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CaliforniaGamer
08-03-2010, 16:46
Can a Bloodthirster be targetted with the Lore of Beasts spell Wolf Hunts? (monster, etc moves 2D6 towards enemy within LOS, counts as charging if it contacts them)

theunwantedbeing
08-03-2010, 16:47
Yes, as its a monster.

Bodysnatcher
08-03-2010, 17:11
Yes, as its a monster.

From the FAQ part 2:

Q. If a Character is also a Monster (e.g. Greater
Daemons, Treeman Ancients, Shaggoth
Champions), is it affected by magic items (e.g.
Rune of the True Beast) and spells (e.g. The Beasts
Cowers) that are stated as working against
‘Monsters’?

A. No, they are characters and not monsters, even
though they share some rules with monsters
(normally this is limited to the way they move, their
inability to join units and their unit strength).

So no.

CaliforniaGamer
08-03-2010, 17:42
I knew an FAQ answered this but couldnt remember where. Thanks!

puppetmaster24
08-03-2010, 17:53
that is a rather bizarre ruling.

decker_cky
08-03-2010, 18:08
that is a rather bizarre ruling.

Probably one of my top 3 worst FAQ answers from GW ever.

Bodysnatcher
08-03-2010, 18:10
It's a fluff and balance thing. Why would a treeman or a greater daemon cower. And be glad there are no turbo charged bloodthirsters coming at you.
Despite the fact it was in white dwarf recently, by someone who should know better.

Revlid
08-03-2010, 19:44
From the FAQ part 2:

Q. If a Character is also a Monster (e.g. Greater
Daemons, Treeman Ancients, Shaggoth
Champions), is it affected by magic items (e.g.
Rune of the True Beast) and spells (e.g. The Beasts
Cowers) that are stated as working against
‘Monsters’?
Relevant text bolded. You could argue that the Wolf Hunts is unaffected by this ruling, since it doesn't work "against" the Bloodthirster. ;)

Or, of course, simply not bring it up. I certainly wouldn't challenge such a move by my opponent - I'd view doing so as churlish and petty, given how obvious the ruling seems to be outside of GW's own company-wide delirium.

Bladelord
08-03-2010, 19:50
Make the damn Greater Daemons so you're able to Cower them!

Palatine Katinka
08-03-2010, 19:57
It's a fluff and balance thing. Why would a treeman or a greater daemon cower. And be glad there are no turbo charged bloodthirsters coming at you.
Despite the fact it was in white dwarf recently, by someone who should know better.

It does work on Treemen though. Only Treeman Ancients are deemed immune by the FAQ. Regular Treemen are Rare choice monsters. Only Treemen Ancients are characters on account of being Lord choices.

I'm pretty sure that the Daemons of Chaos book is quite clear about Greater Daemons being monsters, there's a box out about it. I don't have the book to hand though so I'll leave it to someone else to confirm that.

I don't like it when FAQ's answer questions that shouldn't be asked let alone asked frequently. :(

Bodysnatcher
08-03-2010, 20:10
The daemon book says they're monsters AND characters - which the FAQ covers as they conflict slightly.

decker_cky
08-03-2010, 20:33
A better FAQ would say "Yes. Anything that affects characters affects them. Anything that affects monsters affects them. Note: Monstrous characters may not join units."

Bodysnatcher
08-03-2010, 20:54
Hopefully the next edition will have a new subclass: Monstrous characters.
For the purposes of movement: See the monster section.
For the purposes of unit strength: See the monster section.
For the purposes of issuing/accepting challenges: See the character section.
For the purposes of spell effects: Treat as a character not a monster.

Harwammer
08-03-2010, 20:56
A better FAQ would say "Yes. Anything that affects characters affects them. Anything that affects monsters affects them. Note: Monstrous characters may not join units."

I agree. Does anyone else think this rediculous Beasts of Chaos FAQ with last editions Rune of the True Beast? That and no 5-wide min for raiders... I can't help but feel that someone seriously wanted to gimp the last edition beastmen!

Maoriboy007
09-03-2010, 21:27
The daemon book says they're monsters AND characters - which the FAQ covers as they conflict slightly.

Doesn't the book also go on to say that they are affected by things that affect monsters? Either way they still contradict themselves pretty effectivly with that FAQ.

Kalandros
09-03-2010, 23:24
It's a fluff and balance thing. Why would a treeman or a greater daemon cower. And be glad there are no turbo charged bloodthirsters coming at you.
Despite the fact it was in white dwarf recently, by someone who should know better.

So why do my Nightmares, Zombie Dragon, Dire Wolves, Ethereal Steeds.... and whatever other undead mount, Cower as well? Balance again? Pfft, you can have 2 Heralds of Tzeentch Cower a Star Dragon so that the Bloodthirster can charge it, but you can't do the opposite?

Please, balance?

Bodysnatcher
10-03-2010, 06:55
Doesn't the book also go on to say that they are affected by things that affect monsters? Either way they still contradict themselves pretty effectivly with that FAQ.

No, it just says they're characters and monsters as defined by the game. No mention of being affected by things that affect monsters.


So why do my Nightmares, Zombie Dragon, Dire Wolves, Ethereal Steeds.... and whatever other undead mount, Cower as well? Balance again? Pfft, you can have 2 Heralds of Tzeentch Cower a Star Dragon so that the Bloodthirster can charge it, but you can't do the opposite?

Please, balance?

Because they're mounts and have a dude on top who can defend them. That's the balance. Fluffwise - fully sentient things are not affected by the various beast effects, items and spells.

TheDarkDaff
10-03-2010, 07:21
No, it just says they're characters and monsters as defined by the game. No mention of being affected by things that affect monsters.



Because they're mounts and have a dude on top who can defend them. That's the balance. Fluffwise - fully sentient things are not affected by the various beast effects, items and spells.

Your fluff explaination falls flat on it's face when look at the Dragons that the High Elves use and talk to.

It is a seriously dumb ruling on GW part to make characters that are also monsters immune to items that affect monsters.