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eyescrossed
15-12-2009, 04:02
Well, due to being absolutely severed from Warseer and any form of news since I was at boarding school in another country, I have to idea what to expect from the battle I'm having soon.

I play Warriors of Chaos, my friend has started collecting Skaven, and we're going to play a 1250 point battle. The only things I know he'll be including are Poisoned Wind Globadiers (...what?) and Warplock Jezzails. Maybe a Hellpit Abomination, which I don't know about. Oh, I also accidentally glanced Queek Headtaker or something along those lines when I looked to see if he'd posted in my topic. I think that's a Lord choice though, so it's probably irrelevant.

I just want to know what I should take and what I definitely should NOT take.

PS: I don't want to own him, I just don't want to be taking something like the Lore of Metal against Ogres.

Thanks.

Malorian
15-12-2009, 15:18
Well depending how much he is into the pestilens (sp?) stuff it could ruin your day quick, as those failed toughness tests go right through your armor.

So make sure to take a good amount of hounds to redirect those frenzied units, take horse men to take out weapon teams and hunt down jezzails, and then a big mean knorne fighter character on a jugger to take on the abbomination.

Knights are iffy... either they will rip stuff up or get shot down and destoyed...

selone
15-12-2009, 16:33
As ever take warhounds, horsemen will probably do good too. Chaos knights are a shoe in but they must be screened versus skaven, consider a tzeentch unit with blasted standard. Infantry aren't too bad against skaven as they have no fliers/fast cav and will engage in hand to hand. You don't have too worry too much about toughness tests as chaos infantry is either cheap or tough and will hold their ground against skaven infantry.

I'd recommend two sorcerors with fire/tzeentch lores if he takes an abom. A Khorne character on juggernaut is expensive and practically screams out chuck globes at me/shoot jezzails at me (fear the globes more)

eyescrossed
16-12-2009, 06:53
Well depending how much he is into the pestilens (sp?) stuff it could ruin your day quick, as those failed toughness tests go right through your armor.
Well... I honestly don't know anything about his army, whatsoever. It's not like I'm going to ask, either, since I don't want to be seen as unsporting.



So make sure to take a good amount of hounds to redirect those frenzied units, take horse men to take out weapon teams and hunt down jezzails, and then a big mean knorne fighter character on a jugger to take on the abbomination.
The thing is, it's only a 1250 point game. A big Khorne character like that will be almost a fifth of my points, and wouldn't he get taken down spectacularly easily by Jezzails/Globadiers (unless I keep Hounds in front of him through the most of the game)?



Knights are iffy... either they will rip stuff up or get shot down and destoyed...
Yeah, I was thinking of only having 1 unit, but even now I'm thinking against even one.



As ever take warhounds, horsemen will probably do good too. Chaos knights are a shoe in but they must be screened versus skaven, consider a tzeentch unit with blasted standard. Infantry aren't too bad against skaven as they have no fliers/fast cav and will engage in hand to hand. You don't have too worry too much about toughness tests as chaos infantry is either cheap or tough and will hold their ground against skaven infantry.
Yeah, at least 2 units of Warhounds and 1 Horsemen.
Oooh, good idea with the Knights; I normally face only Lizzies and WoC, so that makes a lot of items redundant either due to the lack of shooting I face or lack of Leadership importance.



I'd recommend two sorcerors with fire/tzeentch lores if he takes an abom. A Khorne character on juggernaut is expensive and practically screams out chuck globes at me/shoot jezzails at me (fear the globes more)
I was thinking 2 Tzeentch Sorcerers anyway, since all the spells on it are great against Skaven.

True about the Khorne character.

What about the Lore of Slaanesh?

CauCaSus
16-12-2009, 12:01
The thing is, it's only a 1250 point game. A big Khorne character like that will be almost a fifth of my points, and wouldn't he get taken down spectacularly easily by Jezzails/Globadiers (unless I keep Hounds in front of him through the most of the game)?

The hell pit abomination costs 235 pts (250 if you give it 1MR) and it will never be taken down easily. If he fields one, I suggest taking fire-based magic and items to negate its regeneration.

Seriously, mine beat a unit of five dragon ogres on its own, fielding it in a 1250 pt game against an opponent with no cannons is a little unfair I think.

Enigmatik1
16-12-2009, 13:14
What about the Lore of Slaanesh?

