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LemonStain
12-08-2009, 16:01
Can someone briefly explain the Regenerate rule?

How many wounds can each individual guy regenerate?

I looked in the rule book and cannot find it. If you have a page number, please include.

Thank you.

siphon101
12-08-2009, 16:04
Can someone briefly explain the Regenerate rule?

How many wounds can each individual guy regenerate?

I looked in the rule book and cannot find it. If you have a page number, please include.

Thank you.

Regeneration is nothing more than a 4+ ward save which can be taken in addition to other ward saves, but can not be taken against wounds causing killing blow, or flaming attacks.

As such, if a model with regeneration is wounded and fails its armor save (if it has one) and its ward save (if it has one) it can take a 4+ regeneration save for each wound it so fails unless that wound:

1) causes killing blow
2) is caused by a flaming attack

That is it.

Deglosh
12-08-2009, 18:34
what i know play by is, if a guy takes more than one wound, he can save with armorsave for one of the wounds. If the model has a wardsave/Regeneration save, the model can try to save ANY unsaved wounds. As a ward could be an aura, or anything else, that can save anything. The regen of say, a troll, can also regen ALL wounds caused. This is one of the things that pops the trolls up into the Rare units choice of for example the O&G list. THEY CAN TAKE ALOT OF "POW!" AND SURVIVE, if not unlucky with dice :P

Except flaming attacks, killing blow, and im not sure, but can some1 say if this goes for poisonous attacks aswell?

Thats how i understand the rules.

pointyteeth
12-08-2009, 18:40
@ Deglosh - siphon101 has it correct. And you can regen poison attacks

Jetty Smurf
12-08-2009, 18:43
Armour saves can be used to save an infinite amount of wounds (provided the attack does not "negate" armour saves).

There is no "one wound only" limit to an armour save.

As previously mentioned, siphon101 is correct, regarding regeneration.

Deglosh
12-08-2009, 18:50
Ok, so a character can make multiple amror saves?

Jetty Smurf
12-08-2009, 18:54
Yes. Even rank and file can make multiple armour saves :)

Deglosh
12-08-2009, 19:02
Wow, awesome. I looked it up aswell, i dont know were i got that from. Doesnt say anything about "one wound only" or "automatic wound".

Sweet! now charges from my friends 15 chaos warriors wond be AS devestating, hehe

siphon101
12-08-2009, 20:33
what i know play by is, if a guy takes more than one wound, he can save with armorsave for one of the wounds. If the model has a wardsave/Regeneration save, the model can try to save ANY unsaved wounds. As a ward could be an aura, or anything else, that can save anything. The regen of say, a troll, can also regen ALL wounds caused. This is one of the things that pops the trolls up into the Rare units choice of for example the O&G list. THEY CAN TAKE ALOT OF "POW!" AND SURVIVE, if not unlucky with dice :P

Except flaming attacks, killing blow, and im not sure, but can some1 say if this goes for poisonous attacks aswell?

Thats how i understand the rules.

As stated, you can ALWAYS take an armor save against EVERY SINGLE wound, unless:

1) the attack explicitly denies armor (cannon ball, certain magic items/spells etc)

2) the attack is of a high enough strength value that it negates your armor

In addition, poisoned attacks are merely attacks for which a "to wound" roll is uneccessary. Any roll of a 6 "to hit" is an automatic wound when made with a poisoned attack. All saves can be taken as normal against a poisoned attack unless the attack has some OTHER characteristics that so deny it (no regeneration may be taken against a poisoned attack that is also flaming for example...not that I can think of one, but in that instance it's the flaming part, not the poisoned part that denies regeneration).

Let's not even get started with the "what happens when a model with poisoned attacks and killing blow rolls a 6 to hit against a man sized model with multiple wounds?" argument.

Condottiere
13-08-2009, 03:37
I don't think there's an argument - an automatic wound bypasses killing blow.

Brother J
13-08-2009, 05:43
Wow, awesome. I looked it up aswell, i dont know were i got that from. Doesnt say anything about "one wound only" or "automatic wound".

Sweet! now charges from my friends 15 chaos warriors wond be AS devestating, hehe

I wouldn't be so sure about that...

trapper
13-08-2009, 06:01
I wouldn't be so sure about that...

Why not? If he has regeneration and now knows how it works better than before then does that not benefit him? I dont see how getting more regeneration saves can be bad in anyway.

Belerophon709
13-08-2009, 08:56
Note, however, that even though it works like a "2nd ward save", anything that denies you a ward save (Tricksy Trinket for instance), does NOT negate regeneration.


Bele

Draconian77
13-08-2009, 09:11
Also bear in mind Deglosh that your Trolls can't be Killing Blowed except by some special characters and items. Regular Killing Blow wont work on models that large.

Griefbringer
13-08-2009, 10:22
Since the OP also asked for the page number, is is 96 (on main rulebook).

Emud
13-08-2009, 13:07
In the time i began playing there were some special item where each wounding hit caused D3 wounds. I dont know if its still around. If it is would not the ward be able to save only the first wound , but regeneration get a chance to save all?

LiamTaylor
13-08-2009, 13:11
@Emud - correct me if I'm wrong but i believe you get your normal saves, ward saves, regeneration etc and then if you still suffer a wound it is then made into D3, not D3 first

Liam

Necromancy Black
13-08-2009, 13:14
In the time i began playing there were some special item where each wounding hit caused D3 wounds. I dont know if its still around. If it is would not the ward be able to save only the first wound , but regeneration get a chance to save all?

No, that's not how saves work.

