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Gyulkus Chaos Saurus
27-03-2010, 05:03
I played lizardmen a few years ago back in 6th edition. Getting back into fantasy now and this is what I'm looking at. whatcah think?

2250 Pts - Lizardmen Roster

Slaan Mage-Priest (1#, 355 pts)
1 Slann Mage-Priest (Battle Standard Bearer) @ 355 pts
1 Plaque of Tepok
1 Sun Standard of Chotec
1 The Focused Rumination

Skink Priest (1#, 125 pts)
1 Skink Priest @ 125 pts (Level 2 Upgrade)
1 Cloak of Feathers

Skink Priest (1#, 100 pts)
1 Skink Priest @ 100 pts (Level 2 Upgrade)

Saurus Scar-Veteran (1#, 141 pts)
1 Saurus Scar-Veteran @ 141 pts (Great Weapon)
1 Hide of the Cold Ones

Temple Guard (19#, 318 pts)
19 Temple Guard @ 318 pts (Standard Bearer Std)

Saurus Warriors (18#, 240 pts)
17 Saurus Warriors @ 240 pts (Standard Bearer Std; Hand Weapon; Spear; Shield; Scaly Skin)
1 Saurus Champion (Hand Weapon; Spear; Shield)

Saurus Warriors (18#, 240 pts)
17 Saurus Warriors @ 240 pts (Standard Bearer Std; Hand Weapon; Spear; Shield; Scaly Skin)
1 Saurus Champion (Hand Weapon; Spear; Shield)

Skink Skirmishers (12#, 84 pts)
12 Skink Skirmishers @ 84 pts (Hand Weapon; Blowpipe; Aquatic; Skirmishers)

Skink Skirmishers (12#, 84 pts)
12 Skink Skirmishers @ 84 pts (Hand Weapon; Blowpipe; Aquatic; Skirmishers)

Terradon Riders (3#, 90 pts)
3 Terradon Rider @ 90 pts (Hand Weapon; Javelin; Flyer)
3 Terradon (Flyer)

Stegadon (6#, 235 pts)
1 Stegadon @ 235 pts

Cold One Cavalry (6#, 230 pts)
6 Cold One Cavalry @ 230 pts (Standard Bearer)
Total Roster Cost: 2242

Vsurma
27-03-2010, 10:01
Why not take an engine over the normal steg, 65pts buys you a dispel dice, a power dice and all the engine abilities, its a pretty good deal, you could even drop the sun standard because the 5+ ward save from the engine performs much the same role.

The characters all seem fine, though taking a diadam on one of the foot priests might be a good idea, if you come up against some heavy magic. A scroll or 2 might be nice as well, saurus warriors and their init1 really don't like pit of shadows.

Why 19 temple guard? the slann takes the place of 4 remember.

Overall a fairly good list.

Gyulkus Chaos Saurus
28-03-2010, 05:44
Thanks Vsurma. I switched up the list a little as per your recomendations. BTW I take the 19 because the scar-vet goes in that unit, making it when combined with the slann effectively a 24 man unit.

Vsurma
28-03-2010, 10:41
I haven't really seen anyone else doing it but I always! take champions in my skink units.

Most lizardmen lists have a fairly hard time with dragons, especially the dark elf lord on dragon and the high elf lord on dragon are tough as the dragons themselves do a lot of damage and the lords a nigh unkillable.

I normally try to take them down with bane head and steal soul over the course of the game, beast cowers and wolf hunts also work if your running the warspear steg but I don't think the normal steg or engine do enough damage on the charge to really make a huge dent.

The reason I like the champs in skink units is that I can keep charging said dragons with those units and have the opponent kill nothing but 1 champ a turn. I will then try to get a large block like the temple guard stuck in the combat for an autowin. Without the champs you will lose the units quickly, you will also drop below his unit strength and autorun due to outnumbered by a fear causer.

Champs are just wicked against dragons and greater demons, things the list otherwise doesn't like.

What's the point of the flying skink priest?
With a 12" march on the little guys, paying points to add another 8" is rarely needed, also he is stuck with the lore of heavens so its not like you will be getting any crown of taidron, burning head or that magic missile bolt thrower from the lore of beasts out of the guy.

Lizardmen spells are either missiles with unlimited range, or ones that have a fairly long casting range for the buffs.

Gaargod
28-03-2010, 17:58
@ Vsurma: Champs in skink units do not work, because you run up (assuming pass terror) and challenge, at which stage big monster gets like 6 CR from overkill and your unit has a break test at -5. In other words... its gone. Skink skirmishers should only ever charge things they want to run away from (hatred/frenzy).

Few things.

Firstly, i would suggest sticking a priest on the steg, and giving him the plaque of tepok. Hey presto, lv3 wizard.

To cover the Slann's lack of spells, drop Sun Standard (not really worth it) and give him Focus of Mystery. There are also a lot of rather useful items you might want to think about (Bane Head, Cupped Hands, scroll/power stones).

To be honest, i never really see the point of cloak of feathers skinks. Its only useful in a very few circumstances, and means you have a lone mage. The best spells don't use his telepathy (Spirit of Forge, beast cowers, wolf hunts, Wall of Fire, Doom and Darkness, etc). The skink himself doesn't get much out of it either.

Champs aren't needed in the saurus unless you have a hero in there for challenging purposes. They have 2 attacks each already, in 2 ranks - 1 more isn;t worth 12pts. Stick to 18 with spears + standard.

Either take 10 or 13 skinks. 10 for minimum cost, or 13 to avoid panic (need 4 as opposed to 3).

Not a big fan of Hide of Cold Ones. Taking a hero on cold one still gets you fear immunity, but will give you better protection, faster movement if stupid, an extra attack and is less expensive. Also allows you to take a magic hitty stick, if you wish.

Love the cold one cav.


Methinks by this stage you may be overpointed somewhat. Tis the problem trying to fit in 3 saurus blocks into 2.25k. Generally i would aim for 2, but if you want 3, maybe think bout dropping the 2nd priest? Slann + Engine is a fair amount of magic (around 12 PD a turn) and 6DD (same as currently, actually) which you could further augment with Becalming Cogitation and/or scrolls.




Sorry if that's a bit negative, its the start of a nice list.

Vsurma
28-03-2010, 21:55
Why would it be gone? ld 4 on cold blooded with a reroll is decent odds, if you have 2 such units in there chances are high that at least 1 if not both stay.

I couldn't find the math anywhere, perhaps someone can help, I know people have created some charts that show the % chance to pass on any given ld, I remember if you had ld5 with cold blooded and the re-roll the chance of passing was already over 50%.

So if for example you charged 2 units of skinks at the dragon, challenged with a champ, you would be taking the max 6 overkill, countered by your outnumber and a flank, you have ld5 when within range of the slann and bsb. (or a slann that is the bsb)

Assuming the 50% odds where correct, that gives you only a 25% chance that both units will break, 75% that at least one will hold. I am happy with those odds, if for some reason the enemy fluffs their attacks which happens then your in even better shape.

So far using these skink champs has been the only way I have been able to deal with dragons if I didn't get the appropriate spell to handle them.

People seem to drop champs of units quite easily, I always found them to be great against enemy characters though, just because its nicer to lose 1 model 5 times over rather than losing 5 models, having that champ could easily equal +2 cr in the next combat round compared to not having it as you might lose a rank and outnumber much sooner without challenging the character. 12pts isn't really a lot in a 2k list.

WGMelchior
04-04-2010, 18:07
Does Skirmisher units still get flank bonuses?

Vsurma
04-04-2010, 19:51
Yes, they can get flank and rear bonuses but they cannot negate enemy ranks.