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SolStar
06-09-2009, 18:16
This is my first attempt at starting a new Thread. I believe this is the right place versus the Rumours page for Space Wolves. (Let me know if otherwise please)

I am looking for opinions on why they did not add 13th company or units of Wulfen to the new Codex.

Thanks

ntin
06-09-2009, 18:19
The Wulfen are not regular Space Marines that could be trained or produced under normal circumstances. What Wulfen that did appear in the Eye of Terror campaign and subsequent Codex were Space Marines that fought during the Heresy who then followed their Priminarch into the Eye of Terror.

weirdo2590
06-09-2009, 18:36
Which very well might be retconned to hell but currently only the one set of wulfen were ever spawned

TrooperTino
06-09-2009, 18:42
I think it's odd, too.

SM codex has Legion of the damned in it... and they are rarely seen on the battlefield (from a fluff perspektive).

Wulfen in the space wulf codex arn't that far stretched to me. Even iff they are official lost in the eye (the 13th), its reasonable a few wulfen are roaming free in the galaxy. Or perhaps they can appear in the spacewulf ranks today, too? A little wulfen is in every Spacewulf ;)

In my humble opinion a codex entry wulfen would be cool, but in a way we wont see a squad wulfen in every second spacewulf list, just a cool fluffy little special unit...

VanirX
06-09-2009, 19:10
I always thought it would be cool for SW to be able to take a squad of Wulfen in there armies. Kinda like how Blood Angels can get a squad of Death Company.

Bestial Fury
06-09-2009, 19:12
We won't know the answer to this until Phil explains in his designer notes in the next WD.

SharpSilver
06-09-2009, 19:54
This is my first attempt at starting a new Thread. I believe this is the right place versus the Rumours page for Space Wolves. (Let me know if otherwise please)

I am looking for opinions on why they did not add 13th company or units of Wulfen to the new Codex.

Thanks

Because The Wulfen in fluff-terms are unreliable, and can only be controlled by a Wolf-Priest.

13th Company Wulfen under the control of a Wolf Priest in the codex would be a great idea, however they would 'have' to stay attached to a Wolf Priest. If they were independent they would (fluffwise) probably attack both the Non-Wulfen Space Wolves and their enemies alike. Therefore not a great choice.

Regular Space Wolves 13th Company who carry the curse who have not allowed it to manifest in them would be a another idea, however I feel they would have to be a small number and not be allowed to be taken as a entire force. After-all, they are supposed to be missing and the majority are supposedly still in the Eye of Terror.

When I first read through the first Space Wolf Novel by William King a while ago, It is said that the first ever Wulfen to emerge was named 'Wulfen', who was one of Russ's followers, was secretly jealous of Russ. After Wulfen passed through the Gates of Morkai and drunk from the Cup, he turned into a ferocious Wolf-like creature and attempted to throttle Russ. Russ killed him with one hand and deemed all those who who were unworthy to become Space Wolves under him would turn into Wulfen.

So 13th Company Wulfen controlled by a Wolf Priest would be alright, however those who turn into Wulfen that are not affiliated with the EoT or 13th Co shouldn't be included, ever, In my opinion.

Absolutionis
06-09-2009, 19:55
If you really want you can still convert your Space Wolves marines to be furries by using Wulfen "counts-as" bloodclaws or whatnot. They're really equipped the same.

Personally, I've always been against the blasphemous idea of furry Space Marines, and I'm not even an Imperial player. They may have simply faced execution for being mutants.

Suffer Not the Furry to live.
http://blogfile.paran.com/BLOG_343887/200708/1187025029_Suffer%20Not%20the%20Furry%20to%20Live% 20Desu.jpg

LonelyPath
06-09-2009, 23:16
@ Absolutionis - Love that image

I'm a fan of the 13th Company myself, so if it's the case of no Wulfen, I'll just have to do a counts-as with Blood Claws as already mentioned.

AmasNagol
06-09-2009, 23:57
Because they wanted to sell lots of new boxes of stuff people didn't have yet.

I'm going to be using mine as either Berserkers or Possessed in the CSM dex.

