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t-tauri
16-05-2005, 17:49
Cobbled together from a number of posts on Dakka

BT next, Tau after BT, Eldar and Dark Angels perhaps to follow.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakka/Default.aspx?tabid=27&g=posts&t=6891


I went, got some decent info. I just don't post much to Dakka anymore.

BT: Expect to have some new sprues. A BT sprue for the plastic troops. Assault Termie sprue and plastic scouts are expected to be released with/for the BT, though they can be used generically. Expect metal support similar to the Ultras. A few characters, etc. Per Pete, each subcodex is going to allow fleshing out a generic SM unit. BT's will give some Chaplain models, including a new Termi chaplain. Vows cost points. They mentioned that Chicago will see some BT minis in the seminar...can't focus on Tyranids then. Expect more news at Chicago.

Templars follow Tyranids.

And Tau follow Templars. SO I gathered from the folks at GD. Tau provided an opportunity to get a quick full Codex in, with some new models, without impacting the bigger projects much. So they took it.


Some speculation. It's pretty simply. The guys can't answer a lot, so you ask leading questions and get a feel for the process. Long story short, projects are not equal. The Codex following Templars was something they could do in the short time allotted, so they did it. Based on their comments, I expect the major redo (the big project) to be Eldar next year. Jes is keenly excited to get back there. I expect Orks to be the big project the year after that. BOTH Jes and Pete are aware that Orks and Eldar have waited the longest and need major work. They will fit in smaller redos where they can.

Next Marine subcodex: also major speculation by me. Pete used Blood Angels as an example several times in our chat and the seminar. I'd expect BA next year. He and Jes both mentioned SW were a while away, so I'd expect DA in 2007, squeezed in.

DISCLAIMER: This is all speculation. They told me none of this, I merely inferred it from our talks. Would I put money on it? Yes. Did they confirm anything after BT...no.

Forgeworld: Done with Tau and the Elysians, but may do some Elysian CHARACTERS.

That covers the Taros book.

Volume 4 will be Tyranids and Jungle/Outposts warfare.
Volume 5 will be sieges, with Siege dreads, Daemon Enginers, and maybe some Adeptus Mech. war machines

Keeper of Secrets has been designed out, and sculpting will start now. Expect it in the fall.

There are more Chapter Termi pads in the works. They showed them. They were asked about standard pads, and said that'd be worked out between them and GW (which means no, we won't get them from either, I am sure)

They want to do character vehicle conversions, and are specifically working on a "Chaplain" Rhino, with bits and bobs to make the Rhino a suitable Chaplain carrier. More to follow that.

Chimera armor was mentioned specifically. Expect that in the next year.

zealousheretic
16-05-2005, 18:04
Argh.

There had better be sliced bread out of work because of the Eldar book, if that is, in fact, the case.

Dreachon
16-05-2005, 18:41
IA volume 4 dealing with nids, damn Simon Egan is gonna be very busy

morac
16-05-2005, 18:59
There had better be sliced bread out of work.
muahahahahaha...... thats great ... SIG'D!

On topic: Yay! Plastic Scouts! That could possibly make my day (if something better doesn't come up. Let us pray that they are better than the old ones... ;)



Next Marine subcodex: also major speculation by me. Pete used Blood Angels as an example several times in our chat and the seminar. I'd expect BA next year. He and Jes both mentioned SW were a while away, so I'd expect DA in 2007, squeezed in.
BT next, Tau after BT, Eldar and Dark Angels perhaps to follow. Is this a mistake, or are you holding out on us.....


morac

t-tauri
16-05-2005, 19:09
Is this a mistake, or are you holding out on us.....

Wishful thinking, perhaps. Though I should've typed Space Wolves and hope they're next. Seems to be that the Marine codices will come out in reverse order. :mad:

No. Typo, my apologies.

Ruskins
16-05-2005, 19:32
The First Legion last? boo! Ill just have to console myself by doing lots of conversions from the cool new plastics.

Anyone know if there was more FW tallarn stuff on show?

boogle
16-05-2005, 20:31
well i'd guess the reasoning behind DA being ast as they were 'technically' the last to be done in 3rd ed with the redux edition, also BA makes most sense as the rumours about the revamped Death Company rules have been doing the rounds.

self biased
16-05-2005, 20:51
and wouldn't it be nice to see a forgeworld avatar? i was playing a game the other day, and my buddy's looked very sad. it's a great sculpt, but it's starting to show its age.

philbrad2
16-05-2005, 21:05
and wouldn't it be nice to see a forgeworld avatar? i was playing a game the other day, and my buddy's looked very sad. it's a great sculpt, but it's starting to show its age.

Or at least a GW revamp. After seeing the monster on the screen in DoW its a bit of a let down when put on the gaming table in his current form. This thing goes toe to toe with Greater Daemons for chrissakes.

The FW siege book I am REALLY looking forward to.

Judging by the tone of the comments on this report there's a distinct possibility that GW may produce a revamped Tau codex sometime in 2006 - more so if they step up to 3 codices a year.


