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Gekiganger
05-09-2009, 21:08
Right - my space hulk box has arrived, I'll be getting some greenstuff and my file out and hopefully pull off turning these blood angels into Masters of Proteus marines - Now, I need some help.

Can anyone point me in the direction (Diagrams would be a life saver) or help give me some information on the colouration of power armour, such as how a librarians armour colouration relates to a regular marines / if teminator armour is coloured differently / what heraldry is displayed on what shoulderpad (iirc one is chapter markings and one is company markings?).

I'm not a 40k player, although I enjoy the background - so apologies if I'm using the wrong terminology, I tried googling, GW website and checking it up on the lexicanum, but either I'm using the wrong keywords, I'm blind or it's harder to find than it should be.

Tokamak
05-09-2009, 21:12
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/warhammer40k/images/4/46/Masters_of_Proteus_Armor.png

They don't have any specific colouring for librarians etc.

MadHatter
05-09-2009, 21:16
In the picture of them on the poster from GW they are white with blue backpack, The rim of their shoulder pads are blue as well as knee pads and boots and the wings and skull on thier chest. Thier eyes are red and their symbol is a double headed Axe. I will see if can get a good picture of it for you.

Gekiganger
05-09-2009, 21:17
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/warhammer40k/images/4/46/Masters_of_Proteus_Armor.png

They don't have any specific colouring for librarians etc.

Aye, I'm aware of the Masters of Proteus coloring, but I'm unaware if transfering the rank and file power armour colouring to terminator armour will result in a change or if it will be identical colouration - if so then my question is over. I'm just aware that librarians wear blue armour - is this universal to SM chapters? Deathwing terminators also wear a different colouration to rank and file Dark Angels - is the change in scheme unique to the dark angels or do other chapters do this?

Edit: http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/mediawiki/images/9/9b/Master_of_Proteus.jpg

That's the picture I'd be going by, lexicanum states that the yellow helm stripe is tied to their company - thus if the terminators have it it should be colouration depicting them as being from the first company, is there a colour tied to this or does the lack of material on MOP mean I've got free reign?

Bah, now ultramarines with all their strange helmet colouration and stripes is coming to mind and I feel out of my depth. Give me some clanrats to paint, can't go wrong with brown.

Corsair117
05-09-2009, 21:22
it depends on the chapter in question, some adhere rigidly to the codex astartes color guide (ultramarines) some have their own colorations and symbols (dark angels).

masters of proteus afaik don't have much background info so you can basically do whatever you want with em and be "right".

MadHatter
05-09-2009, 21:28
thats what will make them fun to do. IMO. I prefer to build my own chapter or use one that has almost nothing for a history.

Adding the picture to the previous post.

susu.exp
05-09-2009, 21:29
The blue armour of Librarians is pretty much universal - itīs part of the IA, the book regulating heraldry. The trim on shoulder pads signifies the company (white for the 1st company, which Terminators belong to), but lacking the trim removes this in favour of the Crux Terminatoris. The chapter symbol is on the right shoulder. The different color of the DAs first company (and 2nd) is an ideosyncracy of the DA and their sucessors.

SharpSilver
05-09-2009, 22:02
As far as I am aware of, Chaplains have always been adorned with the colour black on their armour. Apothecaries white. Librarians blue and tech Marines have traditionally been a red/dark red. It doesn't mean they HAVE to follow this. It's just how they have been represented all these years.

Although there are a few exceptions to this. For example, Iron Priests and Rune Priests in the Space Wolves have different colour on their power/TDA and don't follow the tradiitonal styles. They both just stick with the chapters colour scheme, e.g. Blue-grey.

Lord Damocles
05-09-2009, 22:34
And just to complicate things a little more, Librarians don't always have the entirity of their armour blue. Insex Astartes: Librarians shows a Salamanders Librarian with only his helmet and right arm blue.