Lord Hjamlar
07-09-2009, 00:01
Because after the EoT events, the 13th went back to EoT as they've noticed That Leman Russ got lost in some tavern on the way to Cadia. And as he got drunk he left it and got lost, so they won't appear till they find him...

;)

Bestial Fury
07-09-2009, 00:04
@Sharp, But they captured the feel of the 13th so well in the EoT dex. Tuff but by no means overpowered. Wulfen units were uncontrollable without WP. With the new dex, and having two HW's per slot a wulfen army would have been very nice (maybe give up HS slots or armor altogether if fielded). I think GW again, have shotgunned there own toes with allowing a great them/idea get sucked into the warp. (like the relictors but that is another thread).

That said, I see absolutely no problem with using the new rules and count-asing a 13th co., or other wulfen company.

Heck folks will be using the new dex to reflect Death Wing, Chaos, why can't we do our beloved 13th/Wulfen army as count as? ;)
-------------

Personally, I've always been against the blasphemous idea of furry Space Marines, and I'm not even an Imperial player. They may have simply faced execution for being mutants.
That is interesting from someone sporting the avatar of the Changer of Ways.
And if anyone tried to execute our wulfen brothers, outside of our own chapter doing it, they'd be lucky to leave the space of Fenris.

Pokpoko
07-09-2009, 00:14
....there seems to be a bit of misconception in this thread. Furry is a sad,sad,sick person who wears suit that looks like cartoony animal, acts in a manner that brings shame to his family and friends, and generally is a dreg of society.
Werewolf on the other side, is a bad-tempered, no-nonsense biological killing machine, who tears at it's surroundings in animal frenzy, destroying friend and foe alike, whose fur is stiff with blood of it's prey, and who does NOT look like bipedal scooby-doo.
Furries are disgusting, Werewolves are awesome. With this image in mind, are wulfen furry? Think well on it.

Anyway, they're not in the codex because...well, no idea!

Lostanddamned
07-09-2009, 00:19
If you really want you can still convert your Space Wolves marines to be furries by using Wulfen "counts-as" bloodclaws or whatnot. They're really equipped the same.

Personally, I've always been against the blasphemous idea of furry Space Marines, and I'm not even an Imperial player. They may have simply faced execution for being mutants.

Suffer Not the Furry to live.
http://blogfile.paran.com/BLOG_343887/200708/1187025029_Suffer%20Not%20the%20Furry%20to%20Live% 20Desu.jpg

Ok here we go.

Space Wolves ≠ furries, they are Norse-Werewolves, much in the same way that the Blood Angels are Vampiric Artisans. The thing they share with the furry fandom in your eyes is the "soul of an animal inside them" except y'know - the Space Wolves are geneticly modified beserkers with a whole bunch of throwback mutations. In other words their wulfen form is more like a super-neanderthal. Like many cultures, they have seen the native beasts of their environment and compared themselves to that.

In addendum to this, I see no reason to hate furries, any more than any other subculture, and infact the only thing in my eyes that is pathetic about the furry fandom is the way that the majority of non-furries look down on them, and go out of their way to criticise and demean them.

I am not a furry, but because I don't hate them with a firey passion, I have been labelled as such in the past.

tl;dr - space wolves not furries, get over the furry hate.


....there seems to be a bit of misconception in this thread. Furry is a sad,sad,sick person who wears suit that looks like cartoony animal, acts in a manner that brings shame to his family and friends, and generally is a dreg of society.
Werewolf on the other side, is a bad-tempered, no-nonsense biological killing machine, who tears at it's surroundings in animal frenzy, destroying friend and foe alike, whose fur is stiff with blood of it's prey, and who does NOT look like bipedal scooby-doo.
Furries are disgusting, Werewolves are awesome. With this image in mind, are wulfen furry? Think well on it.

Anyway, they're not in the codex because...well, no idea!

Just. Just argh. So much argh.

You have a Catgirl avatar, so I'm hoping you are in jest.

JHZ
07-09-2009, 00:27
I give this thread 3 pages max before disappearing.