On topic: Yay! Plastic Scouts! That could possibly make my day (if something better doesn't come up. Let us pray that they are better than the old ones...

What's wrong with the metal ones. The original 1996 vintage Jes Goodwin metals are some of the best figures in the SM range. The Mike McVey vintage Wolfscouts are ok - if anorexic. The later Mark Harriosn Wolfscouts give a good spread of weapons just not wolfy enough IMHO.


:cool:

self biased
16-05-2005, 21:07
well, it ought to be able to go toe to toe with a keeper of secrets, logically. but at half the points cost, it's sketchy at best.

boogle
16-05-2005, 21:17
the reason for plastic scouts fits into GW's long term plan on having all the core elements of both systems (The Core Units in WFB and the Troops selections in 40K) in plastic, just hope that they rank up with the current metals

Tenoch
16-05-2005, 22:13
So no Eldar until late 2006/7

Great.

[/painful sarcasm]

Ok it's a big project I get that, to me all that says is dedicate some serious man power to it, but get it out sooner, seeing as the Studio is now pooled, and fantasy isn't getting new coexes for a while, and LOTR is starting to dwindle off.

But no, they put in a codex which will seem like small work at first but I would be willing to place money on there being a very very big "but" announced.

And besides, Tau weren't even a race when I started 40k, but now they get 2 new codexes before Eldar get even one.

PLease god at least let them put out some in depth updates regarding Eldar, even if its just a few obvious point tweaks (wraithguard and shining spears anyopne?). But I doubt that will happen, rather we'll wait and wait and then get bored.

This Eldar codex better be Austin Allegro worth it...[/rant]

[disclaimer]

I guarantee the above will incite alot of negative comments, but to be honest I really don't give a damn.

edit by Brimstone, swearing is not allowed on Portent, do it again and you'll get a strike.

boogle
16-05-2005, 22:25
probably we will see:
New Bikes and Riders, both for Guardians and SS
New Scorpions and a new type of Aspect Warrior
Expanded Psychic Powers
New Avatar (both rules and Model)
Autarch Model and Rules
Most likely new Warwalker/Wraithlord (maybe enough kit in the box to make one or the other to save on shelf space)
New Wraithguard
Spiritseer
Wild Riders (maybe online only like the Maneaters)
Full line of Exacrhs to cover all of the options that are in the Army List
New Spiders

Sgt John Keel
16-05-2005, 22:28
I guarantee the above will incite alot of negative comments, but to be honest I really don't give a damn.

Nope. I'm with you on this. That Eldar codex will better be good, or else the 'burn Pete' signs will be seen all the way to Plymouth.

The only good thing with this is that they don't devote any greater length of time to the Tau.

/Adrian

boogle
16-05-2005, 22:34
i think it will be more a 'Burn Phil' as he is rumoured to be writing it (with fluff input from Gav)

Witch Hunter
16-05-2005, 23:19
i think it will be more a 'Burn Phil' as he is rumoured to be writing it (with fluff input from Gav)


According to the conversation Phil and I had while he was here for GD Atlanta, that is the case. Unfortunately, I was never able to weasel out of him the Studio's plan to 'fix' the shur-cats....

Sgt John Keel
16-05-2005, 23:23
i think it will be more a 'Burn Phil' as he is rumoured to be writing it (with fluff input from Gav)

Nah, Phil seems to be a nice guy. However, Mr. Haines may or may not have caused far worse atrocities to Portent-kind.

/Adrian

boogle
16-05-2005, 23:36
such as?, the Iron Warriors thing maybe, but what else has he done wrong?

Sgt John Keel
16-05-2005, 23:47
such as?, the Iron Warriors thing maybe, but what else has he done wrong?

You know there's a reason for the disclaimer. :D

You know you want to.

/Adrian

boogle
16-05-2005, 23:49
well meh, his stuff seems a bit more balanced and he did write Cityfight, which is my favourite ruleset

Rich
17-05-2005, 00:00
I wouldn't be too upset at the release of Codex tau if GW were planning on releasing more than two codexes a year - unfortunately, it would seem that they only intend to release two (and lets face it, who wants to wait an extra six months for an ork or eldar redo so that tau can get some shiny new battlesuits?).

Farseer Cirdan
17-05-2005, 00:38
So no Eldar until late 2006/7

Great.

[/painful sarcasm]
So Tau after Templars and Eldar in late 2006/early 2007. Wonder where I've heard that before...
;)

the spook
17-05-2005, 03:36
Looks like you took the cake after all Cirdan, congrats on being right... here's your cake, you might want to eat it quickly before the others notice...

Arkanoes
17-05-2005, 03:54
While the Tau is good news for me, I have to admit it is a bit unfair. Also, I was hoping to see some new Orks soon...oh well, guess I'll have to wait until about 2008 *sigh* :(

Easy E
17-05-2005, 04:13
The Tau are the best selling Xeno race and the most common in tourney play (I think). It only makes sense to shake that moneymaker. Especially with the stock decline matching the decline in LoTR sales.

