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TAW
08-09-2009, 05:31
On page 69 of the Empire codex is a magic item called "Aldred's Casket of Sorcery". It basically states you can steal a spell from enemy wizards close enough to you. Now I have a few questions:

1. Is every kind of spellcaster in warhammer is concidered a wizard?

2. Could you thus steal spells from undead casters and casters with variant lores? (i.e. tomb kings, vampire counts, high elves. "Incantation of Summoning", "Invocation of Nehek", "Drain Magic" respectively)

3. Does this item remove the spell from the caster completely and then remove it from the game so he/she doesn't get it back?

4. If it removes the spell does it take it remove all caster's abilities to cast that particular spell?

Thanks for the help

Nurgling Chieftain
08-09-2009, 05:37
1. Is every kind of spellcaster in warhammer is concidered a wizard?Usually, but Tomb Kings and Tomb Princes are not wizards, and lots of characters can have bound spells without being wizards. The casket won't work on them. It only steals spells that a wizard knows in the standard sense of that phrase.


2. Could you thus steal spells from undead casters and casters with variant lores? (i.e. tomb kings, vampire counts, high elves. "Incantation of Summoning", "Invocation of Nehek", "Drain Magic" respectively)Yup!


3. Does this item remove the spell from the caster completely and then remove it from the game so he/she doesn't get it back?Once the casket has stolen the spell, the caster cannot cast that spell again in the same game.


4. If it removes the spell does it take it remove all caster's abilities to cast that particular spell?No, it just takes it from the one caster.

TAW
08-09-2009, 05:51
So I read the Tomb Kingts book and found that their incantations cannot be stolen in any way. Just so it's clear for other people who see this thread.

T10
08-09-2009, 06:00
No, it just takes it from the one caster.

Agreed. While the rules for the casket does not explicitly state this (:rolleyes:), the spell that is stolen is selected from those of one single wizard within range. The scope of the effect should be seen in this context.

-T10

Nurgling Chieftain
08-09-2009, 06:33
So I read the Tomb Kingts book and found that their incantations cannot be stolen in any way. Just so it's clear for other people who see this thread.Tomb Kings and Princes "My Will Be Done" power does not make them wizards and cannot be stolen. Liche Priests, however, are wizards and their incantations can potentially be destroyed or stolen, as far as I can tell. I'm guessing you saw the line where the dice they use for casting cannot be stolen (as they are not power dice).

TAW
08-09-2009, 06:45
Page 34 is based on the lich priest and high lich priest casting incantations. 1 for priest 2 for high priest. Each priest casting using 2d6 power, and high lich priest using 3d6 power. And just under that it states they cannot be stolen. Or is that sole based on the dice not the spells?

And if so does that take an incantation and remove it from that priest's list?

Nurgling Chieftain
08-09-2009, 06:50
Note that these are not Power dice, and can neither be negated by enemy items, nor stolen or anything similar.I feel 100% confident that this sentence is referring entirely to the dice being rolled, rather than the incantation being cast by them. Making the incantation impossible to negate would be amusing and all...

Yes, that priest would then lose that incantation and be unable to cast it for the rest of the battle. See the last couple sentences under that section.

TAW
08-09-2009, 06:59
It's just kinda iffy cause it states that the priest "always know all four incantations" which could be viewed as can't "lose" them, but I could steal one and cast it if i'd like. But then the priest instantly regains the spell into his/her mind.

The Red Scourge
08-09-2009, 07:08
Not much idea in rolling them, if they can't be negated in the first place ;)

Nurgling Chieftain
08-09-2009, 07:18
..."always know all four incantations" which could be viewed as can't "lose" them...It specifically states that they can lose them; see the last sentence under "Using Nehekharan Incantations" on page 34.

havoc626
08-09-2009, 07:59
TK/VC spells can be stolen/destroyed, but remember that the summoning spells only work on undead, so for most armies it won't be very useful to take those spells.

Erethor
08-09-2009, 08:10
TK/VC spells can be stolen/destroyed, but remember that the summoning spells only work on undead, so for most armies it won't be very useful to take those spells.

Empire FAQ says that you can use undead summoning spells and the unit is under your control, but you have to test for crumbling.

TAW
08-09-2009, 08:35
Ok so you can say, summon a unit of zombies and test for crumbling. But you can't bring d6 units back unless they're "undead"?

Axis
08-09-2009, 08:39
1. Is every kind of spellcaster in warhammer is concidered a wizard?

I may be wrong but i think orc shaman's are shamans not wizard. I get this interpretation from the OnG FAQ where they state Azhag is a wizard not a shaman. But, in any case, they would be affected by the casket.

Atrahasis
08-09-2009, 08:39
D6 models, yes.

@Axis - "Shaman" is just the special name for O&G wizards.

Axis
08-09-2009, 10:17
D6 models, yes.

@Axis - "Shaman" is just the special name for O&G wizards.

There is a slight distinction since shamans use a different miscast table. Azhag uses the normal one since he is a wizard. In anycase, as i said in my original post, they will be affected by the casket.

Atrahasis
08-09-2009, 10:29
Shamans are wizards too.

The distinction is in the lore they use, and not in the fact that one is a wizard and the other is not.

Onisuzume
08-09-2009, 12:14
Not too sure about the TKs, but anything that use a "lore of magic" can afaik be stolen. Meaning that the prayers that warrior priests have cannot be stolen since they're more like bound spells rather than a lore of magic.

Or to keep it even more simple - anything with a wizard level is a wizard, the rest isn't.

gdsora
08-09-2009, 13:50
Tomb Kings and Princes have My will be done (lets them cast 2 different incantations)

They do not have the wizard rule.

High Liche Priests and Liche Priests are wizards, and can cast all 4 incantations.

Note, other then how the incantations are cast (power level dice, not power dice)

They count as spells for all other purposes.

Yes the Casket of Sorcery can steal Incantations

Interesting note though...The casket can steal incantations from WIZARDS...yet the empire faq, says it can steal from a Tomb king/prince...

Even though they are not wizards...

backwards ruling?

TAW
09-09-2009, 04:35
where's the FAQ that states it can steal from kings and princes?

Nurgling Chieftain
09-09-2009, 05:06
http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m470835_Tomb_Kings_FAQ_2008-02_Edition.pdf

Generally speaking, go to the games workshop website, and look for FAQ's and Errata at the last option under the GAMING tab. From there you can navigate to the current FAQ's.

gdsora
09-09-2009, 05:08
where's the FAQ that states it can steal from kings and princes?

Empire Faq
Last Page
Bottom of the page
Q: Can Casket of Sorcery Steal Incantations, If yes at what power level

A: Yes, 2d6 for Priests, 3d6 for LHP, D6 for king/princes

DD:
oh the insanity (Not wizards! TK/TP should not be effected!)


awww I was beaten to it