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View Full Version : Possible community breakdowns - Where do you see yourself? The future of Warseer...



XenosVanquisher
12-08-2009, 02:39
So by now most of us know that Games Workshop are planning to, and correct me if I'm wrong, are in the process of creating their own forum. It has had me thinking now what kind of impact the creation of an 'official' forum is going to have on the traffic and new member base of websites such as this one.

A lot of people believe that the rumour mill will die with the creation of an official Games Workshop forum - but people seem to be forgetting that Games Workshop did have a forum once upon a time...and the thing was nothing short of a disaster. The rumour mill will always exist unless they have actual GW staff monitoring the forums and clarifying rumours and rubishing the wild claims, and lets be honest - we all know that is a long shot.

I remember when they closed the old forum it was widely accepted that Games Workshop had cut their ties with the online community, and in my eyes this action sealed their status as the hungry steam train of the hobby world.

But - Could this new forum be a sign that GW has finally recognised the importance of third party communities such as this one? Will we have a collective voice within an official environment? It would be nice to see the green username which indicates you have had a White Dwarf/GW editor look at and reply to your post...it really made you feel connected.

I will reserve all judgement until I see the final product - What do you guys think?

Vandelan
12-08-2009, 02:46
Official forums never do as well as unofficial forums. The regulation on official forums are usually too restrictive to allow the players to speak their minds.

Not to mention, the sub communities on unofficial forums are usually supported as opposed to discouraged.

Vepr
12-08-2009, 02:50
The GW <----Term removed. WarSeer Inquisition----> will ensure that their forums are nothing but nut hugging, unicorns, and rainbows thus ensuring the life of other forums. :p

Kriegfreak
12-08-2009, 02:50
Official forums never do as well as unofficial forums. The regulation on official forums are usually too restrictive to allow the players to speak their minds.

Not to mention, the sub communities on unofficial forums are usually supported as opposed to discouraged.

For sure. I'm curious if they have or will have a type of project log, and if so. Would your post be banned or deleted if your models weren't 90-100% Games Workshop, or painted with something other than GW paints? :d

catbarf
12-08-2009, 02:53
GW used to have forums, and closed them down because the comments weren't positive enough. If they create new forums, it's going to be like that Twilight Zone episode where everyone has to think only happy thoughts or be sent to an infinite cornfield (banlist).

WhineSeer will become only stronger :p

Zingbaby
12-08-2009, 02:57
This isn't new... they had pretty decent forums back in the day. Other forums still did fine from what I remember. I know this forum was called something else before Warseer, but I can't remember what.

I used to spend a lot of time on GW forums heh - there and Brother Edwards Blood Angels site.

doombanner
12-08-2009, 04:04
GW used to have forums, and closed them down because the comments weren't positive enough. If they create new forums, it's going to be like that Twilight Zone episode where everyone has to think only happy thoughts or be sent to an infinite cornfield (banlist).

WhineSeer will become only stronger :p

Not seeing the downside. Differing opinions make for better discussion. I everyone agrees whith everyone else, what's the point of posting at all?

~Doom Banner

Occulto
12-08-2009, 04:10
GW used to have forums, and closed them down because the comments weren't positive enough. were mostly garbage.

Fixed that for you. :p

A badly organised forum that ended up an unreadable cocktail of GW-baiting, cheese complaints, "does anyone else play <army>?" threads and general flaming.

I don't see v2.0 being much better.

HsojVvad
12-08-2009, 04:16
Uh this is news to me. GW having an official forum again? Why? I was so pissed when they took it down the first time. Then when I speak to this at a GW store they said it was no good blah blah blah blah blah.

I am getting a feeling the GW employees can't really say anything they want and are programmed to what they say. I am afraid of this happening on a GW forum, that will make it suck big time.

Inquisitor Engel
12-08-2009, 04:22
When the GW Forums closed down, all the Mods on Portent were ready, coordinated via MSN to warn, ban and slash our way through the inane drivel posts and posters that would flow our way.

Much blood was spilt that day.

Codsticker
12-08-2009, 04:23
A badly organised forum that ended up an unreadable cocktail of GW-baiting, cheese complaints, "does anyone else play <army>?" threads and general flamingIndeed. I didn't visit the old one very much and I don't expect to visit a new one anymore, unless it is vastly improved.

kikkoman
12-08-2009, 04:24
I will travel to this strange new frontier, bringing merriment with tales of gunface jungle ninjas and deli shop eldar.

Lord Inquisitor
12-08-2009, 04:30
While the main forums were generally unnavigatable piles of gibberish that were a nightmare to use (no "edit" button, needing to click on each post to view?!) the specialist games forums were rather nice with decent software, a reasonable degree of latitude in posting and a fairly balanced community.

If GW produce their own forums then hopefully they'll be more like the SG forums were, not the mainstream ones. Then again, the SG community is generally a smaller, more mature one than the mainstream games, so perhaps it is unlikely.

One advantage of the main forums is the possibility that this may galvanise more official (or even unofficial) FAQs. A well-maintained rules forum with access to official answers - well, one can dream... :)

Emeraldw
12-08-2009, 04:45
Official forums will create a central location for communication for the company if they do it right. However, i hope they are prepared for what is coming. If the WoW forums are any indication they are rarely positive places but useful information CAN be found there however I hope they organize it and enforce the rules MUCH better. Warhammer Alliance is probably the best example of how a forum should be run in my mind but that isn't what this is about is it?

@Lord Inq: A rules forum would be nice as well as a place to talk to the devs about future things but as you said, one can dream.....

acme2468
12-08-2009, 04:47
When the GW Forums closed down, all the Mods on Portent were ready, coordinated via MSN to warn, ban and slash our way through the inane drivel posts and posters that would flow our way.