Delicious Soy
17-05-2005, 05:33
Well hopefully they'll flesh the Tau out a bit with new units and more fluff, at the moment they've got all the character and variation of a wheat biscuit.

lord_blackfang
17-05-2005, 07:41
Oh good, I was hoping I'd have to wait 3+ years for my shooty orks to be a viable army again.

Not.

Slazton
17-05-2005, 11:11
Right, well this is somewhat good news to hear. I really think that if they wanted something to fit in to quickly release something than Tau are it.

I think all of you are moaning because you are confused or something. Think about it, would you rather have Eldar after BT with the same amount time spent on it as they did the Tau. The answer should be no.

The Tau Codex is an easy one to quickly release, while they work on the Eldar codex and models etc. You cna gurantee, the Eldar will take the best part of a few years to create, in fact you can gamble your Grandmother's left lung its in production now, but they are working on it slowly and perfectly as Eldar is one of the most respected 40K races (and one of the oldest).

The same will be with Orks. More than likely their plastics are in concept stages, as GW want to release a new line and really milk that cash cow like they are doing with Tyranids.

Just my thoughts.

Tenoch
17-05-2005, 12:08
While what you say may be true if you follow the same logic you could say "why don't they release every codex before Eldar and Orks seeing as they need loads of work, that way we can spend a decade making them perfect"

philbrad2
17-05-2005, 12:11
The Tau are the best selling Xeno race and the most common in tourney play (I think). It only makes sense to shake that moneymaker. Especially with the stock decline matching the decline in LoTR sales.


The "lets revamp what sells well" process seems to be well in place which personally I think sucks. Accountants influence even spreads to development timetable in the company and I find that sad. Where as the developers would like to tackle race A, because the 'suits' reckon product B sells more it get more attention - SUCKS BIG TIME! And could well see this process antagonise some elements of the player community as their race gets pushed back in the schedules. How far will this extend? If races are not purchased in sufficient number by the gaming public will we see them disappear? I really wonder if GW is going to plow money into revising the DE if its not going to get a monitary return on its investment.

:cool:

Kargos Bloodspit
17-05-2005, 12:28
What's wrong with the metal ones. The original 1996 vintage Jes Goodwin metals are some of the best figures in the SM range. The Mike McVey vintage Wolfscouts are ok - if anorexic. The later Mark Harriosn Wolfscouts give a good spread of weapons just not wolfy enough IMHO.


Plastic Provides more poseability, and easy conversion (much easier to slice and dice plastic than it is metal...)

philbrad2
17-05-2005, 13:36
Agreed I'd love to see plastic scouts but one of the reason why they hadn't been done previosuly accord to Mr Godwyn was thet they couldn't do justice to the figures in plastic as could be done in metal. Similar story with plastic SoB's. The need to make the figures multipart in plastic hampers the details they can add to the figures and the positions they can be set in, due to accessories and things like robes. If of course GW can do plastic Cadians Scouts/Neophytes really should be too much trouble. As long as we get all the options with the kit not just pistols/CCW's I'll be happy. Of course these BT 'themed' scouts could simply come with basic weaponry and GW release anther set with snipers/shotguns/bolters and h.weapons just to 'milk' the gamers buck.

:cool:

invivos
17-05-2005, 13:38
Tau are the the best selling Xeno race? LOL, not here in Germany at least. It´s a shame that Orks and Eldar will have to wait longer and longer for a new codex still :mad: From all playable races Orks and Eldar suffer the most from their age old codices, against necrons, sm and very probably the new nids they have a hell of a time to survive.
In my opinion the Tau are one of GWs projects that simply didnt meet the publics expectations. While they have some nice models like the tanks and the fire warriors (hell I even own a Hammerhead myself though I don´t play Tau) the concept of a shooty army with BS 3 just makes me laugh. The Kroot are one of the badest allies one can have, I have killed entire squads of Kroot with my 3pt Gretchin mobs. So no it´s wonder that the Tau don´t meet GW´s selling expectations. Orks and Eldar probably have a smaller community these days but those people still play and buy stuff where as Tau stuff isn´t selling so
well...
IF GW really revamps the Tau now I hope they turn them into a true and fearfull shooty army with higher BS or at least doctrines allowing you to reroll misses.
More and bigger crisis suits and walkers would be nifty, hopefully they´look less anime like and more like FWs stuff.... :rolleyes: And geez give the Kroot a usefull armour save! :p

Farseer Cirdan
17-05-2005, 14:31
Looks like you took the cake after all Cirdan, congrats on being right... here's your cake, you might want to eat it quickly before the others notice...
Mmmmmm Cake. Very appropriate since yesterday was my birthday. So far, being 30 sucks.

Cypher
17-05-2005, 14:36
Guess I was wrong about the Tau thing. It is strange though: certainly round these parts Orks are the most popular of the aliens, followed by Eldar. Not that Tau arent popular. I guess the reasoning is that they can do the book without having to wait for the new model range (because there really isnt one).

