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Richard Dean Anderson
02-09-2009, 20:26
Hello,

I have been looking around the Interweb for my first army, and after a couple hours on the Games Workshop website I narrowed it down to Imperial Guard. However I noticed in thier collectors section they had some other metal guard models, can you still use these models? Then I went on eBay and saw models called Praetorian Guard, I didn't see them on the Games Workshop website to buy them so I was wonderIng can you still use them in 40k? And is it hard to get enough off of eBay to make a force?

Thanks for any help you guys/gals can provide,

drummerholt1234
02-09-2009, 20:27
Yes you can.

Joustarr
02-09-2009, 20:35
Greetings,
To answer your question, basically yes. Praetorian Guard are/were produced by games workshop therefore you can. In fact that probably goes for any imperial guard ever produced by GW.

Explodingboy
02-09-2009, 20:53
yes you can use them, but acquiring them won't be easy, they were a limited release so they'll turn up from time to time on ebay but for quite a price.

spetswalshe
02-09-2009, 21:20
As far as I can tell, everyone wants a Praetorian Guard army. I'd give up on the idea if I were you, unless you want to spend a long time and a lot of money. I think they actually have some kind of reservation system - pretty much every model that comes up on Ebay is earmarked for the next moustachioed colonialist in line.

Go for Mordians instead. They're less of a one-joke army, at least. You'd probably feel less racist when you end up with the inevitable horde-of-savage-orks scenario.

Richard Dean Anderson
02-09-2009, 21:28
Cool, now that I know I can use them I have to get some. I looked into Mordians too, (Is it just me or do they look like exactly the same models just with pith helmets). I was a history major in college so I liked the ideas of history melding with Scifi. The more I look into Warhammer 40k the more I see their correlations, one of them main things that made me start this, and try Gear Krieg awhile ago.

SimpleSquid
02-09-2009, 21:30
They are the same models but with pith helmets

MegaPope
02-09-2009, 21:35
You'd probably feel less racist when you end up with the inevitable horde-of-savage-orks scenario.

FYI, GW 40K Orks are based on English football hooligans from the 1980s, not Zulus :D.

"Sir, Millwall fans! Fahsends of 'em!" ;)

Grimbad
02-09-2009, 21:40
They are the same models but with pith helmets

Except for the one kneeling Praetorian, who does not come in Mordian flavor.
It is speculated that this model was designed solely to inspire jealousy in Mordian players.

Mordians are cooler, I think, and easier to find.

TimLeeson
02-09-2009, 23:18
I've seen them on ebay quite a few times, but they are often rather expensive. I'd imagine collecting an entire army of them would be quite difficult, but not impossible. They look amazing when painted well and since they are a rare force they will stand out which is always a good thing IMO.

Or you could just go through the stargate and find a planet that sells them.

Col. Tartleton
02-09-2009, 23:22
Fully aware of that Gov' ;)

In my favor I typed that rather hastily. I've certainly seen worse typos from you Krauts... er no wait that one's German... hmmm. What exactly would I teasingly call a Brit? Oh! A Limey. Brainfarted for a second there.

But yes, certainly you can do what you want in your home, but I feel GW should be a bit looser with their IP.

It's just money...

grissom2006
02-09-2009, 23:23
Kind of glad i still have all 130 or so of my Praetorians.

Mannimarco
02-09-2009, 23:25
lol millwall fan as orks......theres a conversion just begging to be done

if memory serves me right there was a kitbash on the GW site showing you how to make a praetorian from an empire outrider and a cadian, think it was cadian legs and maybe arms, torso and head was an outrider, looked pretty cost effective if your using bitz websites

Grimtuff
02-09-2009, 23:28
lol millwall fan as orks......theres a conversion just begging to be done


Those ones fight against Vulkan SM's painted Claret and Blue though.
;)

grissom2006
02-09-2009, 23:28
if memory serves me right there was a kitbash on the GW site showing you how to make a praetorian from an empire outrider and a cadian, think it was cadian legs and maybe arms, torso and head was an outrider, looked pretty cost effective if your using bitz websites

I remember that one used the upper halfs of the heavy weapons body for it

Bunnahabhain
03-09-2009, 00:09
Fully legal, and very hard to find in any significant quantity, at least for an IG army.The best solution may be to use them as sergents or veterans within a mordian army, or be prepared to pay and arm and a leg on Ebay, to make sure you get them when they do come up.

They were released around a games day, with a showpiece battle: The Battle of Orks Drift. Yes definitely one of GWs subtle references there...

I really wish I hadn't sold the limited edition set of them I had.

There is a set of non GW plastics that can be used to make them very well. Can't remember the name, but search for 'alternative praetorian models' on here,a nd you'll be right. The you just need to do a weapon swap or two, and you're done.
I belief Forge world have both mixed special weapons, and various patters of lasguns to order ( not cheap, but cheaper than a full metal army), which will be more in scale to the models than asking existing IG players fo 200 spare plastic lasguns etc.

