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View Full Version : How good are IG Chimeras these days...



e2055261
11-09-2009, 12:45
Just recently used my new chimera. Can't see myself not taking these things in future battles. Killed several orks and survived the battle after suffering a couple of penetrating hits. Lost the game but should have won - I owed my opponent a win anyway...

What's the thought out there. Chimeras: really good or a load of old cack.

Aries_37
11-09-2009, 12:49
Best transport in the game imo

Could cost 20% more and they'd still be no-brainers

freddieyu
11-09-2009, 12:50
for their points cost, they do very well especially if taken in multiples....if part of an assault group, heavy flamers work very well when things get up close and personal, and the best thing is that 5 infantrymen can use the fire point without the vehicle being considered open topped, a far cry from the old rules....

I love them, and run anywhere from 4-6 chimeras, depending on the game size....

e2055261
11-09-2009, 12:54
It worked really well for my commander. I took the standard multi-laser turret and heavy bolter in the hull but also added a heavy stubber. This config suits me best. How do you get on with the heavy flamers?

freddieyu
11-09-2009, 12:59
For the company command I use MLasers and HB as they will sit back..but 4 of my chimeras run HF, and up close when things get tight they are really useful...

From my experience it is rare more than 3 chimeras get wrecked/destroyed...if you learn to "layer" their deployment that no more than 2 chimeras have no cover (if you use smoke and terrain smartly, you can have all of them in cover!) then it is really difficult to kill them quickly, unless by some luck a mass assault by certain units (jetbike seer councils, ork nobz bikers) catches several of them in 1 swoop....in this case it is better to be dispersed to avoid this....and if there are surviving chimeras with HF they (and their passengers) will ensure some payback during your next turn...

Bunnahabhain
11-09-2009, 13:09
They're good.

They're still just standard speed tanks, with very thin armour on most sides, and only one hatch at the back, but this doesn't really matter as:

They are also now a sane price, unlike the previous codex, can have a squad fire effectively from the back, and the fact you can't assault from one doesn't matter, as no Guard unit you could wish to assault* with fits in one to begin with.

You can run enough to provide cover for each other, and to saturate the enemy AT capacity

* Rough riders and large combined squads.

e2055261
11-09-2009, 13:23
They're good.

They're still just standard speed tanks, with very thin armour on most sides, and only one hatch at the back, but this doesn't really matter as:

They are also now a sane price, unlike the previous codex, can have a squad fire effectively from the back, and the fact you can't assault from one doesn't matter, as no Guard unit you could wish to assault* with fits in one to begin with.

You can run enough to provide cover for each other, and to saturate the enemy AT capacity

* Rough riders and large combined squads.

You really love rough riders eh? Forgot Ogryns.

How many chimeras would you take in 1500 point game?

Bunnahabhain
11-09-2009, 13:45
You really love rough riders eh? Forgot Ogryns.

How many chimeras would you take in 1500 point game?

Depends on the army. Either 0, or 4+. If I have armour in LOS of the enemy, I have lots of armour in LOS of the enemy, with as much of it as possible being AV14, so the lighter tanks have cover.

I didn't forget about Ogryns, I just refuse to have the filthy abhumans in my army, certainly refuse to pay that much for the models, and when I've proxied them, have been distinctly underwhelmed by their performance. Therefore I ignored them.

command squads can theoretically be used to charge with, but they're better off just issuing orders, and countering assaults with 4 very cheap flamers, than wading into combat, and dying very fast...

Captain Micha
11-09-2009, 13:48
Cheap cheap cheap.

I think they could still use a side armor boost but you can have so damn many of them now that they are good. If you take a chimera, take at least two more.

Vaktathi
11-09-2009, 13:50
Just recently used my new chimera. Can't see myself not taking these things in future battles. Killed several orks and survived the battle after suffering a couple of penetrating hits. Lost the game but should have won - I owed my opponent a win anyway...

What's the thought out there. Chimeras: really good or a load of old cack.

