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Tulun
10-01-2006, 08:32
Hey.

I'm very heavily leaning towards Wood Elves (I noticed what speed m 5 and fast calvary could have on a game). I was wondering a few things :)

1) Unit sizes for Wild Riders, Glade Riders and War Dancers? Unit size in general makes me curious

2) Some good kits for heroes? Helm of the Oak and Stone of Crystal Mere on a Noble seems like a good combo (if he wasn't going ot join war dancers or something), toss on a great weapon and he's pretty decent. I was thinking an Eagle might also be decent.

3) How would you rate the rare choices of the Eagle, Waywatchers and Treeman ? Treeman seems powerful, but also expensive :)

Odin
10-01-2006, 15:39
Cavalry units probably shouldn't have more than about 7 models. In fact, most WE units work best near their minimum unit size. The only one i can think of where you want to go more than a couple of models above the minimum are the Eternal Guard, who ought to be a reasonable size.

Do you mean Helm of the Hunt? In which case, yes - Helm of the Hunt and Stone of the Crystal Mere is a good combo for a Noble, especially on an Eagle.
He can take out enemy war machines or small units, or he can lend his weight to combats.

Tulun
10-01-2006, 21:45
Yes, I meant helm of the hunt. I thought it said Oak, I went by memory.
Minimum? I think I'd go with 6 (2 ranks of 3). Since they can reform freely, it would be good, but for running up, that might be a nice way to do it.

I don't think I'd use Eternal Guard. They seem, well... kind of weak at their point cost...

I actually came up with that Eagle mounted dude too... he seemed very nice to get hiding units. Plus, he's ultra fast. Toss on a Great Weapon, and some armor, and he may not even risk his Ward save ;)

Do you roll each ward save individually, or all of them enmass until he fails one? (since it can be 'destroyed').

Addition question: Are glade riders worth it? They seem expensive for such a light save... they can definately harry units, and they are fast, but if you want to flank the Wild Riders seem infinately better.

nikolai7
11-01-2006, 10:45
I dont think it really matters how you roll them as soon as one of them fails it gets destroyed so you would assume if you roll them en masse that it saves all of them until the ones that fail so the character takes all of the failed saves. eternal guard are still awesome even though they are pricy, the have a 5+save they get to fight in 2 ranks and the front rank get an extra attack.. plus they ignore woodland terrain making them a rather nice flanking unit.

as for rare choices all 3 are good, the waywatchers are pricey but potentially can cause lots of damage and be very annoying as they are hard to hit with shooting and are very accurate, the treeman is more reliable but doesnt make its points back that often as it tends to become a bit of a target but the great eagles are awesome and well worth the points..

Odin
11-01-2006, 14:00
It is quite important how you handle the ward save for the stone of the crystal mere. For example, imagine your hero takes three wounds from shooting attacks. You have two possibilities -

1. The saves are all taken together and if you fail one roll, the stone breaks and the ward save is gone. If you fail just one roll, you're still alive on one wound.

2. The saves are taken one at a time. If the first one fails the stone breaks and you have no ward save against the other two wounds. Your hero dies.

We play it the first way, but a rules clarification would be handy. Anyone?

nikolai7
11-01-2006, 14:05
I think that it should be rolled on masse. thats how i usually play.. so he takes three wounds you roll 3 dice you pass one then fail the other 2 so you take two wounds.. rolling each dice one by one takes far to long

Tulun
11-01-2006, 21:56
It seems that Eternal Guard are kind of meek.. a 5+ save for 12 point infantry at str 3... :|

But, if a Noble joins, they might be worth it, as being Stubborn would be a HUGE bonus. Unlike most elf units, they could probably take a charge and at least hold. A unit held, esspecially with their amazing movement, can make for easy counter-charges...


Yeah, actually, the Rares is something that plagues me a bit ;) It seems you'd even want to consider all 3... the fact the Treeman is Stubborn and comes with Tree-singing (and being tough) is a great ability, the eagles have many uses, and the Waywatchers really help vs units with lots of armor. Plus, they are really what Wood Elf archers should be... ;p

Odin
12-01-2006, 12:37
They may be S3, but for every Eternal Guard model you effectively get 3 attacks (2 from front rank and 1 from model behind). They are also Ws5, which means they will hit on 3+ against most other units, and Ws2 units like Skeletons will need a 5+ to hit them. And stubborn is immensely useful.

The down side to them (for me anyway) is the lack of maneouvreability. The rest of the army can easily redeploy to avoid combats they can't win. But if you've got Eternal guard you can easily end up in the situation where you have to choose between staying in a bad position, or abandoning your eternal guard.

Mook
12-01-2006, 12:44
There's a lot of disucssions about all of these questions on asrai.org (http://http://woodelves.org/Asrai/index.php) - check it out, there's a lot of discussion about EG and treemen and a good deal more!