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Night Bearer
11-03-2010, 12:27
All,

I'm thinking of starting Orcs and Goblins for an escalation league, and I was wondering how decent of a starting 1000pt list this might be (going off memory, so I may be slightly off):

Black Orc Boss, w/ heavy armour, Enchanted Shield, Kickin' Boots, Armed to da Teef

20 Orc Boyz, full command, hw/shield

5x Wolf Riders w/ musician, spears, hw/shield, short bows

5x Spider Riders w/ musician, spears, hw/shield, short bows

2x Snotlings

2x Snotlings

1x Chariot

11x Black Orcs, full command, War Banner, shields, Armed to da Teef

2x Spearchukkas w/ bullies

1x Stone Troll

The stone troll's a bit of a throw-in here - since I didn't see anything else I wanted for 60pts, I figured I'd get started on buying and painting the eventual Stone Troll unit that I do want.

I've taken both Spider Riders and Wolf Riders as I thought it'd be helpful to learn both before deciding if I like mixing them or if one or the other suits my playstyle better.

I'll admit that I haven't set out to build the most powerful list here - I guess my concern is more with whether this list is so weak as to just not be any good/fun to play. I don't think magic is going to be very common in our league at this initial level, and the obvious plan I have here is to use the goblins and snotlings to harass enemy units and try to set up favorable charges for the Black Orcs and Orc Boyz.

As stated, this is for an escalation league, and while we can switch out things as we want (no need to retain stuff), I would like my initial list to be good enough to use as the core for the eventual 2250 list without having to drop half of the models.

Anyways, thanks in advance.

FORtheGREATERgood
11-03-2010, 14:12
All in all it's not bad, but there are a few initial problems you may run into. Before that though, imo almost any O&G army will be fun to play which is why I have them.

Lack of Infantry Blocks. In my experience of playing the greenskins, a couple large infantry blocks are crucial to any kind of success. Don't get my wrong, the cavalry choices and chariot are good, but they can't do it by themselves. Why? A little thing called animosity will come in and ruin your day every now and again. Expect it. For example, your wolf/spider riders may charge a unit your upcoming turn...snake eyes, they will probably die. With multiple large groups of infantry, it doesn't matter. Getting charged won't ruin your plan, it'll throw a speed bump in it but chances are, with large numbers they will survive.
The list I run has me outnumbering pretty much any opponent other than skaven. It's crucial for a greenskin boss to know most of his army will disappear, so bring more.
In this case it will be important especially so since any opposing magic will have an impact on your army even if it isn't much.

What I would change:
Although by the time you reach 2250points everything in your current army list should be included, to start out at 1000 run a vanilla troll, drop the orc bullies on the spear chukkas, and drop the four snotling bases. This should open up about 110points I believe which should be enough for a big unit of gobbos or some more orcs.
If you are against magic, I don't see the stone troll as worth the extra 20points because, chances are that cavalry or something else will take care of it while magic is used on easier targets.
Hope that helps.

Balthazaar
11-03-2010, 15:20
You probably dont need the Black orcs in such a small game, they play better in larger games. your points invested here would be better spent on more regular boyz to beef up your numbers or get some night goblins.

your Snotties probably wont do much on this list as they have little back them up. I would drop these and add a second chariot.

when I play 1k Orc games I like to pack in as many figures as possible.
Orcs are great in small games with big numbers and can be a really effective.

I would also consider dropping the troll in exchange for a Doom Diver.

Night Bearer
11-03-2010, 16:15
I can't remember what the Black Orc block costs, but I think I can switch them for another block of Orcs for roughly the same pts. I mainly included them as I already have the models.

Regarding what to switch in, I would probably prefer Orcs over Gobbos - I feel like two similar mobz of Boyz would be more effective than one mob supported by 1-2 Goblin mobs. I guess I feel like with only one block of Orcs, the Gobbos aren't punchy enough themselves to do much in combat, and I don't know if their bows will really kill enough to make a couple shooty blocks effective at this level (I put bows on the Wolf and Spider riders to give them a nuisance factor while they march block/protect flanks/etc).

Snotlings for Chariot IIRC is the same pts. I believe I'd need 20pts to switch the troll for the DD (the reason I took the troll being I didn't have the points for anything preferable), so I'll need to see what the pts situation is after changing out the Black Orcs.

If the above pans out, the new list would be:

Black Orc Boss, w/ heavy armour, Enchanted Shield, Kickin' Boots, Armed to da Teef

20 Orc Boyz, full command, hw/shield

20 Orc Boyz, full command, hw/shield

5x Wolf Riders w/ musician, spears, hw/shield, short bows

5x Spider Riders w/ musician, spears, hw/shield, short bows

2x Chariots

2x Spearchukkas w/ bullies

1x Doomdiver

If I drop the Black Orcs, I may drop the Boss to a regular Orc Boss. The BO Boss is meant to represent one of my eventual hero choices, Ugzog, along with his Muthacrushaz. If I switch to a regular Boss, I could use him to represent the start of my eventual Warboss, Nazdreg Facebeater.

I believe for roughly the same points, I can take either my current Black Orc Boss, or a regular Orc Boss with close to similar equipment and a Boar. Does either build have a clear advantage over the other?

BTW, thanks to all for the advice. I'm excited to start assembling and painting my Waa-Vandulz, but first need to sort out what to buy tonight to flesh out this first list.

Stuffburger
12-03-2010, 14:37
List looks good and a good starter for a 2k list to me. The bullies on the chukkas are probably not needed and the bully models are pretty expensive anyways so you probably want to drop them.

At 2k you're going to want to bring the boyz units up to at least 25 strong. I personally love night goblins for adding cheap bulk to an army, and for fanatics but if you don't like hordes of terrible troops then orcs are just as good.

Night Bearer
12-03-2010, 19:06
Nothing against Gobbos at all!

At 1000k, my worry is simply that I don't have enough other stuff to rely on one or two units of them for combat. At bigger levels, I'll be able to take enough Orc Boyz and Gobbo units to feel a bit more comfortable with them.

Malorian
12-03-2010, 19:09
Drop the shields on the wolves.

They might be on just because you had a free extra points but it's not worth losing fast cav over.

Urgok the Beard Burner
14-03-2010, 10:31
YOur points that you spent on the black orcs could be better spent on more stone trolls as black orcs are for larger than 1000 pts battles really