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Draconian77
29-06-2009, 13:02
Two demon lists that I would like commentry on, I'm sort of tempted to collect a DoC army but would like to work out some lists first. Not going for a tournament style WAAC force here, trying for some sort of themed yet competitive army.

(Themed around Slaanesh and Tzeentch)

Lords and Heroes;

Herald of Slaanesh, Etherblade = 140

Herald of Slaanesh, Siren Song, BsB, Standard of Sundering = 190

Herald of Tzeentch, Spellbreaker = 140

Herald of Tzeentch, Spellbreaker, Master of Sorcery = 165

Core;

10 Horrors, Standard, Icon of Sorcery = 147
10 Horrors, Standard, Icon of Sorcery = 147

*19 Daemonetters, Full Command, Siren Standard = 283
*Joined by both Heralds, deployed 7x3.

5 Furies = 60

Special;

6 Seekers of Slaanesh = 144
6 Seekers of Slaanesh = 144

Rare;

4 Fiends of Slaanesh = 220
4 Fiends of Slaanesh = 220

Total: 2000pts.


Or something along these lines;

(Themed around anything other than Slaanesh...but after thinking about it it looks pretty balanced;
1 Hero of Khorne + 2 Units
1 Hero of NUrgle +2 Units
1 Hero of Tzeentch +2 Units)

Lords and Heroes;

Herald of Khorne, Juggernaught, Obsidian Armour, BsB, Icon of Chaos Glory = 325

Herald of Tzeentch, Spellbreaker = 140

Herald of Nurgle, Palanquin, Noxious Vapurs, *Stream of Bile = 215

*Ok, I'm under the impression that this gains re-rolls to wound from the Icon of Seeping Decay. If possible I would like some discussion over this point.

EDIT: I've decided that this would go against RAI and I tend to prefer RAI over RAW. That said a S4 breath weapon is still a bargain at 25pts. ;)

Core;

15 Plaguebearers, Full Command, Standard of Seeping Decay = 235

16 Bloodletters, Full Command, Skull Totem = 247

10 Horrors = 120

5 Furies = 60

Special;

5 Flesh Hounds of Khorne = 175

Rare;

5 Flamers of Tzeentch = 175

3 Beasts of Nurgle = 300

Total: 1992


Overview: The first list is very fast with decent offensive magic and defensive magic. (8 PD/6 DD, 2 Scrolls and Sundering)

I could drop a Fiend from each unit to make both the Heralds of Slaanesh Lv1 mages but I'm not sure how beneficial this would be. (Although 8 DD does sound nice.) If I was to do that then I would definately drop a Scroll and replace it with Power Vortex to help me get some more magic off.

The second list is more of a combat list, slower blocks of Stubborn units with some support units. It esssentially has no magic phase(5 PD) but I expect that it would be resistant to magic aswell. (4 DD, Scroll, MR Bloodletters/Hounds/ Skirmishers and Nurgle units.)

So I guess what I'm asking would be roughly the following;

1: What changes would you make to either lists?

2: Are these both fair and competitive DoC armies? I would assume so but I think I'll leave that up to you guys and gals as owners generally don't consdier there own armies imbalanced. :rolleyes:

3: Why are there no undivided Daemons in the book...

Thanks for your time.

Lijacote
30-06-2009, 01:00
3: Why are there no undivided Daemons in the book...

Thanks for your time.

There are two entries for the Undivided Chaos. An undedicated Daemon Prince and the furies of chaos.


2: Are these both fair and competitive DoC armies? I would assume so but I think I'll leave that up to you guys and gals as owners generally don't consdier there own armies imbalanced.

In my opinion, yes, they are both fine. I wouldn't drop fiends for more magicks on the Heralds, regarding the first list. The second list only bothers me in part of the Standard of Chaos Glory but it's probably fine anyway.

My opinion is just mine, you may disregard it with no loss.

Draconian77
30-06-2009, 01:14
Disregarding a posters opinion would go against the point of the thread. :D

The Standard of Chaos Glory will hopefully make the Beasts of Nurgle a proper anvil rather than an expensive novelty. (Ok, so it makes anything an anvil...but the Beasts will be a really tough anvil...)

As for the Undived thing, I sort of meant block infantry units. Something cheap and less powerful, the Marauder of the DoC book I guess.

Thanks for the reply.