Previously, pretty pants.

In the new codex, solid awesome.

55pts nets you two heavy weapons, one can be a scary template weapon. In addition they come with smoke launchers and a searchlight now, making them 36pts cheaper than they were previously with the same kit.

You can fire up to 5 models from within the chimera without ever having to expose your infantry to enemy fire, so this means you can fire all the stuff that matters from inside the tank, and you only really lose out on a couple lasgun shots.

In a platoon you can get 4 Chimeras and 35 equipped infantry for 450pts, that's more than most armies can get in twice that many points. Being able to field so many AV12 anti-infantry shooty platforms can really simply crash an opponents ability to deal with an IG army as they simply won't have enough anti-tank, and their anti-infantry weapon are largely wasted until they drag your guys out of the Chimeras, while all your infantry still get to fire at almost full effect from within the tanks.


I don't play without them. although I didn't under the old codex when they were crap either.

Honestly, I think after the wave serpent, the Chimera is the best transport in the game.

primarch16
11-09-2009, 13:57
Cheap, good fire power and lots of capacity. But the kicker is that you can have 5 guys in the top hatch shooting. Stick Vets squad in there and you have a brutal gun platform. I would take them in bulk however.

Captain Micha
11-09-2009, 13:57
Vaktathi: total agreement. It is second to the Serpent only. (Still a distant second mind... but damn it's useful)

I used to NEVER use Chimeras, because just how crap they were in the old book. Now? If I take them I take 3 or more. Most of the time I still don't use them. But when I do they are very satisfying and very devastating.

Col_Festus
11-09-2009, 13:58
I loveeee the Chimera. You can build it anyway you want to compliment the squad inside. They also give the guard a very serious edge in competition. Also the new Jaws of The Wolf power in the new SW codex was kind of the nail in the coffin for infantry humping it for me.

e2055261
11-09-2009, 14:02
In the game I played I also had two LRBTs, a hellhound and three sentinals. To be honest i think i've really perfected my list and including another chimera might be a squeeze. Could drop a couple of things to include one more chimera.

Really flogged him in terms of kills but he held the objective with the ten ork boyz he had left. Had theere been another turn I would have wiped them. As it was he rolled a 2 for the random game length after turn 5... drag.

laudarkul
11-09-2009, 14:02
I never used Chimera until the new codex... Since then I start using one for my HQ Command squad, which give me some firepower and protection to my officer. Using for my HQ veterans an AC and some PG/GL it becomes and it's just amazing as a fire support/bunker.
So I want at least 2 more Chimera in 2 000 list, all I have to do is to find some spare money :D...

SPYDER68
11-09-2009, 14:08
Id also say its probly the best transport it the game now for its cost..

wall of 5-6 chimera's.. setting along with 2-3 leman russes... its very very nice.

laudarkul
11-09-2009, 14:10
Nice for me (if I will be able to field that impressive number of Chimera's). But for the guys from the gameclub it would sound like :cheese:...

40k Boy
11-09-2009, 14:14
I think the are the best transport in the game. I run mine at 65pts, and for that i get Multilaser, Heavy Bolter and Heavy Stubber, and now they get free Searchlights and Smoke Launchers. I use them to transport my vets (I currently run 3), but they are also awesome mobile fire support platforms once the men have disembarked. Like many have said, one of these things with five guys firing out the top hatch is just shocking to see in action. Though i don't use the configuration myself, can you imagine a Chimera as above with a vet squad in, who are also firing their three Plasma Guns, Lascannon and Sergeant's Plasma pistol! Fair enough, you couldn't move, but that is certainly something you'll keep away from.

The only downside is that you need to take a fair few, and 20 for a 55pts base unit can seem a bit much.

e2055261
11-09-2009, 14:14
Don't mention the cheese. Though th ethought had crossed my mind. Maybe in the next ed they'll be rending...etc

On a side note what's the name of that soviet tank i think chimeras are based on? Anyone know?

