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MarshalFaust
23-11-2009, 17:05
so for some time I have been wanting to play an all bike army but I really cant decide on which one to settle on. here are the choices I have come up with and a list of pros and cons, let me know if you think I have overlooked anything and tell me which army you would choose and why, thanks.

White Scars
pros:
- Great paint scheme
-marine durability

Cons:
- i already have 2 other marine armies

Orks
Pros:
-great new models
-really good close combat
-never played an ork army(something different)
-lots of conversion potential

Cons:
-one trick pony (they do one thing and do it well, games may get stale after a while)

Saim-Hann Eldar
pros:
-jetbikes
-extremely fast and maneuverable
-very durable
-lots of shooty shooty
-good close combat potential with spears

Cons:
-old models
-more expensive bikes than the other armies
-would require lots of conversions for farseers and warlocks

Eulenspiegel
23-11-2009, 17:15
Play Orks.

Theyīre not a "one-trick-pony" if you donīt go cheesy-biker-Nobz.
Ork bikers shooting is very good (anti-infantry), and you can choose to add Deffkoptaz, Skorchaz, warbuggies (as wartrakks to keep the bike-theme).

If you donīt go "pure bike" you can have them being led by a Warboss instead of Wazzdakka. I do that with my Speed Freaks. I field one large bike mob and a small-ish Nobz biker mob (not the cheesy kind). The rest is made up of Trukkboyz.

GrogDaTyrant
23-11-2009, 17:27
I thought I'd pitch in my 2 cents. I've been running the Ork bike army for sometime, and it's quite durable. Their only real banes are Heavy Flamers, and any anti-cover AP 4 weapons (Russ Eradicator). Heavier firepower that ruins other bikes (like Plasma/Las) won't effect the Ork bikes as much. Mass anti-infantry firepower is a pain (Heavy Bolters, Scatter Lasers, etc), but the same is true for any bike unit. Ork bikes are the only bikes that can also go-to-ground in the open and recieve a 3+ cover save for it.

The downfalls to the Ork bikes lie in the Ork morale (or lack thereof) and their pure anti-infantry firepower. Orks have some pretty major Morale issues with their current book. Ld is sub-par, so you're required to take a Nob with a Bosspole and PK. And as far as shooting goes, it's all anti-infantry firepower and lots of it. Ork bikes will dump out a disgusting amount of twin-linked Str5 shots, and will mow down infantry at a ridiculous rate. However PKs are (as always) their only Anti-Tank option. The Ork bike army also runs into problems against Monsters with 2+ saves and dakka-fex nidzilla lists. The combat ability of the Ork bikes is above par, but not top of the line. So versatility is one of the army's strong-points.

On a last note, is the relative cost-ineffectiveness of Wazzdakka. In my not-to-humble opinion he's a truly god-awful HQ. His kannon isn't Twin-Linked, so he rarely hits (averaging 1 hit a turn), and the lack of an Invulnerable save and moderate 4+ armor limits his CC ability. All in all, I find him best as a distraction and to send in against Tac-marines or basic infantry that will have issues with wounding him.

IronNerd
23-11-2009, 17:30
I vote Orks for one reason and one reason only.

Ork bikes are cool.

the-skylord
23-11-2009, 17:33
How about Ravenwing?

I know its another marine army, but i think that they are cooler than White Scars. Also there is boxed set for them with lots (and lots) of bits in it.

505
23-11-2009, 17:37
I vote scars. Ive run a marine bike army for a while. they do not play like other marines

MarshalFaust
23-11-2009, 17:42
I was actually considering buying the ravenwing box set if I go that route as its such a great deal. although i have to disagree about ravenwing being cooler :) Im not stuck on 100% pure bikes and i really like the idea of the deffkoptas in the ork list. Maybe im wrong but i was concerned about orks playing like "drive as fast as possible to the nearest enemy unit and engage them in hand to hand" every single game.

