PDA

View Full Version : An interesting question with WE + regen



Reinnon
04-01-2006, 12:38
hi there

say if i cast ariels blessing upon a treeman.

ok, it gains regen....all very good, but what happens if the treeman suffered a fire attack BEFORE the spell was cast?

does the fire attack "destroys ability to regen" apply and therefore the treeman would be unable to regen?

or does the fire limitation only apply after the model has gained regen so the treeman does gain regen?

thanks in advance

SuperBeast
04-01-2006, 13:01
hi there

say if i cast ariels blessing upon a treeman.

ok, it gains regen....all very good, but what happens if the treeman suffered a fire attack BEFORE the spell was cast?

does the fire attack "destroys ability to regen" apply and therefore the treeman would be unable to regen?

or does the fire limitation only apply after the model has gained regen so the treeman does gain regen?

thanks in advance
The treeman gains regeneration from the Ariel's blessing spell.
He didn't have it to lose in the first place when the wounds were caused.
He gained regeneration AFTER the event that destroys the ability occured.

PS, BRB not to hand, but do flaming attacks actually destroy regeneration anyway? I thought it was simply that wounds caused by flaming attacks may not be regenerated? (Never played in a game where the two met up).

Neknoh
04-01-2006, 13:31
Wounds caused by fire attacks cannot be regenerated, in addition, a creature struck by a fire attack cannot regenerate any other wounds taken after that.

I don't have the book handy either, so it's not a direct quote, but, afaik, the wording is very similar to that, meaning it cannot regenerate after struck by a fire attack, so, it doesn't loose the regeneration, but it cannot use the regen.

mageith
04-01-2006, 13:48
"The flesh of a regenerating creatue cannot regenerate if it has been burnt. If a regenerating creature or unit sustains one a more wounds from a flame attack it cannot regenerate any wounds during the remainder of the battle, not even those inflicted by ordinary weapons." (113)

"The flesh of a regenerating creatue cannot regenerate if it has been burnt."
Legal answer: The creature's flesh has been burnt even though it wasn't a regenerating creature at the time. This might be fluff.

"If a regenerating creature...sustains a wound...
Legal answer: The creature was not a regenerating creature at the time.

If the wording was 'burnt flesh cannot regenerate' it would be clearer. I'd lean toward no, it still can't regenerate but the rule is self-contradictory, IMO.

Mage Ith

T10
04-01-2006, 14:37
This is a rare case where a unit is temporarilly granted the effects of what is normally a pernanent ability.

However, let's assume the following:

1) The spell is cast on the Treeman but is dispelled.
2) The Treeman suffers 1 wound from a flaming attack.
3) The spell is successfully cast on the Treeman.
4) The Treeman suffers 1 wound from a flaming attack.
5) The spell is dispelled.
6) The spell is successfully cast on the Treeman.
7) The Treeman suffers 1 wound from a non-flaming attack.

During steps 1-5, the Treeman has on two occasions suffered damage from a flaming attack. When it is time to check whether the Treman can regenerate in step 7 see wether it has previously suffered a "flaming" wound - which it clearly has.

I find it unreasonable to assume that this is only because the Treeman had the Regeneration ability when it was wounded the second time: Either the Treeman will be able to Regenerate because it has regained this ability (the spell has been cast again), or the Treeman is denied the opportunity to Regenerate for the remainder of the battle as soon as it suffered a "flaming" wound, regardless of wether it possesses the Regenerate ability or not.

In my opinion the latter is the case.

-T10

Atrahasis
04-01-2006, 16:21
2) The Treeman suffers 1 wound from a flaming attack.
Not to pick nits, but this is impossible - a Treeman cannot suffer 1 wound from a flaming attack.

T10
05-01-2006, 06:25
*yawn*

And? I didn't factor in movement, to hit rolls, cover, range, multifire, weapon rules, to wound rolls, armour saves, ward saves, break tests, flee and pursuit rolls or rally either.

-T10

SuperBeast
05-01-2006, 06:59
Flippin' heck, T10 - you're so lazy! ;)

Gorbad Ironclaw
05-01-2006, 09:22
Hmm, the way I see it a flaming attack will cancel any regeneration ability you have. However, I don't think a flaming attack will prevent you from getting regeneration later. So I do think the treeman would be able to regenerate if it was later hit by that spell(again). Granted, I can't remember the exact wording, but I would at least let it in a game without bothering to look it up.

Festus
05-01-2006, 10:51
Hi

Granted, I can't remember the exact wording, but I would at least let it in a game without bothering to look it up.
MageIth was so kind as to provide us with the text.

And I have to say that I am strongly in favour of a *nay*, no regeneration anymore if a creature took a flaming wound (or 2).

It would have been easier if they'd just omitted the *regenerating* in the second sentence.

Greetings
Festus

T10
05-01-2006, 11:00
It would have been easier idf they *didn't* introduce a spell that temprorarily grants what is normally a permanent ability.

-T10

Atrahasis
05-01-2006, 11:55
It would have been easier idf they *didn't* introduce a spell that temprorarily grants what is normally a permanent ability.

They did that in the Ogre book, long before the Wood Elves had the privilege.

From the OK FAQ sneak peak (now 10 months young!):


Q. Also, if a unit was harmed by a flaming attack early in the game, may a spell with regenerative powers be cast on the unit in a later turn and grant them Regeneration? Or does the fact that they were harmed by a flaming attack prevent them from ever benefiting from the regenerative powers of the spell?

A. No, they may later benefit from Regeneration as they are not a Regenerating creature at the time of the flaming attack.