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zeekill
21-09-2009, 22:25
So Lizardmen have many special characters, but I quite rarely see anyone discuss them, so I decided to start a thread based solely upon discussing tactics to use with these special characters and just doing an overall rundown of their special rules and stats.

Lords
Lord Kroak
Lord Mazdamundi
Kroq Gar
Tehenhauin

Heroes
Chakax
Gor-Rok
Tetto'Eko
Tiktaq'to
Oxyotl
_____________________________________

Now the biggest problem I see with tacticas these days is them being unorganized, so I am requesting that at least for your opening comments you put your post in this organization, If something is bolded or underlined that means it should be bolded or underlined (it doesn't have to be exactly like this, just give it some kind of organization, I hate it when people rant on and on going back and forth between good and bad):

Name of Character, bolded and underlined
Strengths: (name strengths here)
Weaknesses: (name them here)
(skip a space)
Comments: (comments about how to use him or specifics about strengths/weaknesses, or overall tactics)
Effectiveness: Rate for effectiveness (NOT POINT EFFECTIVENESS, disregard points cost with this) 1/10 to 10/10
Point Effectiveness: How good he is for the points you pay for him, 1/10 to 10/10

Then go to the next character.
_______________________________________________
If you wish to comment (or argue) with someone else, please Quote the entire Character entry and in the quote underline the part you are responding to like so:


Name of Character, bolded and underlined
Strengths: (name strengths here)
Weaknesses: (name them here)
(skip a space)
Comments: (comments about how to use him or specifics about strengths/weaknesses, or overall tactics)
Effectiveness: Rate for effectiveness (NOT POINT EFFECTIVENESS, disregard points cost with this) 1/10 to 10/10
Point Effectiveness: How good he is for the points you pay for him, 1/10 to 10/10


"This tactic is horrible, you clearly don't understand... (ranting on)"
__________________________________________________ ________

This only applies to the first few pages most likely, then everyone can stop doing this and argue and rant all you want! :D

Trigger36
21-09-2009, 22:34
I'd like to hear rundowns of Oxyotl and Gor Rok. They both seem like fun characters but I can't justify using them.

Malorian
21-09-2009, 22:34
I'll comment on the only ones I've used so far...

Lord Kroak
Strengths: Powerful spell that can ruin an entire army
Weaknesses: Very expensive (still)

Comments: When I used him in a large game he was pretty much useless. The nice new ability of his to put his PD into the pool meant that the other slann could use his dice but when it finally came time for him to rip out his big spell it was quickly scrolled. When you can get two slann for the same cost I can't see any reason to take him other than fluff.
Effectiveness: 8/10
Point Effectiveness: 2/10


Chakax
Strengths: Best way to make sure your temple guard are safe
Weaknesses: Rules counter act themselve

Comments: If you've ever had your temple guard fail their rerolled stubborn Ld8 test then this is the guy for you, however I find his best ability to be the one where hidden models such as assassins and fanatics have to reveal themselves as well as forcing back scouts. Unfortunetly the wording of his ability to make other characters strike last while he himselve only has a great weapon means he will only strike first against opponents with an init less than his... and pretty much anything you care about will not. If you are against dark elves, orcs, or skaven he can be great but most of the time his points could be better spent on a regular scarvet.
Effectiveness: 7/10
Point Effectiveness: 5/10

StarFyreXXX
21-09-2009, 22:38
Chakax
Strengths: cool model, strong, goes first, 1 of the most powerful overall heroes in the game, can defeat most heroes, has a ward save that many heroes do not, grants look out sir reroll
Weaknesses doesn't do what he is supposed too (see below), cost expensive (see below), must challenge (there are times when you'd not want to do that), only useful in a temple guard/slann unit and which point, the unit is VERY expensive

Comments: I will rate him from my several times of using him... he isn't good enough. THe issue is, everyone knows how good/powerful he is...due to that, no one who has even 40% of skill, will charge that unit with a hero...every game i've played, i've had ogre tyrant lords, chaos lords, elves on dragons, etc all charging that unit do kill him and do as much damage as possible. The issue I see, is lords have better equipment than he does, yet lords are what he will be facing most of the time. He isn't a good enough bodyguard for that. What he needs, IMHO to make him worth taking and cool, is his weapon needs to act liek a nullstone vs ALL enemy magic items (Not just weapons), that we can he can nullifysome of the stuff that makes lords so tough. For example, archaon, a lord on a dragon, settra, etc would still probably kill him BUT he has a better chance at least if he can get rid of the enemies items that give them better ward saves, etc. The way he is now..he always dies to a lord. I gave up on him since in every game i've used him, once he did 2 wounds to an enemy...every other time..he has done 1 or died without getting past the enemy's ridiculous armour save, or ward save, etc. If he was cheaper and got rid of some of his abilities, he wouldn't be useful at all for what his purpose is....