Jind_Singh
30-06-2009, 03:20
actually the lists are fine - both of them - not overpowered to the point of !!!!!!, yet tough enough that most people will have to play pretty hard to combat you
I owuld drop the icon that makes you stubborn though - with deamons you dont need to be stubborn - you'll either win combat or deserve to lose the combat so stubborn isnt worth it.
also theres time when YOU WANT to lose combat really badly to allow more favourable charges from other DoC units you have - and the points you save allow for more core toops
power vortex is great - i'd always take it - and if your taking seekers it would be nice to give them that standard which doesnt' allow the enemy to flee as a charge reaction - it really helps to pin a unit in place.
4 fiends is overkill - i run them in 2 units of 3 and they never let me down! plus you'll save a few points to bulk out other units.

Draconian77
30-06-2009, 18:27
Good, thats what I was hoping for, competitive, but not "Oh no I don't want to play this army anymore." competitive. :D

The Stubborn Banner is just insurance really, but I also sort of need it to make the Beasts work at their best. Now, obviously this might mean that the Beasts themselves are too expensive or something but I love their fluff(poison puppy power!) and their general resilience so I'll be keeping them.

Power Vortex is tempting in the first list, if dropping 2 Fiends saved me 110pts then I could bump both Slaanesh Heralds to Lv1 mages (100pts) and upgrade one or maybe both Spellbreakers to Power Vortex(5 or 10pts)?

But that would give me 11~12 PD, which seems to be frowned upon.

I figure the Seekers will probably be going for shooting units or artillery. If they flee they are highly likely to run off board...actually anything than flees from a Slaanesh army is taking a huge risk considering all the M10. :D

Caboose123
01-07-2009, 03:42
In the first list:
I don't like joining your Tzeentchians to units of 10 horrors, even with a 4+ ward they're kinda flimsy...
With 2 Lv2 mages, its seems pointless to not have the Slaanesh characters at Lv1, at the same Time I wouldn't drop a fiend for this.
I also don't like only having 1 rock hard unit, it will be the focus of most of the magic/shooting, or even worse, it will be ignored entirely
Otherwise it looks like a fast and powerful enough, and not cheesy army.

In the second list:
I like the general spread of demons in this list, though I think the horrors may as well be dropped. 3 levels of magic is prolly useless, instead I'd give the Herald a chariot, and maybe beef up the furies (5 is pathethic, and could struggle even against some artillery crew!).
The most important thing here is protecting your big units (I 'spose the beasts can screen...) as they advance, but furies and the chariot would help.

That said I'm not actually a DoC player, so take what I say with a grain of salt...

Draconian77
01-07-2009, 13:58
In the first list:
I don't like joining your Tzeentchians to units of 10 horrors, even with a 4+ ward they're kinda flimsy...

~Well, generally speaking anything advancing towards them would be flickered to death or flanked. This list is going to do a lot of flanking. (I would assume)

With 2 Lv2 mages, its seems pointless to not have the Slaanesh characters at Lv1, at the same Time I wouldn't drop a fiend for this.

~If their Lv1 spell wasn't so pathetic I think I would agree with you, as it stands I think paying 100pts for +2DD is a little pricey.

I also don't like only having 1 rock hard unit, it will be the focus of most of the magic/shooting, or even worse, it will be ignored entirely

~I wouldn't call the Daemonetters rock hard...but with 6 DD, 2 Scrolls, the Standard of Sundering and M10 on 4 of my units(+some flyers) I don't expect to face a lot of magic or missile fire for very long.

Otherwise it looks like a fast and powerful enough, and not cheesy army.

In the second list:
I like the general spread of demons in this list, though I think the horrors may as well be dropped.

~That would be sound advice if they where not filling in my third core slot...

~Units of 10 Bloodletters or Plaguebearers are pointless(from what I can see), 10 Daemonettes give you a flanking force but for a few more points you could get Seekers/Fiends and 10 Horrors give you a Dispel Dice.

3 levels of magic is prolly useless, instead I'd give the Herald a chariot, and maybe beef up the furies (5 is pathethic, and could struggle even against some artillery crew!).

~Giving the Herald a chariot is definately an option but I can't/aren't willing to beef up my magic anymore. This is a "hulk smash" type list. :D 5 Furies should be fine, I don't expect them to be anything more than a distraction but with a Ward save and Fear they should be able to handle anything expect Dwarves with ease.

The most important thing here is protecting your big units (I 'spose the beasts can screen...) as they advance, but horrors and the chariot would help.

~Horrors?

~I can use the Beasts to screen the Bloodletters, I'm pretty sure that shooting won't really harm them, or maybe I'll use the Flamers as a screen, same thing in essence, very resilient to missile fire. I will probably have to proxy some lists setting anything in stone.



Seems like I'll need to get some games in soon.