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Nicha11
12-01-2010, 09:26
I've just been reading through the new tyranid codex and came across something interesting.

It appears the new swarm lord character lays the smack down on Marneus Calgar.
Infact it looks like old bluey boots might have bitten the dust if not for some reinforcments.

Now I'm all in favour of every 'dex having its own stories of greatness, but come one.

We're now at

Swarmlord>Calgar>Avatar>????

So I can only assume with the BA's new dex.

Dante>Swarmlord>Calgar>Avatar>????

Does every codex need to one-up the one before it?

MegaPope
12-01-2010, 09:50
Welcome to Games Workshop's marketing strategy ;)

Or it could be some kind of running in-joke on the part of the writers...they can't unaware of how much nerdrage the whole Calgar issue caused. They may well be encouraging it. :p

Deetwo
12-01-2010, 09:51
Does every codex need to one-up the one before it?

Only if you forget all the other codexes that were printed between tyranids, SM and eldar.. :)

MajorWesJanson
12-01-2010, 09:52
Sounds like Cold Steel Ridge or the older UM vs Nids battle report, just with the Swarmlord dropped in place of nameless nids. Calgar did get beat up by nids pretty bad at one point, hence why he is physically Vader with power fists of doom.

Jackmojo
12-01-2010, 09:54
Indeed, Calgar is hardly indomitable, he's clearly been on the wrong end of things lots of times. You don't get that high a percentage of scar tissue and replacement bits by winning every fight...

Jack

Broken Loose
12-01-2010, 09:56
Well, considering the Swarmlord is a psychic tactical genius composed of the minds of several trillion tactical geniuses with the memories and knowledge of each and every one of them fighting over countless millenia, I'd say Marneus Calgar was outmatched.

Marneus Calgar beating up a god of war without breaking a sweat with a pair of clunky powerfists, though, is a definite stretch. The Avatar would give the Swarmlord a pretty good fight, though, and probably come out on top 1 on 1 due to sheer martial prowess. And being made of melta.

Fighting Swarmlord is kind of like fighting Tzeentch and Khorne at the same time, but instead of being in an immortal body he regenerates wounds and reincarnates. And clones himself. With each one sharing the same mind and memories.

What I don't understand is how the Tau were able to survive against both a Tyranid fleet AND a Necron fleet.

Rick Blaine
12-01-2010, 09:56
There's nothing wrong with Swarmlord>Calgar, it was Calgar>Avatar that was weird.

Radium
12-01-2010, 09:59
But the funny part is, when the new Eldar codex is released it'll be: Avatar>Dante>Swarmlord>Calgar>Avatar>????.

Deetwo
12-01-2010, 10:01
What I don't understand is how the Tau were able to survive against both a Tyranid fleet AND a Necron fleet.

It's simple, Tau might seem like something you mop the floor with, but in reality their animelike technology makes them able to increase their power levels over four digits and a nine.. :D

But seriously, they actually did that? :wtf:

The pestilent 1
12-01-2010, 10:04
Probably has something with not using human waves.
Turns out, it doesn't work so hot against the nids.

AndrewGPaul
12-01-2010, 10:08
Presumably Calgar, like everyone else, has his off-days. It doesn't strike me as unreasonable that his successes will be described in Codex: Space Marines and his failings in the Codex of whatever army gives him a hard time. Calgar defeating an Avatar on one occasion, and being defeated by a Hive Tyrant on another doesn't mean that Hive Tyrants are better than Avatars.

Broken Loose
12-01-2010, 10:12
It's simple, Tau might seem like something you mop the floor with, but in reality their animelike technology makes them able to increase their power levels over four digits and a nine.. :D

But seriously, they actually did that? :wtf:

Basically, the Tau and the IG are teamed up against Hive Fleet Gorgon. The Tau keep switching tactics and ammunition types like that time on Star Trek when they were fighting the Borg and kept on switching phaser frequencies whenever they adapted to the old ones. They're doing a good job of surviving until at one point the Tyranids hit a colonized moon and then abruptly back off.

The Tau take out the remainder left on said moon and start celebrating. 5 minutes later, Necrons burst out of the ground and they realize why Gorgon left. Now they're completely hosed. The Necrons completely wipe out the colony and starts up the raider fleet which harvests world after world.

The Tau start evacuating planets and whoops, Gorgon started eating the evacuation fleets, solving the whole "stirring the Necrons" issue. Things get REALLY REALLY bad and then a huge Imperial Guard fleet comes in from warp and attacks the Tau. Now the Tau are even MORE boned than before. The IG realize what a huge mistake it was to ignore the Tyranids for 5 whole minutes, teams up with the Tau, and they swing from losing horribly to winning very abruptly and without explanation in a single paragraph.