Bunnahabhain
11-09-2009, 14:52
BMP

Needs more characters.....And no, there isn't a 1:48 model of one to be found anywhere. I've looked

Captain Micha
11-09-2009, 14:53
Just use a Bradely.. or that Israeli APC

laudarkul
11-09-2009, 14:54
I would say BMP-1/2...

mortiferum
11-09-2009, 14:56
Is extra armour worth the points?

Fallen DA
11-09-2009, 15:03
I have 11 of them. Various versions. Need more be said...

Keichi246
11-09-2009, 17:07
Running seven in my IG army now.

Now, EVERY infantryman has a ride in my IG army.

Not much more needs to be said than has already been said by others. Chimeras rock.

jsullivanlaw
11-09-2009, 18:34
Mech guard is overrated. All you do is explode the chimera and the guys inside mostly die in the explosion. A nasty high str assault unit can do this no problem even if hitting on 6's. The survivors usually run off the table.

RCgothic
11-09-2009, 18:53
20 for a 55pts base unit can seem a bit much.

Not as bad as 18 for a 35pt unit! At least with rhinos you don't have the opportunity to take 13 of them in 1500pts.

Titans actually get more points per than these transports do.

Extra armour = 27% extra cost to negate a damage result that comes up one in every 6. At 10pts for extra armour I still wouldn't take it.

Lord Cook
11-09-2009, 19:04
Chimeras are good value, particularly in large numbers.


Is extra armour worth the points?

Not in my opinion. When the tank only costs 55 points to start with, adding another 15 points just for extra armour is a massive increase in cost. Over five Chimeras that's enough points for an entire Griffon. And even extra armour itself is just less useful for Guard, given that we tend to use vehicles for speed to maneuver, rather than simply hurling our assault troops closer to the enemy as quickly as possible, where you really can't afford a stunned result.

Vaktathi
11-09-2009, 23:24
Mech guard is overrated. All you do is explode the chimera and the guys inside mostly die in the explosion. A nasty high str assault unit can do this no problem even if hitting on 6's. The survivors usually run off the table.

Sure, but exploding it is easier said than done, and even if you do, that's, what, 120pts if it's an infantry squad for both units? Who cares? I've got 8 more where that came from and will now shoot the crap out of that assault unit with all the other chimeras and the infantry inside them.

There's also plenty of ways of mitigating that, simple movement for one.

IG stuff will always die very easily to anything that assaults them, practically no matter what it is. That's why we have multiples of everything and very few range restrictions.

Also, if you are focusing that much on the chimeras, my Leman Russ tanks and Vendettas are free to operate as they will.

It's all about target overload. If I'm packing 9 chimeras, 3 LRBTs, 3 Vendettas, and 76 infantry in a 2000pt game, I guarantee you won't find mech IG overrated.

Bunnahabhain
12-09-2009, 00:15
Sure, but exploding it is easier said than done, and even if you do, that's, what, 120pts if it's an infantry squad for both units? Who cares? I've got 8 more where that came from and will now shoot the crap out of that assault unit with all the other chimeras and the infantry inside them.



Seconded.

Guard players get this, and Ork players get it, but too many others don't.

Casualties are to be expected, and don't really matter; We have lots of bodies. If you forget this, and don't kill stuff fast enough, you have big problems,

DaSpaceAsians
12-09-2009, 01:52
I actually run my only Chimera as a taxi for my CCS with Creed/Kell but I am planning to mechanised at least one full platoon. My current load-out is autocannon/hvy flamer/hvy stubber

Imperius
12-09-2009, 02:24
Whenever I'm bored of my footslogging horde army, I take the Veterans in Chimeras.

In my opinion, AV 12 is the perfect number for a transport, you wont get slaughtered by anything and everything, like Rhinos, and you still get the cheap transportation costs.

freddieyu
12-09-2009, 03:34
Mech guard is overrated. All you do is explode the chimera and the guys inside mostly die in the explosion. A nasty high str assault unit can do this no problem even if hitting on 6's. The survivors usually run off the table.