Much blood was spilt that day.

LMAO :D So Perfect.

Yea I recall the GW forums of old, a flawed and crippled segment of the Interweb it was.

e2055261
12-08-2009, 04:51
I think it won't work for me. You can't blame them but they'll edit out anything that is remotely negative. Maybe that's why they gave up in the first place.

Shinzui
12-08-2009, 04:54
I'm positive the endless circle of Chaos Tau, Chaos Greyknights and Female Space Marines threads started the day the forum was shut down.

BrotherMoses
12-08-2009, 05:00
they should really concentrate on updating what they actually have on their site before adding new stuff...

sic
12-08-2009, 05:05
Well if the GW forum is easy to navigate and put together well i cant see a problem with it.

As for the problem of idiots posting on it you will always have that problem, it happens here too!
However if it gets support from people on Warseer (the majority of which actually put decent things on the forum) then it could be a good thing.

SO hopefully GW make it attractive to people other than rubbish posting fanboys and cheese callers....

techman
12-08-2009, 05:19
Meh I will say whatever I want, and if I keep getting edited I'll pulla 40k radio...one of the guys eventually called spencer out on the comments about whats done with the money and got a BS answer...I dont care about being banned, having some people willing to say stuff makes the endless masses go whaaa GW isnt god:rolleyes:

Seth the Dark
12-08-2009, 07:19
The End Times are nigh!

EmperorEternalXIX
12-08-2009, 07:37
I think it would be great if the community were less retarded overall.

For example, supposing they had a legitimate forum...the second a dev or mod answered a rules question incorrectly, they would be blacklisted and there would be an epic *********.

The problem is we as a community (and I barely include myself in that) have no respect for the game or its creators; Warseer is a perfect example of that, it is full of threads where we all talk about the foolishness of some of the design decisions. I feel like, largely, it is mature enough on here, but all too often there is just senseless and groundless bashing of the company and the game.

To be honest, a forum where they police it to minimize that stuff would be a welcome change to me. I actually LIKE the game and I actually LIKE the company and its products; I am pretty sick of listening to people talk about how stupid GW is and what an "unplayable piece of crap" their worldwide 20+year-old franchise gaming phenomenon is.

Nicha11
12-08-2009, 07:37
The only reason I would go to said forum would be to work out how rules are meant to be played.

Bassik
12-08-2009, 08:43
I think it would be great if the community were less retarded overall.

For example, supposing they had a legitimate forum...the second a dev or mod answered a rules question incorrectly, they would be blacklisted and there would be an epic *********.

The problem is we as a community (and I barely include myself in that) have no respect for the game or its creators; Warseer is a perfect example of that, it is full of threads where we all talk about the foolishness of some of the design decisions. I feel like, largely, it is mature enough on here, but all too often there is just senseless and groundless bashing of the company and the game.

To be honest, a forum where they police it to minimize that stuff would be a welcome change to me. I actually LIKE the game and I actually LIKE the company and its products; I am pretty sick of listening to people talk about how stupid GW is and what an "unplayable piece of crap" their worldwide 20+year-old franchise gaming phenomenon is.

I totally agree with you! I also have a deep resentment for people who bash this game because it's apparently not elite enough. These are the people who don't just use macs, but feel the need to constantly bash windows.
Warhammer sells well, people like the game, get over thyself.

Hive Mind 33
12-08-2009, 09:07
I think it would be great if the community were less retarded overall.

For example, supposing they had a legitimate forum...the second a dev or mod answered a rules question incorrectly, they would be blacklisted and there would be an epic *********.

The problem is we as a community (and I barely include myself in that) have no respect for the game or its creators; Warseer is a perfect example of that, it is full of threads where we all talk about the foolishness of some of the design decisions. I feel like, largely, it is mature enough on here, but all too often there is just senseless and groundless bashing of the company and the game.

To be honest, a forum where they police it to minimize that stuff would be a welcome change to me. I actually LIKE the game and I actually LIKE the company and its products; I am pretty sick of listening to people talk about how stupid GW is and what an "unplayable piece of crap" their worldwide 20+year-old franchise gaming phenomenon is.

Has there ever been truer words on this series of tubes?

take19
12-08-2009, 09:15
I would like them to make a forum. I didn't think the last one was all that bad, if they do it right then warseer will definitely feel it. I like the idea of a GW one because it allows for more members as people simply visiting the GW website will know about it.

zakk_wylde001
12-08-2009, 09:19
I think it would be great if the community were less retarded overall.

For example, supposing they had a legitimate forum...the second a dev or mod answered a rules question incorrectly, they would be blacklisted and there would be an epic *********.

The problem is we as a community (and I barely include myself in that) have no respect for the game or its creators; Warseer is a perfect example of that, it is full of threads where we all talk about the foolishness of some of the design decisions. I feel like, largely, it is mature enough on here, but all too often there is just senseless and groundless bashing of the company and the game.

To be honest, a forum where they police it to minimize that stuff would be a welcome change to me. I actually LIKE the game and I actually LIKE the company and its products; I am pretty sick of listening to people talk about how stupid GW is and what an "unplayable piece of crap" their worldwide 20+year-old franchise gaming phenomenon is.

+1000

I think it's a shame that some many people spend time looking purely at what they see as the bad aspects of the game, rather than the trillions of very good things about it.

Mojaco
12-08-2009, 09:39
This isn't new... they had pretty decent forums back in the day. Other forums still did fine from what I remember. I know this forum was called something else before Warseer, but I can't remember what.

I used to spend a lot of time on GW forums heh - there and Brother Edwards Blood Angels site.

It was called portent. And it had a red colour scheme, just like Warseer can have if you adjust some settings. I don't like the blue...

