PDA

View Full Version : Should we retcon Imperial (Ravenwing) Jetbikes?



Mozzamanx
08-10-2009, 17:35
Ello,

While flicking through the numerous Dark Angel Improvement threads, one idea in particular keeps cropping up- Allowing Ravenwing Jetbikes as a unit. While the fluff currently prohibits this, it is an incredibly cool image. Especially a story where Ravenwing launched an orbital assault, entirely mounted on Jetbikes.

Simply put, would players care if the current extinction background was removed, to allow for such units? It could be our equivalent of Thunderwolf Cavalry.

The Orange
08-10-2009, 18:28
If they do get it as a unit, they should be prepared for when GW passes it on to all the other chapters. Something that cool you just can't keep to yourselves lol.

Honestly though it sounds a little over the top. I'd be happy for them getting something unique like that, but something about SM's with jetbikes just doesn't sound right to me (might have something to do with my eldar army though).

Sildani
08-10-2009, 18:30
Aye, Ravenwing can get a full jetbike squad as soon as we Eldar can get our Harlequin Land Raiders back. Fair?

Mannimarco
08-10-2009, 18:36
you can have your jetbike squads when i can get my full dark mech army (seriously guys? 10k years and all you came up with is 2 aircraft, a brass scorpion and a defiler? smoke breaks over guys get back to work)

its gone, it shouldnt be brought back

khyron
08-10-2009, 18:47
I would love to see a unit of Imperial jetbikes back in 40k. It should be kept very limited, though. Maybe as a 3-5 strong retinue for the Master of the Ravenwing (so long as he is also mounted on a jetbike).

LonelyPath
08-10-2009, 18:48
I think it would be a neat option to have in the army and it would fit my army excellently seeing how it's based pre-Heresy. I'm still working on some jetbike conversions modeled from RW bikers and pinned to stand about half an inch above the base so that they will be roughly the same height as a bike and work as bikes without handicaps that would arrise if they were mounted on flying bases.

DuskRaider
08-10-2009, 19:07
I think both Imperial and Chaos should get Jetbikes, more leaning toward Chaos, since they keep their Pre-Heresy vehicles and equipment around a lot longer then their Loyalist counterparts.

grissom2006
08-10-2009, 19:07
Nah they should be left where they got put in the past the technology is in effect lost anyway..

MajorWesJanson
08-10-2009, 19:32
Not as a unit, but an upgrade for HQ choices.

IcedAnimals
08-10-2009, 19:47
I know a dark angel player who has a unit of "bikers" that he fully converted replacing the eldar riders and making them look a bit more imperial by making them a bit more blocky and less rounded and smooth.

I could see it working for the dark angels though. There was quite a few jet bikes in eisenhorn and in brotherhood of the snake a marine has one as well. And he was just a rookie.

Suspicions
08-10-2009, 20:03
Fondly I recall the old metal beaky marine on his tiny metal jetbike. Those were good times and actually, rather iconic in the earlier days of 40k.

If they could come back, I would want them to be DA specific (not because I'm a DA player) but because I feel that DA should have something truly unique. I still say that they will get Sternguard / Vanguard Terminator squads, but a Retinue of Jetbikes for the Master of the Ravenwing would be both fluffy and -cool-.

I say bring it on!

@Iced Animals...I thought that the Brotherhood of the Snake was referencing a Landspeeder...not Jetbike...I could be wrong though.

galahad67
08-10-2009, 20:04
I would love to see a unit of Imperial jetbikes back in 40k. It should be kept very limited, though. Maybe as a 3-5 strong retinue for the Master of the Ravenwing (so long as he is also mounted on a jetbike).


I agree with the proposed HQ unit limitations on Imperial jetbikes - 3-5 sounds feasible. It would sell

I would also like to put in a plug for Harlie jetbikes! Heck, I want the entire Harliequin army list or at least a Harlie HQ.

Harlie HQ, reg Harlies and Harlies on Jetbikes would be enough to get my $...

Clang
08-10-2009, 20:05
If it's just the cool image that you like, build some and just have them count-as normal bikes in games.

Rules-wise, I wouldn't object to actual jetbikes being allowed in _one_ of the MEq armies, and i guess it's fluffier for DA than anyone else...

