PDA

View Full Version : Who needs a new codex?



The Ginger Ninja
15-01-2010, 06:00
Keep seeing people say army X needs a new codex, so I thought i would give poll making a try (my second attempt first one failed hard), and find out once and for all what the general consensus is

The question is simple, Who Needs a new codex the most?
I have left the races who have had codexes more recently out (Damn you poll limit!:mad:)

Reflex
15-01-2010, 06:22
who needs it most from a compedetive point of view: Necrons, then WH/DH, then Tau then DE.

why DE are highly competitive and win quite a few tournies a year. the rest are poor with necrons being the poorest. DE do need a new codex, however, they mostly need the hobby as there models and fluff are... well... crap..

Dranthar
15-01-2010, 06:29
It's actually a tough choice. IMO Dark Eldar, Witch Hunters, Daemon Hunters and Necrons are all in desperate need of a new codex thanks to having an ****-load of obsolete rules and uncompetitive units.

My vote is for Dark Eldar, since they're the oldest codex by far, alot of their rules have been superceded by better versions of the same (jetbikes, talos claws, the decapitators weapon, poisoned), and with the exception of a few very good units that keep them semi-competitive, most of the rest are completely outclassed by what's available in the later rule books.

It also gets my vote for having the stupidest rule in the game - the Talos Sting. That weapon is practically a relic from 2nd ed.

Honourable mention goes to both Ordos Codeci though. A fair chunk of their armoury is obsolete and it's a chore just figuring out what variation of the rules you're using for some of the units.


DE do need a new codex, however, they mostly need the hobby as there models and fluff are... well... crap..

I completely agree on the models, but the fluff is actually pretty good. The only problem is that it's also very hard to find. :(

Mecha King Ghidorah
15-01-2010, 06:40
I say Dark Eldar since their codex is the oldest and most of the options are crap however Necrons Daemon Hunters and Witch Hunters suffer from really outdated rules and need a update soon.

Vaktathi
15-01-2010, 07:00
In terms of absolute *need* for competitiveness?

Daemonhunters
Necrons
|
Dark Eldar (great against marines, not so much against orks and IG)
|
|
|
Dark Angels
Tau

Most others I think are pretty ok at least.


In terms of needing an army overhaul for all other reasons?

Dark Eldar
Daemonhunters
Necrons
CSM's
Tau
Witch Hunters
Dark Angels

Ozybonza
15-01-2010, 07:36
While Dark Angels got royally screwed, I really think a PDF update or codex second printing would be sufficient. The concept behined them is fine - they just need to be standardised with codex:SM. Rites of battle is fine for a substitute for combat tactics, although something more characterful would be nice, that can wait until a completely new codex. They could easily release something like that now, which would mean pretty much every other race could have a codex before them.

Other than that, the obvious DH/WH/DE/Necrons.

Personally I think DH and Necrons need it the most, as while the other two have very out of date codex's, WH and DE can still be competative.

They could do Necrons without having to release too many new models, as their current range isn't too bad. WH/DH need a complete plastic overhaul, and most DE stuff (other than raiders IMHO) kinda suck at the moment.

S00N3R FR3AK
15-01-2010, 07:44
I voted Daemonhunters as while I play Necrons plastic elites would make me happy. Also Dark Angels would be nice since SW should just have a sub-title of Codex:Better Dark Angels.

Lord Solar Plexus
15-01-2010, 07:47
It's actually a tough choice. IMO Dark Eldar, Witch Hunters, Daemon Hunters and Necrons are all in desperate need of a new codex thanks to having an ****-load of obsolete rules and uncompetitive units.


This. (I voted Daemon Hunters but Necrons need one just as badly. DE I do not know and WH have Sisters, which aren't that bad.)

WinglessVT2
15-01-2010, 08:01
I voted tau, because they only need some tweaks, a few new figures, options, and that's about it.

Dark eldar must be completely redesigned, same with necrons, and the inquisition will require a lot of work.

Tau also sell really well, so once GW's out of marines and their books to shove down peoples' throats, it's the blue-skin's turn.
My hopes are still high for later this year.

