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hendybadger
08-11-2009, 22:23
I am a 40K player that has just started a gaming club.
I would like to get into WHFB to exapnd my collections, models, games and opponents.
But. Even though I love Fantasy films and books ect, I cant seem to find an army that inspires me enough to collect it.
My current armies and Nid-Zilla / Stealer Tyranids and Grey Knights if it matters.
What would you suggest for me?
And why?

Tokamak
08-11-2009, 22:33
Do you have any preferences in models? Your 40k choices are both organic and highly armoured.

How about something low tech like ogres, beastmen and orcs/goblins? Have you already seen the new skaven? Note how strong you can theme your army to one clan these days.

Grimstonefire
08-11-2009, 22:34
Firstly, what sorts of things do you find interesting from a fluff point of view?

Character rich? i.e. Each and every troop has a worthy background? Or character light where 99% of the army needs little or no fluff.

Your other armies suggest to me that you like armies with powerful themes; nids because of the horror the big gribbles inspire, Grey knights because of their epic struggle in the eternal battle.

It's actually quite an eclectic mix, because both are specialised but very different.

If you like the mutations aspect, combat heavy with the chance of big gribblies I guess Daemons of Chaos, Warriors of Chaos or Beasts of Chaos would be a good choice?

Not sure what army I'd suggest for someone who plays grey knights?

hendybadger
08-11-2009, 22:38
Not that keen on mutations. And Im not really a fan of massed similar/identical models.
Also not keen on bog standard humans.
My would be main opponent has a large O+G army and a large Skaven army.
And my wife has lots of Daemons.

Apart from that Im not really sure what I fancy. I am very model oriantated. They are the main reason I pick a force.

Emeraldw
08-11-2009, 22:47
If you are model oriented and don't like "bog standard" humans, have you looked at Warriors of chaos?

Warriors have quite possibly the best selection of amazing models. Warriors and Knights alone are just too cool.

After that it leaves 3 shades of elves, Dwarves, Lizardmen and 2 undead.

The number of armies in fantasy makes it so you can really collect the army you want, can you give us some idea what kind of army you like to play too? Do you have a particular color you like? When you read or watch fantasy books/movies, what kinds of things do you enjoy from it?

hendybadger
08-11-2009, 22:52
I like the look of the heavily armoured Warriors of Chaos. But dont really like the Marauders.
Elves and Dwarves dont really grab me.
But the Undead and Lizardmen are interesting.
Army wise I dont really now how I would like to play. Not tried yet.

O&G'sRule
08-11-2009, 22:56
Clearly a fan of hand to hand so chaos warriors would be the obvious choice, lots of monsters and deadly in combat, perfect tyranid substitute. Ogres when theyre redone perhaps, but theyre really struggling now against the new armies. I guess lizardmen might suit your paint style if you're used to painting nids, plus theres plenty of big dino's in there

hendybadger
08-11-2009, 23:01
My Tyranids and Grey Knights use as much ranged as they do close combat.
And from what Ive seen shooting does play a decent role in WHFB games.
What about WoC without hounds or Marauders? Viable?
And how do the Undead forces play?

I may look into going for 2 forces. 1 evil and 1 good.

Emeraldw
08-11-2009, 23:05
I like the look of the heavily armoured Warriors of Chaos. But dont really like the Marauders.
Elves and Dwarves dont really grab me.
But the Undead and Lizardmen are interesting.
Army wise I dont really now how I would like to play. Not tried yet.

My friend didn't like Marauders either. You can do an entire army of just chaos warriors and not take any marauders if you want. Though how practical should be directed to the tactics section.

Lizardmen might also be a good choice. I find them to be visually good looking as a whole army and as a list it is very flexible with many options.

Vampire Counts to me aren't visually striking. There just isn't much you can do to spruce up those core troops in my mind. List wise it is an attrition army and doesn't have a lot of variety.

Tomb Kings look much better than Vampire counts. The Egyptian theme just has so much more that can be done to make it stand out. Though you will likely get tired of painting bone.

Ogres have some good models and they look pretty good. The only issue in my mind is the fact that their unit options are all ogres. This means smaller diversity in overall look.

Another idea is a forest spirit army. You may not like elves but Wood Elves can field armies that have very little elves in them. Like the idea of a moving, killing forest? :) There are some good models in the range as well.

Edit:
Vampire Counts utilize a lot of magic to raise back units and get into combat. Attrition is the name of the game in general.

