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View Full Version : The Whispers of Chaos: Calling all Traitor Marines!



Urath
10-07-2009, 21:44
Hello there.
As some of you may know, I fielded Iron Warriors for just under six years. After becoming disillusioned with the new Chaos codex and the faction in general, I left. I tried out Catachans, Dark Eldar (which I also fielded for a number of years), Necrons (didn't last long, but I like the fluff and my friend had Eldar - made for some cool themed games) and Deamonhunters, which I could never get started.

I have ended up with the army I swore I'd never play: Space Marines. Well, to be more exact, I play Dark Angels. As they have a seperate codex and flourished character, models etc I'm cool with it.

But anyway, I've come around full circle and I have rejuvinated my love for the Chaos Space Marines. Once my Dark Angels army is complete, not including purchasing a Land Raider or two, a couple more Deathwing squads, a second Dread and a Terminator Captain (convert) to have the option to field a Deathwing force etc, I'll be moving back onto Chaos Space Marines.

Well, it was either the Fallen heroes or a fractured, dying empire - Eldar. So, I chose Chaos.

Now, I started out all those years ago with Black Legion, then Alpha Legion and finally Iron Warriors. So I'd like to pick a different Legion, but I'm still partial to the Black Legion. If I do pick them I'll do lots of nifty painting tricks to stop that black armour from looking the same on every mini. I've been considering:
1. Night Lords.
2. Word Bearers
3. Black Legion
4. World Eaters

So guys, any help?

Mannimarco
10-07-2009, 21:54
NO DEATH GUARD?!?!

black legion - the big bad guys of chaos, the poster boys even! because deep down everybody secretly aspires to be just as good as the black legion! and you can field abbadon without feeling wierd!

but theyre done to death really and you already have some so im gonna say word bearers: theyre a rare enough army so are pretty eye catching, all that parchment and scripture on them makes them stand out compared to other traitor forces, their colour scheme is pretty easy to get good looking results

the conversion opertunities for character models (dark apostles) and even trying to make your own special (kor phaeron)

and theres the fact that you can really go to town with some crazy lists "hmm this particular star alignment says that our plan of attack should be.....massed infantry waves" next battle "hmm the casting of the bones show us that we should take a ton of bikes"

Eetion
10-07-2009, 22:03
Hmm Id go Night Lords or Black Legion.
World Eaters could be pretty fun too.


But id never leave my beloved Alpha Legion.

warchild9
10-07-2009, 22:40
ABADDON nuff said

Tae
10-07-2009, 22:41
I've always been partial to the idea of a Word Bearers army with the chosen in Dark Angels-esque robes. The notion of chaos chaplins (forget the exact name) has always seemed cool, plus I like that they're still a legion and operate as such, rather than a rag-tag collection of people with no command structure or organisation.

Johnnyfrej
10-07-2009, 22:45
Night Lords.
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat1660256&prodId=prod1110166
Why? Your entire army is "The Batman" only with more "I am the Night." Enough said.

ps, What's wrong with the new Codex? My Iron Warriors kick tail (btw played BL back in Chaos 3.5 till the end of 4th ed but sold whole army to start IG).

Illiterate Scribe
10-07-2009, 22:48
black legion - the big bad guys of chaos, the poster boys even! because deep down everybody secretly aspires to be just as good as the black legion! and you can field abbadon without feeling wierd!

but theyre done to death really

So they're the Ultramarines of Chaos?

Anyway, yeah, Night Lords. They're probably the most aesthetically interesting.

Mannimarco
10-07-2009, 22:54
hehe thats the joke yes

EVIL INC
10-07-2009, 23:57
With the new codex being able to better represent the legions with fluffy and exciting armies then ever before, it is good that you have returned to the fold. Of course, as we all know once your tainted, your tainted forever. ;)
Of the ones listed, my choices would be
1. World Eaters- Now that you can FINALLY use heavy weapons, jump packs and all as the fluff of khorne dictates you should, A world eater force using them all (you would have to convert havocs and all but they would look great) would be fantastic and you would take the fools who believe that world eaters armies should be only berserkers totally by surprise by taking a REAL world eater force.
2. Word Bearers- I like thier fluff and if you use dark angel bodies with robes to represent the champions, you can make for a nice looking army.
3. Black Legion- because its the easiest and your less likely to have to listen to others whine.