Poseidal
12-08-2009, 09:41
I'll probably sign up and see what it's like. I usually wander, see seven wonders around the net.

Bob Hunk
12-08-2009, 10:39
GW are bringing back their forums? Sweet! :) I used to love the 40k 'rules development' forum, purely because people would suggest the most daft and unworkable nonsense, and then defend it to the death when it was explained why they might be unbalanced, etc.

My favourite suggestion was that all Marines should have a profile for their acid spit as follows: R18", S6, AP4, Assault 1. Great stuff! :D

I look forward to the next round of bad ideas and resulting flame wars; all very amusing when you have a few minutes to kill on the internet.

But on a more positive note and as previous posters have mentioned, there was a certain amount of satisfaction/warm glow to be gained when a member of the design team or White Dwarf replied to your post. :)

Overall I can't see the number of visitors to Warseer dropping by any significant amount.

XenosVanquisher
12-08-2009, 10:41
Meh I will say whatever I want, and if I keep getting edited I'll pulla 40k radio...one of the guys eventually called spencer out on the comments about whats done with the money and got a BS answer...I dont care about being banned, having some people willing to say stuff makes the endless masses go whaaa GW isnt god:rolleyes:

I absolutely despise the guys at 40k radio...

How many times a show do they feel the need to say 'I WAS WASTED'? They have an extremely immature teenage attitude to thinking that they need to inform those around them of every 'wild' thing they do, as if it somehow gains them status and makes people like them.

If I want to hear a bunch of lightweights attacking their own credibility on a weekly basis then I'll watch the kids outside the local liquor store asking people to go in for them.

I still find myself listening to them occasionally though...but it gets so frustrating.

pringles978
12-08-2009, 10:43
if the current gw website is anything to go by, ill give it a miss thanks...

Crube
12-08-2009, 10:49
Not 40K specific - thread moved to GW - Other Discussion


Crube
The Warseer Inquisition

yabbadabba
12-08-2009, 10:52
Well, I think most of you are missing the point.

If GW start a new forum site who will it be for. A bunch of Vets with time to waste at work, or their target market of 12-16 year olds who are all web addicted?

I will be happily surprised if (a) it goes ahead and (b) its for the community as a whole. But personally I can see a lot of Whingeseer vets coming back on here saying "Its s**te as its for kids and neewbs". You have been warned.

Charax
12-08-2009, 11:06
Well, I think most of you are missing the point.

If GW start a new forum site who will it be for. A bunch of Vets with time to waste at work, or their target market of 12-16 year olds who are all web addicted?

And that's the difference between the Specialist Games forums - the separate ones, before they were smooshed together - which people largely consider to have been handled well, and the old GW forums, which were a disaster with a signal to noise ratio so disproportionate that you could go days without seeing an intelligent post.

Not to mention the colossal foul-ups you get when you release off-the-cuff FAQs on forums. Remember the "Space Marine Familiars should be on their own bases" ruling, when most of the familiars in the model range were physically part of the Librarian model?

yabbadabba
12-08-2009, 11:10
...that you could go days without seeing an intelligent post.

and thats different to here because? :evilgrin:

Condottiere
12-08-2009, 12:33
Apple heavily censor the forums they have control over, so most of the posters switch to other venues to air their views, which tends to bring more light on what they were unhappy about then Apple wanted to be shed in the first place.

Ixquic
12-08-2009, 13:27
If you need a forum that GW will police just so you don't hear mean things about your hobby that's kind of sad. If Blizzard's forums are any indication, their target demographic of 10-16 year olds aren't going to be happy in a place they can't complain about mundane garbage like it's the end of the world and are internet savvy enough to know there are options out there that will let them. Unlike the old forums, the new ones will have corporate polish and probably be moderated incredibly stringently so I don't see who will want to be there except for the most brainwashed of Stockholm syndrome sufferers.

zedeyejoe
12-08-2009, 13:49
The GW forum was awful. Warseer is OK (my only problem is with the moderators). There are some really good forums out there. Who needs a GW one.

Fenrir
12-08-2009, 14:37
Warseer was better before the GW forums went down. But then, Portent was better than Warseer.

blongbling
12-08-2009, 15:00
one of the reason that GW canned the forums in the first place was that there were so many good one already out there...that and all the GW bashing that went on, you cant expect to post on our forums and not agree with us :D

pringles978
12-08-2009, 15:04
A bunch of Vets with time to waste at work,


do you have a camera in my office?

Joewrightgm
12-08-2009, 15:29
Honestly, and I'm pretty sure this is a by-product of my being a positive person, I would enjoy a forum that was more tightly controlled and less filled with ignorant vitriol and banality like Warseer is, with better regulation of thread content. At Warseer, it seems to be less about the positive and fun aspects of the hobby and more about what is wrong with it.

I mean, I'd love this website if everyday I didn't see the same trolling posts and inane threads pop up. And note, this is not meant to be any sort of a trolling post, this is just me speaking my mind.

zedeyejoe
12-08-2009, 15:30
Portent was better than Warseer.

Ah, you remind me of happy days.

BigBadBull
12-08-2009, 15:37
The old Gw forum 's sucked bad...
The software was bad and it did not run very well

I don't see this ending up good.

Bloodknight
12-08-2009, 15:41
@joewrightgm: I am not sure if you knew the old GW forum, but that was far worse than what you're describing Warseer as. It was an unmoddable mess of flames, insults and mostly idiocy that could make your brain melt after too long exposure, I am not kidding...I used to post there *cough*. So in the end, moderation just consisted of closing threads left and right and you couldn't have a decent discussion because at some point, a troll would sneak in and get your thread locked.