Assuming the Sons' 1st company uses the same colours and heraldry as the rest of the Chapter (no evidence to the contrary that I know of), the Chapter symbol would be on the right shoulder rather than the left, and if they're codex (which judging by the helmet stripe they may not be), they'll have white helmets. Assuming both images given in this thread are 'correct', the 1st company could have a white helmet with a white stripe - so all white; with blue packs on power armoured members.

susu.exp
05-09-2009, 23:10
My take:
Standard Terminator (http://bolterandchainsword.com/tsm.php?hdt=FFFFFF&hdm=FFFFFF&hdl=FFFFFF&ey=FF1A1A&er=FFFFFF&pi=FFFFFF&nk=FFFFFF&cht=FFFFFF&ch=FFFFFF&abs=053BFF&bt=FFFFFF&btd=FFFFFF&cod=FFFFFF&ull=FFFFFF&lk=053BFF&lll=FFFFFF&lft=053BFF&url=FFFFFF&rk=053BFF&lrl=FFFFFF&rft=053BFF&sl=FFFFFF&sli=053BFF&sr=FFFFFF&sri=053BFF&ula=FFFFFF&lel=FFFFFF&lla=FFFFFF&lh=053BFF&ura=FFFFFF&rel=&rla=&rh=053BFF&eg=053BFF&sk=053BFF&rta=053BFF&lta=053BFF&lhd=&rhd=FFFFFF&ct=545454&cts=545454&camh=949494&camb=949494&cams=949494&caml=FF1A1A&brc=&rb=949494&gr=949494&bg=&)
Librarian (http://bolterandchainsword.com/tsm.php?hdt=FFFFFF&hdm=053BFF&hdl=053BFF&ey=FF1A1A&er=FFFFFF&pi=FFFFFF&nk=FFFFFF&cht=FFFFFF&ch=FFFFFF&abs=053BFF&bt=FFFFFF&btd=FFFFFF&cod=FFFFFF&ull=FFFFFF&lk=053BFF&lll=FFFFFF&lft=053BFF&url=FFFFFF&rk=053BFF&lrl=FFFFFF&rft=053BFF&sl=053BFF&sli=053BFF&sr=053BFF&sri=053BFF&ula=FFFFFF&lel=FFFFFF&lla=FFFFFF&lh=053BFF&ura=FFFFFF&rel=&rla=&rh=053BFF&eg=053BFF&sk=053BFF&rta=053BFF&lta=053BFF&lhd=&rhd=FFFFFF&ct=545454&cts=545454&camh=949494&camb=949494&cams=949494&caml=FF1A1A&brc=&rb=949494&gr=949494&bg=&)
Chaplain (http://bolterandchainsword.com/tsm.php?hdt=FFFFFF&hdm=1A1A1C&hdl=FCFCFC&ey=FF1A1A&er=FFFFFF&pi=FFFFFF&nk=0A0909&cht=0F0F0F&ch=0D0C0C&abs=053BFF&bt=FFFFFF&btd=FFFFFF&cod=FFFFFF&ull=FFFFFF&lk=053BFF&lll=FFFFFF&lft=053BFF&url=FFFFFF&rk=053BFF&lrl=FFFFFF&rft=053BFF&sl=000000&sli=053BFF&sr=111112&sri=053BFF&ula=FFFFFF&lel=FFFFFF&lla=FFFFFF&lh=053BFF&ura=FFFFFF&rel=&rla=&rh=053BFF&eg=053BFF&sk=053BFF&rta=053BFF&lta=053BFF&lhd=&rhd=FFFFFF&ct=545454&cts=545454&camh=949494&camb=949494&cams=949494&caml=FF1A1A&brc=&rb=949494&gr=949494&bg=&)

Lothlanathorian
05-09-2009, 23:17
Links aren't working for me. Just go to a blank page.

susu.exp
05-09-2009, 23:36
So for something different - as an attachment.
Top left: Standard terminator
Top right: Chaplain
Bottom left: Librarian
Bottom right: Techmarine

Gekiganger
06-09-2009, 00:10
Wow, thanks for all the replies - very much appreciated and certainly food for thought.

Wintermute
06-09-2009, 09:39
I'm moving this thread to 40K Background

Wintermute

Leftenant Gashrog
06-09-2009, 11:51
It appears that Guilliman was not oblivious to the issue of coloured helmets being the same as a chapters scheme, there are two 2nd Founding Ultramarine Successors who are noted as codex: White Consuls and (Red) Genesis Chapter who use blue helmets for veterans and sergeants respectively.

Personally I'd go with blue helmets with a white stripe for regular termis and red with a white stripe for the sergeants.

I assume the artist for How to Paint Space Marines/BL Poster forgot the company markings - the picture is from 4th edition when all veteran squads had a stylised cross for their squad badge but the guy has tactical markings.

PS: Its the Masters of Protelus not Proteus.

Gekiganger
06-09-2009, 12:47
PS: Its the Masters of Protelus not Proteus.