Effectiveness: As above..5/10. He is good against heroes, and units with no characters, but useless against any semblance of a smart opponent or tougher armies (in terms of their characters) (chaos, demons, vampires, ogres, etc)

Point Effectiveness: I put 5/10 since my view is he needs to be made better...not worse and cheaper... since I don't view many to use him if he is cheaper and has less powers, BUT if he was better, atleast some would use him...

Lord Kroak
Strengths: cool model, great spell and sharing PD and makes unit unbreakable and immune to miscasts (as he should be!)
Weaknesses also kinda expensive....his spell is only useful on armies like elves and smaller armies, and possibly undead (never tried against undead).

Comments: I love the fluff for this character....from his fluff, the most powerful character in the world ever (when he was alive), i kinda preferred his 6E version. It's not that he's bad..the issue is, in games I used him, only against elves did he do much. His spell isn't powerful enough to do tons of damage to most units..elves with T 3, really got hurt by him. Also, never was I able to get the 20+ version of teh spell off AND the retarded thing is, spell destroyer, etc can remove his spell and make him useless....what's the point? Also, some of his more useful items are gone (a banner would make sense for him, and that item that nullified magic weapons would be good)... FInally, he needs +1 PD discipline and a higher cost IMHO... Think of it like this..archaon got 200 pts (almost) cheaper in 7E AND he has become better than before. Kroak got 600 pts cheaper and worse overall, worse. Why not, make him 300 pts cheaper and modify him but still make him "better" so to speak.... AGainst daemons..yeah..in 2 games..he got utterly raped. When people saw I was trying him out..a lord of change came onto teh board..not even Kairos...and the tzeentch guy..especailly after Gleaning his spell..just devastated my lizardmen and then the army was able to totally man handle the lizardmen anyways as the army is smaller due to his pt cost. Also, the opponent had nurgle units, which weren't as bothered due to their ward and regeneration. Maybe against a slaanesh only army, it would be better....

Effectiveness: 5/10. AGainst some armies he's good. against the powerful armies, he won't do much. However, I did use him WITH tetto'eko in a game. THAT ROCKED. They both still got massacred like you can't believe since they can't cut it against vampires or daemons (with good players OR players with harder builds), BUT tetto'eko (see my review of him) needs more PD...so kroak helps him alot.

Point Effectiveness: I put 7/10 since my view is he needs to be made better. His cost is probably ok..but he just doesn't do well against what he is supposed too...

Tetto'eko
Strengths: good fluff..his redeploy rule is so awesome..EVERYONE has to try this guy at least a few times.
Weaknesses can't use his spellsthe way he should be able too...he needs to be a level 3 caster...argument over he can be used in temple guard or not in rank 2...according to the wording, he could....

Comments: I love the fluff for this character....he was better when sharing kroak's dice...he should be a level 3 caster (and no, being a level 3 hero would NOT destroy the game or anything)..raise his cost if needed by 20 pts..but as a level 2, he just doesn't gethis namesake spells (comet) off enough to be useful. That's really it.. he's not bad..but not good enough for what he has. His redeploy is the only reason i consider using him. Especially for players like me who haven't played as much until this year...he can even help overcome an initial deployment error.

Effectiveness: 5/10. I say he is awesome for his redeploy, but just doesn't get good spells off enough with only 3 dice max (even with free dice..hehas 6 spells..he will never get more than 2 off unless you are VERY lucky, and comet I only managed to get off once, when i did not have kroak in the army to power him up)

Point Effectiveness: I put 2/10 since it's hard to justify his cost for a redeploy tactic.

I've also used Gor-Rok, Mazdamundi so will comment on them later...

Regards,

Sanjay

zeekill
21-09-2009, 23:22
Lord Kroak
Strengths: cool model, great spell and sharing PD and makes unit unbreakable and immune to miscasts (as he should be!)
Weaknesses also kinda expensive....his spell is only useful on armies like elves and smaller armies, and possibly undead (never tried against undead).

