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View Full Version : Orks or Eldar, can't decide.



TBryant
13-07-2009, 05:28
Currently I play necrons, I have about 3000 points. Looking to start a second army and can't decide between Orks and Eldar. Just wanted some opinions of the fine people of these forums. I prefer balanced armies, armies with a good "personalities". Thanks in advance for the info and I apologize if this is in the wrong section.:)

GimpMaster
13-07-2009, 05:29
friends don't let friends buy eldar.

sabre4190
13-07-2009, 05:33
Eldar have some great opportunites for balanced lists. Each of the aspects can do a certain job. Banshees and Scorps for combat, Reapers for long range, Avengers for close range firepower and so on. You can build a bunch of different lists pretty easily, although if you give up to much mobility youre wasting alot of potential.

Orks kind of have potential for balance. They traditionally excel in close combat, but with the newer rules ive seen lists that rely on shoota boyz or flash gitz for massive firepower. I guess I would just say that they have raw power. But I say eldar have more potential for balanced lists, and you wont have any fear of that changing with new army books.

Serebrate
13-07-2009, 05:37
I find Ork armies to be quite drab and boring. But I guess it's what you make of it, really.

Eldar has more fluff to support personalization and whatnot. Plus you'll be making the counterpart to your Necrons.

Nazerth
13-07-2009, 05:38
If you enjoy modeling and scratch-building even in the slightest, go with orkz and never look back! The opportunities for personalization and conversions are so insane, you can't really go wrong with what you do, unless it doesn't look ramshackle enough! Then you just need to beat it up some more :p!

ichbala
13-07-2009, 05:40
WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH!!! !!!!!!!!


I you hate Metal, dont play eldar
If you love an all-plastic army, play orks
And with black reach its easy to get a good and cheap start or an all-plastic ork army

Orks are funny
Nob bikers are badass
Cool plastics
You can have every kind of army, mechanised, shooty, CC, dred mob, gretchin meatwall, 100% bikers(Eldar can do that too i know, but ork bikers are much cooler and better) and nyou have some of the coolest characters(I know,Eldar also have very cool characters, i love the phoenix lords) and the power of the WAAAGH!!!!

darker4308
13-07-2009, 06:30
Orks are fun. Eldar are fun. You'll probably be able to do orks cheaper. The orks also have many excellent exploit lists if you want to win a few games (sick of necrons :) ). Eldar ... are very dependent on skimmer hulls and objective rushing. The classic eldar game involves 0 kills.

I would say start dark eldar. You'll win and it's got epic character.

BrotherMoses
13-07-2009, 06:33
Orks is da biggest and da strongest!

Hypaspist
13-07-2009, 08:20
well both the Eldar and the orks can produce very characterful armies. There are lots of options in both, in terms of clans/craftworlds, and in terms of efficacy and cery powerful units (Seer council/nob bikers)

At the other end of the scale, it depends on how you define your fun. If your fun is just as much the building, customisation of the army, then the Orks have it hands down, there is a very strong case for orks to be made on the cheap with AoBR and the scratch-build-ability of anything Orky.

Both armies will give you a good time (oo-er), but I will say that I have never seen an Ork player not enjoying him or herself. (Eldar players always seem to have the vague look of concern on their face, even when winning!)

of course if you want opinion then WAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHH!!!!

Farnsworth
13-07-2009, 09:01
I'm building up a new Eldar army, having run with an Ork force for a couple years. As already mentioned, both can be very enjoyable.

Looking at actually playing games, although Orks can be a lot of fun, you very quickly get used to playing in one style - rush, take loads of casualties, throw lots of dice in cc, mop up.

Eldar on the other hand are almost the opposite, some games they will carve through your opponent like a knife through butter - on other occasions, you'll find your army getting obliterated but turn three. The Eldar definitely take more skill to play well, but are a lot more rewarding when you do win.

The other big difference is in the collecting. Orks are almost all plastic, easy to convert and customize and have some cracking kits available (truck/bikers/burna boyz) The downside is that you can spend ages painting three units and find you've only built 400 points worth of boyz - patience and determination are paramount.

