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View Full Version : Bret Idea.. My Arrows with blot out the sun!!!!



Krom The Eternal
24-11-2009, 22:29
Ok I Was Thinking the other day which is a scary thought all in itself
What if in my bret army i tried running 3 Units of 9 Kotr 1 block of M@A 2 Trebuchets my characters then run as many units of peasent bowmen as i could possibly fit in like a 2250pt army maybe squeeze in a unit of PK anyway let my know if you have seen this done or if you have spammed peasent bowmen yourself how does this tactic fair?

Gazak Blacktoof
24-11-2009, 22:41
A big unit of skirmishers and a small unit of ranked bowmen works well. I don't think they're powerful enough to get the density of fire needed to be worthwhile in larger numbers.

I applaud you for attempting an army with more peasants though. As somebody who used to play bretts regularly they make the game more interesting than another few lance formations.

Lord Anathir
24-11-2009, 22:48
peasants are the only way to play bretts competitively nowadays anyways. The knights just dont have the punch and need the shooting support and cheap rank bonus of the m@a to get the job done.

Krom The Eternal
24-11-2009, 22:51
I agree I actually am working on a all peasant list apart from the 1 unit of Kotr you have to bring and my characters. Plus I love the M@A Models their Awesome looking 1 Billion times better then Empire Statesmen lol

Krom The Eternal
24-11-2009, 22:56
Im going to be playing a game in 2 weeks against HE now normally i wouldnt be asking for advice i mean geez their only Elves.....HA! .... Anyway Im 100 percent sure he will be running 2 Dragons and this is a 2250pt game any pointers on how to counter this? I usually run a royal airforce list but idk how well the PK will hold up compared to others but i dont wanna just give the dragons a free lunch either lol so has anyone faced this or any HE players wanna give me some advice on how to over come this big obstacle lol

Tenken
24-11-2009, 23:06
Im going to be playing a game in 2 weeks against HE now normally i wouldnt be asking for advice i mean geez their only Elves.....HA! .... Anyway Im 100 percent sure he will be running 2 Dragons and this is a 2250pt game any pointers on how to counter this? I usually run a royal airforce list but idk how well the PK will hold up compared to others but i dont wanna just give the dragons a free lunch either lol so has anyone faced this or any HE players wanna give me some advice on how to over come this big obstacle lol

Trebuchet. Whoosh, SPLAT! Dead dragon, just be good at guessing distance.

evisor
24-11-2009, 23:20
Peasent archers have risen somewhat as more and more regnerating large targets pop out. In an enviroment that has multiple Hydra/Abominations/Giants etc lists blocks of archers can actually perform ok. Just remember to give them braziers to get past flaming.

What we get are 20 archers with braziers, stan and mus for 140 points. 2 blocks and a unit of 20 skirmishers should do 5 wounds to a giant/HA at long range per turn, not that bad. And they can get stuck in to provide rank bonus when the time comes.

I don't think the peasents are the new lances though ;)
But variety is the spice of life.

Krueger Condail
24-11-2009, 23:25
Well what type of dragons does he ussually bring because dragon mages are chumps to your knight lites if you can get the charge but a prince may be a different story as it is more killy and can take a bigger hit but if u can tie him up with ur PK last a round of combat and smash him with more knights and the beauty of it is he will have way less units than you so you can set up kill zones and trap his dragons

Krom The Eternal
24-11-2009, 23:29
Im not 100% sure he usually brings one prince on dragon the other i dont remember if it was a mage or prine my buddy fought the other one when we played a 4 way game i Only remember that prince killing my empire knights and making 2 blocks of empire statesmen run hahaha i had the worst luck that day

evisor
24-11-2009, 23:29
Well, the airforce should work fairly well. Pegasus knights are good at hunting dragon mages. Trebuchets should probably be included but they can't be relied upon.

A lord on a flying mout. Grail/questioning if on a pegasus. With sword of heroes, tress of isoulde, virtue of confidence. Should be able to put some wounds on the dragon. A virtue of heroism and the tress of isoulde should give you an ok chance of taking down a dragon (slightly less than 40%?).

If he's low on magic protection a couple of beast mages could ground his dragons, but magic heavy brets are tricky to play.

