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Joshwow1
06-02-2010, 06:18
So I am a complete newbie to fantasy. The beastmen models look insanely cool to me so I decided to play them based off that alone. Here's my first attempt (be gentle)

Lord- 348
Doombull
-Armor Piercing (Gouge-Tusks)
-3+ str. Str 10 against against chariots and war machines (Stone Crusher Mace)
-Light Armor. Granted extra attack per passed armor save(Ramhorn Helm)
-Heavy Armor
-Shield

Hero- 252
Gorebull
- -1 to hit in shooting. -2 to hit in magic. (Pelt of the Shadowgave)
-BSB
-Heavy Armor
-Shield
-Great Weapon

Hero - 125
Bray-Shaman
- 2 scrolls


Core
Ungor Raidersx2- 180
-10 Ungors
-Bows

Special- 754
Minotaursx2- 504
-4 Minotaurs
-4 Great Weapons

Centigor x2- 250
-5 Centigors

Rare- 550
Cygor x2

LordMoriar
06-02-2010, 10:12
You have to buy GW for all the minos, not just four of them. Well, at least thats how it is for all other regiments in warhammer. Is that two or just one unit of minos?

Your army looks like a serious threat with all those chariots, but im missing a couple of things. BSB and some ranked units. Chariots have to cause 5+ wounds just to be competing against a fully ranked unit. If you, on the other hand, combine a chariot charge with a charging unit you can be pretty sure to break your enemy in the fist turn.

Anyways, ive heard good stuff about MSU(many small units). Still i dont fancy that playstyle since it kinda runis the purpose of FB if you ask me. Small "elite" teams thats 40k for me.

Jack of Blades
06-02-2010, 10:20
You cannot have the same magic item twice in the same army, with the exceptions of dispel scrolls, power stones and certain army specific items. I don't know about Beast gifts of chaos, but I would look over their entry to see if they're 1 per army too.

GodlessM
06-02-2010, 11:07
Gifts of Chaos can only appear in a list once each also.

Joshwow1
06-02-2010, 12:30
Ok, again im pretty new so would you mind explaining what BSB means? :p and I will re-do my gifts.
Also, can the command be given extra equipment aside from the banner and instruments? Not a big deal on pts...actually better and leaves room for some nice conversion work (ever seen a banner with a huge blade at the top? :p)

Jack of Blades
06-02-2010, 12:45
Ok, again im pretty new so would you mind explaining what BSB means? :p and I will re-do my gifts.
Also, can the command be given extra equipment aside from the banner and instruments? Not a big deal on pts...actually better and leaves room for some nice conversion work (ever seen a banner with a huge blade at the top? :p)

BSB = Battle Standard Bearer

Champions can sometimes be given magical items, this will be noted in their army list entry in that case. Standard bearers of more advanced units tend to have magic banners available. That's it - normally, only characters can be given magical items.

Conversion you say... oh yes, there must be a converted totem pole borne aloft by your BSB dedicated to the prowess of your beast herd with mutilated skulls for totems, blodily flogged body parts for decoration and pleading, innocent victims about to have their entrails brutally sacrificed to the Dark Gods to further your power! And then their children will all get feasted on by the campfires :evilgrin:... What? oh, yes doctor... I'll be taking my pills now...

Joshwow1
06-02-2010, 12:50
Thanks jack of cra...I mean blades :)

I might merge my gor squads into two squads of 20 with BSB's. How useful are musicians?

Jack of Blades
06-02-2010, 13:16
Thanks jack of cra...I mean blades :)

I might merge my gor squads into two squads of 20 with BSB's. How useful are musicians?

My pleasure to prepare you for sacrif... err, help you :D

You can only have one BSB per army, if you want to use one I'd upgrade the Gorbull into one. Actually I would replace the Doombull with a Great Bray Shaman, put in a second Bray Shaman and use a Gorbull BSB. But if you want a more combat oriented build then keep a Doombull/Beastlord, yes - but do keep in mind that without any wizards of your own (don't upgrade defensive wizards into level 2 ones btw), unless you have anti-magic items available that don't require wizards to use them, you will turn the battlefield into the virtual playground of the enemy's magicians. I don't know yet if the new Beast book has any magical banners worth paying the points for, gonna find out asap, perhaps over in the rumor section... Anyway, Musicians help you to rally from fleeing and if combat is a tie, musicians add 1 to your side's score (so it obviously doesn't help if both sides have a musician).