Arkfatalis
08-10-2009, 20:38
Nah they should be left where they got put in the past the technology is in effect lost anyway..

Oh look is that an STC I see over there.......

Jackmojo
08-10-2009, 22:17
Oh look is that an STC I see over there.......

See they keep looking for it filed under "Jetbike", when it got labeled "Bike, Jet"... ;)

re:OP, I'm totally for Imperial Jetbikes, particularly along the lines of the nice Master of the Ravenwing Jetbike Model (I would adore that in plastic!). I'd be ok with them appearing either as a special Dark Angel choice, or as a normal choice.

Jack

Lion El Jason
08-10-2009, 22:31
I'm against the idea. I didn't want the one we have!

Though just to be picky... It would be a re-retcon (Or possibly a de-retcon?) as originally the Ravenwing all had Jetbikes (It was the very first or second Chapter approved article ever).

I could justify it being just DarkAngels, part of their fluff is holding onto ancient and unique (To the unforgiven) tech and not sharing it. But still, I don't like it... It seems too much like the DA version of marines on wolves (Though not that bad, of course)

Arakanis
08-10-2009, 22:41
Aye, Ravenwing can get a full jetbike squad as soon as we Eldar can get our Harlequin Land Raiders back. Fair?

As an Ulthwe Farseer and a Supreme Grand Master of the Unforgiven I can only praise your statement, sir.

LonelyPath
08-10-2009, 23:40
If it's just the cool image that you like, build some and just have them count-as normal bikes in games.

Which is what I'm doing. It just looks good, heh :)

dblaz3r
08-10-2009, 23:53
@Iced Animals...I thought that the Brotherhood of the Snake was referencing a Landspeeder...not Jetbike...I could be wrong though.


'No, safety. It's a land speeder,' he said, laying emphasis on the final word.

I kind of like the idea but I much prefer 40k as it is. Once you let the retcon door open who knows what would slip through.

Mannimarco
09-10-2009, 01:39
i dont wanna use the dreaded S word but if we open the door to de-retcon stuff you know theyre the first to come back

Ronin_eX
09-10-2009, 01:45
I think it would be a wonderful iconic unit for the Dark Angels. We were noted in Rogue Trader for performing the first orbital drop via jetbike on Rynn's World (this was later brought back in the latest codex but apparently only Sammael did it then, which significantly reduces the cool). So really it was an iconic bit of fluff for us for a long time.

Mix that with our penchant for ancient technology (as said by GW themselves) and I don't see why they shouldn't be a unique unit to us. I mean no one complained about Space Wolves getting a cavalry unit (they complained about a unit riding wolves but not the unit type) so I don't see why the Eldar are getting their panties in a knot over it. It isn't like their isn't precedent for it already and we really can't be reducing your fun by getting a fun and unique unit for ourselves.

Were they this pissy about Orks getting "jetbikes"? It's not like any other race can even claim the Eldar Jetbike rules either so you remain special snowflakes even when other races use a unit type you seem to identify so heavily with. ;)

I've said it before and I'll say it again. If you are going to bother making separate marine codices then bother to make them very, very different. So give the Dark Angels jet bikes as a unit and revel in the differences you are allowed to build into the non-vanilla marine armies. Besides it would be the first time GW de-retconned a previous retcon.

@Lion El Jason
Marines riding wolves is cheesy in a Man-O-War album cover kind of way. Marines riding into the atmosphere on jet bikes is actually awesome and completely in theme for the current universe. Besides it is time that GW gave us something unique again after handing our Land Speeder configuration out to every marine chapter in 3rd.

Logarithm Udgaur
09-10-2009, 01:53
...and in brotherhood of the snake a marine has one as well. And he was just a rookie.
Proving once again why that book should never be brought up as a fluff source.

A 0-1 unit of Jetbikes would be kinda cool, but only if the MotRW is included in the army.