Gen.Steiner
15-01-2010, 08:06
Dark Eldar, because they have the oldest codex in existence at this point. It's from two editions ago and came out in 1998 - 12 years ago!

Baneboss
15-01-2010, 08:08
For me Necrons need new codex the most. That is because they are the most boring army ever with only a handful of competetive units. Dark Eldar right after them.

landingshortly
15-01-2010, 08:14
I think Eldar need an update.

Yes, they are still good but then again, when it comes to certain units ... and especially the newer codices, Eldar lose out:

- Guardians need an update for either their stats, their cost or their shuriken catapult reach.
- Rangers need a buff because they are too expensive for what they do compared to the newer codices.
- Storm Guardians need grenades or lower costs.
- Hawks need a role they can fit.
- Shining spears need cost reduction or a rethinking in what they do.
- The psykers need a slight increase in cost and a buff in their psychic abilities to match their role in the fluff as best psykers in the universe.
- Eldar transports need a rethinking. Either costs go down i.e. Serpents get e.g. Shuriken Cannons automatically without additional costs or a buff in survivability. In comparison to IG, Marines, ... Eldar transports are certainly better but way overcosted for being a transport with mandatory weapon upgrades.
- Autarchs need a buff in order for players to field them compared to psykers.
- Eldrad might need a slight price increase.

=)

Lord Solar Plexus
15-01-2010, 08:44
I disagree. Having a couple of units that are somewhat less effective, unpopular, a straight a waste of time and money or could use a buff is not limited to Eldar. Daemons, Orks (Flash Gitz, Kannon, Grots), IG (Stormtroopers, Engineseer, Punisher, Vanquisher, Priest), Marines (most tanks, Scouts) all have their share of problematic choices.

When it comes to that, Eldar are still miles apart from any of the choices that people in this thread have mentioned so often. These armies have a single halfway viable build and the rest is simply forgotten.

Thud
15-01-2010, 08:45
(...) and especially the newer codices, Eldar lose out

I think the guys at my local club would throw a fit if I started saying stuff like that... :p


Dark Eldar, Daemonhunters and Necrons all desperately need new codices. Some of the other, older armies could benefit from a new codex, like DA, BT and Tau, but it's not that crucial seeing as they, at least, are able to field one competitive list.

genestealer_baldric
15-01-2010, 08:47
Nids have you seen the new codex??

Koryphaus
15-01-2010, 08:50
Nids have you seen the new codex??

:D

Ha, I needed a laugh, cheers!

polymphus
15-01-2010, 08:52
I play Tau, therefore Tau need a new codex.

This is pretty much what everyone in this thread is thinking to some extent.

Seriously though? Witch Hunters, because the Ordo Hereticus aspect of the army is dire but has always been one of the coolest fluffwise in my mind. What's not to love about ultra-puritan psychopaths with the power to destroy planets if they deem it wise? If the next codex allows me to run a half decent WH army without any sisters I'll probably need new pants I'll be so happy.

Petay1985
15-01-2010, 09:02
taking the assumption that the codex will include model releases and general overhaul. Dark Eldar get my vote, closely followed by Necrons and then Inquisition (hereticus, Malleus & Xenos).

Eternus
15-01-2010, 09:48
taking the assumption that the codex will include model releases and general overhaul. Dark Eldar get my vote, closely followed by Necrons and then Inquisition (hereticus, Malleus & Xenos).

Thinking Objectively, I think that Dark Eldar are most in need, but I also think Witch Hunters really need help too. I am working on a Witch Hunters update at the moment - check the 40K Rules Forum, if you fancy giving an opinion.

Freman Bloodglaive
15-01-2010, 10:07
I voted Dark Eldar for one simple reason.

Aside from the small update they got, their book came out towards the beginning of 3rd edition. Other armies have had multiple updates since then (I'm looking at you Space Marines and spiky Space Marines) and I think their players deserve it for their patience.

Then Necrons.

Then Tau.

Then Dark Angels.

Then 6th edition.

Then Orks.

Then Space Marines.

Then Imperial Guard...

Dranthar
15-01-2010, 10:31
I play Tau, therefore Tau need a new codex.

