saturday night, lest the Hellions take your head as a trophy.

He had an almost naked hero leading a retinue of 5 Warriors in a Raider, about 4 Raider squads with 5 or 6 man Lance squads, one Warrior squad on foot with two Lances, one Wych Raider, and three Ravagers. He also had a squad of Mandrakes. All in all I think he had 6 Raiders and 3 Ravagers, for about 9 Dark Lances and 15 Disintegrators total. The mission was some kind of Secure & Control to grab some objectives, at omega level, so a lot of my stuff and almost all of his stuff would be in reserve.

The enemy deployed the Warrior squad inside some area terrain in the middle, and I deployed one unit of Tac Marines on the right flank, inside area terrain, and the rest of the stuff on the left or in the centre, standing on a hill and inside a wood. I spaced each of my models to the maximum, to ensure Disintegrators would always hit only one model. I won the roll and told the Dark Eldar to start, and they didn't do anything, so neither did I. On the second turn the Dark Eldar reserves started rolling in and they got a Ravager and a few Raiders in. Everything disembarked into shooty positions. The Ravager only moved 6" so it could fire everything. The Dark Eldar firepower looks much scarier on paper than it really is, and I lost 3 Marines from a Devastator squad and a Marine from a Tac squad.

I rolled for reserves and I didn't get anything else except my two Annihilators. They came in, and I had two choices, either to try to hide behind some obscuring cover for the whole game and have bad line of sight to the enemy, or to drive in the open and always have clear on sight. I ignored the cover and tried to use my 48" range to my advantage, staying outside Dark Lance range. Afterall, all the Dark Lances the enemy had were in Warrior squads, and all the flying kites had Disintegrators. I destroyed the Ravager and a Raider, with two TL Lascannons.

Dark Eldar reserves came in in full, and again everything disembarked, except the Wyches who came from the right. The Mandrakes entered combat with a Tactical Marine squad, and I didn't manage to kill any of them back, while I lost two models. Dark Eldar opened up with their shooting, and I lost about 4 Marines overall, because all of my troops were spaced and had cover saves which I rolled decently. One Predator was shaken. The opponent rolled really really poorly overall. In my turn, I rolled bad with my reserves, and only got the Dreadnought and a Speeder. Not getting the Librarian at this point was annoying because I could have shot about 4 vehicles with one Fury. Since I didn't get Assault Marines either I couldn't help the Tac Marines with the Mandrakes. I dropped the Wych Raider from the right flank and all of the Wyches but one died in the crash. I destroyed a Ravager and stunned and immobilised the other. I wiped out his commander and his retinue with HBs. Dark Eldar again fired with everything they got, and killed some more Devastators and Marines, wiping out one squad of Tacticals. I had one model remaining of the Devs. The large squad of Mandrakes wiped out my Tactical Marines. In my turn, I got the rest of the stuff in, namely the Assault Marine squads and Librarian, and a Speeder. Assault Marines went to the enemy full speed, spacing properly once again. The Librarian was just looking for some good Fury shots. In my shooting phase, Fury of Ancients went through 3 groups of Dark Eldar and a Raider, destroying the Raider and killing a few models from each squad, but everyone passed their pinning check. Lascannons took their toll and soon the enemy had one weaponless Raider remaining. I killed the Mandrakes. My Speeders were both destroyed, but in the end my Assault Marines and Predators and Dreadnought cleared the table, especially as the Fury of Ancients was hitting hidden models or vehicles all over the field with ferocious efficiency. I had all objectives intact, and the enemy army had been all but wiped out. A Massacre win, 20-0.

Therion
31-12-2005, 09:32
Game 6, Tyranids

I was doing really well and was at first place, and the last game of the tournament was against a Tyranid player who was 11 points behind me at this point already, so I figured a draw would be enough to secure the overall win for me. Even a minor loss could be enough, but I wasn't sure of the painting score yet so I didn't want to take any chances. We don't have composition scoring in Finland, and fair play scores only affect the Best Sportsman prize. In Warhammer, my Tyranid opponent had used an almost identical Lizardman army as the one I played against, except he had a lot of Salamanders too.