The good guys kill all the Tyranids in the system and nobody bothers to mention the fact that they just forgot about the Necrons, who, by the way, haven't been mentioned ever since the whole "evacuation" business. I'm totally serious.



The rest of the fluff in the book is totally ace, though.

Kurisu313
12-01-2010, 10:31
Swarmlord>Calgar>Avatar>????


Well, if people would actually READ that story rather than just jumping on the anti-calgar bandwagon, they'd know that:

1) The avatar had been seriously wounded from fighting through an entire company before he reached calgar.

2) The avatar beat the hell out of calgar before he killed it.

If we assume that the avatar is at full power, it probably goes Avatar>Swarmlord>Calgar

And seriously, people are complaining about marneus getting his **** handed to him?

EmperorEternalXIX
12-01-2010, 10:37
It doesn't matter.

The fact that the SM codex decided Pedro Kantor is Inspiring, and Marneus Calgar isn't, made me take it as the kind of thing they will one day retcon.

I hope so because those lame Wonder Twin Space Marine Chapter Leader stories made me want to throw up.

sayles78
12-01-2010, 10:43
Well, if people would actually READ that story rather than just jumping on the anti-calgar bandwagon, they'd know that:

1) The avatar had been seriously wounded from fighting through an entire company before he reached calgar.

2) The avatar beat the hell out of calgar before he killed it.

If we assume that the avatar is at full power, it probably goes Avatar>Swarmlord>Calgar

And seriously, people are complaining about marneus getting his **** handed to him?

Every time I use Calgar he gets his **** handed to him! But I dont complain about it - we have a good laugh about it! Same as Abaddon - he always gets massacred - thats what happens to big cheeses!

Eldoriath
12-01-2010, 10:59
About Tau and necron fleet stuff:
If I have understood it correctly the necrons can't use warp travel but have to rely on ordinare sub-light travel which makes it take a long time reaching any new target compared to warp travel, which the tau can only sniffingly use. Dunno how big the distances are/were, or if the necron fleet was shot down passing by when trying to get to the tyranids?

Lord Damocles
12-01-2010, 11:09
Calgar [barely] beats Avatar: 'Calgar is too good dammit!'

Calgar gets beaten by something [else]: 'Calgar should still be best dammit!'

...


If I have understood it correctly the necrons can't use warp travel but have to rely on ordinare sub-light travel which makes it take a long time reaching any new target compared to warp travel
Necron ships can 'cross the galaxy in the blink of an eye' (Codex: Necrons, pg.25). They're fast.

WinglessVT2
12-01-2010, 11:24
Necron ships aren't merely fast, but move at the speed of the ninja.

Tau win because they're anime communists, whereas the imperium is gothic noir capitalist fascists. In fiction, the lesser of two evils always wins.
That, and because they have mechasuits. Once marines develop mechasuits, they'll never lose to anyone, ever, for any reason.

wilsongrahams
12-01-2010, 11:59
Being able to best something doesn't necesarily make you better than them - Calgar may have been lucky on that day, and the avatar was looking the other way. Maybe it didn't like blue food so ignored him?

In my time in the army I knew several excellent shots. This did not stop them getting shot themselves by lesser marksmen. The same is true for all wars in history. Luck, gains victory more often than skill, so this Dante>Stromlord>Calgar thingy doesn't really mean all that much.

In games, I've had scouts cut through broods of Tyranid warriors in close combat, but then had termagants slaughter them in return. Real life is the same as our games.

ReclecteR
12-01-2010, 12:12
Real life is the same as our games.

That, my friend, is a very dangerous comment to make 'round these parts. :p

Actually I agree completely with you though. Fluff is there only insofar as to sell codices of that fluff-type, it seems unfortunately often. Ah well, at least for now the nids are the biggest and baddest of the bunch :)

Chem-Dog
12-01-2010, 12:19
Presumably Calgar, like everyone else, has his off-days. It doesn't strike me as unreasonable that his successes will be described in Codex: Space Marines and his failings in the Codex of whatever army gives him a hard time. Calgar defeating an Avatar on one occasion, and being defeated by a Hive Tyrant on another doesn't mean that Hive Tyrants are better than Avatars.

An iota of sense in a sea of insanity.



1) The avatar had been seriously wounded from fighting through an entire company before he reached calgar.

2) The avatar beat the hell out of calgar before he killed it.

True Movie style, the Monster wades through the troops, several moments where a kill is expected but doesn't come (like direct hits with lascannons ect) eventually the Hero has to intervene personaly, up til now he's been:- holding a flank by himself/regaining an artifact/rescuing the girl/escaping capture, he gets smacked about a bit first and it looks dicey there for a moment but the Monster inexplicably:- assumes the Hero dead/gets distracted by a sparkly, the Hero then:- has a flashback/is visited by a dead ally/uses the wonder drug he was loathe to use before/activates the ancient amulet, and gains a second wind and manages to:- overpower/blindside/banish the beast.