Xenobane
03-09-2009, 00:56
Go for Mordians instead. They're less of a one-joke army, at least. You'd probably feel less racist when you end up with the inevitable horde-of-savage-orks scenario.

:D Yes, indeed.

Fair play to anyone who has the dedication to collect any of GW's less well-supported armies though :angel:

wangalang
03-09-2009, 01:48
Some1s probably already suggested this, but you can still buy Mordian Iron Guard models on the games workshop website, greenstuff pith helmets and moustaches on to them and your sorted. They’re pricey but not nearly as pricey as Peraetorians. You could even use a plastic variety of guard and adapt them but Cadians already have helmets and Catachans are bare chested, Infact now that you can only buy guard models by the 10 the price of Mordians dosent seem that bad anymore.

wolf40k
03-09-2009, 02:21
Back to the original post, I'm using squats with lasguns for my Imperial Guard and squats in Exo Armour as Grey Knight allies:angel:. If I can do that your good to go with your Praetorians.:D

Cervantes3773
03-09-2009, 02:25
When people say that Praetorians are just Mordians with a headswap, they're wrong.

Praetorians are Mordians with the top of their head lopped off and replaced with a greenstuffed pith helmet.

Seriously. Buy Mordians and make your own.

Failing that, feel free to cast them if you're an intrepid modeler. Just don't ever sell them, that's the illegal part.

Lastly, the comment about racism was in refernce to the Ork's Drift battle report(s). There were two of them, right?

/Men of Harlech on to glory
This will ever be your story
Keep these burning words before ye
Welshmen will not yield

Grimbad
03-09-2009, 02:31
When people say that Praetorians are just Mordians with a headswap, they're wrong.

Praetorians are Mordians with the top of their head lopped off and replaced with a greenstuffed pith helmet.


You fail to account for the mustaches.
And as someone more knowledgeable than I (that is, with the knowledge to back it up) is going to point out soon, the selling is not the only illegal part. The casting is too.

Barbarossa
03-09-2009, 09:44
Welcome to the Praetorian Guard, son!
Yes, the miniatures are sometimes hard to find on ebay and often expensive, but you'll have one of the rarer armies at your FLGS.
If you want to cut down on the costs a bit, there is a company that produces heads of Zulu-era british soldiers. Just buy some cheaper Mordians and replace their heads.

Emperors Teeth
03-09-2009, 10:10
I've got enough to make 2 low strength platoons with some HW squads, but to further bulk up the infantry I was thinking of GS casting a pith helmet and transplanting it onto Mordian heads. Then add relevant facial hair too.

pookie
03-09-2009, 11:44
Those ones fight against Vulkan SM's painted Claret and Blue though.
;)

you could paint them any colour you wanted, appraently The Millwall clan doesnt care :D

OP - as long as they are Imperial Gaurd, the age will not matter if you can use them or not, i had planned on using my RT era Guard, but sadly i cant afford to keep em :cries:

Cervantes3773
03-09-2009, 13:41
I've got enough to make 2 low strength platoons with some HW squads, but to further bulk up the infantry I was thinking of GS casting a pith helmet and transplanting it onto Mordian heads. Then add relevant facial hair too.

Will you use the mustaches from those mustache competitions as inspiration?! PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE!!

JHZ
03-09-2009, 15:00
No, I'm afraid not. They're OOP and there have been cases of GW disallowing OOP models in their tournaments, because they're old and don't make them any money anymore. Not to forget that sometimes older models can be out of proportion with newer models, giving you and unfair advantage, which could be considered cheating.

...
Oh, wait, that's absolutely ridiculous.


Praetorians would make nice Mordian grenadiers. After all, they look the same, but the Praetorians have more armour (helmets vs. nothing at all).

And why even bother with metal Praetorians, when you can buy plastic Zulu war minies (http://www.wargamesfactory.com/_product_16676/British_Firing_Line_-_Zulu_War) and just convert them with some IG bits. Like Cadian (http://www.wargamesfactory.com/Images/Will_Praetorian02.jpg) or Krieg (http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_qQH7gYA1_es/Sjd618blteI/AAAAAAAAAWM/piBMTYfw-Ok/s400/HPIM1183.JPG).

EVIL INC
03-09-2009, 15:11
I dont understand why they dont just rereleae them. They are obviously populer enough for it to make financial sense.
Maybe forgeworld could pick up the slack on that if GW doesnt.
For most games, you will have no issues with using them. Only on the rare official tourney might you run into problems and even then, I dont think you would as they are still recent enough and populer enough enough.
The only problem I could foresee you having is getting enough of the models to make a whole army of them.

grissom2006
03-09-2009, 16:51
I dont understand why they dont just rereleae them. They are obviously populer enough for it to make financial sense.
Maybe forgeworld could pick up the slack on that if GW doesnt.
For most games, you will have no issues with using them. Only on the rare official tourney might you run into problems and even then, I dont think you would as they are still recent enough and populer enough enough.
The only problem I could foresee you having is getting enough of the models to make a whole army of them.

