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Shamutanti
04-02-2010, 03:06
If you have a magical ranged weapon, does that make the ammunition magical?

e.g. A High Elf with a Reaver Bow fires at a Banshee. His bow is magical but his arrows are not, can he hurt the unit?

Just curious really, because in the Wood Elf book it details ranged attacks as non-magical unless you buy magical arrows and the FAQ for them even states that the attacks are again, non-magical, unless you use magical arrows.

Does this apply across all armies?

Thoughts?

Necromancy Black
04-02-2010, 03:22
No idea. The Dark Elf had an FAQ saying that the magical crossbow didn't do magical attacks, but then I think another FAQ said a different range attack did.

I think the way they go is that if it's a magical weapon that sounds like it shoots normal ammo (slings, bows, handguns) it's not magical, but if it says it shoots lightning or something equally weird (staff of the sun that the lizardmen have) then it's magical.

Either way, the whole thing is just screwed up.

Eric.Miller
04-02-2010, 04:00
Just talk to your opponent about it. "F" the FAQs at this point in time.

I can't wait until 8th edition rolls around and wipes that crap out of existence.

Necromancy Black
04-02-2010, 05:01
I can't wait until 8th edition rolls around and wipes that crap out of existence.

Keep dreaming my friend.

ZigZagMan
04-02-2010, 06:39
Oh dear god no, wiping out old FAQ's even when a new edition comes out just opens the doors up for stupid cheesemongers to exploit known ambiguous rules that were previously fixed, but now are not FAQed. Even if the rule is exactly the same in the new edition.

Shamutanti
05-02-2010, 15:55
So the consensus is...?

Griefbringer
05-02-2010, 15:58
I am not sure if there is any consensus on this, since the FAQs seem to have been contradicting each other.

Malorian
05-02-2010, 16:07
I would play it as magical weapon count as magical attacks unless stated otherwise.

So the arrows of the HE reaver bow would be magical in my books.

theunwantedbeing
05-02-2010, 16:07
The obvious answer to this is,
magic bows shoot magic arrows.

Unfortunately for whatever reason GW FAQ'ed various magical ranged weapons to not deal magical hits.

So best just ask your opponent how to resolve it.

Kalandros
05-02-2010, 22:12
Only the ranged weapons FAQ'd to be non-magical are non-magical.
The rest are quite magical.

Heck I find it ridiculous that they FAQ'd some MAGIC WEAPONS to deal non magic damage.

sulla
06-02-2010, 01:54
So the consensus is...?


The obvious answer to this is,
magic bows shoot magic arrows.

Unfortunately for whatever reason GW FAQ'ed various magical ranged weapons to not deal magical hits.

. It's pretty obvious what GW wants. Any magical missile weapon that shoots ammunition, shoots mundane ammunition. Any magical missile weapon that doesn't use ammunition (like a ray-gun, or a hurled weapon) will have magical hits.

...It's just that what they want isn't supported by any existing rules, just FAQs. (Much like 'Monsterous characters' )... :rolleyes:

Until they actually make a rule enforcing what they hint at in the DE and WE FAQs, Shamutanti, just discuss it with your group.

WLBjork
06-02-2010, 07:27
Always worth checking the rules thoroughly first though.

e.g. Dwarf Warmachines shoot ammunition, but are specifically stated to do magic damage when inscribed with runes.

Harwammer
06-02-2010, 09:31
The obvious answer to this is,
magic bows shoot magic arrows.

Unfortunately for whatever reason GW FAQ'ed various magical ranged weapons to not deal magical hits.

So best just ask your opponent how to resolve it.

Although there are no rules, as far as I know, regarding amunition, it seems to me, especially looking at past FAQs, a magic weapon is of course magical but as the ammunition is not part of that weapon the ammunition is not magical.

It seems strange you state out-and-out magic bows shoot magic arrows based on nothing but opinion.

Agnar the Howler
06-02-2010, 09:44
If the weapon has to buy magical ammunition, then normal shots won't be magical, if no magical ammunition is avaliable, however, then common sense states that the shots are automatically counted as magical, what would be gained from putting a bow (with no ammo options) in the magical weapons section of an army book just to say that it's attacks aren't magical?

Necromancy Black
06-02-2010, 11:21
It seems strange you state out-and-out magic bows shoot magic arrows based on nothing but opinion.

Well let's see you point out the rule that says magic weapons do magical attacks.

Kalandros
06-02-2010, 14:36
Indeed, most things affected by Magical Weapons like Ethereals or Forest Spirit's Ward Saves mention, "when hit by a magic weapon or spell".

Grimgormx
06-02-2010, 16:29
I would say that if the efect is produced by the magical range weapon (like shooting a number of times equal to the character attacks, that is clearly a effect of the weapon but not of the amunition) then the hits arent magical, but if the effect is due to the amunition (something like the characters shoots an arrow that causes 1d6 impacts, in wich case the effect is clearly from the amunition not the weapon) then I will think that the impacts are magical.

but this is only my HO

havockrauser
06-02-2010, 17:17
I would say that if the efect is produced by the magical range weapon (like shooting a number of times equal to the character attacks, that is clearly a effect of the weapon but not of the amunition) then the hits arent magical, but if the effect is due to the amunition (something like the characters shoots an arrow that causes 1d6 impacts, in wich case the effect is clearly from the amunition not the weapon) then I will think that the impacts are magical.

but this is only my HO

Yes, but to that same regard look at a simple magic weapon like the sword of striking. The magical effect of the weapon is that you get a +1 modifier to your to-hit rolls. The problem is that there isn't any mention in the rulebook that states that magical weapons (OF ANY KIND) have magical attacks. And just because some faqs made SOME ranged weapons exempt from having magical attacks, doesn't mean all.

Yellow Commissar
06-02-2010, 18:02
Magical attacks do not appear to be clearly defined in the rules.

Personally, I play that magic weopons inflict magic attacks.

Some of the FAQs have some odd answers for specific items, but the Reaver Bow is not one of them.

If there is a consensus, it would not matter. The only consensus that matters is your opponents. Discuss beforehand.

If he won't agree that your Reaver Bow inflicts magical attacks, just use the Talisman of Light. High Elves have an abundance of ways to inflict magical attacks. Many champions can take magic weopons as well.

Shamutanti
06-02-2010, 19:51
I used the Reaver Bow as an example, the first ranged weapon to come into my head. I myself am playing Wood Elves currently and just found the FAQ amusing and well, my friend mentioned someone raising a point at their local GW that a ranged attack from a magic bow (I think it WAS the Reaver bow actually) was magical but its shots were not and therefore it couldn't hurt ethereal things.

I glanced through a few more FAQs and where as some answers are... bewildering (e.g. the reaver bow can't stand and shoot with 3 shots, because those 3 shots are done in the shooting phase...) the thing that raised my eye were the seeming inconsistencies within the Welf FAQ, such as...

"... if a character is a Wild Rider or Glamourweave their [ranged] attacks are counted magical..."

then

"Do normal arrows fired by a magical bow count as magical attacks? No, only Magical Arrows count as magical attacks"

The problem with this being that no one else, bar Welfs, can buy magical arrows? So surely that's an error in call? It also means if you buy a magical bow and don't wish to buy magical arrows, you need to upgrade yourself to say (at least in the wood elf case) a Forest Spirit to gain magical arrow attacks...

Very confusing.

It's also amusing that if you buy a magical long bow for a wood elf they still keep their normally prescribed longbow!

Palatine Katinka
06-02-2010, 20:59
I can understand the Forest Spirit bit because their rules specify that ranged attacks are magical. I don't understand why ranged attacks from magic weapons aren't normally magical though.