Kadrec
11-07-2009, 00:10
Urath, I would strongly promote Night Lords, from your choices. They'd be the biggest departure from your Iron Warriors and Black Legion, and have some really cool conversion/aesthetic possibilities. I don't really care for the Word Bearers' iconography, but there are some interesting possibilities there, as well.

I would have voted Alpha Legion (my new pet project), but you've already done that and don't seem interested in going back.

Skyth
11-07-2009, 01:20
All CSM armies are Black Legion now...Might as well play them.

Serebrate
11-07-2009, 01:22
Red Corsairs is the only way to go.

Huron is where it's at.

But failing that, I like the Night Lords. They're the special forces of Chaos, if you will.

ReveredChaplainDrake
11-07-2009, 01:27
I voted Night Lords. It's a very interesting army to play with the current metagame that CSM have now. Oblits may not make a lot of sense, but two Winged Daemon Princes do, to say nothing about how devastating dual Lash is in a Raptor-spammed list. (Plague Marines and Dual-Lash is... er, okay, but they don't compliment each other like Raptors and Lash do.)

Models-wise, after GW re-released the plastic Marine Jump Packs, this is one of the best times to start playing Night Lords the fluff-advised way. I use about 16-20 Raptors each game, and while Raptors as a unit get a lot of grief for not being good / scoring, they're best used in squad sizes of 8 or 12. 8 means you get 2 special weapons, while 8 "Tactical" CSM only get 1 special weapon. 12 means your unit can be larger than 10 men and still move 12" per turn (12 CSM don't fit in a Rhino), and thus their icons also become more points-efficient, yet they aren't too cumbersome in terms of cost. 10-men Raptor Squads, while it conserves models, puts them in efficiency debates with 10-men CSM squads, which they honestly can't win.

On the painting front, Necron Abyss makes painting Night Lords very straightforward. Much better than that purple-ish color that Night Lords usually wind up with when you try Midnight Blue. (Actually I live near the city, so our night sky is more like a sickly orange-purple anyway. :rolleyes:)

Joewrightgm
11-07-2009, 02:49
We are returned!

Serebrate
11-07-2009, 03:37
While on the subject, since there's alot of Black Legion people in here - has the Red Corsairs and Black Legion ever crossed paths (or swords?)

Vampiric16
11-07-2009, 10:21
I'm currently revisiting my Word Bearers since I was a bit haphazard with conversions and such. Done right, they are very striking in appearance. I have followed their Daemon fetish fluff in taking possessed and lots of daemons (a unit of 10 from each god).

Vaktathi
11-07-2009, 10:26
Whats wrong with going back to your Iron Warriors? I know that the current codex can be rather..."bleh" at times, but if you are coming back why not just go with them again?


Anyway, of the options, I say go with Night Lords. If you've ever read Lord of the Night you'll know why.

changer of fate
11-07-2009, 10:38
i reckon night lords is good, after looking at what u have done (catachan, dark eldar, chaos and necrons), night lords in my mind is like a army that have all the good part of those army, its fast like dark eldar, they are tough coz they are marines and they can infiltrate like catachans with chosen spam.

they are really cool and a really interesting army to play with, i also just started a night lord army my self recently, they are a good legion, fluff and game wise

Askari
11-07-2009, 11:27
I'm partial to the Word Bearers, silly name, but they are the exact opposite of what the loyal Space Marines are meant to be, using their powers to craft empires, worshipping Gods, and escaping the shackles of being a "tool" to some other master.

And, Eliphas the Inheritor is an awesome character from Dark Crusade.

More so than even the Black Legion, I think they represent Chaos.

Urath
11-07-2009, 11:57
Thanks to all of the swift replies everyone! Also, after going to bed last night I'm heavily considering Death Guard too, but I forgot to put them on the poll. So, Night Lords and Word Bearers seem to be running well? That's pretty cool.

While I love the Emperor's Children, I feel that to do them justice would require lots of green stuff conversion and various other model pieces that, while the end result would be marvelous, I just don't have the time or money to really sink into it.