505
23-11-2009, 17:46
my bikes have a few landspeeders..I would love to convert a dreadnaught on a massive bike but never goten around to it

Hypaspist
23-11-2009, 18:05
If you aren't going to go Ravenwing, Go Orks. Conversion opportunities abound!

DuskRaider
23-11-2009, 18:19
Ork Biker army all the way! Take Wazdakka and a Warboss on Bike, then load up them slots! Truthfully, I'd even throw Wartrakks and Deff Koptas into the mix, they seem to fit the theme too.

starlight
23-11-2009, 18:21
Orks
Ravenwing
Other Marine Bike Lists
Eldar Jetbike Lists

:)

Codsticker
23-11-2009, 18:32
I voted White Scars for the cool factor.

For effectiveness I'm not sure that any can beat the Ork Biker army

LonelyPath
23-11-2009, 18:36
Orks and Ravenwing are the way to really go with this, plus Ravenwing get scoring attack bikes and land speeders :) Also, the RW box is a massive saving, in the UK it's individual components are worth around Ģ77 for the Ģ48.95 price tag. Plus, if you collect Deathwing at a later date the synergy between the 2 units is almost flawless.

Orks get all kinds of neat features like nob bikers and so on, plus a few units of deffkoptas look great on the table (my orks have 9 koptas of their own, but no bikes... yet!). Also, if running ork bikers please try to avoid using 2 units of nob bikers, it just gets annoying for your opponents, Wazdakka is great fun though. Wartrakks work very well form what I've seen, though the models are a bit dated (easily updated to the modern plastics with small conversions), plus orks give you a good reason to go loopy on kustomizayshuns, hur hur.

owen matthew
23-11-2009, 19:47
White scars all the way. If you did orcs you would just be "that guy" and no body would want to play with you, or already know how to beat it. Saim han is poop unless you love underpowered thematic stuff.

WS gives you high theme, a couple interesting builds, and the ability to use a very good book as well. Not the strongest build from the book, but has a lot of possibilty. Plus the whole thing outflanks, whitch is awesome for table control!

borginator
23-11-2009, 20:02
I think you forgot about Ravenwing on your poll. Some of the pro's when considering a Ravenwing army:

-Cheap battleforce -6 Bikes, 1 Attack Bike and 1 landspeeder + 3 Ravenwing sprues for ~$70 (6 Bikes alone would run you about ~$60!)
-HQ Sammael is a really nice looking model
-Easy to collect/build -All plastic models except for Sammael
-Easy to paint- Spray them black, a few metal/leather bits and a little bit of highlighting and they'd look pretty bad ass.

Can you tell I love Ravenwing? hehe

Ricken
23-11-2009, 21:52
Orks!
Wazdakka is lol and nob bikerz rocks.
And also the boy bikers are funny!

Also: White Scars are ugly... Damn Djingis Khan-wannabes!

Corpse
23-11-2009, 22:08
I voted other.
I don't think a bike army is quite what you're looking for, rather then a fast army in general.

Eldar bikes are awesome, with great perks. I've done it, and regretted the cost. I say make your own models with the time and effort you wont regret it. But it also seems after a few armies you want a for fun force, which also includes easy assembly.

Ork bike armies are wonderful, don't get me wrong I use bikes and no nob bikers in a wazdakka force. Its also a bit off in the sense you use the same tactics every game trying to avoid rapid fire. (That means staying outside 18" or get into assault when possible, since move+12" range is the range of our guns)

If you are already slightly against having another marine army, a few things may happen. You might love the bike (fast) army concept so much you wont play your other marines much any longer, wasting what you bought previously for yet more marines that you may get bored with.

I say collect eldar in a combined glory WITH bikes as a big part of the army. This cuts the cost as well as keep the speed potential. Trust me once you feel the speed of a wave serpent with star engines you will feel that you have the speed you have been wanting. With the specialists of Eldar at your fingertips with no restrictions what so ever.


