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jeroen84
24-05-2005, 03:44
When Games Workshop pulled the plug on the development of Climax's Warhammer Online, it seemed as if the project was destined to be vaporware. Warhammer fans all around the world were extremely disappointed at the announcement. The grim fantasy world is the ideal place to set an online RPG; not only is it extremely popular, but its richness, detail, and history rivals that of any other popular fantasy license, including staples such as D&D and Middle-earth. It is -- literally -- a gold mine of online gaming revenue just waiting to be tapped.

Enter Mythic Entertainment. The creator of the popular Dark Age of Camelot series has snatched up the license to develop Warhammer Online, despite the fact that Namco signed a licensing agreement with Games Workshop just a few months ago. The Namco deal, it turns out, is only for console and standalone PC games, not for online games, so Mythic was free to jump in, sign a deal with Games Workshop, and save Warhammer Online from its former fate.

Details, at the moment, are a bit sketchy. The deal was literally signed and made official at E3, but we were able to talk a bit with Mythic CEO Marc Jacobs to glean some info on what gamers can expect. First off, the team is starting from scratch. The game Climax was making is dead and gone forever; this is not a continuation of that project. "That was the game that Games Workshop wanted to make. This is the game that Mythic wants to make," said Jacobs.

Fans of the Dark Age of Camelot series will be familiar with the Warhammer Online design. The game will be Realm vs. Realm and not straight up PvP. "We didn't want a game where players just roamed the countryside whacking on each other," said Jacobs. "We are doing it strictly RvR." That means, among other things, that PvP combat is voluntary and never forced on the player.

As for scope, things are still being hashed out and while the entire Warhammer world will not be represented (at first), the game will be larger than just The Empire. Areas like the mountainous Border Princes and the surrounding area is an ideal place for adventurers to stumble across some of the more dangerous creatures of the world, from greenskins to the forces of Chaos.

The people behind the game are fans themselves. That fact, combined with the comfort of knowing that Mythic knows what it's doing in terms of making a successful online RPG should make fans giddy with excitement. Mythic plans to announce more details in the coming months. For now, Warhammer fans, and fans of the genre as a whole, can breathe a sigh of relief knowing that an online game set in one of the most beloved fantasy worlds is on its way.

I think it's great news. I must say I never expected much of the old Warhammer Online that was in development of Climax and GW themselves, but I did like the idea of a MMO in the Warhammer Old World.

Its really good news that another company(with great records) approached GW for a license to use the Old World intellectual property.


I post this here because this news has just been released in E3, the biggest electronic game show of the year.

Rövhalt
24-05-2005, 07:00
This sounds great, let's hope they don't mess this up.

Bruen
24-05-2005, 07:51
Well its good that Warhammer Online is back, but what a shame that its yet another PvP game :(

jeroen84
24-05-2005, 08:30
Well its good that Warhammer Online is back, but shat a shame that its yet another PvP game :(
The good thing about Realm vs Realm pvp is that its not obligatory. You dont have to participate. There's also a pvm part.


The only big problem I foresee is that it should have something to make it different from WoW to stand out. But.. knowing Mythic, I think that will be alright hopefully.

Anyway, this game is in its pre-planning stage. It will take at least three years to develop.

rkunisch
24-05-2005, 09:44
Anyway, this game is in its pre-planning stage. It will take at least three years to develop.
Unfortunately that is the main problem. :(

Otherwise I really look forward to a Warhammer Online game. If they only would sell the spare time for yet another time-consuming hobby. :rolleyes:

Have fun,

Rolf.

Cypher
24-05-2005, 09:53
Indications are that they intend to have the Beta live by 2007, and realistically an x-mas 07 release sounds viable. By which time EQ2 and WoW should be out of the mainstream picture.

Hopefully it wont be too long until they bring a website online: I very much would like to see some of the art and content being developed.

NetGuru
24-05-2005, 10:03
Sounds good, im a bit iffy on the 'the old game was the game that GW wanted to make, and this game is the game that Mythic wanted to make' so we'll have to see how this pans out...

RvR sounds ok, but when it's released how many realms will we see?