The only good thing that I ever got out of that forum was at the time when the developers were still reading the Development forums and you could actually ask questions that would end up in an FAQ...I always thought they pulled the questions from somewhere until one of mine ended up 1:1 copy/paste in the Tomb King FAQ where it still is ;)

loveless
12-08-2009, 15:54
*sigh* There's a problem with a new forum for me - the "regulars" from other sites. Now, WarSeer is kind enough to ban most of those people who I find obnoxious - it's much of the reason I'm still here and not over at BoLS or B&C. I do not want to have to put up with their egotistical crap or rampant trolling at a new "official" forum.

Don't get me wrong - WarSeer still has several posters that just drive me up the wall - thank the Emperor for the ignore feature. There's just going to be a lot more work for me to get a new forum to an "acceptable" reading level.

However, if the news and rumour mill moves to an official forum, then I'll have no choice but to set up a new camp there as well.

Bregalad
12-08-2009, 16:11
However, if the news and rumour mill moves to an official forum, then I'll have no choice but to set up a new camp there as well.
I wouldn't bet on it. GW's "Kill word-of-mouth" stategy is still in place. You will still see rumours first here on Warseer (then a couple of hours later copied at BolS, then here again in a second thread copied from BolS ;)). If GW thinks that restricting rumours and GW product discussion is a good thing, they will enforce it on their own forum (and podcast and radio) as well. Expect a platform for new happy GW cultists.

Ravenous
12-08-2009, 16:14
Good to see GW is wasting money on something that doesnt help them, however it should be interesting to see if they do it, and what the North American tournament circuit will look like in 2010 when ever they get around to it.


*sigh* There's a problem with a new forum for me - the "regulars" from other sites. Now, WarSeer is kind enough to ban most of those people who I find obnoxious - it's much of the reason I'm still here and not over at BoLS or B&C. I do not want to have to put up with their egotistical crap or rampant trolling at a new "official" forum.

Don't get me wrong - WarSeer still has several posters that just drive me up the wall - thank the Emperor for the ignore feature. There's just going to be a lot more work for me to get a new forum to an "acceptable" reading level.

However, if the news and rumour mill moves to an official forum, then I'll have no choice but to set up a new camp there as well.

I can see the walls of text talk now. Lets just hope GW dont get the brain wave to release mish mashed FAQs on there again.

Grimstonefire
12-08-2009, 17:02
Where has it been rumoured that GW will be doing a new forum? I think a blog or podcast would be much better for them, one way traffic ;)

Condottiere
12-08-2009, 17:21
Considering the current climate, it does seem counter-intuitive for them to establish one, at least not without an overall change in marketing philosophy.

Charax
12-08-2009, 17:23
Where has it been rumoured that GW will be doing a new forum? I think a blog or podcast would be much better for them, one way traffic ;)

I thought they said at Games Day (Chicago?) they were going to start Podcasting?

XenosVanquisher
12-08-2009, 17:39
I thought they said at Games Day (Chicago?) they were going to start Podcasting?

They already did some podcasts, I think I still have them on my computer somewhere.

Wintertooth
12-08-2009, 19:13
They already have a blog (http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/content/blog.jsp) and a podcast (http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/content/article.jsp?aId=9400003).

ChrisAsmadi
12-08-2009, 19:26
It has some potential if they filter out both troll and crap posts, and do one of these two things:

-have actual developer posts
-use it for playtesting new lists so that stuff doesn't end up as broken as HE or Daemons.

Wintermute
12-08-2009, 19:29
When the GW Forums closed down, all the Mods on Portent were ready

I doubt it very much because the GW Forums closed in October 2006 and WarSeer had been in action since March 2005 :p

Wintermute

Son of the Lion
12-08-2009, 19:36
I was about to point this out - I'd been a signed up warseer for at least 3 months when the GW forums closed down (I joined in june '06)

I really have no idea what their thought process is with this - the new content on the site, a podcast, even the blogs are all great positive ways to communicate with their fans (providing they listen to the some of the feedback of course). But considering their business strategy is still hike the prices, snare the young'uns, I can't imagine the forum will be anything other than the cesspool of bile and spam it was when they closed it.

starlight
12-08-2009, 19:44
Actually I fear that (assuming this fanciful rumour is true) it will be even worse... :(


Between all the kiddies flocking to GW.com/forums because it's *kewl* :cries: and the massive backlash from the thousands of bored and grumpy gamers still nursing grudges from last time (I presume they didn't maintain a list of which emails they banned last time around) it will likely be a horrorshow of spam and nonsense to rival our own 40K Gen on a bad day... :(


Although GW *has* made an attempt at a replacement forum, it was (maybe still is?) strictly a one-way *announcements* vehicle with extremely limited interaction allowed...which may be what started all this kafuffle...

Grimstonefire
12-08-2009, 20:06
Could they not just allow people to comment on the blog, rather than an open forum? They could have an automatic swearing filter. ;) As already said by others I don't think there is much they could achieve on a forum that would be different from last time. Even if they did update the forum system to be even remotely decent, their list of things you couldn't discuss and the inane rubbish that went on would still be there.

The most infuriating thing about a badly structured forum like the old GW one is that all posts were mixed together, and they sunk down to page 5 in a day simply because of the number of members.

If they restart this they should split it into a section and subsection for each army, in both the main systems at least.

As most people have said, being away from GW forum is usually a good thing because we are free to discuss things we dislike about what they're doing, and get quality feedback.

Wolf Scout Ewan
12-08-2009, 20:09
Sorry, but I cannot see how this is gonna end any differently from the other forum. Kirby clearly said he doesnt like the internet and forums like this due to the negativity.

Unless someone else has decided that they want to connect with their audience? I remember the GW forums and it was full of nonsense, unless they want to have a forum similar to the City of Heroes Forum which has lots of info from the developers.