The Eldar on the other hand are almost all metal (with exceptions, but main units are metal) more difficult to customize and have a more "strict" painting canon already established. They also have to really annoying kits (Fire prism/warwalkers) As they are quite an elite and compact army, you can really spend a lot of attention on each mini - great if you're a perfectionist.

then you have to consider how large a force you'll create - Orks can include the stompa, and some nice FW units.

Eldar have the titans/scorpion/cobra and the choice of Avatars.

Hopefully that helps - I'd go Eldar, but either way you'll have made a good choice.

GaMeZ mAsTeR
13-07-2009, 09:48
eldar defiantly they have so much cool stuff and ork are well just say ther bad at ever thing

DaR
13-07-2009, 09:59
My two current main armies (as opposed to all my other projects... sigh) are Eldar and Orks, so I can offer my opinion.

Orks are hella fun to model and very easy to paint. Someone once told me you can build suitable ork vehicle models by dumping all your bitz in a ziploc bag, pouring in some glue, and putting whatever comes out down on the table. This is not too far from the truth. If you like cutting things up and putting them back together in different but arguably better ways, you'll very much enjoy orks. There are also a boatload of new plastics, and with very minimal effort you can model every unit in the codex in plastic, even more so if you steal liberally from your other armies bitz boxes. And being Orks, painting is very forgiving. Drybrushes, washes, and intentionally sloppy paint jobs work great, allowing you to get lots of models painted in very short order.

Playwise, Orks have a number of very viable builds right now (including, to some people's surprise, very effective shooting). They're not quite the ultra-top of the heap tournament monsters they were in the very late 4th to early 5th edition, but they're still very viable in most gaming scenarios. Learning to do well with orks is all about learning where to apply your aggression for maximum results, forcing your opponent to react and thus hopefully make mistakes.

Your biggest weakness is dealing with armor, especially heavy armor like Monoliths and Land Raiders, and to a lesser extent Dreadnoughts, Soulgrinders, and Defilers. Beyond that, Orks do have a degree of one dimensionality to them. They function best running at your opponent and krumpin' 'em on da 'ead. Most of your maneuvering will be about getting into assault range or forcing your enemy into a position where he cannot avoid your next turn assault and your primary tactical decisions will often be "kill this unit first or that one".

Eldar, by way of contrast, are not all that fun to build, though they do present an absolutely gorgeous canvas for taking your painting to competition levels. A lot of the models are metal, and of sufficiently old pedigree that they are not built with easy conversion in mind. Aspect warriors especially often come in 2 or 3 very similar poses, and that's it. The plastic kits, especially the newer ones, are very nice, but not especially easy to work with; cleaning mold lines off of Dire Avengers or Guardians will drive most men mad in short order. The tanks, warwalker, and wraithlord kits are nicer, but still nothing truly outstanding. On the painting front, there's lots of smooth surfaces to do custom freehand on, practice blending and layering techniques, and a metric buttload of gems. You will learn to love-hate painting gems, but you will probably get very good at it.

Playwise, Eldar are ultimately one of the most flexible forces out there. They have a wild variety of lists with very distinct play styles, depending on what units you focus on. You can go for a very resilient and hard hitting but small and slow list using lots of Wraithguard and Wraithlords, Iyanden style. You can be extremely fast but somehwhat fragile with loads of jetbikes and vypers, Saim Hann style. Load up on specialty Aspect and Harlequin troops for a jigsaw list that's devastating if deployed well and crumples like paper if you get it wrong, while Mechanized Eldar lists are considered one of the hardest lists to kill in the current tourney scene, especially with a Seer Council on jetbikes or two.

Learning to play Eldar well is all about synergy and timing. When to commit your units and how to preserve your often fragile forces until the situation calls for it combines with knowing how to use force multipliers like your Farseer's Psychic powers and your Autarch's reserve roll enhancing.

Eldar's biggest weaknesses are the same as their strengths. Almost all their units are so specialized that using them incorrectly will leave your army destroyed early on. Combine that with the fact that most eldar models are not especially resilient (there are exceptions, of course), and you can be a glass cannon that can't absorb early casualties. If you get impatient easily, you'll probably suffer a lot playing Eldar.

Bishop Rook
13-07-2009, 10:09
I can condense the entirety of Ork tactics down for you as so;

1. deploy Orks in big line
2. move all Orks forward 6"
3. if something is in shooting range, shoot it
4. if something is in charge range, charge it
5. repeat from point 2 until all your Orks are inevitably dead because Eldar are faster. Haha, stoopid fungus! Eldar smash you good!