Eldar Mecha+Bike combination. Bikes work best with other parts instead of being a full army unto itself. It breaks down, and leaves you wanting something for the right job which eldar is designed for.

MarshalFaust
23-11-2009, 22:59
you may be on to something there Corpse, i used to have a mech tau army and i loved the mobility but just not the poorly designed army. To be honest i would really like to play a Dark Eldar type of army but there is just no way im going to invest any money into an army that will either sit in development hell for eternity or be redone in a few years and be stuck with the old ugly models(those raiders are hideous).

Chem-Dog
23-11-2009, 23:55
Well if you're keen on Dark Eldar, want to do a bikes army and don't want to be stuck with a codex that never gets released, play Dark Eldar as Saim Hann.

1) Archon. Use rules for a mounted Autarch.
2) Jetbike. Duh......
3) Talos. Vyper (perhaps a spiky Vyper is better, it's down to taste)
4) Wych Jetbikes. Farseer and Warlocks.

Best of both worlds?

Dranthar
24-11-2009, 00:34
Well if you're keen on Dark Eldar, want to do a bikes army and don't want to be stuck with a codex that never gets released, play Dark Eldar as Saim Hann.

1) Archon. Use rules for a mounted Autarch.
2) Jetbike. Duh......
3) Talos. Vyper (perhaps a spiky Vyper is better, it's down to taste)
4) Wych Jetbikes. Farseer and Warlocks.

Best of both worlds?

Actually for him I think that's the worst of both worlds. From the sounds of it he'd rather use the Dark Eldar rules with models that don't look like crap. ;)

Of the 3 choices you listed I'd probably go for Orks but without the Nob Biker Spam. White Scars are a close second, but I'm reluctant to get another marine army. :rolleyes:

Reinholt
24-11-2009, 00:34
Good call on avoiding the Dark Eldar as they currently stand; I couldn't recommend them to anyone in their current state unless they were 100% set on the army.

As to the Eldar thing... allow me to second the call for mechanized eldar. All-bike Eldar end up lacking in some way compared to the equally fast-moving mechanized force; in the same way that an all-bike marine army lacks in some areas (like taking objectives in cover), you are limiting yourself beyond what you need to do, but unlike the Ravenwing, you aren't gaining anything for doing it!

A bike-heavy (but not bike-absolute) Eldar army can work very well, but don't neglect a Wave Serpent / Falcon mounted support element.

Hicks
24-11-2009, 01:27
I was in your exact situation not long ago. I really wanted to start a bike army and went with the White Scars because I think they are pretty cool and they were the cheapest choice by far. I bought enough stuff for a 2500pts army, but before starting the assembly I decided to drop the army because... I too had another marine army (2 if you count Grey Knights) and I didn't want to buy more of the same stuff just to have it match the new colors. One should only have so much rhinos and tactical squads after all. Painting white is also a real torture!

So I knew I didn't want to have a SM/CSM bike army and I also knew I didn't want the Ork cheeze bikers. Eldars however didn't really appeal to me for background reasons. I don't particularly like their arrogance and their love of subterfuge and deception. To me they are a bunch of cowards who think way too highly of themselves.

But one faithfull evening I had a revelation that would prompt me to start an Eldar army, but not any Eldar army... it had to be Saim Hann and I would have my (jet)bike army. I won't go into detail as to how this revelation hit me, but let's say I was in the bathroom and I needed something to read. Luckily for me, their was an old Eldar codex in that very room. So I was reading some pieces of background when I stumbled onto the part about Saim Hann. There I learned how different they are from the other Craftworlds. Instead of using underhanded tactics and spending their time patting themselves on the back for being so much more evolved than every other race, they are a brutal bunch obsessed with honnor. Other eldars don't like them because they are too barbaric and they don't mind going to war against anyone, including other craftworlds! That's gotta count for something!

Now as you said, the models are dated, but it's easy to update the look of the bikes with guardian bits and I personally think that converting a seer council on bikes would be really fun. I also checked out a bunch of battle reports on youtube and was really hooked to the Saim Hann playstyle.