About Iron Warriors. While I love the Legion and Primarch both pre and post heresy, I'd like my return to Chaos to be on a different theme. After fielding them as my primary army for the better part of six years, doing it all over again would feel a bit tired. Also, I sold my old Chaos army on ebay so it's a fresh start :)

At the moment, it's a toss up between the Word Bearers, Death Guard, World Eaters and Night Lords.

EVIL INC
11-07-2009, 13:39
All CSM armies are Black Legion now...Might as well play them.
When did they change the fluff? Last I saw in the codex and fluff the legions were still around as well as many other official legions/renegades/home brew armies. ALL of which are perfectly and fluffily representable with the codex. You can field any of them and have a perfectly competative and fluffy army. Just because Abbadon and his black legion are the "head honchos" doesnt mean that call the rest have changed thier colors to serve under him.

eltanko
11-07-2009, 14:02
Night Lords, cool colour scheme, esp if you can pull off the lightning bolts, and models look good. They stand out a bit more than the others.

ElTanko

Urath
13-07-2009, 10:49
Thanks Tank :). Yeah, I have ideas for conversion for the Word Bearers, not so about the Night Lords really. Except for lightning bolts, the conversion kit, primarily fast attack, Lord w/jump pack (possibly) and the symbolism. Though they're still awesome.

Word Bearers: Chosen in power armour - Dark Angels chapter upgrade kit robes, file off Dark Angels insignia, replace shoulder pads with Word Bearer/Chaos pads, Chaos power back etc.
Dark Apostle - Convert Space Marine Chaplain (http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1240875_99060101334_SMChaplaincrozplaspismain_873 x627.jpg) by adding Chaos power pack, using green stuff on Crozius to make an eight pointed star, add an eight pointed star to his forhead and "crux" type thing. Replace the skull on his crozius with a point.
Terminators - Using this tutorial (http://z15.invisionfree.com/The_Great_Crusade/index.php?showtopic=87) to create the pre-heresy tabbards and shoulder pads. I might try and add some more robes to the Terminators, like handing from their waist, back, shoulder pads.

General stuff, using magnifying glasses to paint scripture on the armour of Aspiring Champions, Lords, Apostles,Land Raiders, Defilers, Icons and some Astartes. The robes will be cool.

pookie
13-07-2009, 12:34
World Eaters - Heavy CC Force, i personally favour this style of force more than any other, and Kharn Rocks! ( ive a large Zerk force waiting in the wings at the mo, ive just too many otehr projects for this to get off the ground )

Word Bearers - could offer some good converstions.

Death Gaurd - Large Infantry force ( imo ) again some good converstions.

Night Lords - not too keen on the Batwing look, though the scheme is very nice.

Black Legion - hmmm well think saying they are the Chaos version of UM is the best comment ive heard, i do like the Idea in the Dex with the full body 8 Pointed star, but how that would translate onto a much larger force, imo possibly the least intresting Chaos Legion.

Good luck with what ever force you decide to do.

Urath
13-07-2009, 12:39
Thanks pookie, the only off puttings about the World Eaters and Death Guard, is that I can see myself sinking a lot of money into Forge World conversion kits and I'd like to conserve as much money as possible lol!

CEO Kasen
13-07-2009, 12:43
I like to think Chaos rarely whispers. I tend to think of it more as - depending on your flavor - screaming, gurgling, moaning, or reciting James Joyce backwards to the sound of Beethoven's 5th Symphony For Violin, Newt Catapult and Anatomical Impossibility.

Daicon
13-07-2009, 12:57
Blood for the blood God!

My vote goes to the World Eaters. There's just something that appeals to me about the head long rush towards your foe and the glory to be had in seeing them die face to face.

Personally, I don't see the need to buy the forge world conversion kits for the World Eaters, as I find they aren't much more appealing than the basic kit is. However, if you plan on returning to Chaos in force and having it as a mainstay army for the forseeable future, I wouldn't use price as a negative. After all, there is plenty of time to build the army piece by piece if necessary, so it is quite possible to spread your purchasing over months at a time.