Tomb Kings: Similar to Vampire counts in regards to being attrition but less so. I haven't played them or against them so I will let someone who has add more but there are some fun options in the army like a bone catapult, a bone giant, scorpions, chariots and Giant Anubis headed killers.

O&G'sRule
08-11-2009, 23:10
Well vampires are probably the second hardest army in the game after daemons, lots of magic, nasty characters unbreakable units and well.... vampires. Tomb kings are basically a slower horde that can use lots of chariots and things coming out of the ground. WoC are very viable without those 2 things

O&G'sRule
08-11-2009, 23:12
Vampire Counts to me aren't visually striking. There just isn't much you can do to spruce up those core troops in my mind. List wise it is an attrition army and doesn't have a lot of variety.


Vampire armies painted by a very good painter look amazing.

O&G'sRule
08-11-2009, 23:15
coming from 40k you might also like the wood elves, theyre as close to a 40k army as fantasy gets, alot of skirmishers, alot of dedicated shooting and dedicated combat troops and the characters, whilst hard, aren't all important

Emeraldw
09-11-2009, 00:04
Vampire armies painted by a very good painter look amazing.

More a matter of diversity and model types. Skeletons, ghouls and zombies just don't look appealing to me no matter what you really do to them.

ChaosVC
09-11-2009, 00:16
Sometimes to be inspired to collect a certain army, you need to read more about the background or novel related to the army/armies. If that doesn't get you going, try looking for the models that you like about those armies or look at other people conversions. If none of those things inspire you, why bother?

Red Metal
09-11-2009, 01:00
Grey Knights make me think of Brettonians - heavily armored warriors fighting for a righteous cause. The Brets could almost act like a pre-cursor to the Grey Knights; maybe you could even use some of the same color-schemes, designs, symbols, etc.

'Nids remind me of a cross between Skaven, Orcs, and Lizardmen, in that they are a low-tech, sort of swarm-style army. Granted Nids do have their own unique tech (of sorts), it doesn't have that "standard-issue" feel of something like a bolter. Likewise, Orcs have their own unique Choppas, Lizardmen have their unique swords, and Skaven have their unique "warpstone" weapons.

Urgat
09-11-2009, 02:32
Hmmm, I know it's a pretty obvious answer, but if you're "very model orientated", as you say, just look through the whole range and pick the army with the models that appeal you the most? And if nothing really appeals to you, maybe you should just reconsider playing WFB, no fun in playing an army you don't like.

Laughingmonk
09-11-2009, 04:58
What sort of fantasy films did you like? What did you like about them? That should serve to guide you in your decision making.

The Red Scourge
09-11-2009, 05:42
Since none of the armies inspire you, then why get into the game at all?

It has quite poor rules and game balance, so its gameplay is rather bad. Not that it isn't fun, and you can't have endless hours of entertainment from these little toy soldiers, but the fun usually comes from the 'attachment' you have to your army.

if you only worry about 'competitive' and aren't interested in any of the armies, then play DoC, they're supposed to be the auto-win-button these days.

Personally I prefer my woodies for the tactical challenge, and my VC for their cool and classy presence on the field :)

Bregalad
09-11-2009, 15:25
Browse the Fantasy project subforum or www.coolminiornot.com for inspiration. There is a.o. a nice desert scheme Lizardmen army there.

gorenut
09-11-2009, 15:50
As soon as I read your 40k army choices, I was going to suggest Lizardmen... then I also saw that you noted them giving you atleast some interest.

I play Lizardmen myself.. I also played nids back in 40k. They were my first army. Guess the common elements of both armies is that they can field a wide range of sized models.. from small, "ogre" sized, and large monsters. They're also both very disciplined while retaining a savage/feral/bestial presence (something that orcs, beastment, etc lack). Both also offer a wide variety with troop types that seem to specialize in what they do well.. which is also very well-represented down to the way their bodies are built. Also, fluffwise, both races are "spawned" not by means of mating. Lastly, both armies can do a hoard list or a big monster list.

I don't think you'd be disappointed with the newly updated Lizardmen.

moose
09-11-2009, 15:57
Tomb Kings sounds your kind of game.

Elite.
Ranged and combat prowess.
Undead.
Nice models / imagery and fluff.
Not overpowered (you play GK).


Moose.