Damnit, your right. That doesn't roll of the tongue as easily or sound as cool by far. :(

I've done some more digging and found these, all on the same page praise the Emperor. From what I understand this means that they should have white helmets, sergents have a red helmet with a white stripe and the red skull (The Iron Skull - an honour badge apparently) on their shoulder. Rank and file terminators should have the Omega symbol on their (right? The left one is the crux pad iirc) shoulder. however, the Masters of Protelus have white pads, so should the omega symbol just be represented in black or something?

I also found this.


Each Chapter has its own unique colour scheme and Chapter Badge; however, Codex Chapters all follow a common heraldry system, though there are many slight variations from the system below.

Company Colours - Each Company has a unique colour that its members wear, commonly on the shoulder plate rims, but some chapters use chest eagles, bolter cases, knee pads, helmets or other parts of a Space Marine's Power Armour.

1st Company - White or Silver - Members of the 1st Company should also paint their helmet the company colour.

2nd Company - Yellow or Gold

3rd Company - Red

4th Company - Green

5th Company - Black

6th Company - Orange

7th Company - Purple

8th Company - Grey

9th Company - Blue

10th Company - Nominally white, however the company colour is not displayed in the members armour because they are Scouts.



So from what I understand that means that the pic earlier with the marine with the yellow stripe is from the second company and terminators should have either white or silver displayed on one of the mentioned armour pieces, since the marine in the earlier picture had a stripe, does that mean that they should have a white or silver stripe on their helmets (not that it would show up if it was white on white) or can where the colour is displayed be shown on a different area amoungst different companies (I'd imagine not to preserve consistancy).



Librarians - Wear blue armour, irrespective of what chapter they belong to, and wear their Chapter Badge as normal. (This practice is now widely ignored, even among the more standard chapters.)

Chaplains - Wear black armour, irrespective of what chapter they belong to, and wear their Chapter Badge as normal.

Techmarines - Wear red armour, irrespective of what chapter they belong to, and wear their Chapter Badge as normal.

Apothecaries - Wear white armour, irrespective of what chapter they belong to, and wear their Chapter Badge as normal.



I also found that relating to the specialists within the chapter, so Librarian in (full I presume) blue, and optionally the chapter badge on their shoulder - how would that relate to the crux and the omega? I'm starting to think I've made a mistake in my delving as sofar I have a crux on the left, and theres the Omega sign and Chapter badge - can't put them both on 1 shoulder, I'm presuming either I've made a mistake with that picture and the Omega is not infact displayed, or the chapter badge is not displayed once doning terminator armour.

I seem to be rambling a lot now so I'll leave this post at that and seef anyone has any more to contribute - sorry if I'm making a mountain out of a mole hill but delving into the world of heraldry seems complex if you want to pull it off accurately, 'specially if your chosen chapter has a whole 3 images, none terminator armoured.

Thanks in advance for any more help.

Leftenant Gashrog
06-09-2009, 12:52
The omega symbol is the chapter badge of the Ultramarines, since the Masters of Protelus are Masters of Protelus not Ultramarines they wouldn't have it - they would have the axe symbol of the Masters of Protelus.

addendum: Librarians, Chaplains etc wear their chapter badge "as normal" which in the case of Terminators means it switches to the marines right pad.

pookie
07-09-2009, 14:15
And just to complicate things a little more, Librarians don't always have the entirity of their armour blue. Insex Astartes: Librarians shows a Salamanders Librarian with only his helmet and right arm blue.




its the same with there Apothocarys - as per the new SM Dex.

Gekiganger
07-09-2009, 20:52
The omega symbol is the chapter badge of the Ultramarines, since the Masters of Protelus are Masters of Protelus not Ultramarines they wouldn't have it - they would have the axe symbol of the Masters of Protelus.



I think I'll facepalm untill the shame goes away.

Alas, I think all of my questions have been answered now - Thanks to everyone who contributed.

totgeboren
08-09-2009, 07:07
My brother has a red Blood Angel successor chapter, and he only painted the left shoulder pad (not the trim) blue on his Librarians, the rest follow the standard paint scheme.

It looks really nice, and tie them into the force whilst still marking them out as librarians.

pookie
08-09-2009, 15:13
My brother has a red Blood Angel successor chapter, and he only painted the left shoulder pad (not the trim) blue on his Librarians, the rest follow the standard paint scheme.

It looks really nice, and tie them into the force whilst still marking them out as librarians.

very Valid thing to do with a Homebrew chapter, just look at the SW - they dont have UM Blue Libbys.