AngryAngel
09-10-2009, 02:13
I would love a unit of jetbike riding marines. Perhaps some exceptionally skilled jet bike riding ravenwing marines. If Space wolves can ride around on wolves, I don't see anything out of sorts for ravenwing riding on jet bikes.

pringles978
09-10-2009, 02:18
Aye, Ravenwing can get a full jetbike squad as soon as we Eldar can get our Harlequin Land Raiders back. Fair?

i used to love my badly painted harlequin raider as a kid.... might just paint one up for apoc.

cyenwulf
09-10-2009, 02:45
I would love a unit of jetbike riding marines. Perhaps some exceptionally skilled jet bike riding ravenwing marines. If Space wolves can ride around on wolves, I don't see anything out of sorts for ravenwing riding on jet bikes.

Apart from the fact that there aren't any jetbikes left for them to ride.

Dangersaurus
09-10-2009, 03:05
I'd prefer if all Imperial armies had access to jetbikes again in some form.

Arakanis
09-10-2009, 03:25
Apart from the fact that there aren't any jetbikes left for them to ride.

Because before the current codex the Space Wolves had never considered that those giant well trained Thunderwolves mucking about in the stables on Fenris were something you could ride. :rolleyes:

Raphaus
09-10-2009, 04:38
I'm no DA player but I'd be happy to see the unforgiven with a handful of jetbikes, have them as a retinue for Sammael, it would be cool and far from the most outrageous bit of rules tweeking GW have done (ie marines riding giant wolves).

I'd also like to see a proper Harlequin list back, they used to be awesome.

Arakanis
09-10-2009, 05:01
I'd also like to see a proper Harlequin list back, they used to be awesome.

You have no idea how much I wish there were more variant codices/army lists aside from just Marines.

The Imperium has so much possibility.
Eldar too and Chaos.

It's a pipe dream but if the Imperium, Eldar and Chaos got equal treatment, a lot of people would be a lot happier. (Though Chaos has been getting some Forgeworld love lately, hallelujah)

prose.
09-10-2009, 05:28
I'd like to see jetbikes back I guess. The Sammael model is pretty cool.

Rather than a retinue though, I think they'd be best represented by hero level characters purchased as Fast Attack. Thus you could have a maximum of 3 in an army but they'd be really good and highly individual. Plus it makes sense since only chapter heroes would be trusted with such ancient relics.

Say WS and BS 5, 2 maybe 3 wounds, T4(5) and maybe immunity to instant death since they cant join units. Give them access to the hero's choice of wargear and maybe a heavy weapon on the jetbike and you're set.

Allandaros
09-10-2009, 05:30
I have 4 or 5 Imperial Army jetbikes; I'd love to see the Imperium get access to jetbikes again. That way I could field 'em as actual jetbikes instead of rough riders (urgh) in my Guard army.

So a purely selfish "no retcon" from me!

AngryAngel
09-10-2009, 06:07
Apart from the fact that there aren't any jetbikes left for them to ride.

There weren't any at all before the new DA codex then "WALA !! " They've had one all this time. They have in fact, so many each successor chapter also gets one.

You see its these kinda comments that urk me some. That make me in fact, angry. People come out and say " Hey DA having even one unit of jet bike riding marines would be cool. " There are those so quick to jump in and say, " They can't, they don't have any, that would be stupid. ".

GW "never" changes things and they "never" add new things then act as if they have always been there do they ? Oh wait they do that all the time. So whats the problem, exactly with DA having some jet bikes ? Would it burn people that much they have their own unique units for once ? That we have something other people "gasp" envy ?

I say again, if Space wolves can ride wolves ( which I think personally is more then silly ). DA should be allowed some uniqueness in having jet bikes. Sammie has one, and they didn't have any, so they can I am sure, find some more for a unit at least.

Show us the money GW. As well sorry for the minor rant there.

Jackmojo
09-10-2009, 06:36
Show us the money GW.

I'll show GW the money if they make a nice plastic version of that Jetbike.

Jack

Doomseer
09-10-2009, 09:37
I would definitely welcome a Dark Angels exclusive Jetbike unit but more as a command squad option for Sammael/Master of the Ravenwing if he is selected.

I think it has the potential to be really good and I don't see it being anywhere near as ridiculous as thunderwolves!:rolleyes:

Raphaus
09-10-2009, 09:51
It's a pipe dream but if the Imperium, Eldar and Chaos got equal treatment, a lot of people would be a lot happier. (Though Chaos has been getting some Forgeworld love lately, hallelujah)

You know it's true,

I'd love some Imperial citizens to defend/butcher.