1 question...how many times have you fought mech guard, and and what point level?

Badger[Fr]
12-09-2009, 09:31
Mech IG is obviously strong, but still not on par with the worst Eldar or Ork army list by far, and a Seer Council or a Nob Biker unit can make a short work of such an army. Mechanized armies best asset is their resilience: no matter how much firepower you have, you will hardly be able to table them. Though, it's still a very defensive army, perhaps even more than the usual IG gunline.

Lamoron
12-09-2009, 11:55
;3944094'](...) Though, it's still a very defensive army, perhaps even more than the usual IG gunline. Mech IG can be played very agressively. I usually meet my opponents head on. Sure I can't scratch them in melee, but I can pull the punch from any assault, by blocking lines of movement, exploding transports, or goading assault units away from my artillery/battletanks.

Vendettas (yes I use three in 1850+, they've never let me down so far) hit a flank hard, spearheading a few Chimeras in a pincer maneuver and unloading troops if I can find the points to fill them. When you meet the enemy head on, you can pull back an maneuver, if you stay back you have nowhere to run when the enemy hits you...

If by defensive you meen the utter lack of melee units, then you're right :angel:

broxus
12-09-2009, 12:32
Do you guys think paying 10pts for the heavy stubber is worth it on a Chimera? I have found it to be a pretty good upgrade. I can move and still fire two weapons and if I sit still I can fire 9 shots STR4 or higher. It increases the cost but is the firepower worth it in your opinions?

RCgothic
12-09-2009, 12:47
As my hull weapon is generally a Heavy Flamer, I find the Stubber adds welcome firepower to that of the Multilaser.

shabbadoo
12-09-2009, 13:07
Chimeras rock, don't take the extra armor, and do take the heavy stubber. That is all they need to be extremely effective. How somebody can't carve up a Biker Nobz force with mech guard eludes me. ???

Lord-Gen Bale Chambers
12-09-2009, 14:26
I run 3 chimeras (2 vet squads and psyker battle squad) and 2 LRBTs in my 1500 pt list.

I have a platoon with missle launchers and lascannon heavy weapon squad to provide most of the anti-tank.

With 5 tanks and 72 infantry models in 1500 points, it's a well-balanced force that can be a counter assaulting gun-line or a force that can take the fight to the enemy with lots of guns supporting the advancing chimeras.

With the new codex, I have never been disappointed with my chimeras. With the old one, if I lost 1 early in the game, it was tough due to the cost. Now, it still hurts, but isn't as big of a deal.

Bunnahabhain
12-09-2009, 15:20
. How somebody can't carve up a Biker Nobz force with mech guard eludes me. ???

This little thing called a scatter dice, if it hates you enough....
The best ways to get those nob biker killing S8+ hits in quantity is still the ordnance. Weight of fire alone doesn't cut it with their saves, FNP, unless the ork player is an idiot, and doesn't have a couple of other units you can't ignore, ie the standard 30 boys and klaw mobs...

Turn 1.
Right, 3 russ pie plates coming in... Rolls scatter.. Have we got any spare craters? 3 battle cannon round hitting the same patch of empty ground should leave a hole.

The manticore will do something though.... Scatter 11" and rolls ..1 blast. Great. At least I've clipped that mob...Yes, that one covered by the KFF.

Turn 2. Bikers assualt.

the1stpip
12-09-2009, 15:20
I wouldn't say the best transport (for the same price, I can have a Raider), but they are a must in any decent IG army.

5th ed is about movement, especially in any non-annihilate game, so most armies require transports or something similar.

Lord Cook
12-09-2009, 20:34
How somebody can't carve up a Biker Nobz force with mech guard eludes me. ???