Tae
09-11-2009, 16:05
I am a 40K player that has just started a gaming club.
I would like to get into WHFB to exapnd my collections, models, games and opponents.
But. Even though I love Fantasy films and books ect, I cant seem to find an army that inspires me enough to collect it.
My current armies and Nid-Zilla / Stealer Tyranids and Grey Knights if it matters.
What would you suggest for me?
And why?

I actually have the complete opposite problem - I look at 40k and only see one of two armie - MEQ or horde. Essentially they are (give or take) variants of either of these.

I already own a Marine army, so out of the remaining armies:
Eldar - another expensive, elite army
CSM - Marines with spikes
Dark Eldar - like eldar, only with a rubbish codex
DH - marines
WH - lady marines that are cheaper and squishier
Orks - horde
Nids - horde
Necrons - Marines with a fancy version of FNP
Guard - No I don't want to buy another 3 cases to transport my heavy support choices
Tau - only genuine different army, shame about the codex

So honestly, when I look at 40k my choices seem to boil down to Orks, Nids or Tau, and I'm not playing a horde army as I refuse to require multiple cases for a 1,500 point army.

Compare that to fantasy where every single army inspires me, has differennces which shine through at every level, play differently, have completely unique and indiviual models and generally are more interesting than any 40k armies. Which is a shame as I really want another 40k army, guess I'm stuck waiting for the next Tau book.

Enigmatik1
09-11-2009, 16:45
Tomb kings are basically a slower horde that can use lots of chariots and things coming out of the ground. WoC are very viable without those 2 things

Not quite, Tomb Kings is/are NOT a horde army! Our model count is usually quite low and stays that way. Basically:

Vampire Counts is/are a horde army that can fight like either an elite army or a horde army, depending on build.
Tomb Kings is/are an elite army that fights like a horde army (which takes some serious adjusting to).

Note: I use elite/horde in the context of potential army size, not base fighting ability.

Both are magic/character driven to the extreme. Both are good in their own unique way. But Mummies are infinitely cooler than tired, played-out emo Vampires. :evilgrin:

Darnok
09-11-2009, 16:54
I'd give my vote for Ogres here. I think I'm in the same boat as the OP - lots of nice things spread here and there, but no combination of these in a single army. I love dwarfs for their background and models, but I don't fancy their playstyle. I love some of the models from other ranges too, but it never inspires me enough to collect a whole army.

I decided for Ogres, as they suit my taste on each of the fields that matter for me:

Models: Yes, I like the GW Ogres. The standard troopers are nice, the specialists are great, and some of the characters are pure awesome. I don't like a few, namely Butchers, Yhetis and the special charakters, but I can live with that. The main part of the range looks more than good to me, and I like painting them. In stark contrast to most of the other armies, each of your models actually counts - I don't like painting blocks of 20+ models where only a handful of them matters for gaming and the rest is just there as live counters. This is not the case for Gnoblars, but nothing is perfect, right?

Playstyle: Each of your models is brute force on a stick. Applying that force in the right way is the challenge. And I like that. The army is considered to be slightly "underpowered", but that is not a bad thing in my opinion. To win, you have to actually think what to do with your units, and use specialists and suporting magic to their maximum advantage. Don't expect to win often, if that is of importance to you.

Background: Each of your troopers is a nightmare for any "normal" man out there, and each of them is more than a match for a well trained knight in shiny armour - in the background. Add that brutality with the grim humour of the book - and especially the hilarity of Gnoblars - and I don't know why I should look any further. Not a comedy army, nothing too serious, but very "grim fantasy" with a humorous touch.

This doesn't have to mean anything for you, but I've got the feeling like Ogres might be the right thing for you. Why not have a look at their army book? Why not browse their model range for a bit longer? You might like it...

hendybadger
09-11-2009, 17:02
Comparing my 40K forces to WHFB I have 1 good armoured and 1 evil monsters.
Maybe I could go the other way around fo Fantasy?
Lizardmen - Good monsters
Chaos Warriors - Evil armoured

sprue
09-11-2009, 18:22
I have a similar problem hendy. There are plenty of cool looking armies in Fantasy but I loose interest in them quickly so I've had a hard time trying to get excited enough about a single army to actually complete, paint, and play more than 3 games with it. Then I remembered Dogs of War! Yes their army list is so old that their units are a bit expensive, but you've already experienced that with your GK. But unlike your GK they have variety. You can go with pikemen, skirmishers, shooty, heavy cav and or light cav. They have selections from almost every race. Ogre kingdoms, dark elves, undead, dwarfs and dwarf pirates, dragons, giants, orcs, skinks, and hobgoblins are all in the army list.