I think that depends on a few factors. I haven't faced the new Skaven yet but if they're loaded to the gills with ItP units, don't bother. I also noticed that the game is at 1,250 points...once again don't bother with the Lore of Slaanesh imo.

Slaaneshi magic is extremely devastating against non-ItP armies when brought to bear by a Lord level caster, be he Sorceror Lord of even Daemon Prince. I question the usefulness of Level 2 Slaaneshi Wizards primarily because Lash of Slaanesh is trash.

I would actually consider a Nurgle Wizard and a Tzeentch Wizard...

doddy84
16-12-2009, 14:12
i do both and the key 2 beatin skaven is makin them take LD tests....a slannesh sorcerer is good at doin this so is a must hellshriek could make loads run...and if he is on a steed of slannesh he could make them run off 1st turn with his move 20 and 360 for magic.....the filth mace is good.. 1 wound and u have terror. u will be out numbered so make the globadiers run at LD 5 and try 2 charge the ranks take lots of dogs chaos knights will be hit and miss if it gos good 1 charge in the right place could do a lot off panic.... when rats run they rally on 5 n we all no thats not good

selone
16-12-2009, 16:30
Lash of slaanesh isn't normally that great true enigmatik but a strength 3 magic missile can actually get a kill against skaven and stopping a whole unit of skaven marching is very handy.
You will get use out of their other spells except of course level six spell. perhaps try a lore of fire/tzeentch and lore of slaanesh.

doddy84
16-12-2009, 17:27
u can mahe your knights cause terror or men fear make 1 of there units move 2 where u want whitch is good 4 craw or the weapon teams. u dont have 2 have 2 sorcerer that always do lots of killing some times u wont them 2 do other things. and str 3 is like most magic missiles. i have used 1 2 great sucsses. and like i said hellshriek is brill all unit in 18 take panic test i have made 4 units run and things have ran off 1st turn

eyescrossed
16-12-2009, 23:27
Well, I'm playing the game now - I'll post my army list when I have time.

I'll just say one thing; I've only got 30 models vs his 174; 1 Khorne Hero on Jugger (has Golden Eye of Tzeentch), 1 Nurgle BSB with great weapon and that Fury of the Blood God gift, 1 Tzeentch Sorcerer with Book of Secrets and Power Stone, 12 Tzeentch Warriors, 5 Horsemen and 10 Nurgle Chosen. I'm screwed.

Enigmatik1
17-12-2009, 03:57
I'll just say one thing; I've only got 30 models vs his 174.

This is the single, most depressing thing about facing Skaven imo. I swear, I look at my friends Skaven army when he plays and I often find myself wondering "what flank?" TK isn't as expensive as a Chaos Can army...but I swear I'd only have about 30 models myself. :D

Oooh...no generic Marauders. I see. Yeah...unless you can spark some Panic tests somehow with big minuses, you're in trouble. :( Who knows though, stranger things have happened.

eyescrossed
17-12-2009, 07:11
This is the single, most depressing thing about facing Skaven imo. I swear, I look at my friends Skaven army when he plays and I often find myself wondering "what flank?" TK isn't as expensive as a Chaos Can army...but I swear I'd only have about 30 models myself. :D

Oooh...no generic Marauders. I see. Yeah...unless you can spark some Panic tests somehow with big minuses, you're in trouble. :( Who knows though, stranger things have happened.

Well officially he won, sorta by a little amount (and by little I mean in the 100-200 VP range), but we both ended up killing each other's generals.

I would've won (well, probably would've, unless the dice gods gave me a billion and one ones) if the game had went on for a few turns more (yes, sad, I know).

We decided to keep the game going, just to see what'd happen. I only had my Chosen and the BSB left. Basically, I made a unit of Clanrats break, which caused the rest of his army to panic and run away. Except for another unit of Clanrats and a Ratling gun.

FallenAfh
17-12-2009, 15:50
some general tips:

Dragon Ogres are solid against Skaven. WS4 versus WS3 on most skaven, immune to Warp Lightning, Multiwound model so less susceptible to the Pestilens, and the Str7 is great against high toughness stuff like the doomwheel.

Hellcannons, panic is great and if need be the Hellcannon is great for tying up Skaven blocks too.

Combat WoC are hard to play in low point games, so focus on Magic. Tzeench magic is golden against Skaven.

eyescrossed
17-12-2009, 15:52
Well, I'm gunna play a 3000 point game with him soon. My list is going to be pretty different from my normal lists, ie; less infantry.