Comments: I love the fluff for this character....from his fluff, the most powerful character in the world ever (when he was alive), i kinda preferred his 6E version. It's not that he's bad..the issue is, in games I used him, only against elves did he do much. His spell isn't powerful enough to do tons of damage to most units..elves with T 3, really got hurt by him. Also, never was I able to get the 20+ version of teh spell off AND the retarded thing is, spell destroyer, etc can remove his spell and make him useless....what's the point? Also, some of his more useful items are gone (a banner would make sense for him, and that item that nullified magic weapons would be good)... FInally, he needs +1 PD discipline and a higher cost IMHO... Think of it like this..archaon got 200 pts (almost) cheaper in 7E AND he has become better than before. Kroak got 600 pts cheaper and worse overall, worse. Why not, make him 300 pts cheaper and modify him but still make him "better" so to speak.... AGainst daemons..yeah..in 2 games..he got utterly raped. When people saw I was trying him out..a lord of change came onto teh board..not even Kairos...and the tzeentch guy..especailly after Gleaning his spell..just devastated my lizardmen and then the army was able to totally man handle the lizardmen anyways as the army is smaller due to his pt cost. Also, the opponent had nurgle units, which weren't as bothered due to their ward and regeneration. Maybe against a slaanesh only army, it would be better....

Effectiveness: 5/10. AGainst some armies he's good. against the powerful armies, he won't do much. However, I did use him WITH tetto'eko in a game. THAT ROCKED. They both still got massacred like you can't believe since they can't cut it against vampires or daemons (with good players OR players with harder builds), BUT tetto'eko (see my review of him) needs more PD...so kroak helps him alot.

Point Effectiveness: I put 7/10 since my view is he needs to be made better. His cost is probably ok..but he just doesn't do well against what he is supposed too...



His spell means death for any Slannesh or Khorne Daemon army, because they are low T and usually dont have too many Dispel dice you need to get past. Its a killer for undead especially because they are also low T and they cant raise as fast as Lord Kroak can kill. Combine his spell against T3 with the Portent of Far from a Skink Priest, and he Wounds on re-rollable 2's. Meaning an average of 7 models dead in every undead unit, or an average of 5 for Daemons (5+ ward is annoying) The only thing you need to worry about with him is Dispel Scrolls.

zeekill
22-09-2009, 00:46
Comon guys we still need people that have experience with

Mazdamundi
Kroq Gar
Tehenhauin

Gor Rok
Oxyotl
Tiktaq'to

StarFyreXXX
23-09-2009, 02:23
I will post what i found with mazdamundi and gor-rok......but got stuff to do so will post tomorrow :)

Sanjay

N810
23-09-2009, 02:54
I used gor-rok once or twice...
I rather liked him. :D

I'll let Sanjay elaborate...

zeekill
23-09-2009, 03:16
I used gor-rok once or twice...
I rather liked him. :D

I'll let Sanjay elaborate...

Yea I was checking the rules on Gor-Rok the other day and I was quite pleased at how defencive he was, sure its a bit over 200 points but a bit over 200 points nets you the best anti-calvary setup in the game! I would just run him out in the open in front of a stegadon, and when a unit of 5 Dragon Princes charges him thinking "what an idiot, ill run through his character and then hit the stegadon behind," I say: "hey guess what, you lose your lance bonus so you're S3, and you need to reroll successful wounds against my character." So he hits lets say 4/7 times, and then wounds almost definitely no more than once, and then has to reroll that wound, and then I have a 3+ save. Clearly those dragon princes are going to be feeling the wrath of my Stegadon next turn :D

Necromancy Black
23-09-2009, 04:56
Chakax
Strengths: Best way to make sure your temple guard are safe
Weaknesses: Rules counter act themselve

Comments: If you've ever had your temple guard fail their rerolled stubborn Ld8 test then this is the guy for you, however I find his best ability to be the one where hidden models such as assassins and fanatics have to reveal themselves as well as forcing back scouts. Unfortunetly the wording of his ability to make other characters strike last while he himselve only has a great weapon means he will only strike first against opponents with an init less than his... and pretty much anything you care about will not. If you are against dark elves, orcs, or skaven he can be great but most of the time his points could be better spent on a regular scarvet.
Effectiveness: 7/10
Point Effectiveness: 5/10

This was FAQ'd. Chakax goes first.

dwarfhold13
23-09-2009, 06:20
i haven't had a chance to use any one of them, but i really don't think ANY of them on paper look like they are worth it.... MAYBE in specific opponent situations, but i would never take any of them for a tournament army..
with all that said, tetto-eko looks interesting, and i've got the parts to whip up a mazdamundi model, so i'll give that one a go too at one point
Jon

StarFyre
23-09-2009, 13:25
Gor-Rok
Strengths: denies enemy charge rules, immune to KB, very long lasting hero
Weaknesses: not really any overly expressive weaknesses...same as any other 2 wound hero...

