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FluidSpace
16-08-2009, 00:27
So I have decided to start Vampire Counts. After playing greenskins for a while it will be nice to have an army that I at least know what it will do. Anyway I am planning on making an Empire themed Vampire Count army. Most of the models (skellies, zombies, blood knights, grave guard) will look as if they have been raised from empire units. I converted my first two characters (Empire wizards) and then realized that not only does the Vampire Count army have Vampires for heroes but also necromancers. So the question is... does anyone take necromancers? Is it worth taking them, or should i just take a vampire instead? I know they are cheaper but they can only use two pd to cast spells and their weapon skill is human. So is there any advantages to taking a necromancer?

Skywave
16-08-2009, 00:56
I never used a Necromancer in this edition yet, don't know if I will. It's nice that you can choose your spells, but I hate that they can't be level 2. For that reason I take a Vampire with extra level instead. My Vampire even killed a lone Paladin BSB that charged her, something a Necromancer wouldn't have done :)

Ultimate Life Form
16-08-2009, 03:05
In my opinion, they completely destroyed the Necromancer with the new book. I mean, :wtf:? Everything a Necro can do a Vampire can as well, only better. In the old book at least you had the option to take a Necromancer Lord, but he's no longer available.

However, while most people agree he's pretty much useless, I see him pop up in army lists surprisingly often, so there must be at least some use for him. I think it hasn't to do much with him being cheaper (c'mon, those 45 points...) but more with him being guaranteed to have the spells you want. That means you can ENSURE you'll have a Vanhels handy, which is definitely the most powerful spell and what most people take on him. Give him the Book of Arkhan, an item that wastes a lot of item space on a Vampire which is of little concern to Mr. Necro and you have a Vanhels machine ready. Throw in a Black Periapt and you can abuse him as a Mana Battery for a mean caster Lord. I'm not sure how effective it is, but I can see at least a niche for that build.

Also, an added trick is you can mount him on a Corpse Cart which is the only way such a contraption will ever be able to join units. I'm not sure exactly what advantages this offers or for what devious tactics this allows, but it is worth noting.

bork da basher
16-08-2009, 05:54
i think a necro is only viable now riding a corpse cart in primarily a support role using vanhels and power stones.

ARabidNun
16-08-2009, 07:36
Also, an added trick is you can mount him on a Corpse Cart which is the only way such a contraption will ever be able to join units. I'm not sure exactly what advantages this offers or for what devious tactics this allows, but it is worth noting.

As has been mentioned twice actually. The corpse cart is the greatest advantage you can find with the necro. Sadly there are not any great magic items "necro only" that would help to support his use either.

Another advantage is if you are not concerned with alot of magic (and most VC players usually are) then it will free up some points for more "hardy" troops that can not be created. I find they are better suited to games less than 2000 points and are not well suited for combat so they are typically bunkered in a small unit (extra points for protection) or in the corpse carts (again for protection). If you want to hide him in the rear of an army to raise and move units, wouldnt you prefer something that can maximize your casting times/ chances?

AvariceX
16-08-2009, 08:00
The only thing the Necromancer has going for it is that he can choose Vanhel's... and you're really, really going to want to have access to that spell.

Then again, Forbidden Lore gives any Vampire access to that spell.

Harwammer
16-08-2009, 09:07
Necros are cheap, can get guaranteed vanhels and can fluff up the rank bonus of units with their corpse carts. Lovely.

PARTYCHICORITA
16-08-2009, 16:14
Necros are cheap, can get guaranteed vanhels and can fluff up the rank bonus of units with their corpse carts. Lovely.

This sums it up pretty well. Necros are also cheap bound spell carriers since you may want you vamps with offensive/defensive items.

bludsturm
16-08-2009, 19:59
The reason to put a necromancer on a corpse cart in order to join units is because the number of models it displaces is 10 - beefing up whatever unit may need those numbers for combat res depending on what your enemy is throwing at you.

The Destroyer
16-08-2009, 23:06
I always have mine atop a Corpse Cart.

It just adds some survivability to the guy.

FluidSpace
16-08-2009, 23:49
For that reason I take a Vampire with extra level instead.

What do you mean an extra lvl? Nowhere do i see that you can make a vampire a lvl 2 wizard unless he is a lord. So under 2k all vampire should be only generating one pd and one dd (excluding items).

seraphius
16-08-2009, 23:55
I use necros often (if not always ) in my lists for two good reasons... well.. good for me anyways..

1: cheap scroll caddy.
Vamps are awsome yes, but as such you do all you can to not let them die and tend to protect them a bit much at times.. with a necro you have a cheap PD/DD and scroll caddy.

2. Vanhels dance.. nerco will make sure you get atleast one VHDM..

seraphius
16-08-2009, 23:56
What do you mean an extra lvl? Nowhere do i see that you can make a vampire a lvl 2 wizard unless he is a lord. So under 2k all vampire should be only generating one pd and one dd (excluding items).

Vampire powers ring a bell??

Dark acolyte makes your vamp lv 2

HellRaid
17-08-2009, 00:25
What do you mean an extra lvl? Nowhere do i see that you can make a vampire a lvl 2 wizard unless he is a lord. So under 2k all vampire should be only generating one pd and one dd (excluding items).

This is where reading the army book comes in handy; particularly before posting your claim on a public forum.

Page 82, 'Dark Acolyte'.


On topic, I sometimes field a Corpse-Cart Necromancer in a Grave Guard-based bunker list. He joins the Grave Guard, which beefs up their ranks quite considerably, and also ensures they're always in range of the ASF bound spell.

artyboy
17-08-2009, 10:24
I field necros when I'm short on points. That seems to happen to me quite a bit. They make great scroll caddies and they make corpse carts better. Auto Vanhel's is nice, too.

Sarah S
17-08-2009, 23:27
A level 2 caster vampire will run you about 200 points. For that you will get a decent combat hero, 2 power dice and 1 dispel dice.

A Necromancer on a Corpse Cart with 2 spells will also run you around 200 points. For that you will get 1 bound spell, 1 power dice 1 dispel dice + the ability of the Corpse Cart (Balefire or Lodestone).

I would say that the advantage in terms of magic is with the Necromancer. The automatic bound spell from the Corpse Cart is more valuable than an extra dice. Being able to choose your spells is also quite valuable. Of course the vampire can fight a little harder, but 2d6 S2 attacks isn't thaaaat bad.