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Warsurge
12-09-2009, 04:15
So a few weeks back I went against a IG player. We started off by setting up our forces for a 750 point game. I usually take peoples word that they have the maximum points or just a bit over, but I never checked. He had 2 Leman Russ, 40 or so Guardsmen with grenade launchers and such, 3 mortar teams, and a command squad. I on the other hand had 30 Blood Claws and 1 Rune Priest, which never amounted to 750 points. It wasn't that it was an unequal game in terms of points that set me off but he was going from one squad to another shooting and then saying that he never fired from the first squad. He would also stop midway through shooting phase and talk to people and then we would debate what he fired and what he didn't. All in all I lost but not in a bad temper I congratulated him, shook hands, and we parted. To you do you think this would be called a fair game or even a game at that?

It was my first Wahammer 40k battle and I just wanted to know if I was being taken advantage of because of my noobness.

Thanks for reading,
Warsurge

sabreu
12-09-2009, 04:18
sounds like it dude!

Imperius
12-09-2009, 04:20
Its one of the perils of playing I.G, your opponent in this case only had to manage 40 guardsmen, so its almost inexcusable to lose track of what and hwo you used them. He was just slightly non sportslike (even though we all know WH40K is not a sport.)

I on the other hand have to deal with 160 or so Guardsmen, and frequently forget what I did with them.

____

Its all to your discretion wheher or not your opponent is pushing his limits.

jason_sation
12-09-2009, 04:31
Haha, I always forget who did what with my Guardsmen. I literally have to base my shooting phase by going from left to right across the board or I'll never remember.

SPYDER68
12-09-2009, 04:34
If it starts it be an issue.. have him mark each squad as he shoots that shooting phase..

Thats what i do with my guard army just incase.

ntin
12-09-2009, 04:39
Seems kind of fishy that was a 750 point army, without upgrades the compulsory army is 310 points (1 HQ, 2 troops). Two basic Leman Russ (without sponsons) are 300 points for the pair. 3 mortar squads are 60 points. Every 3 grenade launchers is another 50 points. That is about 720 points right there.

It is questionable though that he cannot manage less than ten units, if you play him again should suggest he place a token next to a unit after it fires.

Reflex
12-09-2009, 05:00
think you got screwed. dont worry about it to much. as you learn more and more you will be able to pick these things up and if your opponent really is as bad as you say just pull the old rules lawyer stuff out on him and it might force him to stop being such a dill.

Warsurge
12-09-2009, 05:19
Yeah. I mean as far as I could tell or remember he was all over the place. I don't know what the definition of a bad player is really. I mean I can tell if the point ratio is off and a couple of other minor things but since I am rather new I havent faced most of the things you guys have.

Ravenous
12-09-2009, 05:22
play 1500 or higher thats when the real game starts.

Logarithm Udgaur
12-09-2009, 07:48
Seems kind of fishy that was a 750 point army, without upgrades the compulsory army is 310 points (1 HQ, 2 troops). Two basic Leman Russ (without sponsons) are 300 points for the pair. 3 mortar squads are 60 points. Every 3 grenade launchers is another 50 points. That is about 720 points right there.

It is questionable though that he cannot manage less than ten units, if you play him again should suggest he place a token next to a unit after it fires.

GL are only 50 points if you take (the frankly stupid) Special Weapons Squads, rolled into the Infantry Squads they are 5 points each, so 20 points for one in each squad.
It is unclear as to whether the opponent cheated or not, I was not there and I am certainly not going to take the whine on the net side of it.

Tedurur
12-09-2009, 10:27
play 1500 or higher thats when the real game starts.

Most useless comment ever? Has nothing to do with the OPs question and seeing as how he is a new player he might have difficulties to field a 1500pts army

Lamoron
12-09-2009, 11:32
It's possible to squeeze his army into 750 points though...

Command Squad
Platoon
Infantry Squad
Infantry Squad
Mortar
Mortar
Mortar
Veteran Squad
Leman Russ
Leman Russ

Comes out to 730 points, which leaves 20 points for four grenadelaunchers... Thre three mortar teams... do you mean one team of three, or three teams of three?