The opponent had two Tyrants, one walking and one flying, a unit of Warriors with guns, an elites slot Carnifex with TL Devourers, 3 squads of Hormagaunts and 3 squads of Spinegaunts, a single Ravener, a Lictor, two big Carnifexes and a Biovore. The heavy Carnifexes had Barbed Stranglers and VCs, as did the walking Tyrant. All his Gaunt squads only had 10 models, so he was quite low on models, even for 1500 points. The mission was some kind of an objective hunt. The table had 6 objective markers, which all would be worth a various amount of points. One objective in addition to the markers was to keep your half of the table clean of enemies, and one was to kill the most expensive model/unit of the enemy army. My most expensive unit was Devs, while the enemy had his flying Tyrant. VPs would not be scored for units, and only the missions and objectives were worth something.

The enemy deployed in two large battle groups, one on the left and one on the right. I deployed one squad on the right inside a wood, and a speeder behind that same wood, and everything else on the left. I deployed my Assault Marines behind my gun line, and I deployed all my vehicles so they would be obscured from the Stranglers.

I rolled first turn, and took it. In this mission the last turn would be great in grabbing objectives, but I had the feeling I'd like to get a couple shots off with my vehicles before they are shaken forever. I started shooting at one of the heavy Carnifexes with 5 wounds, and poured everything I had to it. The opponent rolled bad cover saves and the monster had one wound remaining in the end. I also killed a lot of models from a Spinegaunt squad that was outside Synapse range, so it paniced and ran a little.

The Nids advanced, except that the group on the right wouldn't come out of the woods. Nothing came towards me at full speed, afterall killing me wasn't the main thing, securing the objectives was, and all of them were in the middle, scattered across the board's length. The big monsters fired their guns at the vehicles but they mostly failed to penetrate armor completely. One glancing hit was scored, and it destroyed a TL lascannon from an Annihilator. I started sending some retribution the Nids' way, still keeping my firebase completely immobile, with the Assault Marines closely behind my gunline. I destroyed one of the heavy Carnifexes and put two wounds on a walking Tyrant. The flying Tyrant which was one of my objectives didn't want to show his head, and stayed behind area terrain. I killed some Hormagaunts.

Lictor came from reserves and deep striked inside some area terrain, and assaulted Devastators. A squad of Hormagaunts rolled 6 for fleet and assaulted a squad of Tactical Marines next to the Devs. I lost two bolter Devastators and one Tactical Marine, and piled in. In my turn, I realised that there was nothing to fear in the enemy army, and they seemed to be more afraid of me, cowering behind terrain and all, so I sent my boys in full advance. Dreadnought and Speeders went towards the walking Tyrant, and Assault Marines were in support. The Predators moved. The other squad of Assault Marines moved so it could charge the Hormagaunts in combat with Tactical Marines. A Tactical Marine squad moved to help the Devastators with the Lictor, since they couldn't see anything else anyway. My shooting destroyed the Hive Tyrant, and killed some Gaunts behind cover. I also put three wounds on the second big Carnifex, my opponent again failing all his cover saves. My counter assault wiped the Nids out and all my squads happened to roll 5" for their massacre move, and reformed the gunline.

The flying Hive Tyrant started retreating towards the right battlegroup, still behind area terrain, because the left group had been decimated entirely. The shooting once again came from the Biovore that wouldn't do anything meaningful because it's a Biovore, and from one remaining heavy Fex, who failed to glance a Predator once again. I moved towards the opponent in full, and at this point I had still lost only 3 or 4 Marines, and I took out the Carnifex. I challenged the right Tyranid battlegroup with Assault Marines by daring them to charge, and they came out of the woods and assaulted me. I lost almost the whole squad to Gaunts, but held. In my last turn, I sent the second Speeder who had done nothing whole game to one of the objectives, grabbing a second objective with a Predator, a third with Predator and 2 squads of Tacticals, a fourth with a Dreadnought, and a fifth with Tactical Marines and Devastators. I knew my single Assault Marine would be wiped during my own turn, and the enemy Gaunt squads and Warriors and Dakkafex could try to contest some of my markers, so I sent the second Assault Marine squad into the combat, killing a bunch of Gaunts. The Tyranids only had the Carnifex free to move in their turn, and it's Devourers glanced the Speeder but only shook it. The flying Tyrant was protecting one marker deep in the Tyranid zone. I had a bunch of objectives intact, but hadn't killed the enemy's most expensive unit, and all in all got a Solid Victory 17-3.