Given that I just spent a month converting a terminator chaplain Im a bit annoyed that theres a new model being made, but all said the next set of new marine stuff sounds really good: here's hoping the scouts get a good set of weapon options.

Delicious Soy
17-05-2005, 14:54
Yes I must give credit where credit is due, I was skeptical when I first saw FC's arguement, but I had a change of heart after a few conversations highlighted the (rather unexpected) sales success of Tau and BT. Kudos to FC for the 'from downtown' call that turned out right.

P.S Self contgatulatory statements in your avatar will by punished by relentless spamming :p

Keichi246
17-05-2005, 15:32
Personally - I'm kinda psyched at the thought, but it really could have gone either way...

Reasons TO do a Revised Tau codex.
1) Codex is approaching 4 Years old - not as old as the "grandfathers" of the codex world - but not THAT young either.
2) It was the first of the "new model" codexes - it is already in the larger page count format. It's not like they would have to do a large amount of painting/writing/etc to bring it up to speed - it is already there.
3) One rumor I have heard says that the Tau are one of the "bigger sellers" of the Xenos armies - and that the existing print supplies of the Tau codex may be running low. It may be a case that, like they did with the Dark Angels and Dark Eldar codexes – they feel that if they are going to be running a new print run anyway – they may as well do some minor changes. (Remove/update the Drone rules, add Landing gear or not, put in human Auxiliaries, Rail Rifles, and add any other minor tweaks). This would increase their stockpile AND increase sales of said Codex.
4) The model line is already mostly in plastic, and fully modeled – the only unit that isn’t modeled is the Human auxilaries (which is by their own admission - a "conversion unit"). Very little additional work is needed on the line itself, which looks pretty good and has all existing options available. If they added any new units - it is simply getting one or two metal models produced - or "possibly" a recut sprue. Certainly not huge resource investment like Orks or Eldar require.

Reasons NOT to do a revised codex
1) Several other armies seriously need the revamp before the Tau do. Eldar need their rules updated – and quite a few of their models could use a bit of love. The Ork rules are generally good and rather balanced – but physically the codex layout design is atrocious, the Ork model line is a bit sparse, and the vehicles are seriously out of scale at this point. To be honest – both of these armies “deserve” a rebuild before the Tau.
2) I want my favorite little blue heads to be further DOWN the codex creep path dangit… :p

Basically – if they are going to redo the Tau codex at this point – it is simply because it IS an easy project. Basically – it is a "gimme" they can throw out to feed the voracious masses while they spend real time/resources on the projects that really do need it. They know they have to redo Orks and Eldar, but both of those products are going to need the one resource no one has a lot of - time. The Tau codex is something they can fiddle a few values - throw it to the playtesters and get back to real work on something hard.

Remember – GW is a business first. They make money by selling product. And they have to HAVE product to sell it. For purely business reasons alone – it is not a stupid idea – just an mildly unsavory one. I'd really prefer they did the other older xenos races first. But I am not at all surprised. It simply makes sense from a business standpoint.

Also regarding Forge World - apparently Tau have been doing rather well for Forge World. They have said in the past that Forge World sales information does influence certain GW products (if something flies off the shelves at Forge World - they know there is an interest in that idea/race/product.) Imperial Armor 3: the Taros Campaign is due this summer. That is a minor point to consider as well - so far Forge World has had a reputation for having their big books linked with a codex. (probably because ideas for both "gestate" in the same general environment)

Dave Gaidasz
Armies - Tau, Tyranids, Cadians, Dark Angels, Deathwing, Grey Knights, Armored Company

grizzly ruin
17-05-2005, 15:59
the reason for plastic scouts fits into GW's long term plan on having all the core elements of both systems (The Core Units in WFB and the Troops selections in 40K) in plastic, just hope that they rank up with the current metals


my daemons are waiting...

charlie_c67
17-05-2005, 16:10
Why do people seem to equate the fact that eldar and orks are coming out lower down the list as a bad thing? I'm sorry but that just not true. The eldar, DE and Ork dexes need a lot of work done to them, major work in the case of the pointy ears. There's a question over the model range, a fair bit needs refurbing/bringing up to date. The fluff needs sorting out and in the case of CWE & DE is being done together at the start and being split at the appropriate time. Those tasks are major undertakings, I think the fact that the Eldar are being tentitively worked on now and not due next year give some indication of the sheer scale of the problem facing the dev team. So to the people claiming it's driven only by the bean counters or that GW only care about xyz races, perhaps you need to take a step back and look at the wider picture. For each project there's a finite amount of staff and funds, therefore the fact that DE & CWE is being worked on as we speak should be seen as encouraging . So what if Tau and two flavours of marine are coming out sooner? They need less work, less minis, will take less time leaving more dev time to those that need it. More time spent on a range/dex can only be taken as a good thing.