:wtf: I have personally fired an entire 1,500 points of mechanized Guard, loaded up with plasma and melta Veterans, into a single large unit of Biker Nobs, at rapid fire range. Supported with heavy artillery and plasma cannons. I killed about half, and left the rest wounded. They assault, I die. End of game. Even after killing all the Nobs (as I did) you still get charged by three+ mobs of Truck Boyz bringing up the rear.

When every model has different equipment, combined with FNP, I'm afraid it's just broken. There are only two units in the entire game that I would ever accuse of being broken, and Biker Nobs are one of them.

Lamoron
12-09-2009, 22:42
One Nob biker squad can be blocked, shot, handled... when they bring two I begin crying :cries:

If you know you face them, bring an WH Inquisitor with Divine Pronouncement and some psyker squads in chimeras... that will keep one away at least, and if you manage to force a pinning/morale on the other it's gone as well. I don't like building lists specificly against opponents, but dual nob bikers deserve it badly.

Otherwise you need to spread out, like really spread out... keep artillery/battletanks in each corner, and focus on taking down one squad of them. Even on bikes it's a bit of a trip across the board. Bikes can't change level in ruins... climb damnit, CLIMB! Sure they still have Dakkaguns, but it's infinitly better than being charged.

Sometimes, as Lord Cook said, there's just no winning against them... They're not so bad in objective missions, but in KP *shudder*...

Vaktathi
13-09-2009, 12:30
Speaking of Chimera amazingness...

I was playing a game against Wraithlord/Wraithguard heavy Eldar today, with an Avatar forming the core of the army. As the battlecannons and Vendetttas took their toll on the Wraith units and the autocannons, multilasers and heavy flamers took down everything else, the Avatar strode through basically ignoring everything thrown it's way...until it got to my HQ command squads Chimera.

I was left with the option to either sprint it backwards 12" and try and shoot the Avatar down with the rest of the army...or go for gold, and Tank Shock it (being Fearless of course, my goal was clear here...:angel:).

Well, the Avatar did the predictable thing and chose to Death or Glory the Chimera, and promptly rolled a 3 on 2d6 for armor penetration, failing to defeat the armor with it's S6, and was subsequently crushed, ground, ripped and torn beneath the mighty Chimera's treads. :p

freddieyu
13-09-2009, 13:33
:wtf: I have personally fired an entire 1,500 points of mechanized Guard, loaded up with plasma and melta Veterans, into a single large unit of Biker Nobs, at rapid fire range. Supported with heavy artillery and plasma cannons. I killed about half, and left the rest wounded. They assault, I die. End of game. Even after killing all the Nobs (as I did) you still get charged by three+ mobs of Truck Boyz bringing up the rear.

When every model has different equipment, combined with FNP, I'm afraid it's just broken. There are only two units in the entire game that I would ever accuse of being broken, and Biker Nobs are one of them.

In this case I believe a mixed horde/mech list can do better, since you can have sacrificial units in the form of IG squads, and also a sponge unit in the form of a large blob squad with a commissar...in a mech vet list the veterans are too few in number to be sacrificed this way....

Badger[Fr]
13-09-2009, 13:55
:wtf: I have personally fired an entire 1,500 points of mechanized Guard, loaded up with plasma and melta Veterans, into a single large unit of Biker Nobs, at rapid fire range. Supported with heavy artillery and plasma cannons. I killed about half, and left the rest wounded. They assault, I die. End of game. Even after killing all the Nobs (as I did) you still get charged by three+ mobs of Truck Boyz bringing up the rear.

When every model has different equipment, combined with FNP, I'm afraid it's just broken. There are only two units in the entire game that I would ever accuse of being broken, and Biker Nobs are one of them.
Seer Councils are the bane of Mech Guard: it takes 9 wounds to kill a single Warlock (thanks to the re-rollable 3+ Cover save); morevoer, each model has a S9 weapon and, more often than not, a heavy flamer.

At least, Nob Bikers are helpless against Psyker Battle squads. If you manage to score enough wounds to force a moral test, wiping them in close combat should be a formality (RR are usually fast enough to reach the Orks and break the squad).