Bruen
24-05-2005, 10:18
The good thing about Realm vs Realm pvp is that its not obligatory. You dont have to participate. There's also a pvm part.

Sure its optional, as long as you only want to see your own realm.

If you want to explore all of the game zones then you are forced to PvP.
Lets face it, who wants to pay full price for a game and then only be able to see/use a small part of it.

Since I am an explorer at heart this means that I will not be buying the game.

jeroen84
24-05-2005, 16:22
Cypher, I really doubt an end of 2007 release. Since that's just 2 years of developing and half a year of playtesting beta. Unless they already have a core game engine ready(which is possible for Mythic), I wouldnt see it happen so soon. But then again, them asking for a Warhammer license might just indicate that they already have something ready, but just needed a good background&fluff.

Ofcourse, thats all hypothesing.

Bruen, we cant say anything about such a thing as of yet. Maybe you will have to align to the good or bad guys and start out as neutral, meaning you could still explore as a neutral player. Nothing is released yet, so all we can do is wait. ;)

Bruen
24-05-2005, 16:33
Bruen, we cant say anything about such a thing as of yet. Maybe you will have to align to the good or bad guys and start out as neutral, meaning you could still explore as a neutral player. Nothing is released yet, so all we can do is wait. ;)

Agreed, its possible. In my experience, however, the problems with spies and with 'invulnerable' griefers usualy prevent free access.

Morskittar
24-05-2005, 17:01
There's some more discussion on this in the 'Other GW' forum, as well as a video for the unrelated Namco game.

This site (http://www.warhammeronlineforum.com) actually has a few posts (under 'Fact: WO license acquired by Mythic') from Mark Jacobs. He seems to indicate a reasonable balance between the IP and maintaining world integrity, and making the game fun for a wider audience than the original Warhammer Online project.

That being said, a border princes game sounds like a bit of a cop-out. I'd love to see the huge cities from the Climax version implemented, especially Nuln and Altdorf.

Cypher
25-05-2005, 04:06
I've read a few articles on this so far, but Im pretty certain that they are aiming for a 2007 release. I also believe that the initial game world will encompass the entire Empire and some of the bordering areas, although how that will allow a RvR situation confuses me, unless there's a major war-oriented plotline included (Storm of Chaos or similar?)

Hell's Angel
25-05-2005, 07:42
Whoohoo my ass kicking Tzeetchian Sorcerer WILL live!!! I'll also be the biggest gank yanker in existance!!!!

Crube
27-05-2005, 18:55
Apparantly, there is osme confusion over the actual ownership of the CLimax stuff.
Basicaly GW own the IP, but CLimax appear to own the game engine - They're trying to do something cool with the engine as we speak. Therefore Mythic cant actually use any of the CLImax stuff

Rumour has it (from a very reliable source close to Climax) that GW were over protective of the IP, to the level that they were shown some clothing for the game, which was described as very nice, but that style wouldnt be seen in this vilage, only the one 2/3 miles up the road...

I am slightly concerned about the Mythic game on one hand purely as the Climax game looked soooooo cool. However, I know the Licence Manager for GW, ad trust him implicitly. As long as he's in charge, then the game will still kick serious ass (and I beleive he also has an unhealthy addiction to WoW). I trust him - have faith people...

Spaco
27-05-2005, 19:17
Are you kidding? Was I the only one that thought the stuff Climax came up with looked like the makings of the worst MMORPG game ever?

Mythic will rock the socks off this thing.

Crube
27-05-2005, 19:21
I must confess, that I'm not a great MMORPG fan, but based on what I saw, I personally thought it was pretty cool.

My main concern is the content of the game though, with what Mythic are saying (its the game they want to make not GW...)

Having said that, I am stil loking forward to the game, as I said, I have faith that GW (and the LM) wont accept second best.

Cypher
28-05-2005, 08:26
At the time the work Climax were doing was pretty good: indeed my criticism was that many of the models looked too similar to their miniature counterpart. The core mechanics of the game, as presented, looked like they would have worked wonderfully too. Personally I would have very much liked to see the end result.

Galonthar
29-05-2005, 11:38
is there any newn on which races they will put in the game?