Lord Solar Plexus
12-01-2010, 12:22
Does every codex need to one-up the one before it?

To be fair, there's Marbo and Yarrick, so GW has reached the highest possible power level. You know the story -

Marbo and Yarrick once visited Armageddon and got into a bar fight. When they left, the Inquisition had to come up with a cover story of several Ork and Chaos invasions...

Bunnahabhain
12-01-2010, 12:29
Fortunately, the Guard are unlikely to get involved in this chain.

Artillery Regiment >>> Swarmlord + Calgar + Avatar + .......

Its good to be on top.

Seriously, even mighty heros have off days, which can be a problem if you are facing a god of war, bio-engineered killing machine etc, etc.
5000 gunners don't all have an off day at once though.

wilsongrahams
12-01-2010, 12:34
Depends if those 5000 gunners are asleep when the Imperator Titan decides to collapse on their barracks...

Gen.Steiner
12-01-2010, 12:41
Pah, the Imperial Navy outguns you all (well, apart from the Blackstone Fortresses and the Planet Killer, but that's heresy and don't exist anyway, no, not at all in any way shape nor form).

And then there's Exterminatus... :evilgrin:

The pestilent 1
12-01-2010, 13:31
To be fair, there's Marbo and Yarrick, so GW has reached the highest possible power level. You know the story -

Marbo and Yarrick once visited Armageddon and got into a bar fight. When they left, the Inquisition had to come up with a cover story of several Ork and Chaos invasions...

Not to mention Creed who just flanked you with an Imperator titan.

CREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEED!

Mannimarco
12-01-2010, 13:44
Ive always seen the background as a way of selling the models, which would you rather have in your army:

the guy who kills a couple of low level redshirt grunts, figures "yeah thats probably enough" get back in the transport and goes home or the mighty hero who inspires those around him to greatness, who single handedly holds the line against overwhelming odds and defeats the enemy commander (who himself is a mighty hero capable of slaughtering scores of lesser soldiers on a whim)

The problem with the new fluff is it falls into the "bigger and better than before" catagory which might be fine for the target audience but it would put people of a more, shall we say refined taste off

I for one would love more character development, more depth to the story and more realistic (as realistic as we can get for a game thousands of years in the future where hitting people with chainsaws is a viable tactic) but unfortunately this is not the way of the game, it might have been in the past where you can have pages of background and character development but now the whole thing has taken on a somwhat "michael bay" approach to story telling

for example lets go back to the old realm of chaos books, these were indeed mighty tomes, there were charts upon charts for the games themselves and lots of little neat stories scattered throughout (granted some of them are rather dated but still good) and nowhere in those books do we have such ridiculous stories of one-up manship

Col. Frost
12-01-2010, 13:56
It's simples.

I just bought my new Codex! The background is great except that all my special characters get theirs handed to them by everyone else......

Nah, we like to read about one of our 'lads' sticking it to the man (or Xeno, Beastie, Demon etc). Would Star Wars been as successful if Hann Solo had copped a laser to the face on Tatooine? if Harry Potter got his face melted by Voldemort (we can but hope....:skull:).

Radium
12-01-2010, 14:10
It's simples.

I just bought my new Codex! The background is great except that all my special characters get theirs handed to them by everyone else......

Nah, we like to read about one of our 'lads' sticking it to the man (or Xeno, Beastie, Demon etc). Would Star Wars been as successful if Hann Solo had copped a laser to the face on Tatooine? if Harry Potter got his face melted by Voldemort (we can but hope....:skull:).

No, but then again, people are not invested in the Empire, Voldemort etc. Sure, you can like the bad guys, but they are exactly that: obstacles for the main character of the movie. In 40k each race is a main character, when you degrade certain races to mere obstacles for other races something goes horribly wrong.

SPYDER68
12-01-2010, 14:12
Its more like Calgar > Swarmlord..

Why would he go fight the thing alone ? When he can just order the marines to focus fire it and bring him down fast and easy.

Deetwo
12-01-2010, 14:17
Why would he go fight the thing alone ? When he can just order the marines to focus fire it and bring him down fast and easy.

In a similar fashion, there's a little clue in the name "Swarmlord" ;)

Fluff is never objective though, so depending on who's telling the story, facts bend in different ways.

Rirekon
12-01-2010, 14:26
Fluff is never objective though, so depending on who's telling the story, facts bend in different ways.

This.
You have to remember that GW fluff isn't written as fact, it's written as the myths and legends of the age.

Thud
12-01-2010, 15:09
Rock - Avatar
Paper - Calgar
Scissors - Swarmlord

Is that the beginnings of a new specialist game? No one tell Jervis!