I finished the tournament with 105 battle points out of 120, which I'm quite pleased with. I won Best General, and I won Best Overall also. I got 31 out of 34 painting points, and so all in all I had 136 points while the two players who came tied second place had 122 each. The tournament was great fun as the terrain was good and there was plenty of it, and we had enough time to play each of our games to the end. My match against the Dark Eldar went 40 minutes over the time limit, but we were still allowed to finish it. Thanks to all of the opponents for quality games, and to the tournament organisers for putting up yet another GT class event.

Thanks for reading.

Flypaper
31-12-2005, 23:24
Fun read, thanks!

Ganymede
01-01-2006, 17:12
Ugh, there are still tournaments that give you more battle points based on how badly you beat your opponent? I was with you untill partway into the battle report. About half way through, enixplicably, I started to get very nauseated

Cpt. Drill
01-01-2006, 17:56
Your army looks like the kind you would expect to see at a tournement.....

Lardidar
01-01-2006, 19:18
Ugh, there are still tournaments that give you more battle points based on how badly you beat your opponent? I was with you untill partway into the battle report. About half way through, enixplicably, I started to get very nauseated

How would you propose you win a tournament?

Not having a go or anything just a tad curious.

The way I see it there are three things.

1. Gaming - I suppose you could go for a win,lose,draw system but I think you have to have different scores to represent levels of victory.

2. Painting - I can't see how you could base much on this, you have to have your guys painted or else you don't play but to then say that one army is better than another seems a little unfair.

what would you do if two or three golden daemon winning players turned up and made the rest of the decent painted army's look like someone threw up on them? Well done Mr Neilson you won another grand tournament.

3. Sportsmanship - essential to a good tournament but one of the most abusable parts in that it is the only section that is decided by your opponent.

The last tournament I was at I saw a game next to the one I was playing that was played in a very friendly and pleasant manner, after the game one of the guys fills in his scoresheet and gives the other a 'great game' he then packed up and went to bugman's for a drink, the other guy then filled in his scoresheet and gave him a 'poor game' and when I asked him why he said "we are close in the table and I don't want him to overtake me"

I just can't see of a fair way to get a winner without having how much you beat your opponent by being a big factor.

All that said I only made it to the part where he says the High elf army list .... after that you can see there isn't much point reading on.

Ganymede
02-01-2006, 05:47
How would you propose you win a tournament?

Not having a go or anything just a tad curious.

The way I see it there are three things.

1. Gaming - I suppose you could go for a win,lose,draw system but I think you have to have different scores to represent levels of victory.

2. Painting - I can't see how you could base much on this, you have to have your guys painted or else you don't play but to then say that one army is better than another seems a little unfair.

what would you do if two or three golden daemon winning players turned up and made the rest of the decent painted army's look like someone threw up on them? Well done Mr Neilson you won another grand tournament.

3. Sportsmanship - essential to a good tournament but one of the most abusable parts in that it is the only section that is decided by your opponent.

The last tournament I was at I saw a game next to the one I was playing that was played in a very friendly and pleasant manner, after the game one of the guys fills in his scoresheet and gives the other a 'great game' he then packed up and went to bugman's for a drink, the other guy then filled in his scoresheet and gave him a 'poor game' and when I asked him why he said "we are close in the table and I don't want him to overtake me"

I just can't see of a fair way to get a winner without having how much you beat your opponent by being a big factor.

All that said I only made it to the part where he says the High elf army list .... after that you can see there isn't much point reading on.


Hmm... I am running a ten man tournament here for the locals in about a month (I might even manage to finnagle a case of bratwurst for the event), and I have been doing a lot of thinking about how I would judge the competetion. Bear in mind, this scoring system is geared in mind towards a far less hardcore gamer.

I am judging overall scoring on four aspects: Generalship, Painting, Army Aesthetic, and Sortsmanship. It is based around a possible 30 points per game with a total of three games.

