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View Full Version : Are current Blood Angels worth using?



hendybadger
19-11-2009, 14:33
I know there are lots of rumours about Blood Angels being redone soon.
But ignoring that, I have a couple of questions.
Is the Current BA Codex worth using?
What are your thoughts on it?
And are they any bits in it you would either avoid or take every time?

Thanks in advance

SPYDER68
19-11-2009, 14:39
Ive been using them.. they arent bad.. but they are at a disadvantage for sure.

The cost more then Vanilla marines and alot more then Space wolves.


Your required to take death company, which comes out to 30 pts a model for them.. which is already forced into the point costs of other squads.

A few points more and you could of had thunder hammer / stormshield terminators.

Then of course.. on top of that you haft to still purchase their jump packs.

The baals are fun
Everything else is pretty much overcosted.

except the rhino's are a good buy still. Rest is meh.

hendybadger
19-11-2009, 14:47
So not that great but useable?

SPYDER68
19-11-2009, 14:50
So not that great but useable?

Pretty much.

You can pull the Dante + Corbulo Combo in 1850 pts or so with an effective assault army.

Everyone within 12" of them would have preferred enemy and furious charge..

But in 1850 you would only have 1550 pts left after having both of them, and along with units that cost a bit much makes it hard vs some armies.

hendybadger
19-11-2009, 14:52
It doea seem like a fun combo. What about unsing no named charachters? (i cant spell)

SPYDER68
19-11-2009, 14:54
The non named characters are kinda bleh, and not worth their points compared to the named ones.


Then again.. there is really no reason not to use a named character anymore.

hendybadger
19-11-2009, 15:00
Why is there reason not to?

SPYDER68
19-11-2009, 15:01
for example.. The named chaplin is only 5 pts more then the non named chaplin both with jump packs..

and the named one gets 1 more wound and more/better wargear

hendybadger
19-11-2009, 15:06
Best to look into using the special ones then

Psycoticspacemarine
19-11-2009, 15:39
The DC are NOT are required unit.

OT: They are not bad. I have seen them do fairly well in tournaments and I like using them. The all jumppack army is a fun idea; although I have never used it. The Furioso Dread in a drop pod is nasty. They have their strengths and weaknesses. The most glaring weakness is small numbers. They can easily be outnumbered by just about any army.

SPYDER68
19-11-2009, 15:42
The DC are NOT are required unit.

OT: They are not bad. I have seen them do fairly well in tournaments and I like using them. The all jumppack army is a fun idea; although I have never used it. The Furioso Dread in a drop pod is nasty. They have their strengths and weaknesses. The most glaring weakness is small numbers. They can easily be outnumbered by just about any army.

I consider the DC as required.. because your pretty much Required to pay for them.. Everytime you purchase a squad. you basically purchased a DC marine from the increased cost.

Psycoticspacemarine
19-11-2009, 15:52
By that logic, i guess you could say they are required. But it isn't like they are a bad unit being forced on you, they are a fairly powerful unit. Just don't overestimate their power. If left out in the open on their own they will die.

SPYDER68
19-11-2009, 15:53
I love my death company, i have fun with them.. not saying their bad..

Just saying for 6pts a model more (Death company + assault packs) people get 2+ 3++ save thunder hammer terminators..

Psycoticspacemarine
19-11-2009, 15:58
You do know that the BA termies only get 4+invul save from storm shields, and then only in CC.

Urath
19-11-2009, 16:04
By that logic, i guess you could say they are required. But it isn't like they are a bad unit being forced on you, they are a fairly powerful unit. Just don't overestimate their power. If left out in the open on their own they will die.

Overestimate their power? Whenever I have faced Death Company, they're always one of the first units to be slaughtered.

Psycoticspacemarine
19-11-2009, 16:08
Mine are too, but I have seen some people field them and expect them to win the game. When facing the BA, I tend to slaughter the DC too.

SPYDER68
19-11-2009, 16:12
Im comparing them to what vanilla marines get.

Death company is an overpriced fire-magnet..

If they get there.. yea its great they can do good, most of the time.. not thou.

I think it could be fun to run them without packs in a Land Raider, but havent got that far yet.

Urath
19-11-2009, 16:13
Back in the day, I just used to intercept them with Khorne Berzerkers...

SPYDER68
19-11-2009, 16:19
Back in the day, I just used to intercept them with Khorne Berzerkers...

That matchup all depends on who gets the charge off..

Id give it to the DC now that you can't move 12, get out and assault from a transport.

Urath
19-11-2009, 16:21
My unit of Khorne Berzerkers was bigger, had a Skull Champion with power weapon and the Khornate Chainaxes negating armour to 4+. Usually, I'd stick my Sorcerer/Lord with them too.