The pestilent 1
12-01-2010, 15:13
Dear development team.

Scissors are overpowered.
Paper is fine, as is Rock.

Sincerely Paper

The Custodian
12-01-2010, 15:34
It's interesting that they changed it into the swarmlord...

In the battle report didn't calgar get mauled by a tide of stealers that suddenly appeared from the pipes? Must not have sounded epic enough...

razormasticator
12-01-2010, 15:39
It's simple, Tau might seem like something you mop the floor with, but in reality their animelike technology makes them able to increase their power levels over four digits and a nine.. :D

But seriously, they actually did that? :wtf:

Railguns... Nuff said.:D

CitizenNick
12-01-2010, 15:40
Dear development team.

Scissors are overpowered.
Paper is fine, as is Rock.

Sincerely Paper

This is a simply amazing statement. Bravo.

Tonberry
12-01-2010, 15:49
It is a well known fact that Mkoll was not included as a special character in the new IG dex due to the fact that his presence would render any attempts at 1-upmanship in later codexes obsolete.

Gen.Steiner
12-01-2010, 16:14
It's interesting that they changed it into the swarmlord...

In the battle report didn't calgar get mauled by a tide of stealers that suddenly appeared from the pipes? Must not have sounded epic enough...

He's also been nearly killed by a spore mine that hit him in the head during fighting on Ichar IV. How's that for unheroic? Especially as he'd spent the entire battle hiding behind a Rhino and stood next to an Apothecary.

Necron Lord Omega
12-01-2010, 18:39
Basically, the Tau and the IG are teamed up against Hive Fleet Gorgon. The Tau keep switching tactics and ammunition types like that time on Star Trek when they were fighting the Borg and kept on switching phaser frequencies whenever they adapted to the old ones. They're doing a good job of surviving until at one point the Tyranids hit a colonized moon and then abruptly back off.

The Tau take out the remainder left on said moon and start celebrating. 5 minutes later, Necrons burst out of the ground and they realize why Gorgon left. Now they're completely hosed. The Necrons completely wipe out the colony and starts up the raider fleet which harvests world after world.

The Tau start evacuating planets and whoops, Gorgon started eating the evacuation fleets, solving the whole "stirring the Necrons" issue. Things get REALLY REALLY bad and then a huge Imperial Guard fleet comes in from warp and attacks the Tau. Now the Tau are even MORE boned than before. The IG realize what a huge mistake it was to ignore the Tyranids for 5 whole minutes, teams up with the Tau, and they swing from losing horribly to winning very abruptly and without explanation in a single paragraph.

The good guys kill all the Tyranids in the system and nobody bothers to mention the fact that they just forgot about the Necrons, who, by the way, haven't been mentioned ever since the whole "evacuation" business. I'm totally serious.



The rest of the fluff in the book is totally ace, though.
Which book or codex is this in ?

DeadlySquirrel
12-01-2010, 19:06
Not to mention Creed who just flanked you with an Imperator titan.

CREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEED!


I actually lol'd at that

To answer the OP, it is a well known fact that a Swarmlord's power level is OVER 9000!!1!!! - And calgar's is a mear 8679. Nuff said

But this whole one-upmanship thing, evry race has to have SOME-ONE who is insanley awsome

druchii
12-01-2010, 19:57
There's nothing wrong with Swarmlord>Calgar, it was Calgar>Avatar that was weird.

Circular logic works because...

SPYDER68
12-01-2010, 20:14
100 pt Alpha Warrior > Calgar.

5 attack on Charge... str 6 with furious ini 6

every wound that goes through.. 3d6 LD test or suffer instant death.

ReveredChaplainDrake
12-01-2010, 20:29
100 pt Alpha Warrior > Calgar.

5 attack on Charge... str 6 with furious ini 6

every wound that goes through.. 3d6 LD test or suffer instant death.
Calgar is Eternal Warrior. Nice try though.

When I first saw this title, I thought it was about the Doom of Malan'tai deep-frying an entire Craftworld in one shot. As far as I read from the Swarmlord's fluff, it was that the Swarmlord was at times a better tactical leader than the tactical leaders of the Ultramarines. No mention of Calgar (specifically, anyway) whatsoever.

Besides, who actually won the Battle for Macragge? Tyranids already lose in whip-it-out contests to pretty much every race. Even Tau. (Remember that time when O'shasserra destroyed an entire hive fleet without losing a single vessel?)

SPYDER68
12-01-2010, 20:32
Calgar is Eternal Warrior. Nice try though.

When I first saw this title, I thought it was about the Doom of Malan'tai deep-frying an entire Craftworld in one shot. As far as I read from the Swarmlord's fluff, it was that the Swarmlord was at times a better tactical leader than the tactical leaders of the Ultramarines. No mention of Calgar (specifically, anyway) whatsoever.