Tenoch
17-05-2005, 18:13
@ person above
Because it means I have to wait yet another two years to play with a balanced and fun army list, huge chunks of the ldar are either bland and dull or just lame to play with or against. Can't speak for Orks though.


While what you say may be true if you follow the same logic you could say "why don't they release every codex before Eldar and Orks seeing as they need loads of work, that way we can spend a decade making them perfect"

philbrad2
17-05-2005, 18:37
Mmmmmm Cake. Very appropriate since yesterday was my birthday. So far, being 30 sucks.

Wait until you hit 38!!! ;)



IF GW really revamps the Tau now I hope they turn them into a true and fearfull shooty army with higher BS or at least doctrines allowing you to reroll misses.
More and bigger crisis suits and walkers would be nifty, hopefully they´look less anime like and more like FWs stuff.... And geez give the Kroot a usefull armour save!

I think such things may be a little in the 'plus' side for the Tau what about 'minuses' ??? Tau in rapid fire situations even with BS 3 are formidible in a full Fire Warrior team. You really want to improve their Bs or allow them to reroll wounds :eek:

:cool:

Wintermute
17-05-2005, 19:23
[QUOTE=philbrad]Wait until you hit 38!!! ;)
QUOTE]

Philbrad speaks the Truth!!!!

Perhaps the next Tau Codex may include the lists for different Tau Septs which were rumoured to appear in a Chapter Approved article which never materialised.

XaNder
17-05-2005, 19:53
Just a guess: Pf with rail-rifle,Septs a-la Eldar craftworld or (more likely, doctrines/traits), new suit, maybe some aftermath of the EoT with a new IC, some tweak to the KrootOx and puf! new Tau Codex. Ops... I forgot: add everything that was in the old Codex :D. Did I forget anything else?

XaN

--edit: anyone else has been to Baltimore this weekend and can confirm this rumour of new Tau dex? Or is it a Sept dex?

philbrad2
17-05-2005, 20:41
Philbrad speaks the Truth!!!!


Ain't it the truth ... might use that quote on my siggy :) ;)


Perhaps the next Tau Codex may include the lists for different Tau Septs which were rumoured to appear in a Chapter Approved article which never materialised.

That would be cool, some limited 'traits' for the Tau, it would give them a bit more of a less generic feel. Seems like GW are pretty keen to allow players to customise their armies with minor rule tweaks. Every codex for a good while has allowed this if the Tau codex is next after BT's I'd expect some customisation to be built in to their rules.


:cool:

boogle
17-05-2005, 21:20
i forgot about the Human Auxilla

oh and by the way philbrad, hope Kylie gets well very soon

Dakkagor
17-05-2005, 22:48
Oh good, I was hoping I'd have to wait 3+ years for my shooty orks to be a viable army again.

Not.

Damn straight.

This sets it. I'm going to games day UK this year, just to *********** rant at the developer studio in person. Tau!?! ******* TAU? If its a quick project, I want 3 codexs that year, not two! I don't want to wait 2 years for my orkses. Its just not fair. I've been playing orks since before the tau existed, or even before the accursed necrons existed.

boogle
17-05-2005, 23:00
guess who'll be asked to leave this year then ^^^^^^^

Brimstone
17-05-2005, 23:04
Damn straight.

This sets it. I'm going to games day UK this year, just to *********** rant at the developer studio in person. Tau!?! ******* TAU? If its a quick project, I want 3 codexs that year, not two! I don't want to wait 2 years for my orkses. Its just not fair. I've been playing orks since before the tau existed, or even before the accursed necrons existed.

I think we will probably get three codices next year, Tau in the early part, Eldar mid-year and what looks like Blood Angels towards the end.

I don't think Tau have delayed the Orks they were probably competing with Eldar for the mid year slot and Eldar are further along than the Orks.

Dakkagor
17-05-2005, 23:06
guess who'll be asked to leave this year then ^^^^^^^

Now thats something to put into a sig ;)

But seriously, a bit of a gripe so they know what some of the longer standing players think can't hurt. I think GW is missing a huge chunk of its demographic here: the people with jobs and serious money to spend. pandering to the kiddies with their poorly painted power armour armies who ain't going to playing after they loose 5 times in a row to my orks isn't worth it, considering
I'm going to buy GW stuff until I have a medical reason not to.

boogle
17-05-2005, 23:06
I still think that Orks (if they can get the Vehicle Sprue done), may sneak out before Eldar as they have less reworking model wise and rules wise than the Eldar

boogle
17-05-2005, 23:16
Now thats something to put into a sig ;)

But seriously, a bit of a gripe so they know what some of the longer standing players think can't hurt. I think GW is missing a huge chunk of its demographic here: the people with jobs and serious money to spend. pandering to the kiddies with their poorly painted power armour armies who ain't going to playing after they loose 5 times in a row to my orks isn't worth it, considering
I'm going to buy GW stuff until I have a medical reason not to.