This is pretty much what everyone in this thread is thinking to some extent.
To an extent, sure, but I doubt ~37% of people here play Dark Eldar. ;)

Keebrev
15-01-2010, 10:42
Dark Eldar need a new codex badly. Even more then new rules they need new models. The current models are mostly horrible.

Petay1985
15-01-2010, 10:42
Thinking Objectively, I think that Dark Eldar are most in need, but I also think Witch Hunters really need help too. I am working on a Witch Hunters update at the moment - check the 40K Rules Forum, if you fancy giving an opinion.

Interestingly a friend aand I are in the middle of writing a Codex Inquisition! - its proving interesting! :cool:

Agnar the Howler
15-01-2010, 10:47
DEldar, the Inquisition Codices and Necrons are the ones that immediately spring to mind, with Tau, DA and BT somewhere around there, followed by Chaos Space Marines.

Gen.Steiner
15-01-2010, 10:51
Dark Eldar need a new codex badly. Even more then new rules they need new models. The current models are mostly horrible.

Oh, I don't know, I quite like 'em. They have charm.

Bloodknight
15-01-2010, 10:53
As an avid Dark Eldar player from the beginning, I voted: Necrons.

They have suffered the most ruleswise, aren't much fun for the Nec players and don't pose much of a challenge for the rest while the DE still play fine.


Oh, I don't know, I quite like 'em. They have charm.

Signed.

Gen.Steiner
15-01-2010, 10:57
Be fair - the Necrons seem to work OK to me. I like the faceless horde of robotic metal monsters.

In fact it's a toss-up as to whether I work on my DEldar or Necrons this year.

Lostzilla
15-01-2010, 11:14
I think Eldar need an update.

Yes, they are still good but then again, when it comes to certain units ... and especially the newer codices, Eldar lose out:

=)

Are you serious? :wtf: Or it is a joke? EVEN a new codex has poor units. Eldar are on top armies tournaments. Not all the units are broken like eldrad, firedragons, avatar (see the new carnifexes), falcons, 5avengers in serpent? psyc powers and farseer, and councils of doom? Oh, let my :cries:.

P.S. I play eldar. Let the codex quiet.

Souleater
15-01-2010, 11:19
In terms of suffering under the 5th Ed rules, probably Necron. However, their issues could be given a temporary fix by a PDF update. And to be honest I think that needs to be sorted out right now, rather than waiting at least another 5-6months for a codex.

However, Dark Eldar have models from the previous millenium (and let me remind you we are now in the second decade of the current one!). The figures have not aged well with a couple of exceptions.

Their codex has several rules that don't mesh with 5th Edition because the DE were written for 3rd Edition.

One can still be competitive by using half the units in the codex...but the other half might not even be there. That to me says the DE dex was poorly thought out from the very beginning.

And as to the bottom line, while the DE are a much bigger investment they will sell a lot more kits than the Necron will.

Lostzilla
15-01-2010, 12:09
imperial guard has models older than dark eldar, but are right. DE models NEED a complete redo of the models AND codex.

sayles78
15-01-2010, 12:15
mmm... I'm going to say - Tyranids!

Sorry - couldn't help it - I was only joking! I dont mind it at all apart from all the vagueness...

Anyhow - I voted Chaos Space Marines - I dont play them, but I do play against them quite often and... well... they dont feel very chaosy. Not like they used to.

Aside from that - DE and Necron players really do deserve a dex next. I feel those guys' pain. What is shocking tho - Blood Angels are next - so maybe DE or Necrons after that, then ANOTHER imperium one, then MAYBE DE or Necrons... Jesus - just release them already!

EDIT:


Cruddace hates the Carnifex. Maybe one stepped on his dog.

LOL

He also hates EW, frag grenades, 2+saves, assaulting after DS'ing with specialised DS units, writing rules clearly, pyrovores etc.!

Stormfather
15-01-2010, 12:20
Necrons. They have a lot of great plastic models, but they're a dud on the table.

Max_Killfactor
15-01-2010, 12:22
I had a tough choice between Dark Eldar and Necrons. I voted for Dark Eldar because I am biased.

Dark Eldar have been waiting the longest and really need to expand upon their background. Most of their models are pretty bad, and they have a lot of worthless units and a few pieces of unuseable wargear.