I chose this as an army because I'll never have to assemble and paint a hundred skeletons or have to paint an army the same colour and they have a lot of variety.

hendybadger
09-11-2009, 18:38
Are the Dogs of war still legal?

I still cant seem to settle on one the makes me want to collect , build and play often

CommonPirate
09-11-2009, 18:58
Heyo,


Are the Dogs of war still legal?

I still cant seem to settle on one the makes me want to collect , build and play often

Most major tournaments don't allow Dogs of War, but its up to each individual tournament organizer as to whether its allowed or not. For friendly games, I can't think of a single person who wouldn't happily play against Dogs of War. It really is a fun list is many ways. Unique, flavorful, but definately not over the top in any way at all.

Sounds to me like you just aren't into the game of Fantasy really. When I started playing, I had to argue with myself for weeks just to narrow it down to a single army. I literally liked almost every single one. In the end, I got fed up with trying to choose and turned on the TV....lo and behold The Mummy was playing, and I've been a Tomb Kings player ever since. Sure I've had a few stints into other armies, but I always come back to the original. Can't wait for the rumored new Armybook :)

My suggestion is to pick one based off of models, fluff and to a lesser extent playstyle.

O&G'sRule
09-11-2009, 19:11
Not quite, Tomb Kings is/are NOT a horde army! Our model count is usually quite low and stays that way. Basically:



I horde mine, I think if you can have good combat res for an entirely fear causing army you have a great chance of auto breaking your opponent, not much use vs Immune to pschology stuff but thats not that common where I play, thats my opinion anyway

hendybadger
09-11-2009, 19:22
Sounds to me like you just aren't into the game of Fantasy really.

I think you mat have a point.

DarkTerror
09-11-2009, 19:23
Are the Dogs of war still legal?

I still cant seem to settle on one the makes me want to collect , build and play often

I wouldn't go for DoW because they might be permanently removed from the game. Armies which don't receive any support from GW and can cost a fortune to collect can really wear down your spirit.

However, they are fun to play with/against.

gorenut
09-11-2009, 20:27
I think you mat have a point.

Might be true.. but you might give it some time.. read some fluff and then you might change your mind and better be able to select an army. I used to be like you as well.. I started off with 40k back in 2nd ed and Fantasy never inspired me... I even went as far as to get upset at White Dwarf for having half the mag filled with Fantasy stuff.

Now I'm more in line to be with Tae. I can't imagine myself getting back into 40k. Everything is so Marine or Imperium oriented. Only forces I'd consider playing again in 40k are Orks, Tau, or Nids. In fantasy.. I fall into the dangerous realm where every army has some aspect or list that inspires me and then I get very enticed to start an army. With so many other hobbies, my wallet just can't afford it (people who collect/shoot guns/handguns I'm sure can attest that its definitely a hobby even more expensive than Warhammer).

hendybadger
09-11-2009, 20:37
I may fall to the forces of fantasy. But at the moment its becoming a struggle

O&G'sRule
09-11-2009, 21:41
just read the books, if that doesn't do it for you forget it. I'm the same with 40k, I find it totally uninspiring. I like the idea of an ork army, but can't face painting all that green again, and the mech option has some shocking models.

Bregalad
09-11-2009, 21:51
Maybe these are inspiring for Lizardmen:
http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=180760
http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=184160
http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=173548

Keep in mind that Reaper Warlord http://www.reapermini.com/Miniatures/reptus and Dragonblood Miniatures http://www.dragonbloodminis.com/shop_draconids.htm have some nice alternative minis.

hendybadger
09-11-2009, 22:04
They look great. But Im not that sure on the Aztec iconography.

Emeraldw
09-11-2009, 22:20
They look great. But Im not that sure on the Aztec iconography.

What kind of iconography do you like? Also, did you say no to warriors overall? I remember how you said you don't like Marauders but you might be able to find replacements for them.

Zarroc
10-11-2009, 12:54
40k players :rolleyes:

Id suggest finding out how you want to play your games, close combat/heavy magic/movement/shooting etc or a balanced list, once youve decided that, then you select an army that excels in that department

ALso majority of 40k players that i know, just cant grasp warhammer (warhammer actaully involves tactics, not just point and shoot LMAO), and they dont enjoy it, if nothing inspires you, then stick with 40k

Sureshot05
10-11-2009, 13:31
I'm surprised no one has mentioned Wood Elves yet. This is an army which is great when designed around a few unique individuals. Waywatchers, treemen, and the whole eoths of being the few guardians of the woods combined with a highly mobile, equal mix of shooting and hand to hand with some great characters sounds more what you are after in terms of play style.