Sadly they see that the new gamers who have parents with lots of disposible income as the major demographic, not the veterans as we are perceived as those who have most of our armies anyway, and only occasionally spend money with them, we are the ones who do all the whinging, but as we are perceived as not being big spenders, we aren't really taken into account on what is good to come out

Delicious Soy
17-05-2005, 23:24
Am I the only one seeing the problem with throwing all the 'too hard' codecies at the end of the line? One of two things are going to happen:

1. Production slows to one codex every 9 months or worse

2. We get inferior product that hasn't had the time and effort put into it.

I think the body corporate should be goading the Development team into balancing the release schedule to maintain release at a decent rate instead of pandering to their 'its too hard!' attitude.

Keichi246
17-05-2005, 23:50
Am I the only one seeing the problem with throwing all the 'too hard' codecies at the end of the line? One of two things are going to happen:

1. Production slows to one codex every 9 months or worse

2. We get inferior product that hasn't had the time and effort put into it.

I think the body corporate should be goading the Development team into balancing the release schedule to maintain release at a decent rate instead of pandering to their 'its too hard!' attitude.

Um - I think you got the cart before the horse there, son. What do you think this type of move is?

They probably ARE going to increase the rate of release. That's why they are tossing in an easy codex. I figure it is going to be 1 Marine codex (easy rules wise - just need a few sculptors to tweak out the few additions), 1 "easy" project (easy defined as a project that does NOT require massive rules revamps, or sculpts) and one "hard" project (something that DOES require massive rules revamps and sculpts) for the next 3 years - which will just about clean up the backlog. (3 marine codecies- BA, SW, DA; 3 "easy" projects - Tau, Necrons, Dark Eldar (will be easy after Eldar are finished); and 3 "hard" projects: Eldar, Orks, Chaos and/or Alien Hunters) After that it is anyone's guess. By alternating codices - they are increasing their ability to produce codexes in a timely manner - without overloading their staff. There's a term for that - it's called load balancing. ;)

It's not like they are going to do every OTHER codex before Eldar and Orks - and then say - oops - time for 5th edition. (but it would be kinda funny ;D ) Everyone KNOWS the Sisters/Witchhunters have the tail end charlie position locked down. (they are 2 for 2 for being the last codex of an edition. ) :D

Yes - by rights Eldar and Ork probably shoud have been done first. But as I said before - GW is a business - businesses make money by selling new product - and you have to HAVE new product to sell it. Let them make new product - not complain when they do.... :rolleyes:

Dave Gaidasz

Farseer Cirdan
18-05-2005, 01:24
Yes I must give credit where credit is due, I was skeptical when I first saw FC's arguement, but I had a change of heart after a few conversations highlighted the (rather unexpected) sales success of Tau and BT. Kudos to FC for the 'from downtown' call that turned out right.

P.S Self contgatulatory statements in your avatar will by punished by relentless spamming :p
I'm doing my best to refrain. :D

I miss my old signature from Killjoy about Eldar getting rending ponies...

What do I expect to really see different in the Tau codex (besides fixed drone rules and maybe a new crisis suit or vehicle)? New Alien Races. GW will use the fact that the Codex didn't need a whole lot of work to introduce a few new allies to the Tau similar to the Kroot. I'm not sure what they will be, but they'll be there.

Inquisitor Engel
18-05-2005, 01:42
*AHEM*

http://www.portent.net/forums/showpost.php?p=34544&postcount=76

philbrad2
18-05-2005, 02:02
philbrad, hope Kylie gets well very soon

Cheers BOOG's really put a dampener on my day hearing that on the news this morning going into work. Just glad I didn't shell out to see Miss Minogue in Oz.


guess who'll be asked to leave this year then ^^^^^^^

That'll rank along with the "Why did Chaos win the EoT campaign??" Question a few years back...

Chill people. I think Chicago Gamesday will be the best event for us to get a feel for 2006, once Nids are out of the way focus will concentrate on BT's which I'd expect to form the basis of 40K seminar presentations at GD from Chicago onwards. As to whether we'll get conformation of the next race after BT's who knows. If the switch is to 3 codices they might be out in the first quarter 2006, its been mentioned that all BT mini releases will be out before Xmas 05 so this would leave a pretty big hole in GW's 40K releases from Xmas 05 until mid 06, when the next six monthly codex would be expected. Switching to 3 codices would work in GW's favour here, all the BT releases out of the door by close of 05 ready for a codex release early in 06. If GW were to draw out BT releases into February 06 I'd expect us only to see 2 codicies in 2006.

We haven't had it confirmed about Tau codex coming out or a potential output switch to 3 codices per year but I'd agree with BRIMSTONE's predictions for '06. Two 'minor' codices Tau/SM chapter and a 'major' release like Orks/Eldar. We've been hearing about new plastic Ork vehicles since armound Xmas I've a sneaking feeling thse might get the codex over Eldar.


Let me say the following:

Well, the "Nemesis" approach, of Ultramarines VS Tyranids, Black Templars VS Orks has a large amount of weight as far as the Game Development Team is concerned. The Marine Codex had a lot of stuff regarding Tyranids in it.