Either way it will be heavily moderated... it has been proved that GW doesnt want constructive criticism and this led to the flaming that made them bring it down.

For me, I was here when all portent did was rumours and I will be here till the end of the hobby.

Ravenous
12-08-2009, 20:13
Could they not just allow people to comment on the blog, rather than an open forum? As already said by others I don't think there is much they could achieve on a forum that would be different from last time. Even if they did update the forum system to be even remotely decent, their list of things you couldn't discuss and the inane rubbish that went on would still be there.

The most infuriating thing about a badly structured forum like the old GW one is that all posts were mixed together, and they sunk down to page 5 in a day simply because of the number of members.

If they restart this they should split it into a section for each army, in both the main systems at least.

As most people have said, being away from GW forum is usually a good thing because we are free to discuss things we dislike about what they're doing, and get quality feedback.

Whats better is if you have to register with the store in order to go on their forum, that way GW can know your name and where you live if you bash GW. I dont even want to consider that sort of totalitarian rule over people, especially in GWs hands.

Deep-Green-X
12-08-2009, 20:17
Sorry, but I cannot see how this is gonna end any differently from the other forum. Kirby clearly said he doesnt like the internet and forums like this due to the negativity.

Unless someone else has decided that they want to connect with their audience? I remember the GW forums and it was full of nonsense, unless they want to have a forum similar to the City of Heroes Forum which has lots of info from the developers.

Either way it will be heavily moderated... it has been proved that GW doesnt want constructive criticism and this led to the flaming that made them bring it down.

For me, I was here when all portent did was rumours and I will be here till the end of the hobby.


I used to lurk on the old GW forums, it was rarely ever constructive criticism it was constant whingeing, bitching and GW baiting.

Peope often forget that the other side of the GW Fanboy coin, the GW Hateboy is equally as bad if not worse as they look for any and every excuse to trash the object of their loathing.

If I were in GW's marketing department and all I did was read the Other Gw Discussion board I would have a very negative view of the average Warseer forum user, thank god the other boards have less negativity in them.

yabbadabba
12-08-2009, 20:20
There si so much paranoia and automatic GW bashing on here it is laughable.

starlight
12-08-2009, 20:34
So you're saying that GW's last Forums *didn't* have problems...and that their track record and attitude towards the Internet *don't* speak for themselves?

Have I missed something? :confused:

Deep-Green-X
12-08-2009, 20:38
Whats better is if you have to register with the store in order to go on their forum, that way GW can know your name and where you live if you bash GW. I dont even want to consider that sort of totalitarian rule over people, especially in GWs hands.

So your saying that GW bashing, not constructive criticism but bashing, is perfectly acceptable as long as you have your anonymity?

starlight
12-08-2009, 20:42
That's enough of that tangent.

Please stay on topic of GW's potential return to hosting their own Forum.

starlight
The Warseer Inquisition

Condottiere
12-08-2009, 20:44
We're still in the Wild West phase of the internet and like to keep our masks on.

As regards GW maintaining their own Forum again, they either learn to live with the criticism or censor posters, and accept the consequences.

Cane
12-08-2009, 22:12
GW shutting down their forums was one of the biggest "WTF ARE YOU DOING?!" moments for me and GW. GW products sells itself a community and niche driven hobby and they go and shut down their own community?

However like its been said the last forum was pretty crap including moderation. However THE WORST thing about the forum was its software + server. Even for its time the software was long outdated and paled in comparison to the forum software Warseer and Dakka, and pretty much any large forum used. It was slow, unorganized, and lacked many features its counterparts had during the time. Have to remember that this was a few years back before forums were as mainstream and great as they are now.

As for customer QQ, you'll find that in any forum (even in ultra successful companies that put GW to shame like Blizzard). GW deserves a lot of flak and criticism and will hopefully grow stronger and better after learning what makes their customers tick and to stop their customer base from continually decreasing as its been doing these past few years.

JLBeady
12-08-2009, 22:23
I think the 3rd party forums like Warseer, DakkaDakka, etc. are so mature and diverse that any official GW forum will have a hard time gaining the needed traffic to sustain the community. Not to mention that it is almost a prerequisite that they have stricter moderation which is something the gaming community as a whole chafes under.

That said, I applaud GW for trying to update their digital initiative and I am interested if they will bring something new to the plate that will be a compelling reason to spend more time on their site.

Ravenous
12-08-2009, 22:35
There si so much paranoia and automatic GW bashing on here it is laughable.

Yeah just as much as their apologists.

spetswalshe
12-08-2009, 22:39
There's a few posts here saying 'you can go days without reading an intelligent thread on Warseer'. Are we reading the same forum? Not every post is enormously insightful or every thread a synergistic work of art, of course, but that's true of literally every forum, conversation or social gathering. I've been through all of the first page of 40k Gen and I can't find any threads that I would call the author out on and say 'This is hard evidence that you are mentally subnormal.'.

Also I feel the fact that a company can't make a successful forum because people only have negative things to say about it speaks volumes, about both company and customer base.

I personally would like to buck the trend of 'control these young whippersnappers stop them whingeing cleanse and burn!' feeling, and say that I've virulently against censorship of any kind. Even Warseer's no-swearing laws (which I note have been broken on this thread) chafe like a yoke to me. I appreciate that GW will not have anyone say dirty words in the same sentance as their hallowed IP, but still.


The GW forum was awful. Warseer is OK (my only problem is with the moderators).

sssh they can hear you

starlight
12-08-2009, 22:47
Yes we can...