Krom The Eternal
24-11-2009, 23:43
yea i saw the falconers horn thing but its one use only i could really only think to use it is i could set simultanious traps to nail both dragons in one go haha though with my luck hes going to run double princes on dragons ...sigh anyone know what my chances would be on wounding the dragon with peasant archers? i have to find cheap ways of dealing with the dragons as i know he just bought 25 phoenix guard and those are nothing to laugh at ....*Serious Face* how is the green knight at killing dragons?

Krom The Eternal
24-11-2009, 23:50
lances are great but i just think the idea of peasent forces are great and very fluffy I just wish they were a little tougher I would love to play a peasent list against a elf heavy WE list it would be a epic shoot out hahaha

warhawk95
25-11-2009, 00:21
watch that epic shoot out against skrimshers. But peasent horde is effective. Big skrim unit, 2 units of peasent bowmen that are big, grail relique. All decent units. A more intresting shooting match would be Bowmen brett list with trebs and graile, versus a TK gunline with the SSC and bowmen horde, this would be cool IMO.

Krom The Eternal
25-11-2009, 00:23
yea there could be some awesome background fluff to make up for that one hahaha now my gears are turning thanks alot!!!! hahaha

Canadian_Khan
25-11-2009, 00:47
Yeah, I've done that... works well when the trebs hit well... if they don't you can always flood the enemy with units of 17-18...

A grail reliquae is a must... the only 2 knights I field are PK (3) and Kotr(6), and I score a lot better dans with 5 lances... cause I always have reinforcement... and it tend to actually surprise your ennemy who will ofter make strategic mistakes because it's quite rare to see a peasant horde of doom. They will often charge the bowmen and be proud to destroy them... but my biggest unit is worth 89points total... and it serves as a bait for a PK butt charge :)

Krom The Eternal
25-11-2009, 00:56
and it serves as a bait for a PK butt charge :)
HAhahahahaa thats great you just made my signature box hahaha thats better then this one i read a few mins ago

If Slannesh is the God of Sex, why is it Tzeentch that has a thousand sons?

Foegnasher
25-11-2009, 02:34
if i played brets, that's what i'd do. 1 lance. peasants peasants and more peasants. some men at arms, 2 trashbuckets. gobs and gobs of scabby commoners.

the way it should be.

Croaker2
25-11-2009, 03:01
I tend to take at least 2 large units of peasant archers.
The wonderful side effect is that my enemies have been worried by them and usually devote fast cav/flyers/etc. to taking them out. Which pleases me, because they don't cost much and still get a few turns of shooting in.
When I don't get a hill I'll deploy them in long thin lines.

Krom The Eternal
25-11-2009, 03:07
great tactic

lopezpie
25-11-2009, 04:46
man i would love to try playing with all those archers i have feeling that it would be a absolute blast.... hmm perphaps i will do this friday

time to proxy up some models

Condottiere
25-11-2009, 05:25
It would be closer to the historical model.

BretonniaorDeath
25-11-2009, 14:38
first of lemme say that I think if you can roll the dice peasant archers are pound for pound one of the most amazing trash units in the game. you fully upgrade 10 of them for 90 pts and then can beat small skirmishing units like terradons because they can bring a decent amount of static combat resolution. I have had a unit of archers get flanked by a tomb scorpion and walk out on top.

that being said the army is a really cool idea but lets not act like its fluff oriented. the bretonnian fluff is based around mass knights if you want to play a peasant army play empire. I hear they even feed their poor people...pfft.

The Red Scourge
25-11-2009, 14:46
But peasants are what makes brets a cool army :)

Garviel
25-11-2009, 14:49
I recently played a 2250 tournamebt game against a Deamons army...

Did my Lord wound the Bloodthirster?- no
BSB? - hell no!
Grail Knights - nope.
KotR - nada.




Unit of 10 Peasant Bowmen Skirmishers - Yip

3's to hit (short range large target), 6's to wound.