Besides, who actually won the Battle for Macragge? Tyranids already lose in whip-it-out contests to pretty much every race. Even Tau. (Remember that time when O'shasserra destroyed an entire hive fleet without losing a single vessel?)

ahh boo forgot about that :p

in my case, Chimera > Calgar.. 6 shots... 5 wounds.. 4 1's.

The Custodian
12-01-2010, 20:33
Wasn't it just a splinter fleet??? And the size I said fleet is unknown ( meaning it could have simply been 1-2 ships)....

Abaddonshand
12-01-2010, 22:02
To be fair, there's Marbo and Yarrick, so GW has reached the highest possible power level. You know the story -

Marbo and Yarrick once visited Armageddon and got into a bar fight. When they left, the Inquisition had to come up with a cover story of several Ork and Chaos invasions...

You Sir, are a comical genius! :D



When I first saw this title, I thought it was about the Doom of Malan'tai deep-frying an entire Craftworld in one shot. As far as I read from the Swarmlord's fluff, it was that the Swarmlord was at times a better tactical leader than the tactical leaders of the Ultramarines. No mention of Calgar (specifically, anyway) whatsoever.


It's all detailed in the Battle for Macragge fluff, rather than the Swarmlord fluff, under the heading The Swarmlord Strikes (funnily enough ;)).

As for the Doom of Malan'tai, I would like to see an apocalypse version, one that actually was capable of taking out a substantial number of the pointy ears. Of course, he'd need to be costed at 9000 points or so, only 100 times more than currently!

chaos0xomega
12-01-2010, 22:18
About Tau and necron fleet stuff:
If I have understood it correctly the necrons can't use warp travel but have to rely on ordinare sub-light travel which makes it take a long time reaching any new target compared to warp travel, which the tau can only sniffingly use. Dunno how big the distances are/were, or if the necron fleet was shot down passing by when trying to get to the tyranids?

Wrong. Necrons can travel beyond the speed of light without entering the warp/another plane. They do the whole FTL thing in realspace.


Which book or codex is this in ?

Im guessing the new nid codex

TheShadowCow
13-01-2010, 00:37
Wrong. Necrons can travel beyond the speed of light without entering the warp/another plane. They do the whole FTL thing in realspace.


Indeed they do! Necron FTL tech is an extreme version of inertia-less drive, where they essentially reduce the resistance that their ships encounter (on a molecular level?!) to zero (less than zero?!), and they literally slip from one place to the next. At least that's how it's painted in BFG.

Tyranid FTL tech is different, and seems to involve doing odd things with gravity.



Regardless, it's nice to see something other than "The Warp Did It", and it reinforces the "from beyond the 40k galaxy" feel the Tyranids are getting.

LonelyPath
13-01-2010, 01:28
Termagant > Calgar... or at least in my games when he assaults my Gaunts and they give him a pasting in CC, lol. It's funny no matter how many times it happens!

Of course, with the way things are going when the DA codex is released Jonson will have destroyed Calliban by punching Luthor, knocked Russ out by breathing to hard in his direction (and not from bad breath) and the entire Chapter will be so tough they truly do wear bath robes into battle and nothing else!

heh...

Lord_Crull
13-01-2010, 01:50
Marneus Calgar beating up a god of war without breaking a sweat with a pair of clunky powerfists, though, is a definite stretch.


When did that happen? reading the fight again Calgar took a pretty bad wound and collapsed right after the battle. That defintely not ''without a sweat''

Honestly, the Calgar-Avatar fight has been exaggerated heavily these days.

Joewrightgm
13-01-2010, 01:53
There's nothing wrong with Swarmlord>Calgar, it was Calgar>Avatar that was weird.

Am I the only person that read the part where a squad of thunder hammer terminators softened up the Avatar? Is my codex different from everyone else's?

I don't care if you are the God of War incarnate, but you get cracked about by 5 thunder hammers, you're not going to be on your A game when some cheeky Ultramarine gets lucky.

MasterDecoy
13-01-2010, 02:00
The real issue I saw strait away was that we know calgar can catch 1 sword in his powerfist, but the swarmlord has 4, the fight probably went somthing along the lines of this:
Calgar *Hmmmm, giant sword monster, I know, I'll just cacth the sword in my powerfist like when i was fighting that eldar god thingy last time and then give it the ol kidney punch*
Swarmlord: *FOOOOOOOOD*

Swarmlord swings at calgar who catches the sword

Calger "Yeah, take that you filthy xeno!"
Swarmlord "Raaaaawwwwwrrrr"

Swarmlord swings its 3 other swords at calger

Later in the evac craft

Honor gaurd "Sir, you saw it had 4 giant swords didnt you?"
Calgar "Shut Up!"
Honor gaurd "I mean seriously, what where you thinking, you'd have to be an idiot......"