:eek:

The reality of communication is that *everything* is censored to some degree...internally or externally... Warseer chooses to keep the tone *family friendly* because a large part of our audience consists of children and their parents who appreciate it... If you really feel the need to swear as a part of your regular conversations then you find lots of places on the Internet to do so. If you feel it is a real inconvenience to your lifestyle, then you are welcome to start your own forum and pay for all the swearing you want. However, since you don't pay the bills here, you don't make the rules...

:D

blackcherry
12-08-2009, 22:47
See, with me this argument falls down. Privateer Press seems to operate quite a nice and organised forum and as far as I know there are few and far between forums of the same magnitude of signifigance when it comes to PP games.

Perhaps because the game is less known about than GWs' games systems, but if GW are careful enough to install stringent moderators who will remove the wheat from the chaff, so to speak, standards will be kept.If they also guarentee they are the first place that new information will break when it comes to GW news and releases, then its should be ok. Whineseer we can allways fall back on when we feel like having a good old moan lol.

venus_redscar
12-08-2009, 22:54
Corporate forums SUCK!

I don't care what the old forums were like. I don't care what they will do with the new forums. It will be controlled by ********* and filled with children. And with GW, the forum WILL without a doubt, destroy all rumors that pop up and delete any negative comment. The hint of a game outside GW will be deleted. Any mention of a modeling or gaming hobby will be auto corrected to the GW hobby.

Why are you debating if it will be good or bad? You already have a forum. Its a good forum. It has good mods. Why bother with the new kiddy pool GW puts up?

Of course, has anyone connected the dots of all the GW internet polices together. They want to control information. They fear forums they don't control where negative comments can come up. They don't want anyone else on the web selling their stuff. They don't want their stuff on eBay. They are control freaks.

How long before they try to shut down the third party forums about their games?

Wintertooth
12-08-2009, 23:07
I dont even want to consider that sort of totalitarian rule over people, especially in GWs hands.

Get a grip. "Totalitarian rule"? We're talking about a bunch of dorks who sell toy soldiers for a living, not VEVAK. The thought of those callous villains in Nottingham stringently obeying the Data Protection Act and Directive on Privacy and Electronic Communications is hardly cause for bed-wetting melodrama.

escobar
12-08-2009, 23:12
Is this confirmed at all or just a rumour. Seems only one person (thread starter) actually confirmed it. Just wondering...

Don't think it is really in GWs interest to do it - expensive to moderate and difficult to get right - moderators on here will do a better job for free - better to put the money into the blog, articles and podcasts.

lequaye
12-08-2009, 23:15
I guess I just hope that Warseer is not filled with ''I hate the new GW forum because they deleted my rant/derivative comment/nay-saying... (delete as appropriate)''. I could see this indirectly resulting in Warseer type forums going down hill, fast. Mind you I'm by nature a very pessimistic little person some times.

I would also like to say slightly off the current topic that Warseer's members are in my experience very insightful and creative people and their input is what brings us back here over and over again. If GW do bring back the forums I have ever confidence that this will not be detrimental in the long run for Warseer.

Possible community break downs? No, Warseer is bigger than that (is it not?)

Bob5000
12-08-2009, 23:59
I seem to remember in the few months leading up to the G-Dub Forums shut-down that there was a poster who was causing great problems for the Forum mods due to spamming inflammatory posts and using multi accounts to circumvent the inevitable banning .

Some on Warseer may remember this

I have wondered how much these problems helped lead to the final decision to shut down the G-Dub Forums

starlight
13-08-2009, 00:10
Bets? None.


The decision to shut them down was part of a move away from using the web as a vehicle, combined with GW's view that it was a negative with no positives.

Crazy Harborc
13-08-2009, 01:13
Oh yes the good old days!! I was a member of the GW site and it's forums. (I had joined Portent in 2001).

I remember when GW's forums closed down. The kiddie count went WAY up on Warseer....soon after.;)

IMHO, the GW site will be a positive influence. Less younger posters here very likely, I am a thinking.

I really do hope that GW will do it right from the start. I hope it will succeed. Then there is my fantasy thought......GW want's to be able to monitor the fans and critics who will join there and post there. AND make positive changes at GW.......Surrrre they will.:angel:

catbarf
13-08-2009, 01:15
Whether it's censored or not, whether it's a whinefest or not, at least they may improve on the godawful software they used to have.

howlinmonkey
13-08-2009, 09:03
I think they'll start it with good intentions,but I doubt that
they'll be able to cope with the criticism.There has been a huge
backlash on Warseer about the recent pricehike,I can't see them
allowing that on their website.
There will probably be things like 'sneak peeks' at new stuff,
but it'll be done like they do in WD:one line hints in the news
pages.
Warseer will thrive because it does not have an agenda,whereas
the GW website will have a big brother attitude where anything
that they deem criticism will not be allowed.Do you think they'd
allow a discussion about their prices?

RobC
13-08-2009, 13:27
What if they follow the model of the BL forums? Criticism, where it's rational and considered, occurs regularly. Sure, some topics aren't allowed (GW pricing discussions, for example), but there's still plenty of free discussion that takes place.

I imagine the level of work required will be several times the magnitude of the BL forum, but assuming the ground rules are established from the beginning, and the moderators are as reliable and impartial as BL's, there's no reason why it can't work.

And when there's a topic that isn't allowed, there's always the third-party forums like Warseer to discuss it.

pringles978
13-08-2009, 13:30
i wonder how long it would take for stelek to get booted?

ChrisAsmadi
13-08-2009, 14:03
Blizzard manages to have WoW forums that while they have criticism, they also have fairly good information too. WotC, as well.

I dunno if GW could pull it off, but if they do, the potential for using it for playtesting would be good.

spetswalshe
13-08-2009, 14:58
The decision to shut them down was part of a move away from using the web as a vehicle, combined with GW's view that it was a negative with no positives.

Silly GW, no one fights the internet and wins.