As i recall when i worked for GW the cast was actually destroyed partly due to the back catalogue getting reduced but they also mass ran the molds for them so they was cracking. It's why at one point GW ran a promo of them with a Chimera for a cheap price.

So if the do them they'll need to make new molds.

EVIL INC
03-09-2009, 17:00
I never understood purposely breaking molds becaue you dont want to run them. All old molds should be labeled and stored. At some point, they can always be re-released for a profit. If for no other reason, they could sell them to FW to alter/make new stuff from.
I can understand them breaking from overuse but good lord, youd think they would make/keep extras.

pookie
03-09-2009, 17:05
I never understood purposely breaking molds becaue you dont want to run them. All old molds should be labeled and stored. At some point, they can always be re-released for a profit. If for no other reason, they could sell them to FW to alter/make new stuff from.
I can understand them breaking from overuse but good lord, youd think they would make/keep extras.

Moulds still need to be Stored, which costs money, and since they are trying to save Money then storing them would be extra cost that wasnt needed.

tho i agree, why detsroy them? just stupidity on GW's part, they could rake a fortune in with some of the OOP minis, and gain a lot of capital in doing so, very bad business sence if you ask me!

t-tauri
03-09-2009, 17:17
A string of off topic and rule breaking posts removed. Please keep on topic and inside the posting guidelines.

EVIL INC
03-09-2009, 17:19
True, just how much would it cost to store them? Very little. By making a "run" of even a single model once every 6 months, they could rake in enough to pay for storage for the lot for 2 years and still have a very hefty profit left over.
On the praetorians alone, they could do an officer one 6 monthperiod, a set of "troopers" the next and a heavy weapons team the following. They could do the same for each of the gaurd ranges.
Then again, think of many of the old chaos renegades. So much profit they are letting slide down the drain.
Oh well, to stay on topic, you should have no problems with other players in your using them. Likely, you'll even get "cool points".

Kargush
03-09-2009, 18:23
Seriously. Buy Mordians and make your own.

I intend to do just that over the next year or so, buying the odd Mordian as I come across them.

[QUOTE=EVIL INC;3918014They are obviously populer enough for it to make financial sense.[/QUOTE]

If GW ever made a plastic line with Mordians with Pretorian heads as extra, they'd make a fortune. Heck, they'd have such profits they'd start making even more minitures from the more obscure parts of the 40k universe.

Crazy Ivan
03-09-2009, 21:27
OP, unless you want to play in a GW store or in a Tournament, you can use any models you want, GW or not. So if you don't want to shell out lots of money for original Praetorians, you can make your own. Mordian minis with head swaps would even still be store legal, I think (what is the required "percentage of original GW" on "legal" models again?)


I dont understand why they dont just rereleae them. They are obviously populer enough for it to make financial sense.
Maybe forgeworld could pick up the slack on that if GW doesnt.

My personal theory on why GW doesn't rerelease them again is because they're pretty much a one-off joke, that doesn't really fit in the 40k universe anymore the way it is presented nowadays. I say this puts them firmly in the "Squat" category. Note that the Praetorians, unlike pretty much every other notable Guard regiment (with or without models) haven't even got a mention in the last few codexes.

Don't get me wrong, I really like the Praetorians (cause they're fun!), but there is nothing clever or subtle about how they parody "real" history. Compare it to, for example, the Drookian Fen Guard (who never had models): a regiment consisting of outsider-hating, kilt-wearing, gruff-talking dudes who come from a planet that is made up completely out of moors and who live in clans? :rolleyes:

I also wonder if Praetorians would actually be so popular if GW started supporting them again. Were they actually popular when they were still available? Or are they comparable to Squats and Chaos Dwarves?

People always want that which they can't get...

wolf40k
03-09-2009, 21:33
Squats were discontinued apparently because the game designers felt that they weren't doing them justice, and they just weren't all that dwarfy.

They also might be making a comeback in the future under a different name.
Chaos Dwarfs I heard might be picked up by forge world which would be pricey but cool.

wangalang
04-09-2009, 01:46
You could use totally unaltered Mordians for command squads, or even veterans or conscripts.

jams86
04-09-2009, 13:21
you could update their look a bit and use cadians but model pith helmets on them :D

Sunyavadin
09-09-2009, 11:02
Of course, these days they can keep 3D wireframes of the models stored on computers and the entire GW back catalogue could be stored on one hard drive, rather than in a warehouse, then moulds could be made from them when they want to reissue one. The only issue is on older models, they'd have to scan in an existing model to create the wireframe, meaning digging one up.


Anyway, on the Praetorian issue. My Farsight army has a couple of squads of them as Gue'vesa. The first bunch were original Praetorians, and once I wanted more I just started sculpting helmets and big moustaches onto Mordians.

molloch
09-09-2009, 14:05
Talking of alternate Praetorians, I found these greens, while browsing the old web

http://blackpyramid.co.uk/teawars/

According to the front page they are at the casting stage, so should be available soon. Being Sci-fi it looks like with the other photos (click on th e main one) that they are doing weapons to match