CEO Kasen
13-07-2009, 13:01
As an idea... Why not develop your own legion? :D

Mannimarco
13-07-2009, 13:03
remember folks chaos doesnt always have to use the chaos or imperial guard codex:

how about building yourself one of these?

http://www.darkartstore.darkartminiatures.com/products.php?product=Word-Bearers-Throne-of-Chaos

loading up on imperial guard, arco flaggelants and other stuff from the sisters codex and go for an ultra religious chaos cult led by a dark apostle (inquisitor lord on the throne of judgement) im sure the saint celistine model (with a little conversion work) would make an interesting daemon manifestation

chaos sisters of battle? never gonna happen? everybody hate the idea of just sticking "chaos" in front of every race? chaos sister: i found a way, coming soon: chaos tau lol

pookie
13-07-2009, 13:43
Thanks pookie, the only off puttings about the World Eaters and Death Guard, is that I can see myself sinking a lot of money into Forge World conversion kits and I'd like to conserve as much money as possible lol!

i agree! tho when i started my WE force, FW didnt do the lovely bits they do now, i think all i'l be getting is more chain axes after all ive only 14 and that aint enough :evilgrin:

Urath
13-07-2009, 13:59
Ahh yes. A good call, if you can afford to finance it. World Eaters, I just love the bloodshed and carnage they indulge in. When I used to host games at my house, for each players' turn they'd get to pick a song and for my assault phase I always picked this for my Berzerkers: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hi-ykpDFKwA

Even though they look and sound like ******, it just fit.

Mercutius
13-07-2009, 14:06
Night Lords, of course! In my signature is a link to my Night Lord Blog, perhaps you can get some inspiration there :-).

Jono-NI
13-07-2009, 14:11
I assume you can make an army of any Chaos Legion without many conversions?

I'm in progress of attempting Word Bearers, and can't convert for buttons, can I still get away with it? Also i think the red is the wrong shade :S

Sorry for this mini hijack but it's troubling me and this seemed as good as any place to ask.

Urath
13-07-2009, 14:13
Of course you can create a Chaos force without conversions but, for me, it doesn't do them justice and I wouldn't attempt anything unless I felt I could do them justice, especially if there wrere conversion kits out there to help me.

Jono, do you have a blog?

@Mercutius: Thanks a lot bro, I'll check it out!
Edit: Just checked the blog and I see you have some damn fine painting skills, my friend. I especially like the Lord and the Dreadclaw!

Jono-NI
13-07-2009, 14:28
I know this isn't the place but no I don't have a blog, as i have no access to a picture taking device :P Best camera I have is the one in my dsi and it's not very impressive.

I would like to go the whole hog and convert but money is tight and theres books I want to buy ( The Word Bearer ones :P ) so until then I'm not sure what to do.

As for topic I'd personally like to see custom Night Lords with their seemingly pointless bat wings stuck to their heads :)

pookie
13-07-2009, 14:31
I know this isn't the place but no I don't have a blog, as i have no access to a picture taking device :P Best camera I have is the one in my dsi and it's not very impressive.

I would like to go the whole hog and convert but money is tight and theres books I want to buy ( The Word Bearer ones :P ) so until then I'm not sure what to do.

As for topic I'd personally like to see custom Night Lords with their seemingly pointless bat wings stuck to their heads :)

you dont need to have great conversion skills. all you need to do is source the correct sorts of pieces, theres a wealth of Platics thatc an be used for Word Bearers ( you can get some form teh DA Sprues, for censors etc as a example ).

OT - cant wait see which way you go with this Urath.

Urath
13-07-2009, 14:39
I would like to go the whole hog and convert but money is tight and theres books I want to buy ( The Word Bearer ones :P )

Yeah, they're definatley worth it. I have both books and I found them to be some of the best Astartes and 40K books I have read. Also why Word Bearers are in this poll! :p Anthony Reynolds knows how to write for the Word Bearers!

Pookie is right, you don't need great converting skills really. The Dark Angels Chapter upgrade kit (which is equivilant to Company Veteran box-set x2) is £11.something, and has enough bits and robes to customise and make fully, ten marines.

Thanks pookie, I am still slightly smarting about having to stop the Emperor's Children project as it was costing too much and I didn't want to field a 30k army against 40k ones. But, at least my Dark Angels have so much MKIV,V and VI armour :p.

For Black Legion, I'd use Space Wolf parts. Like the Wolf back-packs, and some of the wolf iconography as well as the heads with hair - a nod back to their Luna Wolf/Sons of Horus days!