Generalship points are awarded by winning the game (7 points) and achieving the objective (3 points). The objective will add a nice amount of victory points, but a person who gains the objective could still lose the game. As a twist I was trying out, mainly to encourage close games but also to make table assignments easier, is a no-ties system. The winner is decided by who has achieved the most victory points. There's a possible 10 points here.

Painting and Army Aesthetic are lumped together for the best army award. Both are opponent judged. Army Aesthetic judges a player's arranged army. Your opponent wound judge your army selection and theme. Each category here is worth five points.

Sportsmanship is exactly as it sounds. It is worth a possible 10 points.


In either case, I'd ideally like to see a battle point system that was a flat score for victory/defeat, but was modified by achieving a special objective And possibly modified further by maybe a table specific event.

For other scoring categories, painting and army design would carry a lot less weight than other categories, and the scale from lowest to highest score would not be very steep either.

Lord Anathir
02-01-2006, 19:15
jezuz.....8 chariots, dragon, 5 eagles. lmao. I wish i had money for 8 chariots...

Trunks
03-01-2006, 01:51
Hmm... I am running a ten man tournament here for the locals in about a month (I might even manage to finnagle a case of bratwurst for the event), and I have been doing a lot of thinking about how I would judge the competetion. Bear in mind, this scoring system is geared in mind towards a far less hardcore gamer.

I am judging overall scoring on four aspects: Generalship, Painting, Army Aesthetic, and Sortsmanship. It is based around a possible 30 points per game with a total of three games.

Generalship points are awarded by winning the game (7 points) and achieving the objective (3 points). The objective will add a nice amount of victory points, but a person who gains the objective could still lose the game. As a twist I was trying out, mainly to encourage close games but also to make table assignments easier, is a no-ties system. The winner is decided by who has achieved the most victory points. There's a possible 10 points here.

Painting and Army Aesthetic are lumped together for the best army award. Both are opponent judged. Army Aesthetic judges a player's arranged army. Your opponent wound judge your army selection and theme. Each category here is worth five points.

Sportsmanship is exactly as it sounds. It is worth a possible 10 points.


In either case, I'd ideally like to see a battle point system that was a flat score for victory/defeat, but was modified by achieving a special objective And possibly modified further by maybe a table specific event.

For other scoring categories, painting and army design would carry a lot less weight than other categories, and the scale from lowest to highest score would not be very steep either.

Personally, I don't like systems like this at all. You should have an award for best general (the one who kicks the most ass), because that is the meaning of a "Tournament". You can then have a "Painting Contest" at the same tournament that judges the armies people use. People can vote for best sportsman, and that person would win that category. It is possible that someone could place first in all three, and you should strive to do so, but they are all seperate entities. Completely seperate parts of the hobby.

But if you are going to use such a system, it is a terrible idea to have Sportsmanship count for as much as actually playing the game and/or painting. Sportsmanship is so damn subjective, and people can be very vindictive with this too. The guy who is having a bad day with his dice can score you low on sportsmanship, despite you being polite while fielding a non-abusive army. People can dock you when they lose simply because you are the better general so they have this perceived "He was using an unfair army" notion, when they just don't have the tactical knowledge to play the game against real good players.

It is laughable, in my opinion, that you could conceivably win a tournament by being the nicest person with the best looking figures while actually playing the game (the main part of the hobby) with mediocre results.

I get the whole "this is a hobby with various aspects", but you really should not be combining them all into one mega-contest. I know I'd be slightly irritated to know that I lost a tournament because someone got mad that I scored a massacre against them so they docked me on sportsmanship (despite me being polite and having an army that no one else thought was abusive).

Painting, Being the Best General, and Sportsmanship should all be seperate as they all have little to do with one another. You could argue that the "Being the Best General" and "Sportsmanship" are related since people routinely use the Sportsmanship category to dock people who use abusive lists, but the problem is that what is "abusive" is so subjective ("noobs" find khorne chaos armies abusive, "vets" generally find that they really aren't all that crazy by comparison to other armies).

