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Xinithorp
16-05-2005, 21:45
Roight.
I've been experimenting with some conversions around turning handgunners into British soldiers from the War of 1812. So far so good. It's a little tricky, but I think I've got it down.

The idea is I've got lots of handgunners, but to keep it from being ridiculously boring I've added other units which fit the theme of the time.
Militia standing in for voyageurs (fur traders and such)
Wizards for priests (I'll probably use Brettonian pilgrims for that monkish look)
Shawnee tribesmen for huntsmen.
And of course a cannon.

(For more info on The War of 1812, go here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_of_1812))

Anyway, with that in mind here is the list.
http://www.thegreatuncleanone.com/viewShort.asp?ArmyID=135969

Basically, the gunmen all hang back and shoot anything that moves. This in combination with the twin mortars should help whittle down key units.
Meanwhile, the free company all advance and take on whatever is left and pull something into range for a flank charge from the pistoliers.
The cannon should deal with monsters and such and help with taking out ranks should the oppurtunity arise.
Should things get dire, I guess the handgunners could jump into combat as well. ;)
Bayonets!

The huntsmen basically pester anything they can. I realize now they aren't quite as agile or expendable as Lizardmen skinks, but I think they have a purpose.

Here's a basic setup which could be modified depending on terrain (obviously hills are preferable):
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v295/Xinithorp/Paln3a.png


Comments appreciated.

I am willing to make a few changes to the list, but please keep in mind the theme I'm going after.
I'd like to keep this somewhat historically accurate but still Warhammer-friendly.
While I understand spearmen are pretty key in an Empire army, they just don't fit here.
And tanks weren't introduced until a hundred years later. ;)


Thanks for any help.

Louis21
18-05-2005, 13:44
Too many handgunners, game tables are too small for them. I don`t like non-fantasy background, maybe better choice are Nuln blackpowder weapon army?

Xinithorp
20-05-2005, 01:42
Game tables are obviously not too small as I've provided a scale model of my set-up.

Anything I replace them with is just going to eat points or take up just as much room anyway.




Do you have any comments about the list? "Too many handgunners" really doesn't go into any depth.

Adlan
28-05-2005, 21:13
Possibly Bronzino and his galloper guns? very themed? with napolionic 6 pounders galloping back and fourth (not sure if the 1812 army was issued, though they were around at that era. you would know better than me, my history goes as far as the raign of the long bow and the napolionic campains, then it gets sketchy)

Angelripper
30-05-2005, 18:07
I tried an Imperial Army with an Civil War theme. It's just a funlist and went not quite well against an normal Fantasy army cause you got some restrictions if you keep up to the theme. After all a Unit of 10 Handgunners with two detachements of 5 Handgunners are quite effective. They can provide covering Fire when the Parent unit is attacked and 15 Shots a turn is quite nice. I also use two big units of Pistoliers, the can blast through anything. Combined with Militia an some Big Guns they can do some damage.
Nonetheless an all Blackpowder army is more for fun than for winning. Cause you stand at your tableedge firing until you see nothing but smoke. When your enemy is in CC you die big time because your armoursave. well armoursave?
The best games I had were against Darkelves Cityguard armies. you got some good Napoleonic/civil War feeling when two armies stand line to line firing until the game is done.

samw
31-05-2005, 18:14
Give your elector a decent weapon. A Dragon Bow (modelled as a gun) would be in theme, along with a great weapon for when the enemy hits. The wyrmslayer sword is terrible. Take him off his horse too, he's very vulnerable upthere and he should be with the troops steadying them. Sharpe always fought on foot! :p

Frankly
01-06-2005, 14:19
I like the idea, but I think your list is really fragile.

BSBs are always good in empire armies, the imperal banner is a good safety net(a real life saver) for all your small units taking panic tests.

Don't worry about tooling your general up for combat, use him how a 1812 army would use him, for his leadership. Thats his biggest boon, keeping your other units from panicing and running away. Get him a ward save and thick magical armour. Put him in a unit and keep him safe, that L.d.9 is his greatest asset in an armylist like this.

Drop the light armour from the free company, just isn't worth it. It averages out better if you put those points into more models on the field.

I'd say buy your gunners in units of 10 so you can fit them all on the field. Buying standards for these units is just giving points away, so is buying champions unless your giving them long rifles. 6 units of 10 would be pretty solid, if you want more go for it, you can never have to many gunners. :evilgrin:

Think about going for two cannons and a mortar and a DoWcannon as a rare choice. cannons are better at killing models and getting rid of your major threat ... heavy cavalry.

pistlors are better run in units of five, less of a points sink, you don't get any bonuses for ranked up light cavalry.