"Computators? Bah, a passing fad, what people really want is reams of rules text based on an eighty-year-old fantasy novel, and static-pose metal miniatures on slottabases. Man the furnaces! Steam pressure is going critical!"

Deep-Green-X
13-08-2009, 18:29
Silly GW, no one fights the internet and wins.

"Computators? Bah, a passing fad, what people really want is reams of rules text based on an eighty-year-old fantasy novel, and static-pose metal miniatures on slottabases. Man the furnaces! Steam pressure is going critical!"

It seems to be raking in the money quickly enough, perhaps you are correct sir.

3lwap0
13-08-2009, 22:57
Should a GW forum come to fruition, I can't imagine anything impacting Warseer overly much. GW relies to heavily on the community to promote, buy, and grow the hobby. You can't change the ingredients in the soup, and expect the same results.

What I think GW lacks, and they realize, is that they are atrocious communicating downstream to hobbyists in general. And it's difficult to blame them - most companies have this problem, and let's face it, the hobby community is passionate to say the least - you average hobbyist will have no problems raking anyone from GW over the coals of a self righteous fire. Who wants to endure that constantly? A forum gives them the chance to correct that, to spin a better image, and maybe dangle bits of info to us. So now you have blogs, and podcasts, and maybe a forum.

Honestly, Warseer's community didn't sprout over night, and I can't see GW poaching traffic or users from any enthusiast site. As for the kids and whiners? Go look up Penny Arcades greater internet ******** theory. To summarize: Take a normal person, give them complete anonymity, and a captive audience, and you get a total ********. Welcome to the internets.

Grimstonefire
13-08-2009, 23:20
Realistically though either the number of negative people is going to be huge and/or they voice their opinions louder than those who sing GW praises. So even if a forum does theoretically give them a chance to spin a better image, if people can comment and it doesn't have even heavier moderation it's just going to be more of the same.

I agree that the only thing a GW forum could offer that you couldn't get better elsewhere would be 100% official teasers for things further away than their usual window (not 'rumours' as they would just be news coming from GW). This is assuming that they managed to close off rumour leaks completely (take a contract out on harry and hastings). But would GW need a whole forum for that? Would it not be easier just to leave it at the podcast/ blogs when they know all of us will find out the info sooner or later and discuss it?

Basically is the info itself not the important thing, not how it's delivered?

Whatever happens I believe they have finally seen that their public image is tarnished through misinformation.

At least they can phrase things exactly as they want to, rather than joining warseer and having to be overly cryptic and on the pretence that they 'overheard from a manager' or 'chatted to developers' etc.

I'd still like to see a quote from exactly where it's been rumoured that the whole forum will be returning. ;)

.

Crazy Harborc
14-08-2009, 01:18
Today/tonight is a different date and a different mood. I don't expect too much from GW as far as their rumored forums being a good place to be.

Rehashing the happenings of the old GW forums is moot as far as to what the new one (if it happens) will or won't be like.

It would be nice if the forum is on a quality par with Warseer. Maybe it will happen, maybe it will be.;)

Condottiere
14-08-2009, 07:14
An official forum allows direct feedback from the consumers.

Of course, the company in question must want to hear from the users of their products and incorporate the more constructive comments in the development of said product.

Otherwise, stick to newsletters and product announcements.

EmperorEternalXIX
14-08-2009, 08:44
I think it would be hugely helpful in their FAQ department.

I have seen like 10 threads on Shrike here, for example. I am sure maybe they would get the hint if similar questions were posted there constantly (instead of telling me dumb stuff like, yes, I can still take a razorback if I use a tactical squad. I don't usually find fault with them but that wasn't a frequently asked question at all compared to stuff like "Does Vulkan work with Sisters of Battle?").

badgeraddict
17-08-2009, 13:31
If GW brought back their own forums, it will not stop me from posting on Warseer!

I spend most of my internet time browsing these forums, so thats not likely to stop.

Earthbeard
17-08-2009, 14:42
Whether it's censored or not, whether it's a whinefest or not, at least they may improve on the godawful software they used to have.

This is it really, christ that forum used to make my eyes bleed.

Codsticker
18-08-2009, 21:15
This is it really, christ that forum used to make my eyes bleed.

Oh good, I thought it was just me.:)

I hope GW takes a look around at Dakka, Warseer, BoLS, etc. and learns a bit of a lesson on how to run a Forum. Their boards were such that all you could really do on them was either complain or rave about the games and products.

starlight
18-08-2009, 21:20
Not just you...it was the primary reason I wouldn't use it...followed closely by the behaviour that was tolerated combined with the censorship... :(

Crazy Harborc
18-08-2009, 22:25
Oh yeah...no negative thought questions allowed. The good old days at GW's site.

Thank goodness we have Warseer.:D;) Did, did, did I say that right Nick?

starlight
18-08-2009, 22:30
Oh yeah...no negative thought questions allowed. The good old days at GW's site.

Thank goodness we have Warseer.:D;) Did, did, did I say that right Nick?

:eek:

The final seal has been broken!!! :eek:



:p

isaac
18-08-2009, 22:31
Is there some kind of inside joke here? ;)

Captain Micha
19-08-2009, 01:55
Official forums never do as well as unofficial forums. The regulation on official forums are usually too restrictive to allow the players to speak their minds.

Not to mention, the sub communities on unofficial forums are usually supported as opposed to discouraged.

Not true, short of perhaps Enworld I have yet to run across a forum as large as the Wizards of the Coast forums, specifically the D&D forum.

Then again we get away with bloody murder over there.

I don't see myself leaving Warseer, especially not for a GW forum. I could see it now, if it isn't a thread about Marines it gets locked... *shudder* no thanks.