I do however belong to the group of people who think you were "had". One solution to the issue of remembering who did what, is marking the squads with the fancy green plastic markers GW sells. They're not pretty, but they're very effective.

grissom2006
12-09-2009, 11:40
I say you was had if your going to play a game the person should concentrate on the game instead of playing lost and distracted tactics with his friends.

His list may or may not of been legal depending on how he worked out his troops and if his tanks had sponsons or not.

Kahadras
12-09-2009, 12:23
Sounds like a typicaly poor player IMHO. Two Russ in a 750 point game, an inability to remember which squads have fired or not points towards someone you probably don't want to bother playing again or at least be a lot more careful of.

Kahadras

LonelyPath
12-09-2009, 13:15
If he can't remember what squads he's fired in a game of that sizee I'd dread to think what he'd be like in larger scale games, watch him play against others and see what happened when he's up against more experienced opponents. If he does the same thing I'd choose to avoid playing him until he starts using counters to mark off what has and has not fired. He's also likely a person who when moving will go back and move a squad a second time claiming he's not moved them already.

Another suggestion is to ask him to work from one end of the table to the other, that way he knows he's moved/fired a certain unit since he's moved passed it ;)

sigur
12-09-2009, 13:45
Most useless comment ever?

No. 750pts games rarely work. He should play games of 1000pts at least.

But the opponent sounds like a bit of a bad opponent or at least an easily distracted one.

Captain Micha
12-09-2009, 14:48
You've probably been had.

You'd have to be a total idiot to not be able to keep track of 40 models.

He was also probably over on his points.

the1stpip
12-09-2009, 15:23
I always stick a dice next to any unit I have fired, mainly so I know what units I haven't fired, and I am not going to forget to fire something.

I don't know about being screwed over, but it was rude (and asking for trouble) if he starts talking to someone else half way through a phase.

e2055261
12-09-2009, 15:37
Don't let it get to you. Happens all the time. I bet his army was completely unpainted and he treated his models heavy handedly? Pity it was your first game though. Try and play more experienced players who you think will be fun to play with or you just think are nice people - usually a good indicator.

Ravenous
12-09-2009, 15:40
Most useless comment ever? Has nothing to do with the OPs question and seeing as how he is a new player he might have difficulties to field a 1500pts army

Of all time? In the history of man? Awesome! :D

Alright alright I'll expand on my point, the game is not balanced for less then 1500pts so do anything less is generally asking for trouble.

However that said the guard player was cheating and suffered from "wandering gamer" which is something I cant stand. I frequently go up against texters and its gotten to the point for me where I actually have to ask them to put the phone down and play the game.

Really the only way to solve issues like this is know your enemy, if you dont your pretty much asking for it. Or a excellent quote from the art of war:

"If you know heaven and you know earth, you will make your victory.

If you know the enemy and you know yourself, you need not fear the results of a hundred battles.

If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer defeat.

If you know neither the enemy or yourself you will succumb in every battle"

Warsurge
13-09-2009, 00:09
Comes out to 730 points, which leaves 20 points for four grenadelaunchers... Thre three mortar teams... do you mean one team of three, or three teams of three?

He had one team of three mortars. There was also another thing I forgot to tell in my original post. When I had killed most of his guardsmen except for maybe one or two, my turn ended. Now in my turn I was in close combat with the guardsmen, so naturally he would have to attack me back in close combat. Well it is his turn now and he starts to try and tell me that I should have killed all his guys. He takes the one or so men off the table and then says that he wants to fire at me with his two Leman Russ, thus ending the game.

Thanks all for the help.

susu.exp
13-09-2009, 00:42
That one if frankly amazing. You can not voluntarily let your own models bite the dust and there are few better things than having an opponents unit just hanging in there after you assaulted 8the only better thing: being in combat with a non walker vehicle that is immobilized. Your opponent canīt shoot at your units, canīt shoot from the vehicle which also gets attacked in his own assault phase.