Necrons just got screwed over by the new rules. They have a decent looking model range and a lot of background material. They could use more unit choices though imo.

I voted Dark Eldar for the background and models, but Necrons are far weaker right now in the power scale.

Agnar the Howler
15-01-2010, 12:29
Necrons just got screwed over by the new rules. They have a decent looking model range and a lot of background material. They could use more unit choices though imo.

Necrons need a better way of representing phase out. Currently all they have is a single unit with a flashing neon sign that says "Shoot me with a battlecannon to win."

sayles78
15-01-2010, 12:31
I had a tough choice between Dark Eldar and Necrons. I voted for Dark Eldar because I am biased.

Dark Eldar have been waiting the longest and really need to expand upon their background. Most of their models are pretty bad, and they have a lot of worthless units and a few pieces of unuseable wargear.

Necrons just got screwed over by the new rules. They have a decent looking model range and a lot of background material. They could use more unit choices though imo.

I voted Dark Eldar for the background and models, but Necrons are far weaker right now in the power scale.

Can you imagine what a bit of imagination could do for the Necron new unit options???

Flyers and big gun-toting walkers (like Terminator salvation)

Destroyer Droids (like Star Wars EP1)

Big transport carrying necron warriors attached to underbelly...

It's obvious I dont have an imagination - but some of these GW dudes do. It could be awesome dex!

PaulmanMN
15-01-2010, 12:31
If we are going STRICTLY by age: Dark Eldar, obviously.

If we are going according to nerfed out unplayability: Necrons, as usual.

R0ot
15-01-2010, 12:35
Black Templars :angel:

sayles78
15-01-2010, 12:50
Black Templars :angel:

Really??? Every BT player I know, or see on Warseer does NOT want a new dex!

Gen.Steiner
15-01-2010, 14:01
What'd be the point, anyway? Black Templars are boooooring.

Give me Evil Space Elves or give me death!

d6juggernaut
15-01-2010, 14:17
Necrons, I play Necrons so obviously I voted them. Rule-wise their weaknesses are so obvious there's simply no way to avoid it, model-wise they're actually fine with plenty of conversion potentials (but plastic immortals are the way to go). I do hope for a brand new Necron codex as soon as possible, but seeing how April is now occupied by BA, this seems unlikely. A PDF rule update shouldn't be that much of a problem IMO, I highly doubt that giving Necrons Stubborn or heavy destroyers twin-linked weapon will break the game, I just think it'll open up much more options for Necron players.

shadow hunter
15-01-2010, 15:06
Dark Eldar.

I'm not really fussed by how strong a codex is - but I do like the models to look good. (which is why I'm not buying the new beastmen figures) My Necron buddy still does pretty good with his army, and his models look ok.

Yes I can win with my DE, but the models look rubbish, and I only take a fraction of what is in the book.

Oh, and the ravager and raider model are terrible to build too. Please change those.

Gen.Steiner
15-01-2010, 15:29
I suspect that if/when the new Dark Eldar arrive, the whole range will have been revamped.

I just wish they still sold Blaster- and Shredder-armed warriors... :(

Bunnahabhain
15-01-2010, 16:53
Nobody needs a new codex.

We need a decent set of erratas, FAQS, and updates, that would clarify how some things work, iron out many inconsistencies (ie storm shields and assualt cannons), and for some of the older books, simply alter how some things work, so they function in 5th ed. Lots of points cost tweaks.

All of those can be done in a few pages per codex.

Then the dev team have the time to do a proper 6th ed, from the ground up.

IronNerd
15-01-2010, 17:13
I'm just going to throw this out there: Me. I need new codices. Give me new codices. I want new CSM, Necron, and Tau (because I play them, and IG, but that's new...). So yeah, I don't want to vote for one, I want to vote for "mine" to be new...

TheoZ
15-01-2010, 17:20
We, the Superior of All, Dark Eldar, have waited for 12 years for a new codex.

The previous Codex that we got back in 1998 was rather an "update" of the 1st edition Codex we had..

We have waited for a long time.. The time is ready so that the scariest, fastest, deadliest race of the universe to appear from the Webway again!