Comments: i liked him. he has stood up to charges by ogres, black knights, chaos, black orcs..so far..only the black knights with all their attacks, etc were able to take him and the front rank down from the units that charges teh saurus I had him in...
Effectiveness: overall, I say 7/10...try him..see how you like him...i forget to his his rules sometimes, so make sure you keep the book handy...
Point Effectiveness: 8/10 I think he's good but use him, and see for yourself. i would still prefer an enhanced version of the Lustria campaign UK event Nakai (please explain why we didn't get Nakai? and we got some new name that was never heard of before??)

Mazdamundi
Strengths: is on a stegadon and can kinda fight close combat due to his weapon rule, has a unique spell which is nice since we STILL never got our own lores (and skaven upcoming have 13 new spells apparently??WTF?)
Weaknesses: he has the worst discipline possible from our list of 8, he has a magical banner WITH NO POWERS!!!! give him a damn warbanner instead damnit!, he won't be able to cast enough spells compared to a regular slann with the best discipline, suffers like any large target...fire heavy weapons at him..hope to hit the steg and kill him, since the steg has no ward save, or kill him in a challenge with a better combat lord.

Comments: I was planning a golden demon entry for this, and after seeing the wonderful slayer sword france winner (by Ben Komets), I really wanted to do this..but then I used him some more...and i Just can't like him. It's better to take a separate stegadon/engine with a chief/priest and a slann with 1 discipline (free power dice) and bsb (with no actual banner). Mazdamundi, since he has that unique spell, and an entire lore...can't get off enough spells without the free dice. How is this the best living caster of the slann and arguably one of the best alive casters (since the best, Kroak, is dead and a shadow of his former self)? I prefer his 6E trial rules where he had a full lore but was more expensive. Really? again, liek i said for kroak..archaon got 200 pts cheaper and better. Mazdamundi deserved to be more like his 6e trial rules in WD magazine, but at 700 pts or 750? His ruination isn't as good as it sounds...especially compared to kroak's from 6E (where it's a REAL earthquake..a radius instead of just 1 unit). the most stupid thing i find..is the banner that does nothing... However, there is some good. I beat archaon in a cahllenge with him..it was pure luck. Since mazdamundi went first (his rule)...i rolled a 6 to hit (since that is the only way mazdamundi can hit archaon), and destroyed arch's weapon. Now, arch will no longer ignore mazda's armour saves. arch wasn't able to hurt maz that round...maz outnumbered, etc...and i broke archaon (by pure luck)... however, we then did a bunch of 1 on 1 tests between the 2...itcame out to like 3/15 matches, mazdamundi won...so it CAN be done..but don't bet on it. He needs 5s to hit most enemy lords..and 6s to hit archaon... the ancient stegadon suffers like other ancients..needs 5 or 6s to hit most decent things in combat so won't do much. But it is tough to kill it. Chances are, you will break him before you kill him. Sadly, unlike the 6E trial rules, there is no ward for the steg. I really like the combined profile of the 6E version *sigh* really, stick to a cheaper slann with the +1 PD discipline. Mazdamundi just can't cut it. He *may* get 2 or 3 spells off..if they are lower casting ones..but to use his custom spell with high rate of success, you need to waste alot of dice...

Effectiveness: overall, I say 4/10...try him..see how you like him..his stegadon can do some damage due to impact hits..but a chief on an ancient with the spear magic item is ALOT more useful IMHO...
Point Effectiveness: 3/10 mathematically...he may be worth a slann+stegadon..but overall effectiveness just isn't there vs a slann with the better discipline, and a stegadon or engine (even though together, those may cost more than 620 pts....it's better spent that way). Only use him if you REALLY like the model and you want to use him more in combat, alongside a heavy charge with another stegadon..don't use him and expect him to be a good caster. The fact is..he's not.