I guess the reason not to have wolfen in the SW is because they're not really something they like to have (Who want's an army of raging mutant beasts? Not the Imperium, that's for sure.), and are more synonymous with the 13th company. And since they don't give us much wulfens, it might give way to the possible notion that there might be a 13th company list in the future sporting tons of them. GW knows how to milk that money from us.

Pokpoko
07-09-2009, 00:28
You have a Catgirl avatar, so I'm hoping you are in jest.
catgirls sit firmly within the safe 10%. And yes, i did mellow out that post a bit,so i don't get a warning:)

besides:STILL? Jesus in monogamous relationship with Budda Christ, i must have changed the avatar ten times already,and it's STILL the same av? Damn it, Emps, get out of my av already!

ashc
07-09-2009, 01:21
If they had similar rules to what they had before they would just be a Death Company rip-off.

Frostmane
07-09-2009, 01:28
To use Wulfen as common troops would be dangerous. It would reveal to all a flaw in the gene seed. Thus the Inquisition would be investigating or attacking.

AmasNagol
07-09-2009, 02:28
I found it hilarious they banned 13th Company lists from all GW tournaments anyway. They were not even remotely close to being even a mid tier army, let alone over powered or unbalanced.

Mine lives on...in storage lol

Hellebore
07-09-2009, 02:52
Probably to leave the BLood Angels with something special.

A Wulfen squad in the SW army would give the SW's pretty much every type of unit every other army has.

I'll just have to counts as Blood Claws I think. About as close in attacks etc as a Wulfen.

That or Wolf Guard in Power Armour.

Hellebore

Eulenspiegel
07-09-2009, 07:23
I am looking for opinions on why they did not add 13th company or units of Wulfen to the new Codex.

I guess because players would think that Wulfen were a regular Space Wolves unit, and field one in every other army.
That means you would see less actual Space Wolves but more 13th company, which certainly isn´t what they had in mind when designing the nex ´dex.

Even if people read the background part of the unit entry, they´d go out of their way to justify a counts-as unit in their SW army, that uses the Wulfen rules.

Of cause this leaves the actual 13th company players hanging, but I guess they rather risked that than watering down the Space Wolves.

Brother Antonios
07-09-2009, 07:45
Maybe it would be to many model ranges to support for one codex? I know it has been mentioned by GW that one of the reasons they produce many marine Chapter codexes and armies is because they can reuse SM models and that saves on cost. It may have delayed the release even more, they can always do it later.

Lord-Caerolion
07-09-2009, 07:45
Of course, the argument that the Space Wolf commanders can't control the Wulfen doesn't really hold true, as the Smurfs got Legion of the Damned, something you can't even try to control.

Lothlanathorian
07-09-2009, 08:06
But Legion of the Damned aren't from a Company of Marines that went into the Eye of Terror and never came back. They are a Chapter of Marines that was decimated by some Warp Spawned foulness and they now show up on battlefields to aid Imperial forces before mysteriously vanishing back to where they came from.

The Wulfen in the Space Wolves proper are a mark of shame. They are recruits who didn't have what it took to conquer the beast within and become one of the Sons of Russ. The Wulfen from the 13th Great Company are mutated from how close they were to Chaos for the last 10,000 years. So, one is even rarer than the Legion of the Damned and of no use to anyone, the other is a mark of shame, cast out into the wilds of Fenris where the Emperor can choose its fate.

blake
07-09-2009, 08:58
They're gone, and we should thank Russ every night that they are.

SolStar
07-09-2009, 18:37
Lots of possible reasons, Thanks,

I personally would like to have seen something of them in the codex.
I haven't read all of the SW stories and background so I will try to find
some of them to read. I like the names for the units for 13th Co better
than the regular names, but that is just my opinion. I will still buy the new
codex and start a Space Wolf army.

Commander Zane
08-09-2009, 00:27
But Legion of the Damned aren't from a Company of Marines that went into the Eye of Terror and never came back. They are a Chapter of Marines that was decimated by some Warp Spawned foulness and they now show up on battlefields to aid Imperial forces before mysteriously vanishing back to where they came from.