TheShadowCow
15-01-2010, 17:45
Dark Eldar have this one, followed closely by Necrons (who have been hit by the 5th Ed bat), and arguably Tau (who are good, but somewhat over-costed). Yay for Xenos!

TheDarkDuke
15-01-2010, 22:01
I voted dark eldar. The ONLY space marine army that needs a update (imo) are demonhunters. Crons are up there as well

Chucklemoney
15-01-2010, 22:14
I voted Dark Eldar, I play them and agree with the majority of previous posts as to the reason they need a new codex.

I only need a month or so to have my entire army painted, so I'm not going to complain about the lack of a new codex until after the BA release.

owen matthew
15-01-2010, 22:31
Dark eldar, tau necrons.

Dio´Ra
15-01-2010, 22:32
I wish we could have left out the dark eldar out of this poll....as dark eldar are pretty obvious in need of a new codex/model range and GW knows that...12 years of waiting...and more waiting to come!

I for one am more interested in seeing which army comes on second place in need of a new codex...also quite annoyed at the blood angels being announced as next 40k update...I also have the feeling that after red marines we will see a different army and then once more marines....my bet will be templars or dark angels....

My vote is going to the witch hunters....I play witch hunters and I'm selfish and annoyed at the current codex...the codex is quite competitive and strong WHEN playing a pure sisters only list...anyway I want to see the wacky side more buffed, maybe make repentia worth a pick :evilgrin:

Parad0x
16-01-2010, 00:12
^Well, Necrons aren't that far behind! Let's hope that's true for GW's schedule too, but I won't hold my breath, as its pretty obvious from the previous months that they've lost their minds. Making a Tyranid codex (let's face it, they didn't need it THAT badly!), and now frickin Blood Angels! What's next, codex Ultramarines, with even more Marneus Calgar? And as a gift for every Marneus and Honor guard bought, we'd get a free terrain piece of dead petrified Avatar with a powerfist hand inprinted on his now-stone-cold cheek?

daboarder
16-01-2010, 00:14
Tyranids!
no really we need a new one.

Parad0x
16-01-2010, 00:28
They got not only a new codex, but some new and beautiful minis, and they're... complaining?:eek::wtf:

40kdhs
16-01-2010, 00:28
Daemonhunters.

Nezmith
16-01-2010, 02:32
They got not only a new codex, but some new and beautiful minis, and they're... complaining?:eek::wtf:

Tyranid players: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-JvtlB_NzI8

S00N3R FR3AK
16-01-2010, 03:14
Necrons. They have a lot of great plastic models, but they're a dud on the table.

We only have 3 fully plastic sets. For plastic scarabs by themselves are metal. Plastic models and a minor pdf update would be great. While immortals can be made from warriors they just don't look as good.

Dervos
16-01-2010, 04:55
Just by glancing at the covers the following armies more than likely need updates(*cue the pun of not judging a book by it's cover >_>)

Daemon Hunters
Dark Eldar
Necrons
Witch hunters(On a unrelated note what happened to the Witch Hunters Codex on the gamesworkshop site? It's disappeared...)

and by the volume of complaints, and reasons I'd say the Tau

The year is yet young, we'll probably see at least another codex to come out if I had to guess.

Ianos
16-01-2010, 07:10
The time is nigh for the darkness to rise, depart before the coming of the Drow, or pray for quick death!

Hail children of Khaine, strike through the void like thunder in a clear sky!

Crovax20
16-01-2010, 10:48
Dark Eldar, but since that is pretty much garantueed to be voted by everyone, simply because of the models and old fluff.... I am voting Necrons, because right now you can play Dark Eldar and have fun but Necrons you can put them on the table and remove them again once your warriors are obliterated and the rest never got shot at.

Tymell
16-01-2010, 10:49
This question has come up before, and the answer is still the same:

Dark Eldar.

