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Redheadedmb
24-12-2009, 02:12
Below are a few lists designed for the first round of a 1000pts Escalation tournament. I would like some criticism and help on all three. The tournament is in January so I have time to revise these lists.

List 1:
Heroes
Noble - 94pts
Hand Weapon, Dragon Armor, Sheild
Core
Archers - 217pts
16, Musician, Light Armor
Spearmen - 205pts
20, Sentinel, Musician, Standard Bearer
Special
Swordmasters - 180pts
10, Bladelord, Musician, Standard Bearer
Silver Helms - 224pts
8, High Helm, Musician, Standard Bearer, Shields
Rare
Repeater Bolt Thrower - 100pts

I have already play tested this list against an army of Dwarves. Didn't do so hot. The only survivors were the Archers and the Bolt Thrower.

List 2:
Heroes
Mage (Lore of Fire) - 185pts
Level 2, Silver Wand, Jewel of the Dusk, Gem of Sunfire
Core
Archers - 126pts
11, Musician
Spearmen - 205pts
20, Sentinel, Musician, Standard Bearer
Sea Guard - 233pts
16, Sea Master, Musician, Standard Bearer, Shields
Special
Silver Helms - 165pts
5, High Helm, Musician, Standard Bearer
Tiranoc Chariot

I know I opted out of a RBT but I was wondering how well a chariot would do in place of a RBT.

List 3:
Heroes
Noble - 146pts
Great Weapon, Dragon Armor, Shield, Radiant Gem of Hoeth
Core
Archers -110pts
10
Spearmen -205pts
20, Sentinel, Musician, Standard Bearer
Special
Swordmasters - 150pts
Silver Helms - 155pts
5, High Helm, Musician, Standard Bearer, Shields
Tiranoc Chariot - 85pts
Rare
Repeater Bolt Thrower - 100pts
Great Eagle - 50pts

I have the most hope for this list. I feel it has a good balance between infantry and the hard hitting power of war machines and cavalry.

Armond
24-12-2009, 03:40
Some simple things which I tend to do is to keep any missile troops right between 10-12 with an archer. Not too many people have the type of missile troops that can go into hand to hand with dedicated units. Dwarfs for instance can use their crossbowmen and thunderers and emergency hand to hand troops should the need arise. But High Elves are a little frail for that.

So 10 Archers with a musician is a good start.

Is that 10 Swordmaster for 150 points? So basically 1 successful shot from any missile/magic will already bring the Swordmasters down to a 0 starting CR? What is their main purpose? I know they are some kick butt troops and all, but their price at 1000 points is pretty steep, can it be justified. If so, how?

Are you going for a balanced all around army? I do like the Swordmasters, but if you can't beef them up a bit, to start out with at least a +2 or +3 before combat begins, I wouldn't bother. In smaller games, units that hit hard and quickly tend to be scarier.

If I saw a chariot or two in conjunction with say a unit of SilverHelms/Dragon Princes/Eagles/Reavers preparing to charge, I would be worried.

So go in that direction. There is nothing wrong with putting some more points into mobility and hard hitting(well for Elves).

I am not sure which playstyle you prefer. Death from afar, infantry advance, mobility, etc...

I am a mobility type of person. So to have one infantry unit as something to hold the line along with a unit of missile troops is just fine. But I would drop the swordmasters on the third list and maybe beef the Silver Helms up to 6 wide. Buy perhaps another Chariot and another Eagle.

Redheadedmb
24-12-2009, 04:39
(I'd like to correct the Mage in list 2. I just noticed that she has three arcane items, I don't know what I was thinking. She now has the Gem of Sunfire and the Guardian Phoenix)

Here is the third list revised:

Heroes
Noble - 146pts
Great Weapon, Dragon Armor, Dragonscale Shield, Dragon Horn
Core
Archers -110pts
10
Spearmen -205pts
20, Sentinel, Musician, Standard Bearer
Special
Ellyrian Reavers - 126pts
5, Musician, Standard Bearer
Silver Helms - 178pts
6, High Helm, Musician, Standard Bearer, Shields
Tiranoc Chariot - 85pts
Rare
Repeater Bolt Thrower - 100pts
Great Eagle - 50pts

Is this better? I am also working on a 1250pts, 1500pts, and 2000pts army lists based around this one. So I want this to be a good anchor force.

Silver-Joe
24-12-2009, 04:56
I would strongly recommend Dragon Princes instead of silver Helms.

For the 178 points it costs you to get 6 Silver helms (aka 7 attacks +1Cr due to standard) you could get 5 dragon princes (10 attacks +1 Cr) with musician and a banner and two more points, which I think you can spare anyways.
furthermore, lose the standard on the reavers, it'll just give away VPs.

Everything else is fine IMO,
Joe

Redheadedmb
24-12-2009, 05:11
So you are saying this:

Heroes
Noble - 146pts
Great Weapon, Dragon Armor, Dragonscale Shield, Dragon Horn
Core
Archers -110pts
10
Spearmen -205pts
20, Sentinel, Musician, Standard Bearer
Special
Ellyrian Reavers - 126pts
5, Musician, Standard Bearer
Dragon Princes - 180pts
5, Musician, Standard Bearer
Tiranoc Chariot - 85pts
Rare
Repeater Bolt Thrower - 100pts
Great Eagle - 50pts

Total = 1002

Any other opinions?