The Wulfen in the Space Wolves proper are a mark of shame. They are recruits who didn't have what it took to conquer the beast within and become one of the Sons of Russ. The Wulfen from the 13th Great Company are mutated from how close they were to Chaos for the last 10,000 years. So, one is even rarer than the Legion of the Damned and of no use to anyone, the other is a mark of shame, cast out into the wilds of Fenris where the Emperor can choose its fate.

this pretty much hits the nail on the head, the only reason you get wulfen is because of the warp bringin out there more feral side, thats why some of the 13th co is wulfen and others arent......or at least i think thats the case, been ages since i read the codex for them:p

shabbadoo
08-09-2009, 00:46
This is my first attempt at starting a new Thread. I believe this is the right place versus the Rumours page for Space Wolves. (Let me know if otherwise please)

I am looking for opinions on why they did not add 13th company or units of Wulfen to the new Codex.

Thanks

You might as well ask why Cypher and The Fallen aren't in Codex: Dark Angels, as they are basically really old Dark Angels. It is really very simple. Where did the Wolfen make their first appearance for the game? Codex: Eye of Terror. Is the 13th Company all buddy buddy with everyone they meet? No, they are very cautious, and while in one story they cooperate with some Imperials, they are very wary of outsiders(and the actual Wulfen are hidden away). Why? Because they have werewolves in their midst basically. Inquisitors would capture/kill them all, and then of course the whole Space Wolves chapter would then likely be subjected to a level of Inquisitorial scrutiny that would make them rather uncomfortable at the very least.

Cutting to the chase, Wolfen are not meant to be part of a standard Space Wolves army in any way because they are a fringe group. Wulfen are very much like the Death Company(the chapter's dirty little secret), but with a little bit more mutant thrown in, and in the case of the Wulfen for a little bit less tolerance from the folks who keep an eye on such things(the Inquisition). 13th company are somewhat similar to the all Death Company variant Blood Angels army list in this respect. It is just not normal.

Letting a little bit of the beast out now and again might be tolerable, if it can be held in check("Mark of the Wulfen"), but full-on giving into the beast and going "full Wulfen" is not, and so they were left out due to being the mutant freaks that they are. True Wulfen are simply outside of the normal chapter parameters. The 13th Company makes for a nice fringe army to play, but that is what it is- a fringe army. If you can actually use all of your 13th Company models under the new list, without any of them being invalidated in any way, people ought to be happy for that reason alone. We'll have to wait and see a few more weeks what units Wulfen models would best be used to represent rules-wise.

Lord Hjamlar
08-09-2009, 00:47
13th Co. Fluff states, that all members bear the Mark of the Wulfen, MotW, though only on some of them it appears in the most extreme version - Wulfen units.

In generic SW, Mark of the Wulfen should be only thing allowed, being 0-1 option from the armoury.

The Wulfens whom some recruits become after they drink from the Cup of the Wulfen, are a mark of shame, Leman said it's the fate w8 every unworthy his geneseed or sth like that.

Please do not mix those 3 aspects... in example, Bran Redmaw, a Wolf Lord with MotW is not ashamed of bearing the mark, nor are his brothers.
Same applies to 13th Co. noone is ashamed of their existance.

Thylacine
08-09-2009, 00:54
This is my first attempt at starting a new Thread. I believe this is the right place versus the Rumours page for Space Wolves. (Let me know if otherwise please)

I am looking for opinions on why they did not add 13th company or units of Wulfen to the new Codex.

Thanks

Hi, SolStar.

We don't know what is in the codex yet as no one has seen one! All that has been put on the web is a few images from a Spanish catalogue that shows independent stockists what is coming and what the cost is.

No one has images of the sprues for the box sets yet because they have not been released. AFAIK, and this is from a good, long time friend, who works for the company! The codex is in OZ we should see them next week and the plastic has not arrived here yet. He knows that there will be a box of Grey Hunters, Long Fangs and WGBG terminators and thats it so far.

At the moment GW 40k is fixed on the Space Hulk release which seems to have gone well for them but I saw a lot of unsold boxes (20+) at my local store today.

