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Tulun
08-01-2006, 23:24
First try at VCs... what do you think?

1500 (Summoner List)

Hero - Necromancer (general) - 145 points
Staff of Damnation, Level 2 Wizard

Necromancer - 150 points
Level 2, Dispel Scroll, Book of Arkhan

Necromancer - 150 points
Level 2, Dispel Scroll, Book of Arkhan

Core - 20 Zombies, Full Command - 115 points

20 Zombies, Full Command - 115 points

20 Skeletons, Full Command , Spear - 185 points

20 Skeletons, Full Command , Spear - 185 points

Special - 5 Black Knights, Barding, Full Command - 150 points

10 Grave Guard, Shields, Full Command - 140 points

10 Dire Wolves - 90 points

Rare - Banshee - 75 points

Three Headed Monkey
09-01-2006, 00:01
I would suggest making your core infantry units a little larger, around 25 models would be great, maybe 30 for zombies, as it gives you wounds to work with before you start losing rank bonuses, which you need because of your lack of fighting characters. Dont force your units to rely on your necromancers, just have the necros there to enhance things as you go along. Large horde like units are more in keeping with a necromancer army anyway :). Perhaps get rid of one unit of skeletons or zombies to spread the numbers around to the remaining units. Or you could get rid of the Grave Guard as well to free up some points. This is just my opinion of how I would run the list, so give it a few games and see how it goes, then perhaps move to my suggestion and see how that performs in comparison.

Remember that, at least, to start off with you will be losing combats, and with so many units to look after, you will have a very hard time keeping your numbers up in individual units. Also keep in mind that you must try to always outnumber your opponent. Even after several combats as your first win in that combat may come a few phases after the charge, depending on what help you get. Outnumbering will be essential in making sure that failed fear tests is as effective as they can be, as well as making use of the autobreak rule. Remember, autobreak will be such a blessing! Make as much use of it as possible. Against some armies, such as dwarfs, it can be the only way to get the stubborn buggers to break!

apart from that, i like your special choices, some lovely hard hitting units. I would try to get your knights, Grave Guard and dire wolves into flank charges. However, as you have no combat characters, giving at least one unit of wights the banner of the barrows as this can really make a difference in a combat. The more hits you have the greater the odds of rolling a killing blow. Dont be afraid to single out characters with these units.

Also, besides dispel scrolls, powerstones and bloodline powers and the like, you cannot have more than one of the same magic item in your army. You can only field one book of arkhan. For the points cost, I suggest the Black Periapt. Very useful magic item. I also ask for you not to grab another scroll instead. Two is enough in a all wizard army.

I like the way you think though, planning to raise fresh units and then get the rear / flank charge (im assuming) in the same magic phase. Not very subtle (or original for that matter :p), but it works, and flank and rear charges are probably

Other units that would be great to use in this more 'control' type army, as opposed to a smash through everything army, would be a second banshee (two work really well together, and literally doubles your chances of racking up the kills), a largish (3-6 base) unit of spirit hosts, remember these guys are healable, and fell bats (which are always useful against warmachines, skirmishes and the like.

These units are also all candidates if you want to expand the list to 2000 points in the future. Also consider that when you get a master necromancer in the list, you could replace one of your hero level necromancers for a wight lord or wraith to give a unit a better chance in combat. Or perhaps use a Necrach Count with the awakening and Nehekara's Noble Blood instead of the Master Necro.

Remember, always play with your ideas first, see how they go, and then changer, or expand the army to compare.

Good luck with it, and may your summoning roles always be large and inconvenient to your opponent!

Tulun
09-01-2006, 00:45
I mainly built the units based on the box sets itself. I think a combined 40 would be a good idea, though.

Thanks for pointing out the Arkhan book, I'll be sure to note that.

At the break to 2000, I would more than likely use a Vampire of some kind as the general. Just seems to be much more suited to keeping the general alive if you have the army of death at your feet.
I would consider Spirit hosts for sure, I just ran out of points (and special slots).

Three Headed Monkey
10-01-2006, 01:07
Units of 40 would also work well :)

Sounds good. A Master Necromancer with the cloak of mist and shadows is pretty well protected, although the vampire does bring some **** kicking ability to the fore as well. Any idea what bloodline you'd be using?

A Necrarch vampire could really help out your magical power much more than any other bloodline and fits into the Summoner theme of the list, while a Blooddragon would give you excellent combat power and probably has the greatest survivability (high WS, full plate armour, and what ever ward you would like to give) but the least in magical ability.

Or are you undecided at this point and want to just focus on the 1500 point list for now? All in all, it is a good list. It has a very solid core, survivablity and is fairly flexible and besides for the concentration on magic balanced in terms of unit selection. Although I still think you could put a Banner of the Barrows and/or a War Banner in there somewhere :)

A banner of doom would also keep a wight unit from its biggest threat, heavy amounts of shooting, considering their small unit size.

shadowprince
10-01-2006, 02:44
I suggest splitting the dire wolfs as I believe they are core, go to things of five. Then I suggest dropping the gravguard as you all ready have three flankng units, getting the banner of barrows for your knights, then uping the starting number of the zombies, the whole raise them idea is good, but its always nice to have more.

Tulun
10-01-2006, 04:41
Shadowprince - they aren't core in the 'Summoner' list. It's why the points for things is a bit off... they get discounts :) Dire Wolves are special, though.

3-headed-Monkey - I would probably use the Blood Dragon line, for 2 reasons:

1) Models. They are, in my opinion, the only vampire models that look REMOTELY decent. The rest, ugh... seem sub-par to me.
2) Combat, but some magic support. The lord can provide level 2 or 3 magic, but still can be a combat god. He doesn't have always do a ton of things, but he provides extra dispel, power, etc. And meanwhile, he can wear armor and an assortment of nasty things.

Three Headed Monkey
10-01-2006, 13:06
Remember he generates one less powerdice than normal. But, yeah, essentially you will have four level two wizards, which is a good thing, plus a combat monster. But the list then changes as it will no longer be the back of the book Necro list.

I also think a unit of ten dire wolves, while less flexible than two units of five, has the needed survivability to last more than one flank charge and remain effective. It takes many less losses to stop the two smaller units from being able to reduce rank bonuses, which, lets face it, is what they are primarily there to do. When I play a game I usually switch these two options around game to game depending on how shooty or speedy an army I feel I will face. Sometimes splitting them up adds to their power and even their ability to survive, occasionally only as I large group do I feel they can be useful. My opinion of them changes from battle to battle.

However I agree with shadowprince that you dont really need the Grave Guard. A unit that small provides such an excellent target for missile fire as they can be reduced to almost zero effectiveness very quickly and they dont quite have the resilience of the black knights. Keep in mind that if they do make to combat, they will be very powerful, its just that they dont have the numbers to last for long or to reliably make a difference. Large numbers in the graveguard can somethings be more important than in other undead infantry as they cannot be targeted by the invocation of Nehek.