Calgar punches the honor gaurd out the evac craft's door into a tyranid hoard below

Back at command

Calgar "My honor gaurd died, so that I may live......."

AngryAngel
13-01-2010, 03:16
Termagant > Calgar... or at least in my games when he assaults my Gaunts and they give him a pasting in CC, lol. It's funny no matter how many times it happens!

Of course, with the way things are going when the DA codex is released Jonson will have destroyed Calliban by punching Luthor, knocked Russ out by breathing to hard in his direction (and not from bad breath) and the entire Chapter will be so tough they truly do wear bath robes into battle and nothing else!

heh...

Woah woah woah, lets just stop right there. We all know DA will never be that powefull. GW hate the DA they have proven that time and again. If that prophecy comes to pass I'll be very surprised. Especially as currently we get zero cool stories for our characters. They all involve them getting beat up in some way, nothing too heroic about that.

meno1
13-01-2010, 04:42
It is a well known fact that Mkoll was not included as a special character in the new IG dex due to the fact that his presence would render any attempts at 1-upmanship in later codexes obsolete.

Haha i thought this was great! Although I seem to be the only one to get it:eyebrows:

druchii
13-01-2010, 04:57
Haha i thought this was great! Although I seem to be the only one to get it:eyebrows:

Chuck Norris jokes aren't funny anymore. Atleast wait untill he dies.

Seriously, all this fan-boy nerd raging and people forget the story in the Chaos Demons codex where a Greater Demon (a Keeper of Secrets I think!) eats an Avatar!

Does that mean that demon-avatar> swarm-calgar?

d

Vepr
13-01-2010, 05:02
The real issue I saw strait away was that we know calgar can catch 1 sword in his powerfist, but the swarmlord has 4, the fight probably went somthing along the lines of this:
Calgar *Hmmmm, giant sword monster, I know, I'll just cacth the sword in my powerfist like when i was fighting that eldar god thingy last time and then give it the ol kidney punch*
Swarmlord: *FOOOOOOOOD*

Swarmlord swings at calgar who catches the sword

Calger "Yeah, take that you filthy xeno!"
Swarmlord "Raaaaawwwwwrrrr"

Swarmlord swings its 3 other swords at calger

Later in the evac craft

Honor gaurd "Sir, you saw it had 4 giant swords didnt you?"
Calgar "Shut Up!"
Honor gaurd "I mean seriously, what where you thinking, you'd have to be an idiot......"

Calgar punches the honor gaurd out the evac craft's door into a tyranid hoard below

Back at command

Calgar "My honor gaurd died, so that I may live......."

LOL. Ultramarine fans everywhere are creating a MasterDecoy voodoo doll...

meno1
13-01-2010, 06:24
Chuck Norris jokes aren't funny anymore. Atleast wait untill he dies.

A little off-topic but...where'd you get Chuck Norris from?:wtf:

There's not much more to be added to this thread really, each codex has to put down another, otherwise there'd be no point in fielding Calgar 'cause he got squashed by a bug, or an Avatar 'cause he got pounded by Calgar. It will always be this way, with each codex claiming that it's characters did some mighty feat, otherwise sales would probably go down.

druchii
13-01-2010, 06:41
A little off-topic but...where'd you get Chuck Norris from?:wtf:

There's not much more to be added to this thread really, each codex has to put down another, otherwise there'd be no point in fielding Calgar 'cause he got squashed by a bug, or an Avatar 'cause he got pounded by Calgar. It will always be this way, with each codex claiming that it's characters did some mighty feat, otherwise sales would probably go down.

It is a well known fact that Mkoll is indeed Chuck Norris Mary Sue-ing himself into warhammer 40k fluff.

d

ps. too soon?

Tonberry
13-01-2010, 09:57
It is a well known fact that Mkoll is indeed Chuck Norris Mary Sue-ing himself into warhammer 40k fluff.

d

ps. too soon?

I wouldn't let Mkoll hear you say that :D

Radium
13-01-2010, 10:13
Woah woah woah, lets just stop right there. We all know DA will never be that powefull. GW hate the DA they have proven that time and again. If that prophecy comes to pass I'll be very surprised. Especially as currently we get zero cool stories for our characters. They all involve them getting beat up in some way, nothing too heroic about that.

Exactly. The next DA codex will be 2 pages. One page for credits, and one with rules. The rules will state the following: "Use codex: UM. Subtract 1 from all of the following: WS, BS, I, Ld." Proof that everyone wants to be just like the UM, but can never meet their standards. This will also be true for every other SM codex after BA.

