View Full Version : The Great Warhammer Armies Pick-A-Part.

Mad Doc Grotsnik
10-01-2006, 18:23
Okay, I see a lot of people asking the same old question of 'I play X, how do I defeat Y?'

So, the thought struck me today that in order to best aid newbies, both to the hobbies and to their army, why not have a series of threads dedicated to the weaknesses of each army, and how they can be best exploited, whilst minimising the armies strengths.

Essentially, this will need volunteers. I'd quite like to cover Stunties, as although I don't play them, I have played against them a lot, and like to think I am wise to most of their plays.

Please only sign up if you have decent experience against your chosen army, AND their army book.

10-01-2006, 23:52
VC army................Kill the general and his casters or life will be tuff.

I play skaven btw=D

11-01-2006, 00:59
I give it a few weeks for stunties as the new armybook might/should/could change how people play or play against dwarves.

Killing the general of any army isn't that easy ... especially a vampire count that doesn't want to get into combat under any terms but its own.

The strongest tactics to best an undead army is play for flank charges, without rank bonuses and outnumbered, core units full on their face.

Deal with undead supporting units, e.g. dire wolves, bats and ghouls, this cuts his options and free's up gaps to get to his flanks, may even set up overrun options.

Take lots of anti-magic.

Your general's best stat is his leadership, keep him protected and let your army use his L.d. to get charges off, don't wasted him in a protracted combat against skellies or zombies.

Mad Doc Grotsnik
11-01-2006, 20:13
This isn't quite what I meant.

I was meaning something a lot more in depth, focussing on specific strengths, and suggesting not so much units, as unit types, which can be used to get round them.

This is all a little light really!

Cpt. Drill
11-01-2006, 20:21
Ummm.. here is the ogre one.... use cavelry

11-01-2006, 20:27
Here is the orc one...

The orcs lose.


Cpt. Drill
11-01-2006, 20:39
Orcs dont always use... my goblins won! (didnt they chuffy)

And ogres beat you!

11-01-2006, 20:44
Orcs dont always use... my goblins won! (didnt they chuffy)

And ogres beat you!

Well your goblins never beat me....and ogres vs orcs is always messy, almost as messy as ogre on ogre hot xxx action.

Weaknesses of a goblin army:

Cause one panic test and you win the game. You might have to sacrifice a unit or two, or take lots of casualties (rock lobbas, magic, fanatics....) but if it's able to cause a panic test, good on yer.

11-01-2006, 20:47
For Chaos, it's not really that simple, not simple at all, one simply have to adapt to the situation and go for flank-charges wheneverpossible.

What can be said though, Chosen MUST be stopped, not only do they reward you a helluva lot of VP's, but, you also get an upped points and psychological advantage (Hehe, watch me Knights charge right over your ĪsplatĪ... ... me knights! Nooo! I can' win without them! I've got to save as much as possible to get a draw!)

What also should be looked out for are the characters, where are they, and when will they be in dangerous positions, the best thing to do is to take them when they are at their weekest, for instance, when that Chaos Lord suddenly only has one rank of Marauders behind him instead of three, go for it, smack into the unit, challenge with your Champion and aim at killing off Marauders to get CR aggainst him.

Static CR is your friend aggainst most Chaos players though, as are massed units, use it to your advantage, your army is bigger than his (most of the time) and you can get more flank-charges than he has flanks

13-01-2006, 04:12
I'm still kind of new to fantasy and I've decided to take the empire as my boys. I do play orcs alot and was wondering how to stop the squig claymore mine. I didn't know about the explosive nature of the unit and lost 7 great swords to their infernal hopping.:(

13-01-2006, 15:14
Ok, here's one that a lot of people have trouble with : Bretonnians.

Bretonnians have high numbers of cheap, fast, durable knights. They don't get -1 Move for barding, so you have a 2+ save and a 16" charge range to deal with. Moreover, when they do get the charge, everyone on the flanks gets to attack as well, so in a typical lance of 9 knights, you'll get 8 attacks from the knights including the champ (at S5 or S6, depending on the unit) and 7 from the horses (S3) That's 15 attacks from a unit with a frontage of 3!

Static combat res isn't really as effective against Brets as other knights either. Brets get ranks with just 3 models, so a lance of 9 will have 2 ranks and a banner, and after the charge, might just outnumber as well.

There is, however, a solution. You have to set charge traps. Against an entire army with a 16" move, it's not easy, so you'll have to let them charge things that they actually want to kill, not just a random unit of fast cav (although less experienced players may fall for that).

So let's talk about the general idea of a charge trap. There are two types that I generally use:

1) the "Flee and Fail" trap, where the enemy charges and you flee out of their charge range, leaving them with only their regular move (8" in this case).

2) The flee / rundown trap, where you intentionally sacrifice a unit, knowing that you're too close to the enemy to get away with your flee move. You get run down, with the payoff of knowing that the charging unit must now move it's full charge distance in the direction of the fleeing unit. You can put the enemy exactly where you want them.

Option 1 is pretty easy for opponents to see coming. If you have a unit hanging out 12 or so inches away from a Bret lance, any General worth the worry is going to figure that you have a pretty good chance of fleeing and getting away, thus saving your unit. Many bret players will charge the very first chance they get though (turn 2), so you may be able to pull this off. Just make certain that you have countercharge units waiting to take advantage of the situation.

Option2 is more costly, but is more difficult to see coming. Many opponents will not expect you to sacrifice an entire unit just to deposition one of theirs. You just need to make absolutely sure that your opponents required full charge move will not bring him into contact with any other units of yours. And again, ensure that you have a countering unit ready to charge next turn. Preferably, the counter-charge unit will be cavalry, as the average flee roll for brets is 10.5, so a infantry unit is unlikely to force the bret player to hold.

Also, if you're planning on executing any flee / rundown charge traps, make sure you have the army for it. You'll want 2-4 (depending on how may points you're playing) "sacrificial" units. These units are strong enough to cause a bit of trouble, but are not so expensive as to be critical to your battle plan. Something like 12 swordsmen might fit the bill. Your opponent can't just ignore these guys or they'll flank charge something and cause trouble. However, at 90 points or so (with musician), they're not going to be overly critical to your battle plan. Just make sure that when you put those guys on the chopping block, you make the opponent -pay- for killing them.

Finally, if you're new to the game, and you give these charge traps a try and fail miserably, don't fret. These are not always easy to pull off. Your flee move may come up snake-eyes, and you'll get caught. Maybe you miscalculate the enemy over-run a bit and wind up giving him an over-run charge. These things happen, the important thing is to learn why and get better as you go.

Brets are not an easy army to beat. They -will- kill a good number of your troops (unless you're a SAD player or something). The trick is to get them to charge what you want them to charge, in spite of their higher move. Then you can predict where they will be a turn or 2 in advance, and arrange a proper welcoming party.:evilgrin:

17-01-2006, 23:12
why would you wanna stop squig hoppers? even when they kill you they are fun as hell to have in a game :)

seriously any shooting will do it if you can get into position to fire at them. A couple of units of handgunners and a cannon or two should see off the little raskel's. Of course then you wont get to stop the Night gobbo units with their payload of fanatics......:) gobbos are so cool