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TheBloodyFistOfKhaine
30-06-2009, 07:05
I have a friend who wants to start Witch Hunters and he loves the Death Cult Assassin minis.
He wants to use 9 of them.
I havnt got the codex but he wants to know if hes gonna be called out for cheese.
How good are death cult assassins.?

Miggidy Mack
30-06-2009, 07:24
I doubt anyone would call it cheese... 9 assassins are 9 easy kill points! They are also pretty easy to shoot down.

jstalker
30-06-2009, 07:40
heh,
unlike 3 marbos :P

tacoo
30-06-2009, 07:57
marbo is too full of AWSOME & WIN to be put even in the same fourm as those things

sigur
30-06-2009, 07:58
...
I havnt got the codex but he wants to know if hes gonna be called out for cheese.
How good are death cult assassins.?

Probably not. In 5th edition, they are generally not viewed as a particularly great unit. But if he likes them, no need to discard the idea.

BayHammer
30-06-2009, 08:06
I would have to say not, I field a mixed kill team myself of Culexus/Vindicre and if you play them in reserves its not so bad, Death cult are kind of a soft touch assassin, really should only field a squad in conjunction with something like gray knights to keep a balance. I do have the codex and you can tell your friend if he feels like throwing down 900 points on independant characters alone go for it, outside apocolypse I just dont see more then 2 kill teams worth.

djinn8
30-06-2009, 08:17
I may be mistaken, but can't a maximum of only three be taken.

BayHammer
30-06-2009, 08:47
you can take them in kill teams for apoc but I have never seen more then two squads of 3 in any given game though. and by 5th ed rules take more then 2 might prove troublesome.

Mannimarco
30-06-2009, 12:52
a valid and widely recognised tactic back in 4th ed was to run a culexius alongside several assassins, they would infiltrate along one of the flanks charge, use the culexius LD drop ability and butcher anything the touch with a flurry or high initiative power weapon attacks, win and because of the higher initiative they would catch what they just beat and often over run into a new squad

Maharajah
30-06-2009, 13:21
I may be mistaken, but can't a maximum of only three be taken.
No, you can take up to 3 for *each* elite slot.

They are individually excellent and very useful in teams too, but are sadly crippled in 5th ed by:
1. They are worth 1 KP each (as already mentioned)
2. The "defender reacts" rule and the casualty removal rule, which means that unless you wipe out a squad with your attacks the counterattacks will hurt. In 4th ed it was possible to mitigate this by minimizing base to base contact and clearing the "kill zone".

Still, why not proxy then and see if you can find some new tactics for them? As 4th ed recedes into the past they will have value as a surprise from time to time, but they can't be called cheesy, that's for sure.

Lamoron
30-06-2009, 17:09
In any game where Killpoints are not in effect, running 9 of them is incredibly funny... or 6 + Culexus or Eversor Assassin.

* Your opponent cannot shoot more than one of them each round with each squad, no matter how well he rolls.

* If they win a combat, all 9 get to roll to sweep the opponent.

* If you don't sweep, and the opponent has no dangerous firepower in the unit, just break of one Assassin to escort the opponent of the table.

* They look amazing!

Killpoints however, killed the Deathcult.

DarkstarSabre
30-06-2009, 17:22
* Your opponent cannot shoot more than one of them each round with each squad, no matter how well he rolls.

If your opponent is an IG player he's not likely to care. Yes, one squad kills one assassin. Pity he has about twenty squads.

Dr.Clock
30-06-2009, 17:30
Even though they will not break your army, they are an excellent distraction unit. They can get in close really quickly and throw a big wrench in the works. As SoB usually need a couple turns to position, they are great for that list.

They annoy me to no end.

Killpoints are the big loser for this unit, as already stated... but in friendly games, they have a place.

I've forgotten their rules: can they contest objectives? If they can't I might be willing to let the whole unit count as a single killpoint.

Cheers,

The Good Doctor.

IAMNOTHERE
30-06-2009, 17:37
This is an effective build but uses up all the slot options:

C:DH parent list.
Inq lord
Callidus assassin
3 DCA

C:WH allied list.
Inq lord
Culexus/vindicare/eversore assassin.

But if you're going for this type of list you'd be better off doing the full carnival.

Alessander
30-06-2009, 19:49
back when the DH codex came out I ran a list of 9 DCAs or 6 DCAs with an Eversor. They were mean. BOLS had a great article on combining DCAs with a Cullexus for an insane LD shredding combo.

Sadly as said above, KP's completely make them KP sinks more so than than Spore Mines.

I got a little sick of the official models, so converted mordheim amazons and LOTR berzerkers into DCAs (since both come 3 to a blister).

Archangel_Ruined
30-06-2009, 20:13
I've got about 18 of the things, nobody has ever given me gipp for fielding multiple units of them. My favourite was my death cult and eversor attack, it was verr. killy and verr. fun, easy enough to shoot down though so no cries of cheese.

shin'keiro
01-07-2009, 01:15
Well, as always... if it's in the codex - it's NOT beardy (cheese)

Drop-Trooper
01-07-2009, 03:49
I wouldn't say they were cheesy, although their sv is invulrable, it's still only 5+.
As for y'all using more then one temple assassin, i'm pretty sure there's a rule in both inq codexii about only being able to use one in any given force.

ehlijen
01-07-2009, 04:25
If he likes the models there's always the option of count as. Maybe a squad of 10 could be used to represent arco flagellants?

Serebrate
01-07-2009, 04:38
The assassins are fairly easily to kill, as they have an invulnerable guardsman save. Sure Death-Cults can probably carve some stuff up on the charge, but they're overpriced for what they do. For six more points you can get a grey knight terminator.

I'm guessing you're an Eldar player, so just buy your cheaper-anyway CC specialists (Scorpions or Banshees, I prefer Banshees) and you'll be striking with the same initiative, attacks on the charge, and with the only downside being one less WS. But you get a better save and higher leadership anyway.

For maximum irony, engage Death-Cultist with Khorne Berserker.

The only assassin I'd ever worry about with a normal non-pskyer heavy list would be an Eversor. They're fun for the controlling player. Throw it at any infantry unit and play Yakity Sax.

BayHammer
01-07-2009, 05:18
I have gone over to DH codex and I keep comming back to, why would you want to, ok sure maybe as a specialist list, but your not going to want to field only Death Cult, and both point and actual cost there are much better variations for a DH list. I dont mean to sound rude but the seems like a rather lazy way to construct a demon hunters list.

TheBloodyFistOfKhaine
01-07-2009, 06:16
Its not lazy, he just likes the models enougth to not care if he wins or not.
Whats wrong with that?

BayHammer
01-07-2009, 06:26
Touche, I can see making a list based on visual interest, I just usualy see more balance and variation in DH armies.

sigur
01-07-2009, 10:34
Touche, I can see making a list based on visual interest, I just usualy see more balance and variation in DH armies.

Like what? 40 GK Marines?


9 DK cultists are okay in my book. I'm all for balance in army lists and against min-maxing but DK cultists aren't too scary really and don't cost insanely much points-wise so there'll be plenty of other stuff in the list too.