Mannimarco
13-01-2010, 13:07
druchii: that particular story is often over exaggerated, its not (as many people insist) a KOS strolling up and munching an avatar

what actually happend is the KOS strolled up while its daemons were attacking the craftworld, the avatar was still inactive at the time, he only woke up and went berserk when the KOS licked him IIRC (i suppose that would wake anything up)

the KOS then possessed the avatar as it was little more than a hollow husk acting on instinct (avatar smash!) and hadnt been awoken in the proper ritual (see court of the young king)

I've said it before and I'll say it again, a lot of the stories which wind people up so much arnt even being read first hand, they are basing their opinions on reading other peoples views on a story and basing their opinions on that however people invariably add their own little slant or personal bias when remembering a story:

the calgar vs avatar is a prime example, depending on whose view you read (and assuming you havnt read the codex itself) you will have either heard:

they wrestled like the gods of old, each mighty champions laying several blows each powerful enough to kill a lesser man OR the avatar, seriously weakend by having to wade through all those ultras OR calgar beat it like he was its daddy

I leave you now with a passing thought: what did everybody think of the story in codex:CSM where huron destroyed 50 strike cruisers and half the space wolves chapter joined him? (see how it works?)

LonelyPath
13-01-2010, 13:31
Exactly. The next DA codex will be 2 pages. One page for credits, and one with rules. The rules will state the following: "Use codex: UM. Subtract 1 from all of the following: WS, BS, I, Ld." Proof that everyone wants to be just like the UM, but can never meet their standards. This will also be true for every other SM codex after BA.

I just wish they would embrace the fact that the DA are Chapter 1. they're the first legion and were th Emperors personal bodyguard. Those things alone should make the DA stand up above most other chapters regardless of their own hidden agendas in seeking out the Fallen. Oh yes, and bring back some form of the Iron Wing so they can hve vehicle squadrons, that'd seerate them more from the UM... or at least until C: SM 6th edition is released...

Fobster
13-01-2010, 14:36
I just wish they would embrace the fact that the DA are Chapter 1. they're the first legion and were th Emperors personal bodyguard. Those things alone should make the DA stand up above most other chapters regardless of their own hidden agendas in seeking out the Fallen. Oh yes, and bring back some form of the Iron Wing so they can hve vehicle squadrons, that'd seerate them more from the UM... or at least until C: SM 6th edition is released...
I thought the Fists were the emporers praetorians? Which was why dorn was fortifying the imperial palace. Also why purtabo hated dorn so much. He was at the emperors side while he was stuck in a trench, sapping.

The Custodian
13-01-2010, 14:50
I just wish they would embrace the fact that the DA are Chapter 1. they're the first legion and were th Emperors personal bodyguard. Those things alone should make the DA stand up above most other chapters regardless of their own hidden agendas in seeking out the Fallen. Oh yes, and bring back some form of the Iron Wing so they can hve vehicle squadrons, that'd seerate them more from the UM... or at least until C: SM 6th edition is released...


Um, the dark angels were never the emps bodygaurd... Those were the custodian guard, and the whole first legion thing meant nothing really despite he angels trying to say it did...

wilsongrahams
13-01-2010, 16:22
I have to agree here. Being the first legion is nothing more than a number. Horus was the first to be found, and have his legion united with him. Until then, the Emperor fought with all the legions equally as far as I am aware.

The pestilent 1
13-01-2010, 18:28
I just wish they would embrace the fact that the DA are Chapter 1. they're the first legion and were th Emperors personal bodyguard. Those things alone should make the DA stand up above most other chapters regardless of their own hidden agendas in seeking out the Fallen. Oh yes, and bring back some form of the Iron Wing so they can hve vehicle squadrons, that'd seerate them more from the UM... or at least until C: SM 6th edition is released...

And The Emperors Children bore not only the Imperial Eagle, but his name.

Guess that makes them deserved of respect?

(and as noted, no, first legion only, not the praetorians, personal guard, bishies or anything else)

Abaddonshand
14-01-2010, 00:32
I thought the Fists were the emporers praetorians? Which was why dorn was fortifying the imperial palace. Also why purtabo hated dorn so much. He was at the emperors side while he was stuck in a trench, sapping.

Dorn did fortify the Imperial Palace, but that's because of his Legion's expertise in fixed fortifications. By the time of the Heresy when Dorn did this, the Emperor already had his Custodes.



Um, the dark angels were never the emps bodygaurd... Those were the custodian guard, and the whole first legion thing meant nothing really despite he angels trying to say it did...

Before the creation of the Custodes, the first legion was used as the Emperor's bodyguard. I don't have my codex to hand, but I'm pretty sure it was in there.


I have to agree here. Being the first legion is nothing more than a number. Horus was the first to be found, and have his legion united with him. Until then, the Emperor fought with all the legions equally as far as I am aware.