Nukem
03-06-2005, 19:26
HAHAHAHA YES!! I have made a Civil War style army just like this. Imperial banner, Elector count with a handgun a level 1 scroll cady and a Engineer with a long rifle. Then a bunch of handgunners :rollseyes: 2 cannons a morter and a unit of 6 pistoliers. and 2 helblasters hehe. I love this list, yeah if the enemy gets to your lines your @*$#ed but with that many shots they will be hurting. I would love to fight your army... just sitting back and unleshing volley after volley of lead. Damn that would be a great fight.

Xinithorp
17-07-2005, 22:39
Well, I've gone through the list again after a long period of nothingness and I'm ready to give it another go:

Greatuncleanone isn't too happy right now so I have to do this manually:

LORD
Elector Count
Armour of Meteoric Iron
Holy Relic
Sword of Justice
Pistol
190

HERO
Wiz
2 Dispell Scrolls
Level Up!
145

Wiz
Seal of Desruction
Level Up!
145

Cap'n
BSB
Banner of Valour
Full Plate
123

Character Total: 603

CORE
28 Militia
Full Command
165

28 Militia
Full Command
165

12 Handgunners
Musician
Marksman

Detatchment of 5 Handgunners
Detatchment of 5 Handgunners
186

10 Handgunners
Musician
Marksman

Detatchment of 5 Handgunners
Detatchment of 5 Handgunners
170

10 Handgunners
Musician
Marksman

Detatchment of 5 Handgunners
Detatchment of 5 Handgunners
170

10 Huntsmen
100

SPECIAL
5 Pistoliers
Marksman
102

5 Pistoliers
Marksman
102

Mortar
75

Mortar
75

RARE
Dogs of War Cannon
85

Grand Total: 1998

Basically, the Militia all march ahead getting into combat hijinks while the Pistoliers add flanky goodness. I'll admit the Militia are fodder, but I think therer are too many of them to ignore. And they'll take some of the heat from the handgunners. The handgunners (all 62 of 'em ;)) hang out in the rear adding fire, whittling down enemy units and trying not to get killed. The mortars do their thing, and who couldn't love a cannon?
The two wizards I feel add a great amount of magic protection (A respectable 4 Dispell Dice total) with 3 scrolls and a chance to take out a trouble spell such as Conflagration of Doom. I'm thinking I'd go Lore of Heavens with these guys and keep them chillin' with some handgunners. They can provide decent offensive magic.


Now, I'm not too sure on the placement of the BSB and general. Part of me thinks they should join the Militia and keep them relatively alright, but I also think that hanging back with the handgunners while staying within 12" would keep them a little bit safer while still providing some benefits to the apt combat in front.
Also, keeping some of the main handgunners immune to panic could prove very beneficial. I have a feeling that they'd be taking a few checks from shooting and magic.

Overall I kind of feel like it's a bit weak, but I think there is so much there and - with the exception the general - nothing is worth more than 165 points. It's approaching horde status.
Maybe I'm just used to Lizardmen where Saurus units can easily get into the 300 range and characters cost a whole lot. ;)

Comments welcome and encouraged!


EDIT: I realize that since this thread's original creation, a specific army-list forum has been created. Could a mod please move this there? Thank you!

Lord Kitchener
19-07-2005, 14:18
Hi Xinithorp,
I understand your army list is based on a more historical theme, but I would try giving a silver horn (45pts) to one of you wizards, this will allow you to rally any units anywhere on the battlefield. I know you want lots of hand gunners (I love em and take em all the time) but I feel you should think about taking units of ten and no detachments. Even think about putting a marksman with a long rifle in each unit; just imagine picking up four dice and saying to your opponent “four long rifles at your general” or “at your wizard” a very good way to get rid of your enemies magic, just imagine the feelings running through their veins (and the lack of bowel control) oh such good in black powder. I think you should also keep your Bsb and your Elector count with your rearguard, as I would not expect your militia units to last to long in combat (Swordsmen are very good, it’s that armour save and unusual weapon skill). Keeping all of your characters at the rear will add to your idea of strength in firepower, also if your enemies make it to your defensive lines, then you will get more of a feel, of a glorious last stand and be able to spread the love, or leadership.

I must say, I do like your ideas on the whole and I wish you all the fun and good luck with your Empire army.

Martin K