Teh winz ;)

SPYDER68
19-11-2009, 16:24
Weekend or two ago, 3rd game with a marine army in over 5 years.. been playing IG :P

I charged my death company into a Zerker squad, with chappy.. i had 8 hits.. and 0 wounds.. (8 man death company and Lemartez.. so i got to re-roll to hit on charge)

Then somehow.. i lost only 1 death company from them..

Sadly thou.. Tzeentch Lord with daemonweapon charged me.. got 11 attacks.. and whiped the squad.

Lemartez held out for 3 rounds of combat.

In 3 rounds.. with 4 attacks base.. i did 0 Wounds out of the 13 attacks i had.. 5 got to re roll to hit..

I was sad.

Urath
19-11-2009, 16:27
Ouch... Still, it was nice to see Lemartes didn't go down without a fight! My Chaos army was in use during 3rd and early-mid 4th Ed, so before the current buff on Berzerkers and *nerf on Death Company.

*they were nerfed somehow, right?

SPYDER68
19-11-2009, 16:29
Yes and no, They are all Rending now, with 4 attacks each on charge. Sadly thou.. no power weapons or power fists :(.

10x DC with 40 attacks rending str 5 ini 5 and re roll to hit on charge(with chappy) is still nice.

hendybadger
21-11-2009, 12:36
Sounds as fun as a large group of genestealers

beeny13
23-11-2009, 06:15
ba are more expensive than marines on about 1/2 their units, and a few of their units are more efficient or better. termies get an actual free death co, but they have no teleport homers to deep strike on. death co are the most efficient assault marine in any book, but they need lemartes or corbulo otherwise they aren't under your control.
the scouts are better if you go shotgun, but not scoring
the rhinos are better, but no free weapons in squads. about a wash
the characters are almost all awesome. dante, mephiston, lemartes, corbulo in that order. most space marine characters make an army better but need help getting to combat, where space marines have three jump characters. and best of all stacking rules makes their vet assault squads ridiculous. they can pack 2 meltaguns and 3 power weapons while getting furious charge and preferred enemy.

baal is very versatile, better than a lascannon against av14, but not by much. still shreds troops, and the ability to be fast is a nice option to have.

i just made a list that would cost 40 points more in standard marine lists, i lost a flamer and 2 missile launchers, but my lemartes with 4 jumping death company are so much better than a regular chappie with a fist assault squad.

also mephiston is one of the best characters ever. pair him with dante and a tooled up honour guard and you can really wreck units. multiple ones because mephiston can split and just use preferred enemy plus his godly attack profile.

Griffindale
23-11-2009, 07:05
DC suffer in 5th because their two favorite special rules, feel no pain and rending, were nerfed.

After reading the current BA dex I think they're overpriced and underpowered in comparison to the current marine rules set. I could see them being excellent in some sort of objective grabbing game BUT they lack hitting power AND staying power when compared to your average marine. That and a fire magnet unit with rules hit hard by the new edition mean they are really not worth using unless you REALLY REALLY love painting with red. I guess you could paint them read and substitute them as something else though...

gasmann
23-11-2009, 07:26
The DC got way overpriced since the rending nerf, 35 points per marine. As had been said, they just catch a lot of fire and occasionally they will actually kill enemies (standard troopes etc.). Don't field them against your enemie's elite melee troopes, because they'll likely get chopped down pretty good. At least shoot down some of those power armour ignoring, first striking banshees if you have to engage them :rolleyes: at least that's what I do, because I can't deny them their good last fight.

Other than this, it's a shame the last imperial equipment freigther got lost in the warp on it's way to Baal.
No free weapons for tacticals squads,
no flamers for assault squads,
drop pod malfunctions :D (no drop pod assault),
outdated storm shields and apothecari rules,
only three special weapons for a whole veteran assault squad
rending nerf for the baal predator...

Despite all that, this was my first army (2nd edition) and I have grown with it over these last years. Unique unit choices and background make up for the drawbacks.

Epicenter
23-11-2009, 07:38
BAs ... aren't bad, but they're definitely hurting. In some ways, they're like Dark Angels. They're both sort of 'tween codexes where they're better off than the old SM codex, but with some updated costs and limitations of the new Space Marine codex, but without some of the biggest "powerhouses" of the new Space Marine codex.

The Death Company aren't so hot with the new Rending rules - Rending was supposed to make up for the fact that you couldn't really arm the DC, but like Harlequins and Genestealers, Rending went from waaay overpowered to being overpriced on the units that have them. If DC had the ability to take one or two power weapons + the average the trooper had Rending, it wouldn't be so bad.