The first legion, funnily enough, were the first to be created. They played the main role in the unification of Terra. The Dark Angels legion had a much higher number of Terran Astartes than other legions, hence the "difficulties" between the Terrans and the Calibanites.

LonelyPath
14-01-2010, 01:06
I read in some fluff somewhere (forget where) that thee DA were the Empreror's bodyguard during the crusade, was this retconned?

The Custodian
14-01-2010, 01:09
Dude, the custodes have have been around forever.. Heck if you read last church you'd know that...

LonelyPath
14-01-2010, 01:25
Maybne so, but the fluff has also had the Dark Angels as his personal bodyguard. The Custodes may have always been at the Emperor's side, but the DA also had the role of being his bodyguard. It may sound weird, but it does made sense to have more than 1 layer of defence ;) lol.

I can't find the fluff regarding to it ATM, but I'm still looking...

EDIT: I found this on Fortress Of Fun Unforgiven... "The Dark Angel legion was the oldest of the space marine legions. It was the only legion to have the honour of being the emperor's personal bodyguard during the Great Crusade." While not from a canon site, it is from canon fluff.

Abaddonshand
14-01-2010, 11:13
Dude, the custodes have have been around forever.. Heck if you read last church you'd know that...

Have you read the last church? In it the Emperor says, of the super-soldiers with him, "I will not conquer the galaxy with these men, for they are but men". The Custodes were created long after the legions, and the legions were created in order, 1, 2, 3...

Fobster
14-01-2010, 11:58
"They remained the emperors Praetorians throughout the campaign and when he returned to terra to build a capital from which to rule an empire of a million worlds, the Emperor took Rogal Dorn with him."

index astartes.

Adra
14-01-2010, 12:30
Presumably Calgar, like everyone else, has his off-days.

I had an off day once. Nothing went right. Dropped my toast, put the wrong address on a letter, stubbed my toe. Guess its all relative...

ZamOne
14-01-2010, 12:57
Well, considering the Swarmlord is a psychic tactical genius composed of the minds of several trillion tactical geniuses with the memories and knowledge of each and every one of them fighting over countless millenia, I'd say Marneus Calgar was outmatched.

Marneus Calgar beating up a god of war without breaking a sweat with a pair of clunky powerfists, though, is a definite stretch. The Avatar would give the Swarmlord a pretty good fight, though, and probably come out on top 1 on 1 due to sheer martial prowess. And being made of melta.

Fighting Swarmlord is kind of like fighting Tzeentch and Khorne at the same time, but instead of being in an immortal body he regenerates wounds and reincarnates. And clones himself. With each one sharing the same mind and memories.

What I don't understand is how the Tau were able to survive against both a Tyranid fleet AND a Necron fleet.

If the hive fleets ever manage to digest Creed the Imperium is screwed with a capital S.

rabblerouser
14-01-2010, 14:40
whats really going to bake your noodle is a story where avatar>swarmlord when the next eldar codex comes out

The Custodian
14-01-2010, 15:18
Have you read the last church? In it the Emperor says, of the super-soldiers with him, "I will not conquer the galaxy with these men, for they are but men". The Custodes were created long after the legions, and the legions were created in order, 1, 2, 3...


I could have sworn those guys at the end with the big E were custodes... I need to read that part again >.<

chaos0xomega
14-01-2010, 16:00
I could have sworn that the custodes were created BEFORE the legions and the primarchs.

ScreamPaste
22-01-2010, 09:15
The real issue I saw strait away was that we know calgar can catch 1 sword in his powerfist, but the swarmlord has 4, the fight probably went somthing along the lines of this:
Calgar *Hmmmm, giant sword monster, I know, I'll just cacth the sword in my powerfist like when i was fighting that eldar god thingy last time and then give it the ol kidney punch*
Swarmlord: *FOOOOOOOOD*

Swarmlord swings at calgar who catches the sword

Calger "Yeah, take that you filthy xeno!"
Swarmlord "Raaaaawwwwwrrrr"

Swarmlord swings its 3 other swords at calger

Later in the evac craft

Honor gaurd "Sir, you saw it had 4 giant swords didnt you?"
Calgar "Shut Up!"
Honor gaurd "I mean seriously, what where you thinking, you'd have to be an idiot......"

Calgar punches the honor gaurd out the evac craft's door into a tyranid hoard below

Back at command

Calgar "My honor gaurd died, so that I may live......."


Well, except the SwarmLord left him limbless. :chrome:

Orktavius
22-01-2010, 09:23
Dear Broken Loose

*smacks you upside the head* of course they don't mention what that newly awoken necron fleet is doing anymore...that has no place in a NID book! Wait for new necrons then we'll hear more about the anime fish people being harvested