Overall, i'm so disappointed with our SCs, it's not even funny. I use them now and then, (but never when I used to play in tournaments) but I wanted to start using some more often and build fluffy armies around them...and I just can't be bothered now... However, I want to try oxayotl with some cham skinks.

Haven't used Kroq gar yet, but used him in the old rules.. sadly, his weapon doesn't grant it's bonus against vampires or demons (the most common armies I face).. why is he so expensive and his weapon is useless against them? really? that would have broken the game or something? don't give me that! atleast you don't HAVE to use any cold one riders. so you can use him, with an unfluffy army and just use saurus with spears and skinks+krox which are more useful than CoR. I never had much luck with CoR (6E kroq gar you had to take a unit of CoR where as now, it says you MAY!). Still, when I used him before he wasn't that great, except for his hand of gods ignoring armour saves, which now it doesn't, so I can't even use him to kill chaos knights or blood knights from a distance...

Regards,

Sanjay

SabaLoth
24-09-2009, 08:13
oxayotl anyone?

StarFyre
24-09-2009, 11:58
Sabalath - i haven't used oxayotl yet, since due to my overall disappointment with the armybook, i've kinda stopped playing Warhammer ...

the one person I know who tried oxayotl liked him... he used him in a tournament that had rules like no casters, no magic items, no lords.

funny thing...the Masque, Skulltaker, epidemius and Oxayotl are like the only special characters that meet those criteria...

he said 2 units of chameleons, with oxayotl in 1 was quite good since lizardmen have no more scouting skinks now...but they do cost quite a bit total.

He liked them, but he is amore experienced player, where as many people may have issues using them to their full potential.

Sanjay

Tenken
24-09-2009, 17:50
I'm pretty new to this game, but it seems, that for their points, our special characters can be outperformed by a run of the mill character with even a suboptimal build about 90% of the time. Their magic items/special rules simply aren't worth the points they're asking for. If tehenhuin was a hero maybe we could have that at least but he's a lord that can never live up to the magic awesomness that is the slann.

I can honestly say I have almost no desire to use lizardmen special characters. There's armys like WoC where the special characters are just ridiculously awesom and we get overpriced garbage it seems. I'll pry try em all at least once, but I don't have much hope for them.

N810
24-09-2009, 18:08
..... (please explain why we didn't get Nakai? and we got some new name that was never heard of before??)....
Regards,

Sanjay

For those who haven't seen these Nakai's rules before...
http://sgabetto.free.fr/Telechargements/nakai.pdf
This is the kind of special character we where hopeing for... :eyebrows:

Necromancy Black
25-09-2009, 00:26
For those who haven't seen these Nakai's rules before...
http://sgabetto.free.fr/Telechargements/nakai.pdf
This is the kind of special character we where hopeing for... :eyebrows:

Oh man. Through another 20-50 points on him to make him count as US5 and I'm sold.

N810
25-09-2009, 00:33
US is not that big a deal because if he does loose and run, he can't be followed and run down. :D

Necromancy Black
25-09-2009, 01:01
US is not that big a deal because if he does loose and run, he can't be followed and run down. :D

I was thinking of negating ranks.

Loq-Gor
27-09-2009, 10:37
Tiktaq'to
Strengths: Makes his unit harder to shoot and magic missile, ignores armor in CC, ability to bring in a unit of Terradon riders from the rear is awesome.
Weaknesses: Crummy stats, KB not so useful with one attack, no ranged weapon (WTF), forest hoping garners similar results to coming on from table edge mid game.

Comments: OK I have some problems with this guy but generally he is really good. His ability to fly in from the rear with a unit of Terradons is priceless against lone characters and small or easily scattered units. I fly him with a unit of four Terradons (because that is how many models I have, I plan to get more and fly a unit of about six plus him). He flys the unit in on about turn three most of the time, when my opponent has managed to become convinced that his vampire general is safely away from all my units, and drops rocks while leading the unit into a forest or up to another unit to shoot. He has killed Vampire generals, Dark Elf sorceresses, Wood Elf wizards, and broken numerous units. He has even managed to beat a few fighting characters in CC (fluke, don't count on it). He comes with a nice helm which does a bit to keep his unit alive. All that said, Zwup has not once, in dozens of games, struck a killing blow, his inability to shoot is quite irksome once the rocks have been dropped, and he is just a Skink chief so you can't expect a lot in CC.

