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WoodElfGeneral
27-09-2009, 14:48
I am fairly new to Warhammer Fantasy and just got my Wood Elf army a few months back. My friend who I play with all the time because i live in the middle of nowhere plays chaos mortals/warriors and always beats me. I also play against skaven and lizardmen and i can masacre them, i just cant beat the chaos warriors. None of my friends can.

So the question is, how can i defeat a Caos Warriors player with my wood elves? If you have a good army list or tactic in mind please post it here.

Thanks
-WoodElfGeneral:)

Harbinger09
27-09-2009, 15:05
Depending on the size of the game, an Alter Highborn with Arcane Bodkins and The Bow of Loren can be a great way to take out out knights and any other armor he may have. But overall, WoC is a tough army for Wood Elves to beat. Treeman and Treekin go down quick to knights, since their magic attacks negate our ward save. I would also suggest taking an eagle in order for some march blocking, Wild Riders could serve this purpose as well. I have done a similar tactic against O&Gs, where I march blocked with my Wild Riders until the orcs were whittled down enough by shooting, then charged in a flank. A well placed Hail of Doom Arrow and some extra Glade Guard could do some good also. Good luck!

Mirbeau
27-09-2009, 15:11
Not that tough, depends what your opponents fielding. Wipe out maurader cav asap with shooting or whatever, then perhaps hounds and you'll be able to run rings round him using the WE's high speed. avoid combat when the odds aren't stacked in your favour, hit him in the flanks with wild riders, wardancers and dryads and the jobs a good one. check out asrai.org for more in depth advice on this, i found them a tough nut to crack for awhile too, good luck!

WoodElfGeneral
27-09-2009, 15:24
The big problem i have is that when we play 2k points he has an exaulted hero on some demon horse that marches twenty and then he runs down my treeman and hits him with flames.

Deglosh
27-09-2009, 16:37
Depending on the size of the game, an Alter Highborn with Arcane Bodkins and The Bow of Loren can be a great way to take out out knights and any other armor he may have. But overall, WoC is a tough army for Wood Elves to beat. Treeman and Treekin go down quick to knights, since their magic attacks negate our ward save. I would also suggest taking an eagle in order for some march blocking, Wild Riders could serve this purpose as well. I have done a similar tactic against O&Gs, where I march blocked with my Wild Riders until the orcs were whittled down enough by shooting, then charged in a flank. A well placed Hail of Doom Arrow and some extra Glade Guard could do some good also. Good luck!

Ok so if an attack is magical at strenght 4 it negates one armor and one ward?

Mabus
27-09-2009, 16:48
It sounds as if he's using a hellfire sword. That's a very expensive piece of kit and so it's unlikely he's using any magical armour. I'm sure if you targeted this champion with enough magic and shooting, he'll die suprisingly easily.

Unuhexium
27-09-2009, 17:19
Ok so if an attack is magical at strenght 4 it negates one armor and one ward?

No, it only negates one point of normal armour. Wood Elve's dryads and treemen have a special wardsave that is negated by any magical attacks. Normal wardsaves are NOT negated this way.

PeG
27-09-2009, 18:42
I play that matchup quite frequently and usually beat WoC with my WE. Movement and shooting is key to winning. Even knights have a lots of armour they still roll 1s now and then and every one hurts since it is usually very few of them.
It is important to remove low armour units as fast as possible so that you can focus on the more expensive units and stay out of combat unless you want to fight. Having fewer units on the table helps with that.

Dryads in the flank of knights/warriors/chosen etc can usually win or at least lock them in combat. take multiple units.

Treeman can kill anything with his strangle root attacks and relatively high movement and if you want him in combat he can do that as well.

Alter hero with great weapon + helm of the hunt is as always a good choice.

Take glade riders for marchblocking and shooting some low armour units.

Take a BSB to decrease the chance of breaking from combat.

If the hero marches 20 inches in the first turn he is not together with any high armour unit and he is also not on a jugger which should mean that he has 2+ AS and has 2 wounds. If he is alone you should take him out easy with S4 shooting from glade guards (AS 3+). If he is with a fast cav unit hit him with HoD and more shooting to take them all out. Most WoC units are rather small so it should be possible.

Make sure that you play with at least some terrain preferably a wood or two ;) If you can get it into your deployment zone it helps to hide some of your units.

The biggest problem is usually if they go magic heavy since our magic defence is really bad. One or two scroll caddies + clusters for extra dispel dice helps a bit but sometimes not enough.

If you can give more details about yours and/or your opponents lists we can provide more support.

WoodElfGeneral
28-09-2009, 01:26
My army list changes almost every game because i am still looking for a good fit but here is a basic outline of what i take in 2k list:

Treeman
5 Wild Riders with/ full command
At least 1-2 units of 10 Glade guard
5 Glade riders
0-3 units of 8 dryads
highborn with alter and then either great weapon + helm of hunt or with bow of loren and arcane bodkins
lv 1 or 2 mage with 2 scrolls

im not sure how that adds up but once in a while i also take either another wizard or another noble. I have also been trying out warhawks, treekin, and a noble mounted on a great eagle. Not working out to well really.