So we have:

Cool background
Cool color scheme
Potentially really nice and unique minis
Very different and tactical playstyle

What's the catch? The army is insanely expensive to build. Normally when I start a new army the part of my brain that's keeping finances in check just shuts off for a while and I get a ton of stuff in a very short time frame. Not so much with this army, I started buying stuff mid summer and I still don't have all I want for my first 1500pts list. Thankfully, I have more than enough figs from other armies to paint right now, so I still buy eldar stuff here and there, but buying the whole army in one go would have given me a heart attack :eek:.

So yeah I voted Saim Hann :p

Corpse
24-11-2009, 10:07
you may be on to something there Corpse, i used to have a mech tau army and i loved the mobility but just not the poorly designed army. To be honest i would really like to play a Dark Eldar type of army but there is just no way im going to invest any money into an army that will either sit in development hell for eternity or be redone in a few years and be stuck with the old ugly models(those raiders are hideous).

Well for one the units are very, if not super set on what targets they should go after type specialists. You are also aware that the opponent is aware of this as well. This gives you the deployment edge and move advantage when coupled with speed.

Dire avengers? What if you kept them waiting until turn 3 when all the targets they CANT kill are dead? They are pretty awesome when used effectively on the move.

What if you used lots of warp spiders? Well why not add 2 autarchs with meltaguns, warp generators and go to town with deep strike on turn 2 with 2+ reserves rolls.

It can go in many ways and each unit can be used differently for the same job. It just takes experience. People who get stuck (forgive me for saying this) in the marine rut. They get in a marine mindset, and remain semi divided on how to use each unit each turn. With eldar its more straight to the point. You don't have development hell at all. You have tactical errors that you learn from each game. You disembarked too close to the enemy and they charged the serpent+dire avengers and you failed to put the two transports close enough together to stop it? Too bad, remember to put the vehicles closer next game. That sort of deal.

In eldar there is no such thing as a bad unit, just a mis-used one. Granted if you have enough units for the same job, some will be seen as inferior as a result when in fact they are worth their cost. Just not as much as the other unit might be. And in some situations, they are more worthwhile. And very powerful if you plan around them.

Lets take one of the most less favored units of eldar, the swooping hawks. 24" range, perhaps with doom they reroll wounds to be like units with storm bolters pecking at the enemy moving 12", and firing 24" away. Sure this might sound somewhat weak, but given that they almost never get caught in melee makes them very powerful in a mecha army fire support. The best weapons on wave serpents are brightlances after all.

Some may prefer to use the tougher (IMO being beyond rapid fire range is tougher but to each their own) warp spiders, spitting the same shots with double the strength for similar cost and hit+run ability. (I still say being too close is relying on fate and luck)

You can pack 30 meltaguns in the frame of 510 points. I am very serious about that. Pack 30 dark reaper shots in the frame of 525 points. For 1035 you have an army that can wipe 60 marines in 2 turns easily, and your just getting started. Add in the fast attack, and thats another 600-ish points for enough anti horde shots you can remove 80 orks in 2 turns on top of those 60 other kills in the same time frame. All because of doom, and perhaps even guide. Or stick with dire avengers and get double those kills.

See where this is going? Eldar can be done powerful, but its the mistakes and perhaps terrible rolls without backup plans that make eldar fail in most cases. Not true for marines. Marines will turn any situation around with great rolling. (Well almost any situation), because they can hurt almost anything with their gear and stats. One marine has the ability to hurt anything except a monolith, wraithlord, c'tan, land raider(and variants) while every other model in the game is threatened by it with marines that should, by math-hammer cost 19 points but cost less then that.


Try eldar man, it will only lead to more fun.

genestealer_baldric
24-11-2009, 10:16
Another option though it requires alot of modding is a thunderwolf list with everyone riding wolves but i dont think there is anyway to give sw bikes to normal troopers.