You have armour saves, ward saves and regen. Armour saves are modified by strength, ward saves are not modified and regen is not modified and is always a 4+ (flaming attacks do ignore it though).

With multi wounding hits, you take take any amour save for each hit before multiplying. If failed, take any ward save and if failed take any regen save.

Only if all saves are failed do you then roll D3 to see how many wounds are done.

Another example is a unit with a 5+ ward save and regeneration gets hit by a cannon ball and takes one hit. They first take one armour save (in this case, it's ignored), if failed take one ward save, if failed then take one regeneration save and if failed roll a dice for each unsaved hit. That's how many wounds that unit takes.

Replace all the ones in bold with the number of hits taken my multiple wound causing hits. That's how it works.

Milgram
13-08-2009, 13:30
I know what emud means. but it didn't even work that way back then.

old rules - do not read unless you want a history lession - if hit by a weapon that causes d3 wounds, only one armour save and one ward save was made for every successfull attack. if the armour/ward save was successfull, then no wounds were dealt. if the armour/ward save failed, then d3 wounds were dealt (same as today). now the 7th edition regeneration works the same as a ward save - besides it is taken in addition. the 6th edition ward save was taken for suffered wounds. so your opponent has e.g. 7 attacks, hit and wounds with 6 of them, you save 2 with your armour, 2 with your ward save, the other two deal d3 wounds each - let's assume the opponent rolled 3 and 2, so 5 unsaved wounds. the clou on the old regeneration now was that your character/troll probably only had 3 lifes. now you have wounded 5 times, but he has only lost 3 lifes. he rolls 3 times for regeneration, saves one and survives with 1 wound left. and this is why the 7th ed regeneration rules were taken as a nerf.

Draconian77
13-08-2009, 13:55
You have armour saves, ward saves and regen. Armour saves are modified by strength, ward saves are not modified and regen is not modified and is always a 4+ (flaming attacks do ignore it though).



That's a little incorrect, Regeneration isn't always a 4+ any more, the Beasts of Chaos have a 6+ Regenerate and the Empire have a 5+ Regenerate save off the top of my head.

Deglosh
13-08-2009, 13:59
if a cannonball hits a troll who fails his regeneration save. Do you multiply wounds?

theunwantedbeing
13-08-2009, 14:05
if a cannonball hits a troll who fails his regeneration save. Do you multiply wounds?

You multiply unsaved wounds.
A wound is only "unsaved" when it has bypassed every save the model has.

So yes, you multiply after the regen has been taken.

Page 31 of the rulebook on multiple wounds.
Page 96 for the rules for Regeneration.

Tae
13-08-2009, 20:54
That's a little incorrect, Regeneration isn't always a 4+ any more, the Beasts of Chaos have a 6+ Regenerate and the Empire have a 5+ Regenerate save off the top of my head.

Warriors of Chaos can also get a 5+ Regenerate.

However I think it is probably easier to state that Regenerate is always a 4+, unless specifically mentioned to be otherwise (as in the above examples).

Milgram
13-08-2009, 21:22
I think demons get a 5+ too through a special character. basically it is 4+.

Draconian77
14-08-2009, 02:20
Warriors of Chaos can also get a 5+ Regenerate.

However I think it is probably easier to state that Regenerate is always a 4+, unless specifically mentioned to be otherwise (as in the above examples).

In my experience that stumps new players as soon as they meet something that isn't a 4+ Regenerate save. :D

Best to get it out of the way as early as possible I say!

Now that you mention it Milgram I think Festus conveys a 5+ Regeneration too...

nosferatu1001
14-08-2009, 15:26
I thought Nurgle Heralds give a 5+ regen to the unit they are with - plus no doubt the tallyman Epidemius also does something similar.

EvC
14-08-2009, 15:41
Nurgle Heralds give regeneration to their Plaguebearer unit- "regeneration is normally an additional 4+ save, that cannot be modified, and does not work against flaming attacks or killing blow", there, that'll do it :D

siphon101
14-08-2009, 18:03
I thought Nurgle Heralds give a 5+ regen to the unit they are with - plus no doubt the tallyman Epidemius also does something similar.

no, it's a straight up regular 4+ regeneration in addition to the stock 5+ ward save that all demons get.

In addition, Epidemius actually does NOT grant regeneration, as the named heroes are not heralds and thus do not have the locus rules. Which is fairly sensical, as only 2 of the 4 named heroes can join units at all.

Izram
14-08-2009, 18:24
While on the topic of nurgle heralds, I didn't want to make a whole new thread for this; but do they get a 6+ save for being mounted on a palanquin?

Belerophon709
14-08-2009, 18:28
While on the topic of nurgle heralds, I didn't want to make a whole new thread for this; but do they get a 6+ save for being mounted on a palanquin?

Yes they do, since it's a 1-wound-mount, classified as a cavalry mount.


Bele

siphon101
14-08-2009, 18:46
While on the topic of nurgle heralds, I didn't want to make a whole new thread for this; but do they get a 6+ save for being mounted on a palanquin?


It's a single wound mount, so...yes.

Jushak
14-08-2009, 18:47
That's a little incorrect, Regeneration isn't always a 4+ any more, the Beasts of Chaos have a 6+ Regenerate and the Empire have a 5+ Regenerate save off the top of my head.

WoC special character gives unit he joins 5+ regenerate too. However, these cases always say something like "has regenerate but at X+ instead of normal", so it's safe to say "always" in the same way as everything "always" works in certain way, if you know what I mean :p

Lord Zarkov
15-08-2009, 11:16
The usual GW "Always"(tm) :P