Steadman
24-12-2009, 15:00
This list is probably more solid. A solitary eagle won't be too much trouble to dispatch, so I'd drop it. Adjusted the Noble's equipment to be cheaper yet as effective, dropped the banner from the fast cavalry (They should never fight unsupported by a unit that has one so it's just points to your opponent if they lose it) and lost the Sentinels from the spearmen as with 3 ranks the exta attack is not really worth it in 1000pts. Added another solid block of spears as a strong base is a must.


* Heroes

o Noble - 118
Great Weapon, Armour of Caledor


* Core

o Archers -110pts
10

o Spearmen -150
15, Musician, Standard Bearer

o Spearmen -150
15, Musician, Standard Bearer


* Special

o Ellyrian Reavers - 112pts
5, Musician

o Dragon Princes - 180pts
5, Musician, Standard Bearer

o Tiranoc Chariot - 85pts


* Rare

o Repeater Bolt Thrower - 100pts


1005pts


EDIT: IDK if you have a model, but a Dragon Mage is always fun in 1000pts

puppetmaster24
24-12-2009, 15:10
DO NOT DROP THE EAGLE!!

if you are clever that will win you games. but i would definitely drop the standard on the reavers.

Steadman
24-12-2009, 15:45
If you want the eagle that badly, make it more killy by mounting your Noble on it with the Star Lance/Enchanted Shield. I personally do not see the merits of keeping an eagle that won't negate ranks, run down units or even last very long in CC or when shot

Redheadedmb
24-12-2009, 17:29
I just finished a game with this list:

Heroes
Noble - 146pts
Great Weapon, Dragon Armor, Dragonscale Shield, Dragon Horn
Core
Archers -110pts
10
Spearmen -205pts
20, Sentinel, Musician, Standard Bearer
Special
Ellyrian Reavers - 126pts
5, Musician, Standard Bearer
Dragon Princes - 180pts
5, Musician, Standard Bearer
Tiranoc Chariot - 85pts
Rare
Repeater Bolt Thrower - 100pts
Great Eagle - 50pts

It did worse than List 1 when i comes to VPs but I believe that is because no banners were captured by either side. I mounted my Noble in the chariot and by himself he took out a unit of 15 Dwarf Warriors.

@Steadman - I am planning on keeping the Great Eagle as I use it as a distraction for enemy war machines, but I will run a test game first, also using the additional spearmen. However I do like your modification to the Noble and plan on using that. And I do plan on dropping the standard for the Reavers. I shall see if it goes well.

puppetmaster24
24-12-2009, 17:38
the best tactic to use with an eagle is to use him to kill warmachine crews, march block, redirect charges and just to generally die at the right time so your units can get a flank charge on that scary block of grave guard.

Armond
25-12-2009, 07:09
Reavers should not have standards, fast cav just don't have the resiliency to hold onto it in any form of combat, save perhaps against warmchine crews.

Hey now, how about telling exactly how each unit performed. If they won back their points or not, or if they flunked out of warhammer?!

I for one love the great eagle. It does the following: block march moves, kill T3 warmachine crews, kill magic using characters, and can combine charge with just about any unit you decide to charge with! Just be smart with it!

I also suggest either mounting the noble on a steed or perhaps in a chariot. Just beware of S7 stuff.

Redheadedmb
26-12-2009, 16:15
Well I can tell you this, they all flunked out of Warhammer, except maybe the RBT. The Noble/Chariot almost caught up with it's points because it took out a whole unit of Dwarf Warriors by itself. Spearmen = destroyed. Quickly. Same with the Dragon Princes. Neither got any points thanks to an Organ Gun on a hill. I hate those things.

However, it felt like there was something missing from the list I used. Magic, even low level, would have helped tremendously. High Magic, using Curse of Arrow Attraction and the like would have supported my Archers and RBT.

And that is how I use the Great Eagle :evilgrin:

Oh! I got a chariot for Christmas. Making it a Lion Chariot. Yay S5 Impact hits, two sets of 2S5 Lion attacks, and two sets of 1S6 White Lion Charioteer hits!

Bladelord
26-12-2009, 19:41
Gratz for the Lion chariot Redheadedmb, myself it was the only thing on my wish list & it was the only thing I never got.

I love magic at 1000pts. A list I made before that worked 100% against some friends was something like this:

lvl.2 Dragon Mage, Silver Wand, Ring of Fury.
435pts.
10 Archers.
110pts.
5 Dragon Princes, standard bearer, Banner of Sorcery.
220pts.
Tiranoc Chariot.
85pts.
Great Eagle.
50pts.
Repeater Bolt Thrower
100pts.

Total: 1000pts.

The Dragon Mage surprisingly never died:) & slaughtered whatever it could get into line of sight for the pure fury of Fire & Khaine!:evilgrin:

Dragon Prince of Caledor
27-12-2009, 02:17
My basic 1000pts has 15 PG 15 WL 5 DP 10 archers 15 spearmen and a L2 mage with two scrolls and silver wand. The PG have full command and the Banner of Sorcery. The white lions have full command and gem of courage if memory serves correct. I think the dragon princes were generic. If you are playing against dwarves turn the scrolls into an eagle. That list did well against brets and TK (including chariots). You could always cash in on the mage for a fighty Noble with armour of caledor, great weapon, and guardian phoenix. With the extra points you could get a second eagle... now that sounds effective :D

Bladelord
27-12-2009, 13:15
Aye it does:)