Idaan
16-01-2010, 11:11
I'd like Craftworld Eldar to get a new codex sometime soon. Not that I'm thinking that it's weak or broken or unplayable. Let me elaborate: their two previous codices were written when the design philosophy was to put simplicity over customisability and the fun factor: first during the "pamphlet era" of early 3 edition, than in the Jervis' "Dark Age of streamlining". This, coupled with the rigid caste-like system of Eldar Path, makes army-building and list writing less fun than, say, 3,5e CSM, new Space Wolves or Imperial Guard who have lots and lots of options to choose from. So I'd like the Eldar to get some new units, heroes, wargear, special characters and pseudo-variant army lists before the current trend ends and we're reverted back to the 'dark ages'.
Of course, this shouldn't be at the expanse of Dark Eldar or Necrons, but I'd love to see it done. Also, this could mean the release of the plastic Jetbike they've had ready for 3 years now :rolleyes:

bennett_181
16-01-2010, 11:18
Dark Eldar, Tau and Necrons, but Tau get my vote since i play them.

guillaume
16-01-2010, 11:25
Dark eldars need a new release the most. Their models are just god-awful (unless you like the classic look, and many do - In fact I do like it) compared to the newer dynamic multi-part models.

Let's not forget GW is in the business of selling models. Redoing the DE would mean all new models!

After that, the Inq could do with new models, although grey knight terminators remain some of the best models out there.

Szalik
16-01-2010, 14:40
I voted Necrons. They need both new rules and old/new models in plastic (those plastic ones now are quite ok but Necrons have A LOT of metal miniatures in blisters).

Next ones are DE of course. They are still playable but need whole range of miniatures redone, especially those on foot (I still like those skimmers).

And WH/DH. Both need plastic miniatures and new rules ( 50 points Rhinos :wtf: ).

I don't know much about Tau so I won't comment on them.

LonelyPath
16-01-2010, 14:42
I voted DH and not just because I play them. DE and Crons can still work fairly well if used right and Mech Sisters is still astonishingly powerful and effective. All the other Dexes listed also work and have viable forces they can field.

40kdhs
16-01-2010, 16:04
I voted DH. I have been waiting for too long.

Lord_Squinty
16-01-2010, 16:37
Necrons *NEED* their Codex most,

Dark Eldar players deserve theirs most
;)

OneMeanDuck
16-01-2010, 17:45
Dark eldar easily. I used to play them in 3rd but sold all ny stuff but now I am back and still going to restart them. Though I plan on using harlie models as wyches and making a cult with them.... stupid 12 year old models...

As for how good they are... they are fun.. and can be slightly competative... but I also play eldar and tau and the few times I have played agaisnt daerk eldar in 5th it reeally wasn't a challenge...

primarch16
16-01-2010, 17:52
Necrons need a codex, Dark Eldar need models, and they deserve a codex.

Alfhedil
16-01-2010, 18:22
Necrons, mostly due to the fact that almost the entire range is metal. I don't really see why it is that people say Necrons are unplayable, as when I bought my army, my SW friend said he was going to focus on me, instead of the Tyranid horde right next to him.

Crovax20
16-01-2010, 18:42
because you are easier to take out :P sweep your warrior and call the job a good'un

Gensuke626
16-01-2010, 20:39
I Voted Necron on a very simple principle. The last two games I played against DE, they Ripped my army apart and I struggled to get a Draw. The last two games I played against Necrons I easily hit Phase out for the Auto-win.

Necrons are in the WORST need of a rules update, While DE need a new Codex in the same way that Orks did just before they got their new dex. To remind people, Orks, just before their new dex, had viable builds and were still a competitive army in many cases. The release of the new Codex gave them substantially more power and therefore substantially increased the number of viable builds.

The Dark Eldar still have viable builds and tactics (And I mean there are lists other than Pure Wytches that work) where as Necrons have 1 build that's viable and it's not particularly good.

the1stpip
16-01-2010, 23:12
I voted for Dark Eldar, as I play them, and numerous other reasons already noted.

But really, DE, Necrons and Inq all are in bad need of a new codex.

Occulto
16-01-2010, 23:26
Necrons for one simple reason - phase out = auto lose = people ignoring the mission 99% of the time when facing Necrons.

Other armies might deserve a new codex (the amount of DH/WH stuff that simply doesn't work under 5th ed is astounding) but none of them encourage players to go for all out killing the enemy regardless of the victory conditions.