TheShadowCow
24-11-2009, 10:21
Night Lords CSM biker army, led by a Lord on a Bike with a Bloodfeeder ^^

marv335
24-11-2009, 12:29
I'm in the process of doing an all bike army
I'm using Orks.
The convertion oppertunities are fantastic.
I'm using the FW Warboss on bike (he's a reason to do the army on its own) as Wazdakka.
My other HQ is a Big Mek on bike (just for the theme).
I have;
4x 6 bikers (with PK Nob/bosspole)
2x 5 deffcoptas (with buzzsaw)
1x 1 scorcha (Because I like it :D)

It works quite well (in proxy playtest) and is fun to play.

Eulenspiegel
24-11-2009, 13:02
(...)The convertion oppertunities are fantastic.
(...)
1x 1 scorcha (Because I like it :D)

[shameless plug] Just finished the first bike from my Speed Freaks army, a custom Skorcha.
"Speed"painted in about 3hours (with the extensive use of drybrushing and Devlan Mud wash).

Wrooooom :D

marv335
24-11-2009, 14:27
that's nice, not the way I would have gone, but nicely executed.
Another reason why Orks are the army of choice for the converters amongst us.

MarshalFaust
24-11-2009, 15:41
Eulenspiegel, thats a nice scorcha

ahhh im really torn, both orks and eldar sound like a lot of fun. I think I agree that it will be best to do an army that is bike heavy and not pure bikes.

on one hand I think I will enjoy building, converting, painting orks more, but almost all of my friends play orks.

on the other, I really like the way that Eldar play and no one else in my gaming group play them currently but their isn't nearly as much opportunity converting, although a lot of their models are blank canvases for freehand painting.

ah hell maybe I should just buy more Guard :)

toxic_wisdom
25-11-2009, 02:22
If you're considering a Mech+Bike option then take a look at CSM ( Nurgle )... Nurgle Icon Bikers and a few Rhino Squads will be hard as nails for an opponent to drop.

bigcheese76
01-12-2009, 20:36
I'd go for Eldar. If you can paint and convert to a reasonable standard once the army is up to about a thousand points it should look awesome.

leonmallett
01-12-2009, 20:59
so for some time I have been wanting to play an all bike army but I really cant decide on which one to settle on. here are the choices I have come up with and a list of pros and cons, let me know if you think I have overlooked anything and tell me which army you would choose and why, thanks.

White Scars
pros:
- Great paint scheme
-marine durability

Cons:
- i already have 2 other marine armies

...

Why not just do a bike army to match an existing marine army? Captain on a bike and you are good to go. Build up your bike elements over time, using more bikes and less non-bike elements.

It is exactly what I am doing with my homebrew chapter and add-on all-bike army. I don't care that it may not be uber-competitive: it will (hopefully) look cool.

hendybadger
01-12-2009, 23:03
I have voted Orks. Wazzdakka, Warboss, Nobs troop unit and all Biker troops.
And with Orks every bike can look different without too much effort. And still look cool

Johnnyfrej
01-12-2009, 23:26
How about an Exodite army? Alright so dragon-riders arn't "bikes" but you can argue that they give the rider a 3+ scaly skin save and can run really fast :angel:

Sanctjud
01-12-2009, 23:38
White Scars/Ranodm Vanilla SM Biker army.
I feel it's much more balanced.

My 7 Cents.

DuskRaider
01-12-2009, 23:38
Ork Biker armies really are a lot of fun. Granted, you have little in the way of anti-tank, but Power Klaws can still do some nasty nasty damage (STR 10 on an assault? Yes, please!). You can usually purchase the older Warbikes for dirt cheap off of eBay. I just picked up 14 of them for $11! Granted they're a lot smaller, but with some converting and modern riders they look just as good, if not better with their rear treads. Some food for thought.

owen matthew
02-12-2009, 03:55
PK Nobs are more than enough for tankbusting, really.