(and which areas,.... I hate all that has to do with humies & empire,... soo if they only place in the old word... :skull: )

for WH is a fantasy game,... so there must be quite some different races (O&G, HE, WE, DE, chaos, lizziez, /... well.. frankly everything!!!)

Cypher
29-05-2005, 14:47
As the core of the human world the Empire is always going to be central to a Warhammer RPG, and the reason for this is that the market appeal of a title is so much higher if there is a human element in there somewhere. And it follows then that other races will primarily be those who have good relations with humans (ie Elves, Dwarfs etc).

Darkfang74
30-05-2005, 18:42
Well. I was looking forward to the Climax version. I play Star Wars MMORPG its fun. Climax's would have been kinnda like that. I would have loved to have been my Dwarf runesmith!!! As long as dwarfs are in this one I'm happy!

Zabuza
30-05-2005, 19:36
I think it's great news. I must say I never expected much of the old Warhammer Online that was in development of Climax and GW themselves, but I did like the idea of a MMO in the Warhammer Old World.

Its really good news that another company(with great records) approached GW for a license to use the Old World intellectual property.


I post this here because this news has just been released in E3, the biggest electronic game show of the year.


Uh, I may be wrong. But I think I read about this in my PC gamer magazine about...5 months ago?

-Zabuza-

Cypher
31-05-2005, 06:01
Most likely. Climax were developing the title till GW pulled finding. The licence has since been picked up by Mythic. Same basic game idea, but otherwise different projects.

PBGhost
31-05-2005, 06:13
Uh, I may be wrong. But I think I read about this in my PC gamer magazine about...5 months ago?

-Zabuza-

Heres what happened:
GW announced Climax was making it.
Climax talked about it for a while.
GW axed it.
Climax said "No, no! It can still work! It'll come out eventually!"
Climax trailed off.
GW announced Mythic is making it.

Cypher
31-05-2005, 09:49
Remember that Climax also made some pretty pictures and animations for everyone to "ooh" and "aah" at :D

But that's basically what happened. Climax weren't able to deliver, GW went to someone who could.

Darkfang74
31-05-2005, 20:40
as long as the job gets done I'm happy! :D

tzeentchgiant
31-05-2005, 20:45
Yes as am I, the sooner the better, would warhammer online be out by now if it hadn't been axed?

TG

Cypher
01-06-2005, 06:02
Doubt it. There was suggestion that they'd Beta it early this year, but that was never really going to happen. My guess is if Climax had gone through we might have seen it at the end of this year.

Darkfang74
03-06-2005, 02:31
Yes, the climax one, had it finished was aimed to hit stores end of 05- Mid 06

Earlandir
03-06-2005, 21:25
when do you think mythic will start giving out more information about WO? mainly in the form of a WO website?

tzeentchgiant
04-06-2005, 00:49
Was there a non online portion of warhammer online planned, to learn the basics, or was not much known about the overall end result, other that it would become online?

Please don't hit me for asking a silly question

TG

Cypher
04-06-2005, 07:18
There was never a Warhammer Offline, so to speak. Truthfully beyond some nice art and a set of design notes, very little was released about the Climax project.

As for Mythic releasing screenshots/website/whatever. Consider that they've only had the project a short while (at most six months, more than likely less than that) and it's a bit early to expect anything. Id say once they've got some art and so forth that's worth showing we'll see it, but that could take a fair while. The critical question is whether they are writing their graphics engine from scratch, as that could take a very long time and until its done you cant really show pictures. Im guessing however that WH:O will use an updated version of the DAoC engine.

Quercia
04-06-2005, 12:02
W0W this is great news. I hope it will last like other Online Internet games!

I've always dreamed of actually being in the Warhammer World. And I mean really dreaming, in my sleep even!

Anyways, I hope there will be a lot to do in the new RPG.

No release dates yet, eh?

Ah well, I just keep on dreaming.

Cheers,
-Q

Darkfang74
04-06-2005, 18:19
We'll have to see still, they just got the rights to it a few weeks ago

aznsk8s87
07-06-2005, 13:05
er... i don't want to dash anyone's hopes, but i can't really see this project taking off of the ground. Games Workshop video games just aren't all that popular. Look at DoW and FireWarrior (I admit THAT one was crap). DoW was a good game, but notmany people could really get into it. In all honesty I think people will be more inclined to play World of Warcraft and Guildwars than Warhammer Online.