I could do it from my jetbike.

Petay1985
09-10-2009, 10:11
i like the idea of the Dark Angels having a handfull of these jet bikes left, but i think 1 squad limit is required and Sammael's presence in the army list!!

shabbadoo
09-10-2009, 10:11
It would be nice to see them added back in, and yes, if it were a plastic kit I'd expect that everyone would get them.

Then again, maybe not. If GW wanted to sell more models, supposedly being a model company and all, they would have FAQ'd most of the new Space Marine kit options into the BA and DA lists too. I know I would have a 2 LS Storms, a Techmarine w/Thunderfire Cannon, Scout Bikes(12 most likely) and an Ironclad in my DA collection, just for completeness, but in game terms there is no reason for me to spend the money on them. Wow. That is over $300 US in lost sales from just me. :p

So, on second thought, who knows what GW would do with something like Imperial Jetbikes? :confused:

Doppleskanger
09-10-2009, 10:31
I think this is a great idea for a couple of reasons. One the Sammy jetbike is a great model, so a few more would look even better!
As a power weaponed or even a relic bladed retinue for Sammy the Ravenwing would get some sorely needed close combat punch.
And the basic rules for jetbikes ie not Eldar, really aren't very impressive so this unit could be added without any accusations of OMG that Scks, so ovpwrd etc etc etc. Cue endless whining about game balance and someone mentioning the DE are overdue a codex :) !

scarletsquig
09-10-2009, 10:46
Some sort of flying wolf cavalry that uses the jetbike rules might make more sense.

It could be a bionic wolf, with an exhaust coming out the back and doggles over it's eyes. :)

totgeboren
09-10-2009, 12:43
Some sort of flying wolf cavalry that uses the jetbike rules might make more sense.

It could be a bionic wolf, with an exhaust coming out the back and doggles over it's eyes. :)

I hope they give it a rending laser on its head too. That would get my $. :)

No, but seriously, I'm all for DA exclusive jetbikes.
Only problem is that they will prove popular, meaning standard SM will get them too in their next codex, and so to make DA special, they will get jetbikes as a standard FA unit in their codex after that, and then the standard marines will get it too since they are always given whatever is popular. (Maybe they will get xeno-mounts for their bikers too?)

Anyway, I guess its inevitable that the background for 40k will come tumbling down in the name of profit, but as long as everyone has a good time, I don't see the problem.

the1stpip
09-10-2009, 14:16
No, while I can understand one or two relics still existing, Imp Jetbikes aregone, and can not be maintained.

At the moment, Eldar, Dark Eldar, Orks and Necrons have Jetbikes, why not let everyone have them so they lose their special appeal!

Onisuzume
09-10-2009, 20:29
If they do get it as a unit, they should be prepared for when GW passes it on to all the other chapters. Something that cool you just can't keep to yourselves lol.
Name something that we had that *hasn't* been passed to other chapters?
Heavenfall Blades? SMurfs got a two-handed version.
Land Speeder Tornado? They stole that back in 3rd edition from us.
Mortis Pattern Dreadnought? They now have our autocannon version of it.

It would be fun to have a unique unit for once... >_>

At the moment, Eldar, Dark Eldar, Orks and Necrons have Jetbikes, why not let everyone have them so they lose their special appeal!
Not every had beasts/cavalry available to them, and yet the SW got them for no good reason.

Firaxin
09-10-2009, 20:50
At the moment, Eldar, Dark Eldar, Orks and Necrons have Jetbikes, why not let everyone have them so they lose their special appeal!
There's something wrong with that...

If Orks can have jetbikes, I don't know why the Imperium can't have some.

Logarithm Udgaur
09-10-2009, 22:38
Orks can have anything if they believe hard enough!

That said, they do not have jetbikes, they have ground bikes that are better.

Arakanis
09-10-2009, 22:47
Orks can have anything if they believe hard enough!

That said, they do not have jetbikes, they have Helibikes WAAAAAGGH!!!!

Fixed that for ya. ;)