Ganymede
03-01-2006, 02:15
That system is designed with ten local players who all know eachother in mind. The prizes awarded are for best overall, best general, and best army. I don't think we have to worry about ******* attitude from people attending this particular event. The only way that would happen is if I had to be a ringer to fill a spot. :-P

In essence, the awards are already seperated and tallied independently from eachother. The only exception is the "Best overall" award.

I like to consider a warhammer tournament to be something akin to an ironman competetion or a triatholon, where the people who are able to do the best at all three asects of the hobby are rewarded. That's what I like about this system. If you don't feel confident as a painter, army designer, or general, there's always other awards to shoot for. But if you really want to test your mettle and show everyone your skills in every part of this hobby, then you are rewarded for your efforts with a Best Overall trophy.

Painting, sportsmanship, generalship, and such may be seperate entities, but they are all apart of the same hobby. Each may hold varying weights, and score you differnt amounts of points, but they are all important. If anyone plans to bring home a gold at a tournament I run, then they better be prepared to show their skills in the hobby as a whole.

Anyways, in a game of such dubious balancing, I would hate for victory to depend solely on how much ass you kick.

Ganymede
03-01-2006, 02:26
I get the whole "this is a hobby with various aspects", but you really should not be combining them all into one mega-contest. I know I'd be slightly irritated to know that I lost a tournament because someone got mad that I scored a massacre against them so they docked me on sportsmanship (despite me being polite and having an army that no one else thought was abusive).

For the longest time, I always told my opponent what I scored him on sportsmanship/comp/whatever as I was writing it down. If I didn't like something my opponent was doing, I'd let him or her know. Ideally, the other person would learn from the experience.

I started doing this when I played a friend at a tournament. We ended up getting paired together in one of the games. At the end of the game, he told me that he docked my sportsmanship score a notch because I was messy with my dice and casualties. I learned something about sportsmanship that day.

I'd like to see all player subjective judging done openly at a tournament. It an only be for the better.

Trunks
03-01-2006, 02:34
Since you are doing this with a close group of people, what I said doesn't really apply :)


In essence, the awards are already seperated and tallied independently from eachother. The only exception is the "Best overall" award.
That's perfectly cool, and the way it should be (four total awards, counting each category and best overall). From what I understand, there are tournaments that don't work that way though. No "best general", no "best painter", just "The best overall", which isn't very satisfying if you came to just have a good time, try to do your best, and knew you had no chance of competing in the painting division. Where you don't get rewarded for the individual components, just the sum of them.

The open sportsmanship thing is a good idea as well. At least then your opponent has to justify to you why he gave you a low (or high) sportsmanship score to your face instead of the "hit and run" coward way.

benmannen
03-01-2006, 22:33
Hehe, thats a naaasty High Elf army.

8 chariots...cheese-master! I hope you get to face the new dwarfs with that... Nothing will make it across the board :) I have heard about the finnish tournaments... It's you, the Italians and the Polish that rule the powergaming universe ;)

Gabacho Mk.II
11-01-2006, 14:25
Two things...

> The reports were well written. Good job. :)

> 8 chariots, Dragon, etc....??? Power-gaming is alive and well. Thank God I havent gamed any tournaments for the past 6 years. The sort of armies presented in such an environment is a joke, not an army.

[well, back to my 1,500pt campaign]

Frankly
12-01-2006, 09:06
Hehe, thats a naaasty High Elf army.

8 chariots...cheese-master!




The guy can run any army he wants, 8 chariots ... who cares, I run 120+ dwarves in my latest .... with 6-8 B.throwers.

Or all cavalry undead with 60 - 70 dire wolves and 3 units of B.knights.

The last tournament I went into I took 100 skinks, 3 units of kroxigors and a fare bit of magic.

How is his army going to fare against mine? 50/50?

It's a tournament, people are exspecting hard, tough fights.

There's hugh problems with taking 70 dire wolves to a tournament with no magic defense or 100 T2 skink models in an army with no rank and file or a dwarven static battle line. There's also tactical problems with taking 8 chariots and putting a points sink hero on top of the large target, so how is it powergaming?

I don't see 8 chariots as powergaming at all, because it has weaknesses and because of what environment he's playing in.

Good battle reports by the way, I was a bit disapointed in what the DE player brought to the tournament, but thats a personal taste thing really.