My friend usually uses the same list because he has less models than i do. Here is a general outline:

Exhaulted hero on varying mounts( he is also new and trying different tactics) w/ a 2+ save and usually some sort of flame weapon
5 Knights with lances and full cmmand (MoK i think)
12 warriors with full command and MoK
5 Maurader horsemen w/ javelins
20 mauraders on foot w/ full command and MoK i think
10 warhounds
chariot
sourcerer of korne or nurgle (not sure which)
he sometimes takes 5 chosen w/ gw

Not sure how that all adds up but that is a general outline from what i remember

As for terrain i try to get at least 1 hill, two forest, plus my free wood on the field but sometime it doesnt work out. I always deploy on the hillside and put glade guard on top of it. He never ever enters the woods, i mean it. He always lets my units get away rather than to go into the woods and get hit with treesinging.

I also have questions on rules:

1) do glade guard and dryads have any armour besides the 5+ ws for the dryads
2)can you have above a 6+ armour save from modifiers or does it stop at 6+

I may think of more question but this is it for now.

Rosstifer
28-09-2009, 01:53
Your lucky he has lances on his knights. Chaos Knight Lances don't count as magical weapons, only their ensorcelled weapons do, so you'll still get your forest spirit ward save.

Alcibiades
28-09-2009, 04:06
1) do glade guard and dryads have any armour besides the 5+ ws for the dryads
2)can you have above a 6+ armour save from modifiers or does it stop at 6+


1. Glade guard do not have any armour, normally. There may be an option to take light armour for them (check your codex), but I've never seen a Wood Elf player do so, so it's either not an option or too expensive to be worthwhile.
Dryads just have the ward save. The WE army is not one that stands up well to being hit: your tactics should involve staying away from the enemy until you're in a position to hit him hard enough that he can't hit back.
Treemen and Treekin are an exception to this: they can take a lot of hits and still keep fighting, but generally, if someone hits a wood elf, that elf is going to die.

2. A 6+ armor save that gets a -1 modifier means no armor save at all.

Patrick84
28-09-2009, 07:20
to anwser first question... Easy!

to give you some pointers:
use glade riders to get within 8 inchs of his frenzied warriors and flee turning them the wrong way or into woods, or if his knights are frenzied do the same to them even more effective, (ofcause be within 14 inchs) as nights trapped in woods = uneffective nights.
same thing works with putting some dryaids just outside a forest, letting the knights charge them, when you lose combat and flee he follows into the woods and is stuck.
----

you do have some nice units but i feel you are missing out on 2 of our best units. Waywatchers, and wardancers.

Waywatchers can easily be marchblocking his units from turn 1, v important + with KB on his knights very good, just keep them out of charge arcs and close to cover to dance around.

Wardancers are immensly powerful, a flank charge with a unit of 8 will decimate most things, just remmber they are very delicate (also wardancer lords are one of the most nail's charictors ive ever played with)

your wildriders ideally should be 6 strong and have the warbanner, this normaly gives them 3 static combat ress, getting a flank charge with them normaly menas the opponent has 2 scr (outnumber + banner) now linked with dryads/wardanncers for combat ress your winning by miles except against some elite units.


if your set on using a tree man, try using a lvl 4 mage with the recast tree singing and a lvl 2, and tree surf the treeman + mages + wardanncers upto his front line. e.g. have them in the forest enough so they can't be charged.


if he is beating you on magic, a branchwraith with clusters of raidence is AWSOME!!!

remmber his guy needs to be a lord to have flaming attacks an exalted can't get them as its a 75pt item. personaly i only take treeman/treekin if i have alot of magic to hide them in woods etc, otherwise its elfs dryads and a unit of wildriders for me.

hope this helps

PeG
28-09-2009, 07:30
OK he has 4 units that has to die fast, the chariot, 5 horsemen and probably 2 units of 5 dogs each. If you can kill these units the rest is either slow or unsupported. I would take HoD and possibly additional models intead of Bow of Loren+ arcane bodkins. 3D6 S4 shots will wipe out a unit of horsemen or hounds or at least reduce it to non efficient strenght while at least I have problems with getting my points back from an elf carrying Bow of Loren+ arcane bodkins. If you are shooting at knights the Bow will give you a few (depending on who is shooting) S3 shots hitting on 2+, wounding on 5+ and then potentially a ward save.

Then you need sufficient number of glade guards to take out the rest of these units in maximum 2 turns of shooting unless you add some waywatchers or similar things to marchblock from turn 1 which should give you at least one more turn of shooting.

I usually set up as far forward as possible and move everyting forward on turn 1 for marchblocking or to get in short range with Glade guards (if he got first turn). It also gives me more space to flee from his charges.

If you can kill his fast stuff you can dance around him and pick of his other stuff.