Foegnasher
18-12-2009, 00:58
some general tips:

Dragon Ogres are solid against Skaven. WS4 versus WS3 on most skaven, immune to Warp Lightning, Multiwound model so less susceptible to the Pestilens, and the Str7 is great against high toughness stuff like the doomwheel.

Hellcannons, panic is great and if need be the Hellcannon is great for tying up Skaven blocks too.

Combat WoC are hard to play in low point games, so focus on Magic. Tzeench magic is golden against Skaven.

dragon ogres are cannon bait, i also killed almost an entire unit with a flank shot from crack's call.

hellcannon gets owned by HPA, seen it happen.

tzeench magic does blow stuff up. question is, will you be able to blow up enough? focus on one unit as a time, try to take as many ranks off it as possible. dont spread the fire around. pick one unit. (the general's perferably) and vaporize it.

eyescrossed
18-12-2009, 03:31
dragon ogres are cannon bait, i also killed almost an entire unit with a flank shot from crack's call.

hellcannon gets owned by HPA, seen it happen.

tzeench magic does blow stuff up. question is, will you be able to blow up enough? focus on one unit as a time, try to take as many ranks off it as possible. dont spread the fire around. pick one unit. (the general's perferably) and vaporize it.

Cannon bait... But isn't it a Warp Lightning Cannon, therefore only being able to Frenzy the Drogers?

What's a Hell Pit Abomination like, anyway? I haven't even looked at the rules for most things in the Army Book.

I'll have enough Tzeentch magic to ROFLWTFPWN things, though.

Foegnasher
18-12-2009, 03:41
Cannon bait... But isn't it a Warp Lightning Cannon, therefore only being able to Frenzy the Drogers?

What's a Hell Pit Abomination like, anyway? I haven't even looked at the rules for most things in the Army Book.

I'll have enough Tzeentch magic to ROFLWTFPWN things, though.

HPA is the stuff of nightmares. but tzeench has lots of fire attacks to keep it from regenerating, but the thing still hits like a ton of bricks. it's str 6, causes terror, does impact hits, and generally eats units that are infront of it. it moves like a spawn, so you can turn it any way you want and then roll 3 dice and there it goes.

i checked the book, the cannon fire warp lightning. so yes, it'd just **** them off. still, they can get pawned by list of other nasty stuff the skaven bring, but they are hard, i'll give them that. personally, i'd shoot them on perpose, then frenzy bait and flank them.

eyescrossed
18-12-2009, 05:41
HPA is the stuff of nightmares. but tzeench has lots of fire attacks to keep it from regenerating, but the thing still hits like a ton of bricks. it's str 6, causes terror, does impact hits, and generally eats units that are infront of it. it moves like a spawn, so you can turn it any way you want and then roll 3 dice and there it goes.
Damn... Sounds like more of a pain in the **** than spending Christmas with your inlaws.



i checked the book, the cannon fire warp lightning. so yes, it'd just **** them off. still, they can get pawned by list of other nasty stuff the skaven bring, but they are hard, i'll give them that. personally, i'd shoot them on perpose, then frenzy bait and flank them.
Which is why I'll be shielding them with Hounds for at least a turn :D

AussieSocks
19-12-2009, 11:42
Dogs take the bullets
Knights kill the rats.
Keep things real simple.

ALSO: Spawn. Can do a tango with the Abomination, yay for random everything.

eyescrossed
19-12-2009, 12:29
Dogs take the bullets
Knights kill the rats.
Keep things real simple.

ALSO: Spawn. Can do a tango with the Abomination, yay for random everything.

Hmm. I've got lotsa Dogs, no Knights so far (thinking of using some Drogers instead).

I'll post my list when I'm done... So in about half an hour, probably.

snottlebocket
19-12-2009, 20:27
Skaven armies tend to contain lots and lots of bodies with relatively low armour and toughness. Their damage methods can take almost any form possible but the constant usually is lots of bodies, low toughness / armour.

Which means you can't go far wrong by bringing a lot of attacks and a lot of screening. Screening to counter whatever he brings. (warhounds are top) and lots of attacks because in the end you're going to have to kill a lot of skaven to win. A hellcannon is probably not a bad choice either.

eyescrossed
20-12-2009, 01:43
Well, here's (http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=235975) the list.

It's pretty unique in my opinion. The question is, will it do well?