Galonthar
07-06-2005, 13:10
er... i don't want to dash anyone's hopes, but i can't really see this project taking off of the ground. Games Workshop video games just aren't all that popular. Look at DoW and FireWarrior (I admit THAT one was crap). DoW was a good game, but notmany people could really get into it. In all honesty I think people will be more inclined to play World of Warcraft and Guildwars than Warhammer Online.

I`ve never played firewarrior,... but DOW??..... OMG.. I`ve got it, and its one of my favorite,... mostly I dislike anything that is about 40k futuristic crap,.. but that game was seriously good (and popular,... here at least...),... even the space marines, I hate them in the game (so, not the digital version), but in DOW they were cool (just like the rest), only pity there were no tyranids

Cypher
08-06-2005, 11:34
Firewarrior was really (really) bad, which is why it sold about six copies on PC. Dawn of War on the other hand did very well indeed for an RTS title: they dont make expansion packs unless games sell.

Success for WH:O will be resulted from the quality of the game (and the service in general), and the relative market at the time (in other words, Mythic should hope WoW2 isnt released the same week ;) )

rkunisch
08-06-2005, 13:39
Bah, Fire Warrior was not that bad. It was a simple ego shooter in th 40k universe which got the atmosphere about right. The single player part that is. I never played it in multiplayer mode, though.

Have fun,

Rolf.

Kelroth
08-06-2005, 19:03
I remember a lot of people buying up DoW over R: TW when it was released. At least here, it's popular.

75hastings69
08-06-2005, 19:18
Firewarrior was crap, dodgy missions, even worse collision detection. DoW is pretty cool though, and the old Shadow of the Horned Rat was good (way ahead of its time), most other WH(& 40k) games have been naff (Dark Future, BloodBowl, Chaos Gate, Heroquest 1 & 2, Rites of War.... blah, blah, blah) Spacehulk/quest was ok too. It says in the front of WD 306 (page 2) that NAMCO have aquired the rights to produce games based in the Warhammer world (hopefully not just Nottingham ;) ).

Galonthar
08-06-2005, 19:32
Firewarrior was crap, dodgy missions, even worse collision detection. DoW is pretty cool though, and the old Shadow of the Horned Rat was good (way ahead of its time), most other WH(& 40k) games have been naff (Dark Future, BloodBowl, Chaos Gate, Heroquest 1 & 2, Rites of War.... blah, blah, blah) Spacehulk/quest was ok too. It says in the front of WD 306 (page 2) that NAMCO have aquired the rights to produce games based in the Warhammer world (hopefully not just Nottingham ;) ).

hmmm....

so there have been other WH pc-games,... I was about to make a post
"not to forget firewarrior & DOW were 40k, and that everything can be different with fantasy"
but it seems that post would be a bit useless now

hmm I`ve never heard of that "shadow of the horned rat".....sounds cool though
(any1 have any idea how old it is exactly??)

tzeentchgiant
08-06-2005, 20:35
10+ years old for anything that isn't still on the shelves, I for one enjoyed there older games a lot, but in fairness DoW was much better than all of them.

I hope they put the same amount of effort into the namco games, but as previously stated it could be about 4 years before we see anything happening on that front.

TG

taintedarchon
08-06-2005, 21:24
I'll play it if it comes out. Before WoW, I played DAoC a lot, so I imagine it won't be too much different from Dark Age, at least not at its core mechanics.

I'm hoping to be able to play Chaos guys myself. I didn't like that Climax had it limited to five races. Come on, where are the Orcs, Goblins, or Lizardmen? It's lame to exclude them.

Alric
08-06-2005, 22:00
I just hope they create a game that compliments their miniture gaming . The last thing they need to do is create an online game that will compete with their other games.

Ideally the game would be a gateway game to the minitures introducing new players to the larger Warhammer miniture games.

One thing about online games is that they are highly risky theres a lot of cost in developemnt and production , then maintenance upkeep and updates. Look what happen to Asherons Call's AC2.