We don't know if the Leman Russ Exterminator is in or out.
We don't know if the rumoured 'special' Land Raider is anything more than a rumour.
We don't know if the Wolf Scouts will keep OBEL or if they have use of the LS Storm.
We don't know if the Wulfen are in this codex or not and we don't know what GW will give us by way of an FAQ!

It would be nice to see the Wulfen back in some role but I doubt if we will see it soon unless they make an appearance in another add-on like Planetstrike or Cities of Death!

So much hype over nothing! I know, we who like the chapter and play it have waited for such a long time for a new codex but can folks keep off the stupid pills for another week or two!

:chrome:Thylacine:chrome:

Lord Hjamlar
08-09-2009, 01:05
Man... Check the SW rumours thread ;)

Thylacine
08-09-2009, 02:24
Man... Check the SW rumours thread ;)

Dude, I have.

I have been looking at that rumours thread for months, most of it is wishfull thinking! No codex has been sighted yet, no one can quote a page number of give a full set of stats.

Some of the GW staff at 'games days' give out tid-bits of information to keep the fan-boys happy, knowing full well that by the end of the day what they said will be on one of the forums. This is done to keep and build up your interest in the soon to be released and much waited for Space Wolf Codex!

Looking at the cover this time it is a codex (stand alone) rather than a supplement tied to the SM codex.

Example: "Wolf Claws – The Space Wolf version of Lightning Claws, allow you to choose to either re-roll “to hit” or “to wound”."

We have all seen the model with the twin lightning claws (Wolf claws), nothing new there, at a games day a staffer feeds out a rumour that the new wolf claws are so great you can do this and that with them.

So we have the hint of a new rule, that may or may not be in the codex, how did the staffer know the rules when he has not seen the codex? He knows another staffer who was involved in the playtesting or he saw one of perhaps many pre-production versions of he codex!

Nothing to get all hyped up over.

I have been playing SW's for nine years, it is the only codex I play and like the rest of you I am waiting with baited breath for the release of the new codex. At last I can go to a tournament and not have to argue over the legitimacy of a rule or piece of wargear.

:chrome:Thylacine:chrome:

Triszin The Wrath God
08-09-2009, 02:36
i think you should take a look over at the thread lots of stuff just got confirmed mini wise. rules wise not so much as of yet.

grissom2006
08-09-2009, 09:06
Well i can say i heard that Wulfen got mentioned as biend a option to the Codex but not a troop choice so much back in early August. Going by the rumours what i got told of them has been comfirmed in that they are in the Codex just not in the same manner as they was.

Onisuzume
08-09-2009, 12:42
The SW may be ashamed of the Wuilfen's existance, they still mourned their passing.
But I do not think that shame is the reason why they shun them... I think it is fear. Fear of what they might become. Fear of losing yourself, even if it isn't to chaos.

The Saga of Jorin Bloodfang.
In time the ranks of the 6th Legion swelled to a great host. And many bore the Mark [FRAGMENT MISSING]. And so Russ banded them all into one Great Company. And to Bloodfang fell the honour. Of leading them to laurels and glory. In the name of Russ and the All Father. Bloodfang named [FRAGMENT MISSING] Grail; Orkbane; Sigurd; Thorbrand and Grafeld. To each a retinue was granted. And as a band of brothers the 13th Great Company. Reaved across the stars. Neither Xenite, nor Apostate nor Fiend. Could stand before [FRAGMENT MISSING] the Were was upon them. But at the Gates of [FRAGMENT MISSING] did Bloodfang rage. And plunge headlong into [FRAGMENT MISSING] Neither Kin nor Master could restrain him. And beyond the Gates did the Wulfen-kind pass. At Asaheim the Wolved did cry for one hundred nights. Mourning the passage of their kin.

Commander Zane
08-09-2009, 13:00
Dude, I have.

I have been looking at that rumours thread for months, most of it is wishfull thinking! No codex has been sighted yet, no one can quote a page number of give a full set of stats.

Some of the GW staff at 'games days' give out tid-bits of information to keep the fan-boys happy, knowing full well that by the end of the day what they said will be on one of the forums. This is done to keep and build up your interest in the soon to be released and much waited for Space Wolf Codex!

