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Poseidal
04-03-2010, 10:36
If I have two units that are frenzied, and both within charge range of a unit, if it is impossible to get both into base to base contact what happens?

Do both go in, one of them has to fail the charge?
Does one go in, the other now can't declare a legal charge so stays where it is?
Something else?

Diagram: both frenzied units are in the front arc (the diagram isn't the best...) and can't reach the other side of the enemy due to impassable terrain.

>|-----enemy-----|
>|_______________|
>|friendly|
>|________|
>
>
>
>
>

****** |-Frenzied-|* |-Frenzy-|
****** |_____1____|* |____2___|

> = Impassable terrain

Seth the Dark
04-03-2010, 10:49
I would say its a failed charge unless the furthest right one could reach the enemy unit in the back.

Milgram
04-03-2010, 11:04
both have to declare their charge before any charging units are moved. so failed charge for one of the units.

theunwantedbeing
04-03-2010, 11:17
Dice off to see who charged first.

Palantir
04-03-2010, 15:57
I think the rulebook specifically states that you (the player) can choose which unit charges.

Don't have it in front of me though.

Gaargod
06-03-2010, 16:18
Interesting, don't you measure to see if frenzied chargers are if range before 'declaring' their charge? In other words, it was always an invalid charge, as they couldn't get in there.

Of course, if they had fled and the movement values of the units had been different, it they could all have 'fit' in the failed charge.

Generally however, i would play it that one unit fails the charge. Specifically, the one which goes last fails (as you always declare charge order, even for frenzied units).

Comes up a fair amount when i play cold one heavy LM - not the frenzy part, but multi charges. If i can and its not a negative to the plan, i will elect to charge 2 units, so if one fails stupidity its not a disaster. Often leaves one unit looking confused behind.

rtunian
06-03-2010, 17:01
If i can and its not a negative to the plan, i will elect to charge 2 units, so if one fails stupidity its not a disaster. Often leaves one unit looking confused behind.

sorry but you are playing it wrong. stupidity tests are done during the "start of turn phase"

stupid creatures that are not engaged in combat must make a test at the start of their turn to see whether they overcome their stupidity

Urgat
06-03-2010, 20:52
You don't declare charges when the unit has frenzy. It just charges if it can. So you make one unit charge, and then if the other can't charge, well, it doesn't charge.

TMATK
06-03-2010, 21:23
You don't declare charges when the unit has frenzy. It just charges if it can. So you make one unit charge, and then if the other can't charge, well, it doesn't charge.

They do have to declare actually. p52

Wolfmother
06-03-2010, 21:23
i agree with palantir you choose

Urgat
06-03-2010, 22:44
They do have to declare actually. p52

Yeah, I just checked, and you're right. But it also says that you have to check if they can manage the charge before declaring the charge (or something like that, I don't have the english brb). If there's no room, obviously they won't manage, so my conclusion still stands.

TMATK
06-03-2010, 23:27
Yeah, I just checked, and you're right. But it also says that you have to check if they can manage the charge before declaring the charge (or something like that, I don't have the english brb). If there's no room, obviously they won't manage, so my conclusion still stands.

It doesn't say anything about checking if they can make the charge, at least as far as I can tell. It tells you to measure if they're in range and in LOS. If so, charge must be declared.

Urgat
06-03-2010, 23:37
It tells it quite clearly in the french BRB. Checking range and LoS is the next sentence, and is presented as pointers in my book. If there's inconsistencies between versions of the BRB, there's little point for me to discuss that rule, at any rate.

TMATK
06-03-2010, 23:50
It tells it quite clearly in the french BRB. Checking range and LoS is the next sentence, and is presented as pointers in my book. If there's inconsistencies between versions of the BRB, there's little point for me to discuss that rule, at any rate.

Here it is verbatim.

"In the declare charges part of the movement phase, after the charges of all non-frenzied troops have been declared (including relative charge reactions), measure to see if any enemies are within charge reach of any Frenzied troops (ie, within the unit's charge move and in their normal arc of sight). If so, the Frenzied unit must declare a charge against that enemy."

T10
07-03-2010, 11:58
Comes up a fair amount when i play cold one heavy LM - not the frenzy part, but multi charges. If i can and its not a negative to the plan, i will elect to charge 2 units, so if one fails stupidity its not a disaster. Often leaves one unit looking confused behind.

Are you sure you have understood the Stupidity rules correctly? You test for Stupidity bfore declaring charges.

-T10