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View Full Version : Wanting to start in the tournament scene need advice please.



strigoi
13-12-2009, 13:04
hi all,

well i just started playing skaven and haven't played a proper fantasy game in ages, but i wanted to enter tournaments but have no real good army construction or how tournys work for a usal friendly playing style player.

what i would like to know is how i should construct a competative list what i should look for and good tactics or even army lists you guys can provide as i need advice.

Thank you in advance as ive not been to any tournament.

narrativium
13-12-2009, 15:15
That's a tall order. I can't help you much with the Skaven aspect of it, as I haven't played against the new army book yet, but otherwise...

First: which tournament are you hoping to enter? Tournaments vary from event to event - the army points allowance is important, and so are any scenarios to be used at the tournament. Tournaments can also be divided into 'comped' and 'uncomped' categories - 'comped' events place more restrictions on your army composition than the army book itself does, generally to prevent people from choosing some of the most competitive or extreme army lists, whereas 'uncomped' events allow you to pick a legal army straight from the book.

If we know, for example, that you're looking at a 1500 point tourney, we can avoid recommending lord level choices. If we know you have particular models, or like particular models, and want to include them, that will help too - saves us recommending things you need to spend lots of money on. That sort of thing.

Second: you haven't played a proper game recently. Play more. If a tournament is what you're aiming for, choose your army list for that event and play several games with it. Your tournament opponent ought to be forgiving if you don't know everything that their army is capable of, but you should be familiar with your own and with the order of play, both from reading the books and from the experience of play. Tournaments have time limits to make sure everyone gets several games in, so you need to be able to play properly.

strigoi
13-12-2009, 15:49
hi Thanks for the reply much appreciated well the kind of tournaments ill be entering will be uncomped as it will be down my local gaming group but i will be playing 2000 points to.
sorry i haven't been to clear what i wanted to know is general army building list what are the basics i should be looking for when creating an army list as if it was handed to me it wont preform as it would do to the person who wrote it.

the tournament will be my local gaming group and at 2000 points and uncomped, but i just want the basics of what makes armies succesful and how to get better. i was forced to play 40k for ages (yes forced lol) and no matter how many times i played i would lose but had no real determination to play it so i didn't get better, but coz i want to play fantasy i would love to hear good ways on how to construct a list, how many casters i should have in a 2k list or skirmishs just general points, treat me as a new person who just got into the hobby if that would help as i usally paint but want to go a step further.

Thank you again Narratiyium and sorry for being unclear hopefully this will help a little.

WusteGeist
14-12-2009, 05:47
hi all,

well i just started playing skaven and haven't played a proper fantasy game in ages, but i wanted to enter tournaments but have no real good army construction or how tournys work for a usal friendly playing style player.

what i would like to know is how i should construct a competative list what i should look for and good tactics or even army lists you guys can provide as i need advice.

Thank you in advance as ive not been to any tournament.
Well lets ask the big question. Are you talking semi pro tourneys like around the area store based or Pro, like IndyGt circuit? As for a competitive list that wont get you dinged to hell and back, comp scores factor alot in your over all placing in any tourney system. You have to balance several factors at once, keep your core percentage high keep your character and magic item percentage low. Buy a copy of army builder, which will help you alot in doing that. Now as to the actual task of making a skaven army, read the book alot and see what bits catch your fancy and work out what you think is a good army on paper. Then test drive that paper army, ie play several games with it and modded it as time goes on. Thats the best I can advise at the point.

LooseMoose
15-12-2009, 19:06
Whilst Warseer is cushy and has a more general focus on the hobby( it's great for rumours and volume of posts) you may find yourself in better company on www.warhammer.org.uk , it's a lot more tournament (And WHFB) orientated.

For Skaven take a look in any army list building section, a good core to base your army around is 30 plague monks (obligatory storm banner) pushing a furnace with two units of 8 plague censer bearers. Then build to taste around that. A thing to remember is to not take duplicate Rare choices and triplicate Special choices, you'll find that your army then conforms to a lot of tournament guidelines whilst being competative but not built to an extreme.

CarlostheCraven
15-12-2009, 20:29
Hi

Where abouts are you looking at playing in tournaments?

As a rule of thumb:
If in Europe, there are many composition restrictions at many major independent events.
If in NA, there are very few composition restrictions at most events.
If in AU, then look into the masters system as a place to start.

Speaking for most central Canadian tournament goers, there is really no concern regarding taking duplicate or triplicate units if that floats your boat. Years ago it was a big concern, but that has faded as the price of the hobby increased. The general consensus is that if it is an option in your book, take it if you want to. It is my job in a competitive environment to overcome your madness with my own, not whine about your selection and torpedeo your solf scores.

That being said, a tiered system is being used in some places in Canada to reflect the fact that some new books are slightly too good and some old ones are looking really terrible. This is to assert some sort of balance in the grand scheme of things, but doesn't impose other artificial restrictions. It also encourages players to look beyond Daemons, Vampires, Lizardmen, and Dark Elves as choices for their armies.

Cheers,
Carlos the Craven

Bac5665
15-12-2009, 22:57
Welcome to Warseer!

To do well at the game of warhammer, you need to have two things; a decent list, and make sure everything has a purpose, and that you play towards that purpose.