At the moment, it's either Night Lords or Word Bearers. I like the Night Lords fluff better and their Legion character more so, but the Word Bearers have so much oppurtunity for conversion that I can see myself doing.

pookie
13-07-2009, 14:49
Thanks pookie, I am still slightly smarting about having to stop the Emperor's Children project as it was costing too much and I didn't want to field a 30k army against 40k ones. But, at least my Dark Angels have so much MKIV,V and VI armour :p.

For Black Legion, I'd use Space Wolf parts. Like the Wolf back-packs, and some of the wolf iconography as well as the heads with hair - a nod back to their Luna Wolf/Sons of Horus days!

At the moment, it's either Night Lords or Word Bearers. I like the Night Lords fluff better and their Legion character more so, but the Word Bearers have so much oppurtunity for conversion that I can see myself doing.

Understandable, it does take a loooong time and effort/money, but it does make the force Unique and stand out ( My proposed companys one, as well as the BT Crusade im still building, which is ALL tabards/Night helms ) more than the next persons 'enter name here' army of Marines/Chaos Marines.

Daedalus81
13-07-2009, 15:27
I don't conform to those legions as I love playing almost straight Thousand Sons. Pew pew!

badguyshaveallthefun
13-07-2009, 15:39
World Eaters FTW. The Forgeworld conversion kits just look plain awesome, and there's something to be said about a legion of blood-drenched madmen. It's true not all WE are bezerkers, and this dex does allow you to field a more "rounded" force. Plus it will give your opponents assault troops something to think about when they try to assault your havocs and they're getting 3A each!

Vedar
13-07-2009, 15:40
If you want to go Black Legion go Black Legion. I'd say you should only choose the other options if those armies grab you and it sounds like they didn't. Essentially all Chaos armies are black legion now unless you want to restrict your own choices. Only play Night lords if you like fielding fast attack and like to pretend your marines are scarier then other Chaos marines.

Urath
13-07-2009, 16:38
They all do, that's why I'm having such a hard time. Tbh, I've never been one for building armies using the best pieces of wargear and taking the best units, just because I can and because I'm determined to win. I pick what suites the army, the theme and the mission. The scenario, the fluff: I want my army to look good, capture the feel and still have an edge. Considering I usually field a balanced list, I've rarely lost in store.

I wouldn't go that far. Every army has the option to take whatever it wants, but that doesn't make it "Black Legion". I think you're still constricted somewhat to the 3.5 Codex, with army lists and where the Black Legion was used as the "everything" army. But, in the fluff the World Eaters do field Havocs and the Death Guard would use Raptors. I liked the Legions getting certain veteran skills or bits of wargear and even unique units. Like the Word Bearers' Dark Apostle and the Iron Warrior's servo arm. But, you can still effectively create a Dark Apostle to an extent, it's just not as satifying as having an actual slot for a real Apostle.

Jono-NI
13-07-2009, 18:12
Thanks for all the advice by the way I'll keep it in mind for the future.

As a result i change my mind Urath, I say you choose Word Bearers so I can see, as i'm sure, a much more professional hobbyist give them a go :)

Urath
13-07-2009, 18:27
Awh Jono, I didn't mean to make you feel inferior and I'm certainly not professional, but I appreciate it all the same. Cheers bro.

Jono-NI
14-07-2009, 16:00
No prob, but I am pretty inferior :P

Whoever you choose please keep us posted :)

Mercutius
14-07-2009, 18:45
@Urath: thanks for your nice words. Even if you don't start the fashion Forces ähm Night Lords, I hope you give us a painting Log of your new chaos Army :-)

Norsehawk
15-07-2009, 04:02
I voted for the Word Bearers, without them, there wouldn't have been a Horus Heresy, at least not as it went down.

ChaosReigns
15-07-2009, 05:35
I would definitely give my vote to Word Bearers and World Eaters, as they are my two favourite Traitor Legions (I really like Death Guard as well, but they're not on the list).

Of course, if you go Black Legion you can make a fluffy list that incorporates elements from all of the gods' armies.

I switched over from World Eaters to Black Legion when the current dex came out for this reason...although my army is still entirely Khornate, with the exception of a couple Undivided units. I'm planning on putting some Nurgle stuff into the army soon. That'll be fun.

EDIT: Woops, my bad. Death Guard are being considered. In that case I'm going to give my vote to them. The Death Guard are pretty awesome and their Forge World models are amazing.