The Lord of Banes
02-12-2009, 05:18
White Scars/Ranodm Vanilla SM Biker army.
I feel it's much more balanced.

My 7 Cents.


Why not just do a bike army to match an existing marine army? Captain on a bike and you are good to go. Build up your bike elements over time, using more bikes and less non-bike elements.

It is exactly what I am doing with my homebrew chapter and add-on all-bike army. I don't care that it may not be uber-competitive: it will (hopefully) look cool.

Like these guys said.

Fluff - White scars captain teaching other chapters some really good bike tactics and moves, so that the chapters all sent a biker squadron over to learn from the captain.

That way, it has good fluff, you can paint however you want, and you can grow it to make it your own.

Lord of Banes, pulling off a random solution that works, one post/thread at a time.

killalot363
02-12-2009, 05:24
Run a chaos nurgle biker army they get T6 1 from Mark of nurgle 1 from being a bike.
Chaos is filled with fluffy goodness and the bikes can take flamers and meltas and champ can have pfist so u can literally do anything. besides that chaos if awesome in every shape and form

Sanctjud
02-12-2009, 06:01
@killalot363:
Well...CSM don't have scoring bikers.
In addition they are painfully expensive and have few options for Ld/morale boosting (if you go with T6)....and T6 in itself is a gimmick.

In addition, it's an Icon and not a mark.

So a CSM bike army is not really a 'biker' army. It's impossible as you'd still need to purchase troops.

spaint2k
02-12-2009, 06:12
I voted Eldar. Don't do White Scars: you'll be crying tears of blood trying to get the white looking nice.

Corax
08-01-2010, 11:22
I voted Eldar. Don't do White Scars: you'll be crying tears of blood trying to get the white looking nice.

While you're right about the misery associated with trying to paint white, there is nothing to say that he can't do a White Scars successor chapter that isn't white (as I have been pondering for a while...) :o

Abaddonshand
08-01-2010, 11:57
I voted other; Ravenwing.

Grimmeth
08-01-2010, 15:33
I voted Orks, get a few options in there (elite bikers in the form of nobs, normal scoring bikes with Wazdakka, Buggies/Trakks + Koptas for a bit of Anti Tank.
And they're Orks - what more reason do you need?

Although SM comes close with the versatility from Speeders and Attack Bikes, but personally I'd probably go Ravenwing if I were doing that.

Grax
08-01-2010, 16:33
I think Space Marines have the most balanced bike armies out there right now. Orks and Eldar have very powerful close combat focused bike units, but they're not really enough to base an entire list around. They're really meant to be an addition to an otherwise balanced army.

If you want bikes alone, I'd go with the Space Marines. They don't need to be White Scars, as I think outflanking out bikes is a bad idea. Keep them together and strike your opponent's weak flank with everything you have, at once.

jay court
08-01-2010, 23:03
Ravenwing all the way! Entire army outflanks, are fearless, & have in Sammael, one of the coolest (& hardest!) characters around!

Black Legionaire
09-01-2010, 17:45
ATTENTION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Either do a white scar army with gaggeta Khan on his moodragon or a Ravenwing army with Shrike in and mont him on his hover bike!!!!!!!!!!

susu.exp
09-01-2010, 19:50
I voted other. One of the possibilities, which I think is rather cool is fallen Ravenwing. The RV goes back all the way to the heresy and thus youīd see bands of Fallen that belonged to the RV. Use the DA Codex and donīt use Typhoon Speeders. The conversion potential is big and while Iīd take some other Troop unit (in cast objectives are on high ground, where bikes canīt go), itīd make for an interesting army.

DeadlySquirrel
09-01-2010, 19:55
Orks for the nob-bikers... they are NASTY

or do a ravenwing army =]

wazatdingder
09-01-2010, 20:32
Chaos bikers, Word Bearer's...

All bikes and HQ on bikes...

Lots of demons in reserve, no limit...

turbo-boost, summon, assault...

nuff said.