First, the list. For most (read: other than Ogres and OnG) armies, any average list can win a tourney. Some make take more or less effort than others, but you can win with most normal lists.

For the second, the players who win tourneys in my area are the players who make sure that every thing they do is designed to accomplish something. If I take a unit of skinks, I have a role in mind for them. for some units, they may have several different roles, to be chosen from based on the foe or terrain. But I make sure I know what it is that I want a unit to do in a game, and I do my best to a) pick a reasonable goal for each unit, and b) reavaluate these goals every turn. If my opponent does something, I consider how it affects my goals and react accordingly. Mostly, this kind of game play means that I know what I'm doing, that I never charge just because I want to role some dice, or that I never take a unit without at least some understanding as to what it will do on the field.

strigoi
15-12-2009, 23:07
Thank you so much guys for all the support, i really cant thank you enough as you have all come to help in a time where i was getting frustrated about the simplest thing about the hobby really i love playing and even love painting more but when it comes to deciding a list im all over the place indecisive and foolish about it.

Thank you guys you have given quite good basis on how to create a army list especially Loosemoose.

i hope in the near future i will be able to help you guys out :)

ill also write up a starting army list once its written.

Gaargod
16-12-2009, 01:11
Try browsing through the army lists sections for ideas. There's been an absolute deluge of skaven lists recently, many of them aiming for competitive play. I'm not saying you should copy them (indeed, its generallya VERY bad idea to copy paste armies, as they're suited to different people), but it gives you some ideas of what's hot and what's not. Also, take a looksie through the skaven 5th ed tactica. Usually some reasonable stuff in tacticas.

As a rough guide, people seem to be agreeing Plague Priests on furnace, at least lv1, in a block of plague monks is a good start. Either slaves or clanrats for core (generally i'd say slaves, cheaper and more expendable - notice the pun :D ), a couple of plague censer units, then probably 1 doom wheel and 1 abomination. Magic items to taste, but include the storm banner on a plague monk unit somewhere. If you have spare points somehow, add more magic!

doddy84
16-12-2009, 14:35
the best way 2 make list is 2 read the war book..with skaven a good way 2 start is clanrats and a lot of them i always take 2 sorcerer at 2000 and some times 1 is a gray seer... the thing is wots good 4 1 person is not 4 some 1 else so have lots of games find wot u like n when u think u are ready then do 1 cos in them will be people that no your army beta then u

strigoi
19-12-2009, 15:14
Kello guys,

i was gonna post a list earlier but fell quite ill and still kinda recovering ah well i have nowt to do better nowa days then to paint and build and write lists.

okay here is my list please give me pointers or constructive critisim.


GREY SEER + 2 Dispel Scrolls 290 Points

Plague Priest + Level 2 + Plague Furnace 285 points

Warlock + Level 2 + Warp energy condenser + dispel scroll 145 points

Chieftan + shield + Battle standard Bearer + Storm banner 127 Points

24 Clanrats + Standard + Poisoned Wind Mortar + Shields 186 Points

24 Clanrats + Standard + Poisoned Wind Mortar + Shields 186 Points

30 Giant Rats + 5 Pack masters + PACKMASTER SKWEEL 230 Points

30 Plaguemonks 210 Points

5 Jezzails 100 Points

5 Globidiers 50 Points

Warp Lightning Cannon 90 Points

Plagueclaw Catapult 100 Points

Points: 1999
Power Dice: 10
Dispel Dice: 6

Aim for this army is to nullify enemys with gun lines and disabling them to shoot. The whole ideal is because i wont have many units that use BS to fire with the storm banner will have no effect on me but to Dwarfes, DE, HE and others this could hamper them with fire and wont want to risk commiting sitting back and shooting.

while my other parts of my army like the furnace and plaguemonks who are Unbreakable charge any enemys while driving myself up with the giant rats clanrats who have mortars.
or if i know its a brawling army i shall sit back and shoot like crazy and focus on the target that have hard hitting units or focus on low leadership.

I know a few people will ask why not a Hell abomination pit, the reason for that is it is too unpredictable and is a monster which spell casters can use Beasts cowers on it rending 250 points useless and everyone will expect it to a tournament scene and go off a bit saying u only won because of that, tired of people complaining about the war hydra tho i kinda agree but no point moaning just play and enjoy.

Well once again Thank you for listening warseer community and thank you for listening to me.

The strig.

meowser
20-12-2009, 01:21
Solid start for a list, but here are some general comments that I'm sure most people will agree with.

0. Priest should have a flail.
1. Slaves. Take them. Nuff said. 2+ x 20-21, i like having the musician.
2. Most people encourage taking Jezzails/globadiers in full units of 10, or not at all.
I'd recommend comitting to either unit.
3. Hammer unit. You need something other than clanrats or giant rats to charge into units your PM are holding down. I'd recommend at least 1 unit of 7 Plague Censer Bearers, as they get leadership bonuses from both the plague monk unit and the furnace when they are near it.
4. With your 6 DD total, you might be able to get away with 2 scrolls to free up points for
5. Plague claw catapult is cool and fluffy, but few seem convinced of it's tournament worthiness. I would trade it up for the censers.
6. Storm banner on the monks; so you can get a ward on your bsb. halberd is a popular option in addition to shield