I'd rather actually learn about the game (such as the tactica threads) and get useful things to download such as Tactica pdfs, than have to look through a Gw misorganized mess again.

Btw ya'll will be seeing more of me this week. as the said Wizards forums are doing, they "are undergoing a migration and supposed massive overhaul" (please dear god fix the Class Roles forums... seriously...each class should have it's own subforum.. *Rants for hours*). :D

Condottiere
19-08-2009, 05:26
:eek:

The final seal has been broken!!! :eek:



:p
So what appears, the Four Horsemen or Archaon?

Carlos
19-08-2009, 11:10
It depends how GW promotes their forum. If they use it as an advice discussion, with modelling, painting and scenario advice then it has the potential to become something great as they could genuinely use it as a place to exasperate all the positive sides of the hobby (like actually having fun) whilst stopping all the negativity one finds on here and every other wargames forum on the net. For example if they banned all talk of tournaments and trying to create powerlist 2.0 and instead focussed on discussion of different scenario's and how losing is not actually a bad thing if you have ENJOYED playing the game then Id leave.

x-esiv-4c
19-08-2009, 12:39
What'll be interesting is the dynamic in which rumors will be posted on warseer and will migrate over to the GW forum.

CapitanGuinea
19-08-2009, 17:31
So by now most of us know that Games Workshop are planning to, and correct me if I'm wrong, are in the process of creating their own forum.

excuse me, on what basis we can affirm that?
Are we sure their are planning to? What the source of this rumor?

Grimstonefire
19-08-2009, 23:46
Having looked around at the rumours I don't think there is going to be a new forum. I think the podcast and twitter feed that we've already seen daily now is it.

Which is exactly as it should be imo.

Crazy Harborc
20-08-2009, 00:54
So what appears, the Four Horsemen or Archaon?

ME!! and three old fart, long time, bush lipped, yanks. We will be thirsty, hungry, crabby and likely fall asleep alot.

Rumor??? But, if it's on Warseer it has to be true.;)

Radium
20-08-2009, 09:39
Meh, we'll see where this all goes. If the GW forum is any good, I'll join that one too. It's not like being on 6 hobby related sites is any worse than being on 5....

Desert Rain
20-08-2009, 13:21
All my warhammer discussing needs are fulfilled by warseer, but if it's a good forum I might register there as well.

Emperors Teeth
21-08-2009, 09:14
I would only be impressed if the first post was:

"What happened to all the great articles such as Warhammer Skirmish missions and those in 'Black Goblin'?"

Followed by:

"No problem, we kept them safe and sound. Here is a link (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHg5SJYRHA0)."

(But with a real link)

starlight
21-08-2009, 16:09
...and the entire GWOZ hobby section... :cries:

heretics bane
21-08-2009, 16:52
GW forums where just awful......simply awful Warseer is a haven for online game discussions.

I dont think we know how lucky we are:)

Crazy Harborc
22-08-2009, 00:32
Oh some of us do. IMHO, it's why some of us are Guild members. We want to help keep Warseer online.;)

heretics bane
22-08-2009, 17:43
If only i had money to spare!!

Lord Malorne
22-08-2009, 17:53
Its not that much ;).

The idea of a GW forum making ones like this close or 'breakdown' is silly.

Very, silly.

TheDarkDuke
22-08-2009, 22:22
Ughhh i used to post on that forum when it was around..... and now all i can think of is the one and only ************* popping out of his troll cave getting his account banned 500 times before they closed the forum down....


Edit: it appears that the troll was so bad they even banned his name from this site. Awesome

TheBigBadWolf
23-08-2009, 01:20
I used to post on the GW forums the were pretty wild, warseer is far better, in setup and content, although on some days 40k general can get almost as bad :D

Monster Rain
23-08-2009, 03:04
I'm obviously new to this forum, but the advice I've received and have seen given to others in the day that I've been here have impressed me a lot. Would GW having it's own forum give it some sort of authority to shut down 3rd party sites like this one though?

That would be decidedly uncool.

starlight
23-08-2009, 03:43
Not likely...although it would be funny to see...

Grimstonefire
23-08-2009, 15:22
I don't see why they would want to though, GW should want as much coverage as possible, having 1 forum for everything is not going to do this? Not to mention that they would alienate 99.99% of people from discussion of their products if they didn't want to join the GW forum.

IF there is a GW forum again (not certain yet), it would have to be very good to encourage people to post regularly there.

Warseer is a well structured forum, with something for everyone and clear divisions between what goes where, what is important (round up sections), different hobby things etc.

My main criticism of Warseer, and it's something GW could do differently, is that the hobby sections could be a bit better split.

Codsticker
23-08-2009, 17:37
My main criticism of Warseer, and it's something GW could do differently, is that the hobby sections could be a bit better split.

Interesting; by "Hobby Sections" do you mean the M,P&T forums?

Crazy Harborc
23-08-2009, 17:43
Chances are, if GW's site comes back it will have an age make up like their old site did. I'm basing that on what the threads/posts were like on that site. Let's just say a goodly portion of those posters "talked", typed at a young (as in early teens to mid teens level).

Lord Malorne
23-08-2009, 18:43
Hilarity will ensue, 40k general discussion here will look like a lazy sunday in comparison, should be worth a laugh at least.

Scion of Ferrus
23-08-2009, 20:25
As a Lot of people have said It will be Garbage:evilgrin::D:skull::chrome:

You won't be able to complain and whinge about fluff retconning, etc.

Wait for it to open and then SPAM it with the whole Death of The Squats Thread:evilgrin::chrome:

Max Jet
23-08-2009, 21:56
In the grim darkness of the far future there are only forums.

Condottiere
23-08-2009, 22:00
The Warseer background seems grim and dark enough.