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Voracioustigger
06-10-2009, 19:59
The main issue is... What is a "dice roll of a 1"?

Ragnar's ability allows +D3 attacks on the charge and a Wolf Standard allows re-rolls of a 1. When rolling a D3, a 1-2 count as a 1 on a D6... However... the rulebook clearly states that you only use a D6 "since there's no such thing as a three-sided die." So, the rulebook indicates that if it were possible, you would roll a 3 sided die... in which case 1/3 of the time you would roll a 1... which the Wolf Standard would allow you to re-roll.

I know this is a bit of rules lawyering, and I fully intend to only re-roll 1's (well, I don't intend on using Ragnar, so it's a bit moot for me), but based on the rules, it seems like you should be able to re-roll 1's and 2's when rolling a D3 w/ a Wolf Standard.

Thoughts?

Also note... there actually ARE 3 sided dice... Would you allow re-rolls of all 1's on those dice?

Arakanis
06-10-2009, 20:50
First off. No. You cannot use D3s to gain an advantage. That's cheating as nowhere in the BRB does it say you may use anything other than D6s.

Secondly, I'm going to chide you for even thinking this. It's cheesy in the extreme and personally I wouldn't play you.

Third and finally, if it says you re-roll (1) ones, you are going to look at that die, and by the Emperor if it says (2) two on it, you're going to leave it alone.

CthulhuDalek
06-10-2009, 20:53
lol, it's not cheesy in the extreme, but it's just not kosher.

I'd say you only reroll the natural 1.

Still it's sort of up for debate I suppose.

One of those things that's really up to you and your opponent though.

Hypaspist
06-10-2009, 21:00
if it says you re-roll (1) ones, you are going to look at that die, and by the Emperor if it says (2) two on it, you're going to leave it alone.

Definitely this, By the Emperor if it says a two those hands are staying by your sides!

pom134
06-10-2009, 21:03
First off. No. You cannot use D3s to gain an advantage. That's cheating as nowhere in the BRB does it say you may use anything other than D6s.

Secondly, I'm going to chide you for even thinking this. It's cheesy in the extreme and personally I wouldn't play you.

Third and finally, if it says you re-roll (1) ones, you are going to look at that die, and by the Emperor if it says (2) two on it, you're going to leave it alone.

You missed his point entirely.

He is saying, because it is impossible to make a 3 dimensional shape with volume that only has 3 sides, that the D6 could possibly be reinterpreted as a D3 by using the substitutions 1-2 = 1, 3-4 = 2, 5-6 = 3. He is not "using a D3 to cheat." He was told to roll a D3 by the rules.

If the substitution is being taken very literally then yes, rolling a 1 or a 2 on a D6 "counts as" a 1 on the D3 you were asked to roll and by the rules you can re-roll.

Of course this is only if you choose to really believe the substitution. Personally, as the poster said himself, I wouldn't try to pull that, but I can see the justification.

Arakanis
06-10-2009, 21:17
You missed his point entirely.


Not at all. I simply refuted it as against the rules. He has to use a D6 in place of a D3 (No where does it tell you to use a D3, simply that's how many attacks you will get, and you will use a D6 to determine it), a 1 or 2 means that he gets 1 attack, a 2 or a 3 means he gets 2 attacks, and so forth.

There is no magical substitution clause that will ever make rolling a "2" the same as rolling a "1" for the purposes of "re-roll ones"

If you are trying to make that argument, it certainly isn't RAW, and to be honest I doubt it's really RAI either.

Now, if 40k actually used multiple sided die other than the D6, then maybe you'd have case there. But all I see is Space Wolf players trying to tell me how because the "2" they rolled is "Actually" a "1" they get to re-roll twice as often. :rolleyes:

IcedAnimals
06-10-2009, 21:32
eh id let someone do it. a 1-2 on a D3 is a 1. They tell you specifically that 1-2 when asked to roll a D3 is = to 1.

But I will say that if someone takes something that literal expect to be fully rules lawyered by your opponent.

pom134
06-10-2009, 21:46
Not at all. I simply refuted it as against the rules. He has to use a D6 in place of a D3 (No where does it tell you to use a D3, simply that's how many attacks you will get, and you will use a D6 to determine it), a 1 or 2 means that he gets 1 attack, a 2 or a 3 means he gets 2 attacks, and so forth.

There is no magical substitution clause that will ever make rolling a "2" the same as rolling a "1" for the purposes of "re-roll ones"

If you are trying to make that argument, it certainly isn't RAW, and to be honest I doubt it's really RAI either.

Now, if 40k actually used multiple sided die other than the D6, then maybe you'd have case there. But all I see is Space Wolf players trying to tell me how because the "2" they rolled is "Actually" a "1" they get to re-roll twice as often. :rolleyes:

The concept of a D3 is that there are three possible outcomes: 1, 2 or 3. The rule states that you re-roll ones. When you roll a 1 on the roll (a D3 roll) you re-roll.

TheEndIsHere
06-10-2009, 21:48
Btw there is a d3. and a d2.

Well a d2 is a coin.

I'd let my opponent reroll all 1s and 2s if this was an even game. If he was using a cheesy armylist while I wasn't and he was being an ******, I'd let him too as he's an ******.

But if this were my friend, I'd let him reroll all 1s and 2s.

Actually, whats the exact wording?

D-End

Vandelan
06-10-2009, 21:54
Oh dear Emperor!

Read page 2 of the rulebook. This is blatantly covered there!

Just look under the section about dice...

And in the case of the standard, it states that it is in effect for the entire Assault Phase, so no mumbo jumbo there about when the D3 roll happens.

Nexus Trimean
06-10-2009, 22:12
Go Buy a D3. Problem solved.

Vandelan
07-10-2009, 03:46
So, if I'm unable to agree on this rule with my friend, does that mean when we roll off on it that I can re-roll a result of a 1?

bugbait_nz
07-10-2009, 04:34
D3 -> 1 or 2 on a 6 sided die = 1 -> reroll allowed if you are interpreting the wolf standard rule corretly.
easy, its not cheating its understanding what D3 means