However, I have to say you definitely seem to either be just not into fantasy or maybe thinking a bit too linearly about it. Conversions can change the entire tone of an army and I would suggest the best way to approach each army in its mind set is to view them as Space Marines or Guard in 40K: I.e. Each army has no one defining appearance or setup.

A few examples of ideas and armies that I've seen or chatted about in a pub!
Empire - standard massed infantry, crusading knights, religious fanatical crusade, cowboys (I've seen this army painted up and was really impressed by the overall theme and work done on it), Crazed steam punk, pirates.
Bret's - peasants crusade, traditional knightly crusade, arthurian legend, the host of the black knight (very sinister, but superbly executed).
Lizardmen - Standard, jurassic park with heavy emphasis on the beast side and removal of all the aztec references, northern america indian style, etc.

I think you need to concentrate more on developing a theme of what you are interested in and then ask what army would suit it better. Fantasy lends itself brilliant to a huge amount of adaptability and often forming the theme is the most important and satisfying bit. Watch a few fantasy and historical movies and if one of those armies starts to take your fancy, then think about how you would go about it in Fantasy to fit your idea.

A final example to illustrate this, my night goblin army purely came from the line in the Two Towers ' "Ten Thousand" "It is an army bred to do a single thing, to destroy the world of men" '. I wanted to recreate that vast sea of black and the unending horde. Once I worked out I could get about a thousand night goblins in 3k-4k of points I was sold on the idea and it evolved into a spoof of the original concept with my night goblin shaman Shaguman leading the force. The fact I can also build other night goblin armies from the list adds to the variation, but the original theme and goal has stuck with me ever since and continues to drive my enthusiasm for the force.

hendybadger
10-11-2009, 16:52
40k players :rolleyes:

Id suggest finding out how you want to play your games, close combat/heavy magic/movement/shooting etc or a balanced list, once youve decided that, then you select an army that excels in that department

ALso majority of 40k players that i know, just cant grasp warhammer (warhammer actaully involves tactics, not just point and shoot LMAO), and they dont enjoy it, if nothing inspires you, then stick with 40k

I dont have any problems with the game itself. I just cant find anything I like with the armies or models

Tokugawa100
10-11-2009, 19:47
40k players :rolleyes:

Id suggest finding out how you want to play your games, close combat/heavy magic/movement/shooting etc or a balanced list, once youve decided that, then you select an army that excels in that department

ALso majority of 40k players that i know, just cant grasp warhammer (warhammer actaully involves tactics, not just point and shoot LMAO), and they dont enjoy it, if nothing inspires you, then stick with 40k

I actually agree.

I switched from 40k to fantasy and there is a HUGE difference.

In 40k its based on powerbuilds, the toughest units crush all and SPACE MARINES.

Fantasy is very enjoyable and Ive found it far more entertaining with actual tactics and the fact that my night goblins have officially given me the most entertainment in a while.

hendybadger
10-11-2009, 21:39
Im just not that keen on building and painting ranks of troops all the same that may not even see the middle of the board before they get removed.
Most FB games i have seen just seem to be 2 big lines marching towards each other in the middle.
With usually the newest army winning

Bregalad
11-11-2009, 00:06
Rumours are that Warhammer Fantasy will have missions similar to 40k in the upcoming 8th edition. You already find them in some White Dwarfs, some campaigns and IIRC the General's Compendium with some advanced rules.

ChaosVC
11-11-2009, 02:51
Well if you can't find any, don't collect it. Why spend so much money on something you wouldn't enjoy collecting. Playing with your friends collections should be just fine for you

zan77
11-11-2009, 03:20
Im just not that keen on building and painting ranks of troops all the same that may not even see the middle of the board before they get removed.
Most FB games i have seen just seem to be 2 big lines marching towards each other in the middle.
With usually the newest army winning

I thinl Wood Elves might be for you then. They have a lot of fast moving skirmishers, and some forest monsters (treemen for example) and they seem pretty solid. Nice models too.

Lord Anathir
11-11-2009, 05:45
no way we can force inspiration on you. Thats something you have or you dont. If you just want to play the game for the game itself there are better options (like computer games).