I don't know if you have, but I wouldn't put standards on every unit, especially not those that rely on killing rather than static combat resolution. This is because standards give plenty of victory points to your enemy should he capture and hold them until the game ends, which is done by making a unit break in close combat and then pursuing them/destroying them in close combat. Multiple standards in the same combat also still only give +1 CR.

Six minotaurs are way too much in a unit. Three are enough and pretty decent, four is the favoured number for these kind of large creatures like Ogres, Trolls, Minotaurs etc. because five and more means problems with maneuverability and getting them all into base to base contact with the enemy in combat.

I would also drop either the Tuskgor or Pumbagor chariots, most probably the Tuskgor ones because they are much worse than they were in the previous book. That should give you some points to play around with. If I recall correctly you can use Pumbagors without tying them to chariots, you might want to put a few into your list to help your Minotaurs chase down and wipe out defeated units.

In case you've been looking at Centigors, cavalry models tend to come in units no larger than 6, or 5 if they get a character put into them (although some people run 6 + character). This much for the same reasons as Minotaurs and such get run in units of 3-4 models.

Anything else, just ask.

Keetoowah
06-02-2010, 13:22
Gifts of Chaos can only appear in a list once each also.

Because the chaos gods don't like repeating themselves.

Keetoowah
06-02-2010, 13:25
Cavalry models tend to come in units no larger than 6, or 5 if they get a character put into them (although some people run 6 + character).

Unless you play bretts, of course.

Joshwow1
06-02-2010, 13:43
So how would I go about doing a defensive wizard?

And making adjustments to the list, but just a quick question, are chariots worth it at all? I saw people commenting on how good razorgor chariots were which is the reason I placed them, if you could shed any light on this matter that'd be great.

And the banners are all not very good. One of them gives 1+ str to the squad (but at 75 pts!) and another is an auto pass on primal fury which is actually pretty sweet.

I would definitely want to go more psychic defense. Cygors seemed psychic defense-like but I guess not too much, if he wasted points?

Jack of Blades
06-02-2010, 14:07
So how would I go about doing a defensive wizard?

And making adjustments to the list, but just a quick question, are chariots worth it at all? I saw people commenting on how good razorgor chariots were which is the reason I placed them, if you could shed any light on this matter that'd be great.

And the banners are all not very good. One of them gives 1+ str to the squad (but at 75 pts!) and another is an auto pass on primal fury which is actually pretty sweet.

I would definitely want to go more psychic defense. Cygors seemed psychic defense-like but I guess not too much, if he wasted points?

A ''scroll caddy'' is the most common version, it's simply a level 1 wizard with a pair of dispel scrolls. Most effective against enemy armies casting few but powerful spells against you, much less effective against armies like VC (and mostly only VC) that single-dice spam.

Chariots are good because their impact hits strike before stuff with Always Strikes First and they add pretty good hitting power on a small base frontage, meaning that it's pretty easy to support other units with them, you won't have to worry much about fitting all bases into the combat when using a Chariot. A chariot is also varyingly cheaper than cavalry. They take up less space in your battleline than cavalry and other big stuff too.

But, chariots are worthless if they get charged and also rely on breaking/nearly destroying or destroying their enemy in the first round of combat because they are significantly worse in subsequent rounds due to not getting their impact hits from charging.

Well in that case I wouldn't bother with a BSB, more points and trouble than it's worth. *Self-mumbling activated* Beastmen are overpriced to begin with without having to pay a whopping 75 points for unit-wide +1 strength, nothing of which makes particularily good use of the bonus when it comes with a giant bullseye saying ''kill me'' attached to the unit... *Self-mumbling deactivated*

I don't have much of an opinion on Cygors because nearly no one has seen one in action yet. I will reserve my judgement until then, but on paper, they look pretty decent - certainly good for boosting one's magic defense. A GBS, BS (not a scroll caddy) and Cygor is plenty enough magic defense and gives you some offensive potential in the magic phase as well, because Gorbulls are still good close combat fighters. Not as good as Doombulls no, but they will do just fine. I would avoid Wargors though.

Joshwow1
08-02-2010, 06:20
K, So I have got some info and from the info on here, I came up with a new revised list.

Pretty much went min-max with the list, let me know what you guys think about it.

blackjack
08-02-2010, 14:12
I think you need 3 core. You only have 2 raiders listed.

KayazyAssassin
08-02-2010, 14:22
with strength nine armor piercing is not really needed

Domandi
08-02-2010, 14:49
Just a small note, you have magic light armor, and heavy armor. You can not combine multiple armor sets. One armor set(heavy/light), shield, and other add on's(like cloaks etc.).

Blackjack is correct, in 2250 points, you need 3+ core.

Looks like a fun list.