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inq.serge
31-12-2009, 14:05
Hi.

I have a slightly CC-oriented lvl3 VC lady with spectral form and forbidden lore, bunkered in a 5 strong unit of wraiths, with a banshee.

Now the question is, which of following 3 lores do you think I should take;

1; Lore of Fire:
The flaming sword of rhuin gives an extra attack, and some extra strength, and good chance of hitting. Combined with ethereal, she's quite good in combat against mighty characters with mundane attacks. Also, lore of fire has some good offensive spells.

2; Lore of beasts:
Bears anger seems to be great, since she becomes a star dragon, with higher I, 1 extra attack, Higher LD, and 4 less wounds. And She's ethereal. Great against infantry. Also, It has some fine spells for my swarms and monsters (It's a ghouls and ghosts army with a dragon-ridding frostblade, avatar of death, lvl4 lord, and 2 elite-unit slaying cc-flying heroes, a unit of skellies with character-slayer Wight and a varghulf), and the wolf hunts seems great in combo with the dragon lord, since he can first-turn charge. But don't know if flamers can stand and shoot against the wolf hunts?

3; lore of light:
Some nice spells, the 6th spell seem great against daemons, but the best part is, phas illumination, that she can either cast on herself, loosing one attack, or on the banshee, who gains 2 to both strength and attack, making the enchanted superb in challenges, unless meeting something with magic attacks from other sources than magic weapons (Since magic weapons counts as mundane against Phas Illumination, and don't forget the etherealness)

So, which lore should I take, or, more correctly, which of these 3 lore should I take against what army? (Don't forget that she's a CC-character that cast spells, not a spellcaster.)

sulla
31-12-2009, 20:13
I can't see any reason to take any of those lores instead of the vampire lore. With all 6 spells of the Vamp lore plus invocation you have an incredibly versatile caster with far more options than any of the other lores offer.

inq.serge
31-12-2009, 20:30
But, AFAIK, lore of vamps doesn't have any mean ethereal+cc-spell combo.

Darkangeldentist
31-12-2009, 21:01
Whilst lore of vampires is a great lore I am a firm believer that the other lores add a great deal to our magic phase and also make the game more fun for both sides.

Against anything likely to have regeneration take fire. It makes such a difference. Plus the sword turns the lord into an incredibly reliable killer whilst also being easy to cast. However I find the lore of fire is actually a bit lacking. The spells are not very easy to cast (with the exception of the first two) and do modest damage. (Since all are S4.)

Lore of beasts is pretty awesome for your level 3, most of the spells are useful, bear's anger in particular being both easy to cast and makes the vampire a lot nastier and tougher in combat. (T6 is a big boost.) Hunter's spear and crows feast are useful direct damage spells and beast cowers is frankly awesome against a lot of foes. (Star dragons can be nicely taken out of the picture.)

Lore of light would be my favourite choice though. Easy to cast spells, great versatility and one of the most evil combos ever. Pha's illumination is frankly obscene when combined with ethereal status. The best spell in the lore is dazzling brightness though, making an enemy WS1 for a round is just evil. Cleansing flare is indeed a very good spell, able to weakness or finish off many units. It is probably most effective against undead rather than daemons since so many daemon armies the great standard of sundering.

I take a level one with forbidden lore and never use lore of vampires with him. The other lores add so much more if you already have a decent caster with the vampire lore.

Light would be my favourite against most armies but fire would get a go against anyone with lots of regenerating units. Beasts if there are several monstrous units or characters riding dragons and such. Overall though light gives the greatest range of support spells. (Make the enemy WS 1 for a round means the wraiths will hit on 3's and Pha's illumination to stop that nasty character with the big magic sword.) Plus it is probably the easiest lore for casting.

grumbaki
31-12-2009, 21:34
I'd go with light and these three spells:

* Burning Gaze: Decent damage, flaming and increased strength against undead/daemons
* Pha's Illumination: Makes your caster literally unkillable in close combat. What is not to like about that?
* Dazzling Brightness: Not so much to cast when that unit is in combat (etheral anyways) but to help out your other units. Even WS 2 skeletons can perform well when their enemy is reduced to WS 1.

The Red Scourge
01-01-2010, 13:56
Don't forget lore of Death. Doom & Darkness and Steal Soul are favorites of mine :)

I also prefer a different lore from the Vampire one on my lord. It adds diversity to the magic phase, and is a whole lot more fun than just casting VHD :)

Per default I choose Fire; I like 5 S8 attacks hitting on 2+ followed by Red Fury. Along with lots of magical missiles to burn those regenerating things out there.

VS elves in asbestos I go for Beasts; Bears Anger gives 7 S7 attacks on a T7 character, Hunter's Spear is great for skewering dragon princes, and there is even a little movement control too.

I'd also go for beasts to beat up a 'thirster in cc

wingedserpant
01-01-2010, 15:29
I beleive the Lore of light can also get your wraiths a Ward save .

redshylock
01-01-2010, 19:07
Can you cast Pha's Illumination on a Banshee which is a champion but not a "friendly character"?

redshylock
01-01-2010, 19:11
I beleive the Lore of light can also get your wraiths a Ward save .

That's the Lore of Heavens

Gorak
01-01-2010, 19:13
vampire's can't take lore of light. Also vampire lore as no off spells? Are you nuts? danse macbre is prehaps the best spell in the game,curse of years also very nice against large units of inf,gaze is a soild mm and you can heal you poor wriaths. Now on to wraiths, poor choice imho as one soild magic mislle will destroy them or any skaven shooting(count as magical attacks)

danny-d-b
01-01-2010, 19:31
vampire's can't take lore of light. Also vampire lore as no off spells? Are you nuts? danse macbre is prehaps the best spell in the game,curse of years also very nice against large units of inf,gaze is a soild mm and you can heal you poor wriaths. Now on to wraiths, poor choice imho as one soild magic mislle will destroy them or any skaven shooting(count as magical attacks)

incorect I belive- acording to army builder vamps can take everythin but life

Darkangeldentist
01-01-2010, 21:59
Forbidden lore prohibits lore of life only. Lore of light (however absurd) is perfectly legal.

If we were only taking a single spell caster then lore of vampires would be best, however if we are taking more than one good spell caster then other taking the vampire lore is less important.

Whichever lore they choose they still retain invocation so they will always be able to heal stuff.

inq.serge
02-01-2010, 11:45
Thanks.

The Lvl 4 and the 2 lvl1 vampires will have lore of vampires, and the lvl 3 will have Lore of Light.

Seems great.

I'm not sure if I can cast pha's on the banshee, but, AFAIK, spells that can be cast on friendly characters can be cast on unit champs, but I might be wrong.

DarthBinky
03-01-2010, 16:32
I'm not sure if I can cast pha's on the banshee, but, AFAIK, spells that can be cast on friendly characters can be cast on unit champs, but I might be wrong.
No, you can't. Per pg 81 of the rulebook, champs are not characters, but are R&F models that follow a few special rules that apply to characters (ie they can participate in challenges, they get "Look out, sir!", etc).

Slayerthane
05-01-2010, 16:17
I think there might be a misunderstanding about Pha's Illumination. It grants a total of 3 attacks at strength 5 to the caster or the target of the spell, but this is not 3 additional attacks and an increase in strength to 5. That means, no matter whether you're a wizard, warrior priest or VC Lord, you only get 3 strength 5 attacks.

Flaming sword gives only 1 additional attack, +3 strength, hits on 2s. That's good but definitely not as good as bear's anger. That's the spell to use for close combat. I think lore of metal and lore of beasts are probably the most versatile lores.