Effectiveness: Generally 9/10, he has managed to survive, do serious damage, and be incredibly agravating to my opponents in every game he has been in.

Point Effectiveness: Probably 5/10 (maybe only 4 or 3), the unit has always made up their points but aside from a dead VC general here and there he only has a few times. You are paying a lot for the ability to bring a harassment unit in from the rear, a KB that will almost never be an issue, and a mediocre fighter. MR 1 was never that valuable, -1 to hit is good not great, 6+ ward is OK. If he cost less with the same abilities I would call him a must have for a Terradon unit, as it is probably just a fun investment.

StarFyreXXX
28-09-2009, 21:47
Thanks Loq-Gor....wanted to know how he was...if he was worth using...

Sanjay

Frozen-Squirrel
02-10-2009, 11:26
Tiktaq'to
Strengths: Makes his unit harder to shoot and magic missile, ignores armor in CC, ability to bring in a unit of Terradon riders from the rear is awesome.
Weaknesses: Crummy stats, KB not so useful with one attack, no ranged weapon (WTF), forest hoping garners similar results to coming on from table edge mid game.

Comments: OK I have some problems with this guy but generally he is really good. His ability to fly in from the rear with a unit of Terradons is priceless against lone characters and small or easily scattered units. I fly him with a unit of four Terradons (because that is how many models I have, I plan to get more and fly a unit of about six plus him). He flys the unit in on about turn three most of the time, when my opponent has managed to become convinced that his vampire general is safely away from all my units, and drops rocks while leading the unit into a forest or up to another unit to shoot. He has killed Vampire generals, Dark Elf sorceresses, Wood Elf wizards, and broken numerous units. He has even managed to beat a few fighting characters in CC (fluke, don't count on it). He comes with a nice helm which does a bit to keep his unit alive. All that said, Zwup has not once, in dozens of games, struck a killing blow, his inability to shoot is quite irksome once the rocks have been dropped, and he is just a Skink chief so you can't expect a lot in CC.

Effectiveness: Generally 9/10, he has managed to survive, do serious damage, and be incredibly agravating to my opponents in every game he has been in.

Point Effectiveness: Probably 5/10 (maybe only 4 or 3), the unit has always made up their points but aside from a dead VC general here and there he only has a few times. You are paying a lot for the ability to bring a harassment unit in from the rear, a KB that will almost never be an issue, and a mediocre fighter. MR 1 was never that valuable, -1 to hit is good not great, 6+ ward is OK. If he cost less with the same abilities I would call him a must have for a Terradon unit, as it is probably just a fun investment.

I think he sounds like a SC I have to try. Just need some Terradons first.

I was wondering. Can a unit of Terradons charge a target and drop stones on someone they flew over in the same turn? I was seen it was a FAQ once, but didn't get an answer anywhere.
If the unit can see an enemy unit where another enemy unit blocks half the LoS, I can still see them with the Terradons. Then I can fly over that unit.

zeekill
02-10-2009, 20:07
I think he sounds like a SC I have to try. Just need some Terradons first.

I was wondering. Can a unit of Terradons charge a target and drop stones on someone they flew over in the same turn? I was seen it was a FAQ once, but didn't get an answer anywhere.
If the unit can see an enemy unit where another enemy unit blocks half the LoS, I can still see them with the Terradons. Then I can fly over that unit.

Yea they can drop rocks if they charge. The problem is why would you charge 8-/

N810
02-10-2009, 20:31
Yea they can drop rocks if they charge. The problem is why would you charge 8-/

well you might want to drop some rocks on light cav,
as you charge a weak warmachine crew ???

StarFyreXXX
03-10-2009, 00:28
No..they drop rocks when they fly over a unit and you declare that you are going to drop them. You can also drop them if you charge over another unit, although, why charge withthem? fly over stuff and then maybe flank or rear charge specific units, but otherwise stay ready to crossfire stuff.

Sanjay

zeekill
03-10-2009, 02:51
well you might want to drop some rocks on light cav,
as you charge a weak warmachine crew ???

Seriously, I think that even some war machine crew could stand up to them and live for a turn or two. (Especially Dwarfs)

N810
03-10-2009, 02:55
Seriously, I think that even some war machine crew could stand up to them and live for a turn or two. (Especially Dwarfs)

ahhh... but they can't fire the weapon then... ;)