Looking at the cover this time it is a codex (stand alone) rather than a supplement tied to the SM codex.

Example: "Wolf Claws – The Space Wolf version of Lightning Claws, allow you to choose to either re-roll “to hit” or “to wound”."

We have all seen the model with the twin lightning claws (Wolf claws), nothing new there, at a games day a staffer feeds out a rumour that the new wolf claws are so great you can do this and that with them.

So we have the hint of a new rule, that may or may not be in the codex, how did the staffer know the rules when he has not seen the codex? He knows another staffer who was involved in the playtesting or he saw one of perhaps many pre-production versions of he codex!

Nothing to get all hyped up over.

I have been playing SW's for nine years, it is the only codex I play and like the rest of you I am waiting with baited breath for the release of the new codex. At last I can go to a tournament and not have to argue over the legitimacy of a rule or piece of wargear.

:chrome:Thylacine:chrome:

why dont u check the GW website they have the tactical marine sprue up and it looks amazin:)

Ge_X
08-09-2009, 13:46
But wasn't the 13th company a supplement army to the (now old) SW codex? So the new one shouldn't ban the current army list for them. From what I can see, the 13th company will only be effected by the 3 HQs and wolf guards, the other units are independent (eg. grey slayers) of the SW dex.

Onisuzume
08-09-2009, 14:02
No, it was, afaik, mostly a stand-alone minidex.

Ge_X
08-09-2009, 14:10
So my 13th company wouldn't be 'banned' by the new SW codex?

Onisuzume
08-09-2009, 14:40
Could work as a "counts as" army...
Maybe with Wulfen "counting as" Space Puppy Scouts?

Lord Damocles
08-09-2009, 14:43
No, it was, afaik, mostly a stand-alone minidex.
Sure... if by 'mostly stand-alone' you mean a list which referenced Codex: Space Wolves, which in turn referenced Codex: Space Marines.

Ge_X
08-09-2009, 14:56
Sorry, I meant if the 13th company list from the eye of terror would still be playable (legal) despite the new space wolves codex, or would something happen, like the eye of terror ulthwe army being banned by the new eldar codex.

Thylacine
08-09-2009, 16:01
why dont u check the GW website they have the tactical marine sprue up and it looks amazin:)

I was on the site up until I posted and logged off, then the sprue came up. Remember I live in OZ thats 10 hours difference in time.

I saw the sprue when I was at the local GW this afternoon, lots of heads and arms. I had a quick look at the codex and it is a codex this time not a supplement like the old one. Lots of fluff, some old artwork, there are some changes to what the GH and BC packs can take, like only one PW not two!

It was just a quick look and then the staff literally snatched the codex out of my hand so I did not have a chance to view the vehicles!

:chrome:Thylacine:chrome:

Onisuzume
08-09-2009, 16:56
Sorry, I meant if the 13th company list from the eye of terror would still be playable (legal) despite the new space wolves codex, or would something happen, like the eye of terror ulthwe army being banned by the new eldar codex.
Since its from an older edition: no.
Even if it is very easy to adept to the current edition.

Sure... if by 'mostly stand-alone' you mean a list which referenced Codex: Space Wolves, which in turn referenced Codex: Space Marines.
Erm... yes, I did mean that! :rolleyes:

Commander Zane
08-09-2009, 18:28
I was on the site up until I posted and logged off, then the sprue came up. Remember I live in OZ thats 10 hours difference in time.

that i did not know lol

AmasNagol
08-09-2009, 20:16
You can use your 13th company list in friendly play. You might even be allowed to use it in store if the manager gets on well with you on vets night or what have you. They are all GW miniatures afterall.

As for using them competitively, the 13th Company list was banned from tournaments just 1 year after the EoT codex was released. I thought at the time this was disgusting as so many people invested a great deal of money converting and modelling the 13th Co.