*Flips through shiney new Black Templars Codex*

Yes, I certainly see alot of anti-Ork material there.

*Smells that new book smell*

AHHHHH sometime you can really go off people can't you :D .... the Nemesis/Adversary theory proves right ?? (bear out what I've just typed above at least ... :) )


DISCLAIMER: Yes, I have a copy, no I cannot confirm or deny rumours regarding the list, rules, points costs or changes, so don't even bother asking. It's for my playtesting, and revealing anything from it would violate my NDA. I'll say that again - You will not get any Black Templars info out of me.

Now come on ENG would we ask you to do that bud??? ;)


I miss my old signature from Killjoy about Eldar getting rending ponies...

Anyone know if KILLJOY or **** SECURITY ACCESS DENIED **** as he's known (top bloke sorted me out with a =I= Lorr mini long before it was released for GW's 30th Anniversary) has surfaced again. I know he was getting some 'flak' from certain areas of GW, no doubt the PORTENT URL is one close monitored for traffic via GW's corporate internet access.

:cool:

Inquisitor Engel
18-05-2005, 02:13
Anyone know if KILLJOY or **** SECURITY ACCESS DENIED **** as he's known (top bloke sorted me out with a =I= Lorr mini long before it was released for GW's 30th Anniversary) has surfaced again. I know he was getting some 'flak' from certain areas of GW, no doubt the PORTENT URL is one close monitored for traffic via GW's corporate internet access.
Killjoy no longer works for GW.

From what I gather, he left of his own accord due his disagreements over some portions of GW's policy.

sulla
18-05-2005, 07:36
In my opinion the Tau are one of GWs projects that simply didnt meet the publics expectations. While they have some nice models like the tanks and the fire warriors (hell I even own a Hammerhead myself though I don´t play Tau) the concept of a shooty army with BS 3 just makes me laugh.

Huh? Never heard of the imperial guard?

Darius Rhiannon
18-05-2005, 07:41
Apparently not.

S5 weapons hitting 50% of the time as basic infantry weapons?...

Yes please...

philbrad2
18-05-2005, 09:05
Killjoy no longer works for GW.

From what I gather, he left of his own accord due his disagreements over some portions of GW's policy.

Pity KJ was a sound guy. The leaving reason seems to be nothing new, another victom of GW relentless strive for profits above all else - not a practise solely the remit of GW I might add. Shame, wish him well it what ever he does.


Apparently not.

S5 weapons hitting 50% of the time as basic infantry weapons?...

Yes please...

You could see why Tau can sell well. A testament to the ethos if you can't fight your way out of a wet paper bag - shoot the paper bag before it gets you!

:cool:

xerxeshavelock
18-05-2005, 12:40
...if you can't fight your way out of a wet paper bag - shoot the paper bag before it gets you!

:cool:

Now THAT'S sig worthy! Spoken like a true Tau player!

philbrad2
18-05-2005, 13:22
Now THAT'S sig worthy! Spoken like a true Tau player!

Yes my 12 year old UM playing son regularly borrows my Tau force to play with in his school gaming club and keeps wondering why he llept loosing when he charged Khorne Bezerkers!!!! LOL. So I put it in those terms to him and now those Bezerkers die in a hail of pulse rounds before they reach him. That's ma boy...

Oh I forgot... that line is now copyright Phil Bradley May 2005 .. and errr patent pending .. oh and a registered trademark of Phil Corps.. :D

:cool:

Sai-Lauren
18-05-2005, 13:23
If the switch is to 3 codices they might be out in the first quarter 2006, its been mentioned that all BT mini releases will be out before Xmas 05 so this would leave a pretty big hole in GW's 40K releases from Xmas 05 until mid 06, when the next six monthly codex would be expected. Switching to 3 codices would work in GW's favour here, all the BT releases out of the door by close of 05 ready for a codex release early in 06. If GW were to draw out BT releases into February 06 I'd expect us only to see 2 codicies in 2006.

There is a little thing called Warhammer Fantasy Battle you know ;)
Whilst Wood Elves is the last of the major races, there's still Chaos Dwarves (need a lot of work), possible updates for things like the Dark Elves, and expansion of armies which have either only really been mentioned so far, or haven't had a lot of input like Cathay and Nippon, Kislev and Norsca, Araby (which may be the next campaign book ala Lustria, expanding the Tomb Kings, bringing back Nagash), Dogs Of War and so on. GW can alternate between 40k and WFB easily enough.

Add in anything else for LoTR, any releases of what used to be in the specialist range (aren't the rules essentially complete for BFG 1.1?) and they won't be short of releases.


Am I the only one seeing the problem with throwing all the 'too hard' codecies at the end of the line? One of two things are going to happen:

Or 3) The armies get dropped altogether, and any reference to them is stamped on immediately. Questions get asked and ignored in games day seminars, message boards fill with bring them back/don't bring them back threads and fan lists spring up, the finally, nearly ten years later, someone within GW eventually posts the real story of what happened.