Games like WoW have an advantage with an exhisting pc game development staff and the exhisting War Craft games series history for pc's, WoW was a natural development for a company like Blizzard.

Cypher
09-06-2005, 07:42
If my memory serves, Shadow of the Horned Rat would have been released sometime late 95 or early 96. So it's pretty old. There was also a sequel, Dark Omen.

And Firewarrior sucked.

Hell's Angel
10-06-2005, 06:16
Dark Omen was fun!

Earlandir
10-06-2005, 06:24
the most important thing they can do for WO is to make as many playable races as possible. the climax game was most dissapointing because the race choices sucked. skaven and vampire counts would be awesome to play as

Gotrek
10-06-2005, 06:55
those races are opponent races. such as orcs and the likes. you can't go arround saying i wanna be a beastman or something couse those are the enemies. unless they do the realm thing with good and evil sides i seriously doubt you can be any of those races.

75hastings69
10-06-2005, 07:05
Until WO makes a debut, i suggest that fellow nerds have a go at Guild Wars, it is £17.99 from play.com and is FREE, yes that's right FREE online gaming. I for one will be cancelling my sub to WoW in order to fully enjoy the Guild Wars experience (p.s. did i mention it was free!!!!!!!!)

Oh BTW Dark Omen was pretty good. There have been numerous games based in WHFB & WH40k worlds, but i believe that DoW is the best so far (or maybe shadow of the horned rat).

Does anyone remember Chaos (battle of the wizards) by Jullian Gollop??? I think this guy was something to do with GW at some point. The game was basic to say the least, but really enjoyable multi player (death by gooey blob anyone?!?!?), back in the day of the old rubber keyboard spectrum. In fact i am off to find if i can download a freeware version of it from somewhere.................

I will be back.

75hastings69
10-06-2005, 08:17
here is a link to play chaos on your PC http://www.spectrum.lovely.net/ would be much better if it was full screen & ran a bit slower

geoffkemp
10-06-2005, 10:15
hopefully they will keep the old careers idea that aws banded bout in the previous incarnation of WO. So you end up being whatever depending on what choices you make etc. I`d guess it will be old world centric at least, with races that people of the street (not currnet WH devotees) can associate with. So look for humans, halfings, and ex-pat dwarfs and possibly elves.

If it follows the same model as EQ, for whihc I have the most expernce with, look for things like extra conintnets, races added with furhter expansions.

Thiugh I guess stuff like Vampire counts and Tomb kings, beastmen, etc will be NPC races as oppose to PC races, really as the general game playing population percieves them as enemies.

PBGhost
10-06-2005, 10:30
Until WO makes a debut, i suggest that fellow nerds have a go at Guild Wars, it is £17.99 from play.com and is FREE, yes that's right FREE online gaming. I for one will be cancelling my sub to WoW in order to fully enjoy the Guild Wars experience (p.s. did i mention it was free!!!!!!!!)


I fully reccomend Half Life 2. Its £17.99 from play.com and has FREE online gaming. While I did buy Half Life 2, I won't be quiting WoW because Half Life 2 is *not* a massively multiplayer game like WoW--neither is Guild Wars!

I'm sorry, but I'm sick of people going on about how awesome the 'free MMO' Guild Wars is. Not even Arena Soft claims it is a MMOG, because it simply isn't.

75hastings69
10-06-2005, 16:51
I'm sorry, but I'm sick of people going on about how awesome the 'free MMO' Guild Wars is. Not even Arena Soft claims it is a MMOG, because it simply isn't.

at no point did i claim that it was an MMOG, i simply stated that until WO comes out i will play this over WoW, especially as it is free. BTW it's not Arena Soft - it's NCSoft powered by ArenaNet :p

oatish
11-06-2005, 09:46
Warhammer Online better present an accurate Old World like experience. That will be key to winning the exisitng gamer crowd but, to win the average consumer over, the game will need to keep a sense of "gamey-ness" to it.