BretonniaorDeath
25-11-2009, 14:49
the way i deal with dragons is thus. I bring a unit of grail knights with a lord and a paladin in it 10 strong +2 characters so 12 all together. I give the lord immunity to killing blow/poison, gromril great helm, morning star of fracasse (because it means str 6 even when charged) and the virtue of confidence. then you can build your paladin BSB in this unit one of 2 ways. EITHER you can give him the extra D6 charge and try to get the drop on mr.20 inch movement OR you can give him killing blow against large targets.

then the trick is just to get your lord into combat with the thing. against a star dragon you are looking at re-rollable 5+ armor saves followed by 5+ ward saves. all your lord needs to do is live and in a decent sized unit you will win by 4 static combat rez and have a pretty solid chance of making the lord run away.

pegasus knights don't get an armor save vs. str 7 dragons so i don't see how they are gonna help you here. dragon needs 3s then 2s and then you get 5+s or die.

imo the trick to high elves is living. i know that seems like a stupid thing to say but the vast majority of their army just dies if it gets attacked. big lances that increase the number of knights that make contact are really nice because if you charge with a 12 man unit and they kill 3 dudes you still have 6 or so that hit and because they are elves they just die to str 5 lances.

relying on your treb to drop a dragon is a terrible idea because its too random, its not a real solution more just a "cross your fingers!" kind of thing. and honestly i think elven BS is too good to risk lots of royal air force. the 6 shot bolt thrower needs like 4s to hit 4s to wound against pegasi and then you get 5s/6s or die.

falconhorn is pretty good however you gotta find room on a knight for it and there are probably better things to bring because dragons move 12 when they walk which isn't quite as significant as say dropping terradons from 20 to 4.

id love to hear this conversation play out though, what are your thoughts?

BretonniaorDeath
25-11-2009, 15:13
Peasants are what make bretonnia dirty army. Having the best core cav in the whole game makes it an awesome army. If you don't get into the glory of the charge and be chivalry of the lance/arthurian legends then why play bretonnia?

if you want to field the tired and hungry masses yearning to be free play empire.

and yes i am currently in an argument on the tactics board arguing that peasant bowman drop large terror causers like a bad habit my archers killed a dark elf lord on the back of a dragon 2 days ago and it was ***** sweet. but they are my mascots and my underdogs not the reason i play the army.

Rogue
25-11-2009, 15:21
"Then my dwarves will fight in the shade"

I think that Pesant bowman do have their place and I would like to see how something like this will work. It sounds interesting to have basically a bowline (as opposed to a gun line) and I have faced a crossbow line. I would say that you may have issues with high armored armies, like my dwarves, but I can see it doing some damage.

Ozorik
25-11-2009, 15:35
the bretonnian fluff is based around mass knights if you want to play a peasant army play empire

Not so I'm afraid, just because Brettonia is famous for its knights doesn't means that they form the bulk of the Brettonian armies in the same way that Imperial armies are not formed from artillery. There are many, many more peasants in Brettonian armies than there are knights.

The only Brettonian armies with a large percentage of knights would be vanguards and crusades (and they would still have a large number of mounted squires, probably in a 1:1 ratio at least).

All bowmen armies woul dbe much better if they still had the arrowhead formation :)

BretonniaorDeath
25-11-2009, 15:49
How many stories are there in the army book about peasants? In the one novel about bretonnia to come out (Knight Errant, Knight of the Realm) the peasants pretty much just die and they are barely mentioned in the story they exist by necessity as a mass of people to die to establish the savagery of villains. they are hilariously awesome as trash units and should imo always be taken in every army under any circumstance but they are the nameless background faces of this army.

but what do i know? im the guy who refuses to take pegasus knights to tourney because paravon is a sissy, pretty boy dukedom.

Ozorik
25-11-2009, 15:55
Of course the knights are the focus of nearly every Brettonian piece of written fluff, it is Brettonia's key feature; that doesnt mean they make up the bulk of the army. It is much more fluffy to have a peasant army with a few knights than it is to have an army consisting entirely of knights.

A small unit of KotR is sufficent to cover the knights who are likely to be present in a typical Brettonian army.

Rupposed
25-11-2009, 16:52
I used to play this army. For peasants I had two units of 25 M@A units, two units of 20 bowmen, and one 10 man of skirmishers. Three units of knights, two trebuchets, and mounted yeomen (I think two units of six). If you go through the current and collector's ranges, there's a bunch of different yeomen models, I want to say around sixteen.

The list did rather well. M@A units are greatly under-appreciated. They are so cheap and don't give up banners that, making them excellent throw-away units. Add in a counter-charge from some knights and the list becomes solid.