(Looks for innocent smiley, settles on ->) :D

charlie_c67
18-05-2005, 13:29
Sorry but who are you suggesting are going to be dropped?

philbrad2
18-05-2005, 14:01
Sai-Lauren quite aware of WHFB - dont play it, but I'm aware of it. GW have done pretty well providing support and releases for each game system and LoTR, so I don't see that changing in the immediate future.

TBH I'm not bothered what releases WHFB has coming out, I am only interested in 40K and we are commenting on release rumours for 40K on a 40K forum. I'll let GW worry about the logistics of release schedules for all three game systems. WHFB have had a totally new race recently in the form of Orges which will have taken up a good wedge of studio resources, with the neglect 40K has had since LoTR hit the shops I think its time 40K had a bit of 'quality time' fro Games Dev, remeber 40K limped along with 3rd ed with a multi-patched set of rules and armies for several years before 4th ed came out. From what I've seen, WHFB isn't exactly short of new and forthcoming releases now is it. :D (I like this smiley - innocent or not)


aren't the rules essentially complete for BFG 1.1?

Didn't I hear somewhere this had been shelved due to Andy C's other commitments like Starship Troopers :confused:

:cool:

Sai-Lauren
18-05-2005, 16:00
I'm not suggesting any army is going to be dropped, I'm just making a point back to 2nd edition with what happened to a certain army which is no longer in 40k. "Too difficult", "no one wants to do it", wound up being discontinued.

Philbrad - 40k has been neglected in favour of LoTR? Sorry, I really have to laugh there. 40k is GW's favorite son, it's never been neglected since it was launched as Rogue Trader along with 30 RTB01 beakie marines in thin cardboard box. Yes, 3rd edition probably did hang around too long, but considering some of the armies didn't even get their rule books in the time it was orginally supposed to have been replaced in (Sisters for example), that's not a problem (let's not even consider the unholy mess they would have been if they had somehow come in within 3rd edition's original projected lifetime). And as my old sig used to say, currently it's v3.1, not v4.

As for BFG, I thought AC was freelancing on it around Troopers, but the closing of Fanatic killed the re-release plans.

grizzly ruin
18-05-2005, 16:47
I miss my old signature from Killjoy about Eldar getting rending ponies...

I miss that sig too. It was one of my favorites on portent.

self biased
18-05-2005, 17:26
summary? the thread's gotten too long to read.

Brimstone
18-05-2005, 17:31
summary? the thread's gotten too long to read.

That's why the rumour roundup is there. ;)

If you want the discussion then read the thread.

self biased
18-05-2005, 17:39
bah. it looked like there was a really good threadjacking in progess, too.

philbrad2
18-05-2005, 18:12
Philbrad - 40k has been neglected in favour of LoTR? Sorry, I really have to laugh there.


[HAN SOLO] Laugh it up fuzzball [/HAN SOLO] :D

C'mon SAI I think you just answered my point for me. From 2001 LoTR had 3 games released for it GW were cashing in on the LoTR hype of the time and made cash from it but both its core products were neglected to some extent, I think 40K lost out more in this period. I still say WHFB and 40K will be around a long time after LoTR is forgotten.

WHFB had 5th ed with lots of race revamps. I admit 40K had new races in the form of Tau and we had EoT with all its associated releases (Chaos, IG DH's) the genral hint from Games Dev that all thses forces were "4th ed ready" it just we had no 4th ed!But on the development front of 40K you really can't say 40K was heavily supported to the effect of establishing a new game/edition was it? We had 2 lots of trial rules for it in the dying years of 3rd ed thats the first GW game I've ever known to have such rules published without there beinga new editon put out. If 40K was GWs "favourite son" it would have been supported like it. One rumour as to Andy C's departure was down to the extended period gamers had to put up with 3rd ed and the lateness of 4th ed. Don't know the truth behind these but I know 4th ed was at least 18ths behind when it should have been released. I know 4th ed isn't that radical a departure, its not like a totally new game was developed now was it? I sat in on numerous GD and event seminars where AC very strongly hinted at the time we'd see 4th ed, the hint he always came back with was "When do the LoTR films end - you work it out!"

OK we're getting sidelined here a bit, I respect your thoughts and opinions but before we get busted for thread deviation (ohhh errr :eek: ) I think we'll aggree to disagree about the neglect of the 40k game system in the early '00's.

Back to the regualr scheduled threading ...

:cool:

ionfish
01-06-2005, 15:49
So Tau after Templars and Eldar in late 2006/early 2007. Wonder where I've heard that before...Kudos. And a belated "happy birthday".

Halt!_Stoj!
02-06-2005, 09:11
The whole problem with the Elder is they stuffed up the 3rd Edition codex so badly. The rules hardly improved on the ones in the rulebook for christ sake. As well GW did not release enough new models to make them visually interesting enough for new gamers to walk into a shop and say "they look cool, I'll collect them." No interest from new gamers equels poor sales, simple as that.