We would all like deep, engrossing Old World in which we could "live" but to market the game there has to be the actual game element similar to the way WoW has it. They have things like capture the flag and other mini-game type activities that draw people in. The key to WO will be to balance the need to present an "experience" to the Warhammer gamers and a "game" to the basic consumers. I think, if they mange this, we could be in for one hell of a treat.

oatish

aznsk8s87
14-06-2005, 14:07
hopefully they will keep the old careers idea that aws banded bout in the previous incarnation of WO. So you end up being whatever depending on what choices you make etc. I`d guess it will be old world centric at least, with races that people of the street (not currnet WH devotees) can associate with. So look for humans, halfings, and ex-pat dwarfs and possibly elves.

If it follows the same model as EQ, for whihc I have the most expernce with, look for things like extra conintnets, races added with furhter expansions.

Thiugh I guess stuff like Vampire counts and Tomb kings, beastmen, etc will be NPC races as oppose to PC races, really as the general game playing population percieves them as enemies.

I'd imagine they'd do it like WoW, you have a good faction and you have an evil faction. Though I wonder which category WE would fall under... in the preview in the white dwarf a month or two back they said '"it's not because they're neither; it's because they are both good and evil" or something along the lines of that.

Earlandir
14-06-2005, 22:13
if they are following the RvR style of DAoC, they will be able to easily add the 'evil' races as playable classes. hopefully, that includes skaven or VC as playable....

taintedarchon
15-06-2005, 01:42
those races are opponent races. such as orcs and the likes. you can't go arround saying i wanna be a beastman or something couse those are the enemies. unless they do the realm thing with good and evil sides i seriously doubt you can be any of those races.

I don't know, EQ II has evil races in it, and they certainly don't focus on any PvP. It's not a hard thing to do. World of Warcraft and Dark Age of Camelot both have it. So, I can't imagine it being such a hard thing.

Besides, even if you don't play Skaven, (I don't) it would be cool for anybody to play a Skaven character. (I would love to play a Skaven Assassin.)

PBGhost
15-06-2005, 02:16
it's NCSoft powered by ArenaNet :p

I knew I had the name wrong. :p

Cypher
15-06-2005, 02:32
I don't know, EQ II has evil races in it, and they certainly don't focus on any PvP. It's not a hard thing to do. World of Warcraft and Dark Age of Camelot both have it. So, I can't imagine it being such a hard thing.

Besides, even if you don't play Skaven, (I don't) it would be cool for anybody to play a Skaven character. (I would love to play a Skaven Assassin.)
The difference is, the entire world of Everquest was designed to allow for evil player races, such to the point that an entire continent has gone to the nasty. This cant really happen with Warhammer. If you take everything in the black and white of good and evil, then certainly the Empire and surrounding nations are considered "good" places. There isnt anywhere that Orcs, Skaven and Undead can hang out and have a beer, if you get my meaning. While it would be possible to play an evil character of a good race (Necromancer, Chaos worshipper, Dark Elf perhaps) because there is no obvious difference between them and anyone else (except for all the black and skull-like bling) it wouldnt be functional from a gameplay perspective to be an Orc or Skaven.

geoffkemp
15-06-2005, 10:16
Besides, even if you don't play Skaven, (I don't) it would be cool for anybody to play a Skaven character. (I would love to play a Skaven Assassin.)

I would asume that ifthat werethe case you would start as a clanrat then develop your chracter into an assassin, along a career path, perhaps through a night-runner first maybe. I doubt you would be an assassin straight out of the box though.

If I were to do it, I would perhaps develop career paths for skaven something like this:

Clanrat -> Night Runner -> Assassin
Clanrat -> Warlock -> Grey Seer
Clanrat -> Warlock -> Warlock Engineer
Clanrat -> Plauge Monk -> Plauge Priest
Clanrat -> Storm Vermin -> Cheiftain
Clanrat -> Beast Master -> Master Moulder.

IIRC that covers all the 4 great clans, plus an option on the warlord clans. That would also fit quite nicely into the D&D class archtypes as well, such as Assassin = rouge, Cheiftain = Warrior Class, Grey seer = Wizard. My example however was heavily truncated.

probably the same with other races with a bit of thought to the background.

PBGhost
15-06-2005, 10:36
Mythic has talked about the upcoming game at length, see my thread here. (http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4155) :)