If you're playing a wagon-centric list, replace the 'move forward 6"' to 'move forward 12"'. Otherwise it remains the same, because Eldar as still faster!

Souleater
13-07-2009, 12:59
Orks have more character than Eldar could ever dream of.

If you want a very different army go with Orks.

sigur
13-07-2009, 13:39
...
Eldar has more fluff to support personalization and whatnot. Plus you'll be making the counterpart to your Necrons.

Have you ever read the tons of Ork background? They probably have as much background as chaos have.

Orks and Eldar are both great armies. I don't really believe in personalities matching the army one plays but apart from that, current army lists give you the possibility to play these armies pretty much any way you like.

In terms of background, both armies are very good, Orks have superior older background though. If you ever get the chance to read it, do so. And worship it. :p

I have to admit that I haven't played Eldar in many years and even then only once or twice but I think that they are almost a bit more interesting to play than Orks. (played Orks quite a lot in the past year)..

All I can say really is that both armies are really great in every respect. The only real difference I see is that if you want to convert much, Orks probably will be the easier choice as they have much plastic stuff plus converting Orks is quite easy. For converting Eldar, you have to plan ahead and you have to have some skill. Eldar on the other hand look better when painted. Current Ork models just always look the same, Eldar models really reward people who invest the time and efford to make them look good.

Nym
13-07-2009, 13:40
I love Orks, but they can be pretty boring if you play an all footslogging (or all-mechanized) army.

If you really want to have fun with them, go for a "Hammer & Anvil" kind of army. A big chunk of slow units (footsloggers, kanz, etc...) and a few fast units (Deffkoptas, Trukks, Bikez). That makes for a really fun and balanced army to play. ;)

Eldars have a cool gameplay, but fluff-wise they're just a bunch of arrogant bast**** :p

Sorros
13-07-2009, 14:11
On the topic of Eldar conversions...

You can still do lots of conversions, if in an odd way. Take fantasy/dark eldar bitz and interchange them with normal Eldar Guardians/Dire Avengers.

If you equip a squad with swords and pistols, guess what? Scorpions or Banshees. If you take large weapons, the size of a reaper launcher, you have a dark reaper. The armour isn't a big deal, as long as their equipment fits.

I run a full converted unit of glade guard/random Eldar bitz as warp spiders, and they don't even have spider packs--they're exodites, they're so good at moving through the landscape it seems like they're teleporting.

I recently won a high elf battalion for only 16 bucks, and now I have wonderful opportunities for more units. So no, Eldar are not very limited conversion wise, you can make anything you really want, you just have to take stuff from other armies, etc. I intend to have an entirely converted army by the end of the year, approximately 2k points. I'm even crafting tanks from modeling clay, but with a few twists.

Exia Angel
13-07-2009, 15:54
I'd take Eldar.

Yes, the army is at least 50% metal, depending on the aspects or craftworld you play (Ulthwe and Saim-Hann can actually be made mostly with plastic, Alaitoc only needs rangers, Biel-Tan and Iyanden are heavy metal.)

I get tired of orks because every army seems identical to me. Doesn't matter what guns you put in it, how many mobs, how it acts, how its made, they just bore me. They are what they are, and some players like them, but I'm pointy-eared, like Taylor Swift!

Eldar really make for a good list, no matter what your particular style is. Mechanised, basic infantry, aspect/elite heavy, all vehicles, etc. LOTS to choose from. The drawback is knowing how to use it. It's my professional opinion that anyone starting eldar should expect heavy casualties, and a string of losses, till they make it work for them.

-Exia

Clang
13-07-2009, 21:53
Orks if you want to spend lots of time converting unique characterful models. Eldar if you just want to buy, paint and play.

TBryant
14-07-2009, 01:35
Thanks for all the feedback. After thinking about it last night and most of the day today, I think I am going with Eldar. I just love Eldrad, the Wraithguard/lord models, just all the models in general look really great. Now just need to come up with a list to get started.

12345_7
14-07-2009, 01:42
Are you planning on doing a certain craftworld right now or just getting a list and moving on from there?