BA Gun Terminators can only take one heavy weapon, but don't get the two shot Cyclone Launcher. BA Assault Terminators don't get the 3++ Storm Shield. VAS are good, but expensive (though my personal opinion is that VAS are worth using, as opposed to Vanguard).

The best reason to use the BA codex now is that when (if?) the new BA codex comes out, you can at least sit around on your porch talking about all the youngins who jumped on the bandwagon while you were there in the bad ol' days.

Colonial Rifle
23-11-2009, 09:33
BAs ... aren't bad, but they're definitely hurting. In some ways, they're like Dark Angels. They're both sort of 'tween codexes where they're better off than the old SM codex, but with some updated costs and limitations of the new Space Marine codex, but without some of the biggest "powerhouses" of the new Space Marine codex.

The Death Company aren't so hot with the new Rending rules - Rending was supposed to make up for the fact that you couldn't really arm the DC, but like Harlequins and Genestealers, Rending went from waaay overpowered to being overpriced on the units that have them. If DC had the ability to take one or two power weapons + the average the trooper had Rending, it wouldn't be so bad.

BA Gun Terminators can only take one heavy weapon, but don't get the two shot Cyclone Launcher. BA Assault Terminators don't get the 3++ Storm Shield. VAS are good, but expensive (though my personal opinion is that VAS are worth using, as opposed to Vanguard).

The best reason to use the BA codex now is that when (if?) the new BA codex comes out, you can at least sit around on your porch talking about all the youngins who jumped on the bandwagon while you were there in the bad ol' days.

Agreed, although the Cyclone is a bit of a grey area as there is no listing in our weapons section. You can arguable use the new version :)

I still use the BA list, but it is increasingly painful to get it to work at higher levels. The lack of options and general overpriced-ness means you are fighting with a 100pts+ handicap against any of the modern codexs.

Still, new book next year, so no reason not to start collecting them :)

beeny13
23-11-2009, 14:47
how do you get to 100 points overpriced? non named characters? spamming tac squads with weapons? refular dreads. most of the options are lightly overpriced. razorback 10, tac squad -5 but gets 15 points less of weapons, assault squad 30 points per 5, bikes 5 apiece, reg dreads 20, vindie 10, land raider worse potms but free multimelta and 5 for the bolter, heavy bolter attack bikes 10, speeders 5 to 10, scouts 5 but better, snipers are exorbitant however.

if you really try you can get a 1500 point list overpriced by over 100. however if you grab the most efficient stuff you will actually come out under pointed with a slightly better unit or two.

basically named characters and the elites slot are better deals. if you rely on them, then the extra points on troops or heavies might come up even or under.

horus666
24-11-2009, 10:27
The Blood Angel codex is fine

SPYDER68
24-11-2009, 14:53
The Blood Angel codex is fine

Blood Angels *PDF*.. Not really a codex :P


Imo kind of unacceptable for GW doing them like they did, would have been better to have left the old book.

Just glad were finally getting a new codex soon.

Croaker2
14-12-2009, 19:16
Apologies on the noob questions, but I've just got back into 40K after not playing for 6 years.
Where can I find the Blood Angels PDF mentioned above? (since the GW site doesn't appear to have any downloads)
Also I have the old codex from around 2002/3. IS that no longer in use?

Thanks.

SPYDER68
14-12-2009, 19:20
Go to GW site, Gaming, Errate and FaQ and the codex PDF is there, the 02/03 is no longer usable.

Croaker2
14-12-2009, 19:33
Thanks for your help!

Epicenter
14-12-2009, 19:50
how do you get to 100 points overpriced? non named characters?

BA named characters aren't such a great deal as it first appears. They're very cheap for their rules, I agree there. They also have nifty powers. The big problem I find with BA SCs is that you pretty much end up taking two of them because unlike Space Marine ones, their nifty powers aren't army-wide special rules. Where vanilla Space Marines can get away with one, you have to take two in order to get coverage. Since they're SCs their equipment is inflexible, you often also run into situations where Corbulo really could use a jump pack, but doesn't have one, as well.

The Elites choices, dreads (incl. Furioso) are the only real great value choice - I'm not a huge fan of dreads though. I find them so pathetic compared to MCs - frankly the only dread worth getting IMO is the Ironclad, which BAs don't get (don't get me wrong, an Ironclad Furioso would be sweet). VAS are better than Vanguard, but the vanilla Command Squad is pretty much the same as VAS. Terminators are limited to units of five without any option of buying more guys, the Storm Shields are the older model which hurt.

Baal Predators are pretty cheap, though.

Everything else is about the same price or overpriced. I find my points just don't go as far.