Making Jorin Bloodfang or Wolf Priest Sternhammer a special character in the codex who unlocks Wulfen as an Elites choice, The Gate power for Rune Priests, Wolf Guard become Troops, Wolf Guard on Bikes become Fast Attack along with Wolf Packs, Long Fangs as Heavy Support, NO Terminator Armour or Jump Packs and NO other unit entries from the codex permitted aside from either a Lord, Rune Priest or Wolf Priest (ie: vehicles, Blood Claws, Grey Hunters, Skyclaws, special characters) and would have been utterly acceptable. It wouldn't have been over powered and it would have taken up AT MOST 2 pages in the codex. This would have meant that you would never see Wulfen units in a traditional Space Wolf army doing madness like running out of Land Raider Crusaders with Ragnar Blackmane or such.

In my opinion it is a complete cop out, and I am looking at a really really weak Chaos Space Marines list for counts as. I'm very disappointed.

Lisiecki
08-09-2009, 20:25
This is my first attempt at starting a new Thread. I believe this is the right place versus the Rumours page for Space Wolves. (Let me know if otherwise please)

I am looking for opinions on why they did not add 13th company or units of Wulfen to the new Codex.

Thanks

Because there horrid freaks who bring attention to the flaw in the space wolf seed. And the last time a Space Wolf chapter went Wulven, they were purged

AmasNagol
08-09-2009, 20:29
13th Company:

HQ:
Must take a minimum of 2 HQ choices.

Wolf Lord 0-1
(May not take Terminator Armour, may take Mark Of The Wulfen)

Rune Priest 0-1
(Always has 'The Gate' psychic power, may not take Terminator Armour)

Wolf Priest 0-1
(May not take Terminator Armour)

Elites:
Wulfen pack 5-15
5 - 5 4 1 5 2 10 3+
Power Armour
2 CCW
'Rage' universal special rule
Only a Wolf Priest may join this unit, if he does they are no longer subject to 'Rage'

Troops:
Wolf Guard 5-10
(May not take Terminator Armour or Jump Packs, a unit of 5 may be mounted on bikes however they then become a Fast Attack choice)

Fast Attack:
Fenrisian Wolf Pack

Heavy Support:
Long Fangs Pack

All models gain the 'Scout' universal special rule and infantry gain 'Move Through Cover'

How difficult was that? Didn't even require me to make up any special characters either.

Dranthar
09-09-2009, 02:06
Well it at least looks like the wulfen can be taken as a unit upgrade for blood claws and grey hunters, but only one per unit.

Great if you had only 5 wulfen, but not if you have 15 of the buggers. :rolleyes:

As far as "counts as" goes, maybe they could be taken as a pack of wolf guard, Lone wolves or scouts. But then the weapon options for those models become very limited (as in 'none'...maybe a PW). So right now, I remain unconvinced.

I suppose this means that my 13th company will remain a Chaos Space Marine army, complete with possessed. It's not the most efficient list, but at least the models have more fitting stats.

AmasNagol
09-09-2009, 03:42
I suppose this means that my 13th company will remain a Chaos Space Marine army, complete with possessed. It's not the most efficient list, but at least the models have more fitting stats.

I got bored:

HQ:
Wolf Lord (Chaos Lord)
Frost Blade, Mark Of The Wulfen (Daemon Weapon)
Combi Weapon
150

Rune Priest (Chaos Sorceror)
Cyber Raven Familiar (+1I) (Mark of Slaanesh)
Gate (Lash of Submission)
125

Elites:
Wulfen Pack and Wolf Priest (8 Possessed with Champion)
Initiative 5 (Icon of Slaanesh)
238

Troops:
Storm Claw Pack (8 Berzerkers with Champion)
Power Fist
Personal Icon
213

Storm Claw Pack (8 Berzerkers with Champion)
Power Fist
Personal Icon
213

Grey Slayers Pack (8 Chaos Space Marines)
Plasma Gun
Icon of Chaos Glory
145

Fenrisian Wolves (6 Lesser Summoned Daemons)
78

Fenrisian Wolves (6 Lesser Summoned Daemons)
78

Fast Attack:
Storm Claws Biker Pack (3 Chaos Space Marine Bikers)
2 Melta Guns
Icon of Chaos Glory
129

