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Eternus
18-09-2009, 11:59
Ok, this may just be me being too impatient to wait till I get home and lay claws on the BRB, but at what point after a charge is declared are psychology tests taken, like Fear and Terror tests? I believe stand and shoot is done at the range the chargers started at before they move into combat, right?

The reason I ask is because I'll be using the Doom Totem in an upcoming game, which reduces by 1 the Ld of any enemy unit that has LOS to the standard, and I think this means that a unit in CC with a unit not carrying this standard will not count the modifier to Ld because their LOS is blocked by their opponents & if the unit carrying the Totem gets into CC, then it will only affect the unit they are fighting, again because of blocked LOS. If an enemy unit is charged and can see the banner when the charge is declared and they have to test for fear or terror, then they would count the modifier, because the test for Fear or Terror is taken before the chargers move and block the LOS - right?

dude.sweet101@yahoo.co.uk
18-09-2009, 12:46
As soon as the declared charge is measured to be in range

EvC
18-09-2009, 12:48
Yessir, that is right!

Eternus
18-09-2009, 13:02
As soon as the declared charge is measured to be in range


Yessir, that is right!

My thanks.

Atrahasis
18-09-2009, 13:24
Note that that point is BEFORE resolving stand and shoot, or moving on to compulsory movement.

If the charger causes fear/terror in their opponent, then an extra "check range" subphase is added just after charge reactions are declared, as failed tests can change the charge reaction.

BRB FAQ part1 for more info.

Eternus
18-09-2009, 16:10
Note that that point is BEFORE resolving stand and shoot, or moving on to compulsory movement.

If the charger causes fear/terror in their opponent, then an extra "check range" subphase is added just after charge reactions are declared, as failed tests can change the charge reaction.

BRB FAQ part1 for more info.

So it's:

Declare Charge > Delcare Reactions > Take Psychology Tests > Enact Reactions if Stand & Shoot or Flee, Unless Failed Psy-test Prevents > Measure Charge > Move Chargers

Right?

stripsteak
18-09-2009, 16:21
I believe stand and shoot is done at the range the chargers started at before they move into combat, right?

S&S is done when the charger makes it into range of every firing model in the unit. generally this will be before they move since most charge ranges are shorter than weapon ranges. but there are some 'tricks' you can do to change this. for example a unit of dwarf thunderers champion can take pistols instead of his handgun. if that unit is charged they wait until the charger is in pistol range, this allows them to make sure the handgunners are all firing at short range.

narrativium
18-09-2009, 20:42
Don't forget the Compulsory Moves phase (after Reactions are declared, before Stand & Shoot... not sure whether before or after Psychology).

I've played one game in which this was vital - an Ogre general with Mastadon Armour charged and was killed by stand and shoot, and stood up again at the end of the phase - but a nearby unit had to use his Leadership to rally before he was killed. We checked; rallying happens before stand and shoot. Worth knowing.

WLBjork
19-09-2009, 09:32
So it's:

Declare Charge > Delcare Reactions > Take Psychology Tests > Enact Reactions if Stand & Shoot or Flee, Unless Failed Psy-test Prevents > Measure Charge > Move Chargers

Right?

I've always played:

Declare Charge>Declare Reaction>Measure Charge Range(only if Chargers cause Fear/Terror)>Psychology Test (if in charge range)>Alter Reaction (if appropriate)>Enact Reaction>Measure Charge Range>Move Chargers.

This is because Fear/Terror tests are only taken once the unit is determined to be in range and can, in some circumstances, override the normal reaction.


Yet on the current read it seems that the method could be:

Declare Charge>Declare Reaction>Enact Reaction>Measure Charge Range>Psychology Test>Alter Reaction>Enact New Reaction>Move Chargers.

That's probably due to GWs inability to put all appropriate parts together, and instead scatter them throughout the BRB.


Trouble is both make sense - the first flows better as only one reaction happens (and I think is slightly more supported by RAW), whereas the second makes sense as the missile troops shoot down some of the enemy only to realise that they're still too scary for words!

AS I said though, I think the first is correct and that's how we'll continue playing.