Storm Claws Biker Pack (3 Chaos Space Marine Bikers)
2 Melta Guns
Icon of Chaos Glory
129

1498pts

Dranthar
09-09-2009, 04:09
I got bored:
:D

Actually I've already worked such a list out, and played it several times too. It's something like;

Chaos Lord w. Daemon Weapon
8 Possesed w. MoK
8 Possesed w. MoK
10 CSMs w. 2x Meltas, MoK and Champion
10 CSMs w. 2x Meltas, MoK and Champion
10 CSMs w. 2x Plasma, MoK and Champion
5 Bikers w. 2x Flamers, MoK
As many Lesser Daemons as will fit in.

The wolf priest is a now a unit champion, while my Rune Priest is no longer in the army. Serves him right too - he used to actively sabotage my games whenever he used his gate power, as in squads deviating onto the enemy, deviating too far away or completely failing at a critical moment. :rolleyes:

I went with the Mark of Khorne because it brings the units closer to the stats they should be. Possesed could also take Mark of Slaneesh, but it's all much of a muchness, really.
Lesser Daemons were the wolves for a while, but with time I'll be replacing them with something else.

I have the benefit of my 13th company army not actually being modeled as Space wolves...more like commandoes with bucket-loads of equipment (ie. as many ammo pounches, grenades and combat knives as I could find) so converting them to Chaos isn't a huge challenge.

AmasNagol
09-09-2009, 04:26
I think they both approximate things reasonably well. I never took a Rune Priest either, Wolf Lord with TLC and MOTW with Wulfen as troops necessitated a Wolf Priest for at least one of them. The Long Fangs have to go into storage for a while though.

Hellebore
09-09-2009, 05:25
My 13th co Wolf Lord had the mark of the wulfen and a bike. I modelled him up from a daemon prince model. He's a huge wulfen.

Thus, I shall use Canis Wolfborn's stats for him.

I shall use blood claw squads as wulfen (with a model with the mark of the wulfen)
I shall use thunderwolf cavalry as giant werewolf monsters.
2 wolf lords give 2 wolf guard units as troops


The only thing I can't replicate in my list is the long fangs with special weapons. :(

I can replicate the effect of the gate a little by using drop pods.


Hellebore

AmasNagol
09-09-2009, 05:36
Can WG take 4 special weapons in a 5 man squad? Admittedly you can't run 4 meltaguns with a Rune Priest and gate them around melting 2 targets per turn, but still.

Hellebore
09-09-2009, 05:53
I don't know, but I somehow doubt it. I wasn't aware they could take any special weapons though.

The old army list is still usable though. It's out of date and you couldn't play it at tournaments but I'm sure friends wouldn't begrudge people using their army with the rules written for it.

Given 5th ed's metagame the wulfen army list isn't really that powerful.

I once caused 36 wounds on 5 terminators in melee for two assault phases in a row (so a total of 72 wounds) and they saved all of them and proceeded to tear apart the army. :p

The lack of rending or any kind of power weapon equivalent in the wulfen packs did have an affect in some games.

There was the fact that my 1500 pt army had 3 packs of 13 wulfen as troops so I didn't have many models on the table. Still, against guard those three packs were whittled down to 3 men each and those 3 3man squads destroyed the entire guard infantry complement in 2 turns...

Hellebore

AmasNagol
09-09-2009, 06:23
I remember it well. I went to one of those one day tournaments at GW Nottingham the year the Codex came out and took my 13th. Actually getting across the table was enough to make my underpants damp, but the journey was.... rough! Using those Wolves to try and charge 1st turn and hold up anything they could long enough to stop it shooting and get the Wulfen and Storm Claws across the board.

It was a fun army. Very unique play style too. Was nowhere close to competitive though.

lol@rolling 72 dice and no 1s. You can't use that as empirical evidence that they need power weapons, I'd use it as evidence you need new dice! Besides, when the Wolf Lord with MoTW and Lightning Claws/Frostblade made it into combat, with his Storm Claws pack also swinging 2 Power Fists and the WG with Thunder Hammer, it balanced out the lack of ignores armour in the Wulfen units!